# General Mandolin Topics > eBay, Craig's List, etc. >  Vancouver Craigslist Mandolins for Beginner?

## Luwafer

Hey everybody,

I'm looking to buy my first mandolin, but the Vancouver mandolin front seems rather lacking, from what I can tell. I'm hoping not to break the bank since this would be more of an intro for me. I'll be looking into the few stores around here that sell mandolins, such as Prussin Music and Rufus' Guitar Shop, but I was looking through Craigslist and found some decently-priced instruments. Alas, I am a complete beginner and would know absolutely nothing about these instruments. Even if I were to check them out in person, I'd have no idea how to test if it's a quality instrument or not.

I suppose my question is twofold:

1) Is it generally a bad idea to purchase a used instrument as your very first?

2) Do any of the Vancouver Craigslist mandolins for around under $200 (my budget) seem decent?
http://vancouver.craigslist.ca/searc...query=mandolin

There are a few on there that are a hilariously low price, which of course makes me weary. Some of them are below (the $80 one sounds the most suspicious...):

http://vancouver.craigslist.ca/van/msg/5032907144.html
http://vancouver.craigslist.ca/bnc/msg/5030760019.html
http://vancouver.craigslist.ca/rds/msg/5051285910.html
http://vancouver.craigslist.ca/pml/msg/5081452606.html

I hear Rufus sometimes carries Rovers for $169 which I hear aren't bad, or I could order online (eg. there's always that questionable Rogue RM-100A A-Style which is about $120 after shipping and taxes). My main issue is that shipping to Vancouver seems absurdly expensive on most sites...

Sorry for the long post. I'm looking forward to joining the mandolin-playing community, but my first step would be to acquire an instrument!

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## JH Murray

Actually, the last one, with the Russian label, is probably the best of the bunch. Those Russian flat tops were well built. I had one from the 1970s that I started on. It will be good enough till you can save enough for a better instrument.

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## pheffernan

I don't think it's a bad idea to purchase a used instrument as your very first, provided that you are buying the right instrument from the right shop that ensures that the instrument is set up properly for you to play. Used mandolins in the ~$200 price range are a dicey proposition, unless it's a beginner instrument in the classifieds here from a player moving up to an intermediate or professional level. Instead, I'd probably recommend a Rover A-style from Rufus' Guitar Shop: http://www.rufusguitarshop.com/banjo.html#newmandolin

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## Luwafer

> Actually, the last one, with the Russian label, is probably the best of the bunch. Those Russian flat tops were well built. I had one from the 1970s that I started on. It will be good enough till you can save enough for a better instrument.


Hmm that's encouraging me to go for the $80 Russian one, haha. Not sure if that's a steal or a terrible idea. Is there any way for somebody who has essentially zero idea of how to play a mandolin to check if it's any good when holding it? I suppose not falling apart in your hands is a start...





> I don't think it's a bad idea to purchase a used instrument as your very first, provided that you are buying the right instrument from the right shop that ensures that the instrument is set up properly for you to play. Used mandolins in the ~$200 price range are a dicey proposition, unless it's a beginner instrument in the classifieds here from a player moving up to an intermediate or professional level. Instead, I'd probably recommend a Rover A-style from Rufus' Guitar Shop: http://www.rufusguitarshop.com/banjo.html#newmandolin


I just called all the local stores, and Rufus' Guitar Shop indeed has one of the better deals with the Rover RM-50 for $199. I've heard both good and bad things about this instrument. It's a bit pricier than I had expected, although only by some $20-30. Probably the weak Canadian dollar. Prussin Music also sells the Rover RM-50B for $225, but are doing a 20% off sale on all instruments at the moment, bringing the price down to $180, which is in fact cheaper than the RM-50 at Rufus. Is there a difference between the RM-50 and the RM-50B? If the RM-50B is superior, I would assume that would be the way to go. I do believe both places set the instrument up for you as well.
Amazon Prime (which I have) also sells the RM-50B for only $164.49, but of course that's ordering online so setup is doubtful. Perhaps all of these questions would best be suited in a thread of their own..? Nevertheless, thank you for your response!

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## mandobassman

The RM50B is the same instrument in a black finish.  If you're interested in the Rover, I would highly recommend getting it for Cafe sponsor FolkMusician.com.  They have a outstanding reputation for a first rate setup and excellent customer service.  Setup is one of the most important things in a beginner mandolin that many stores either don't do properly or don't do at all.
Here is a link to the page on their website for the Rover.  

http://www.folkmusician.com/Rover-RM...tinfo/RM%2D50/

I would not buy a mandolin on Amazon.  You can see on the folk Musician page that they have a link to Amazon where you can buy the RM50 for $137, but it comes with no setup and that's really taking a chance that you can get something nearly unplayable.

On the other hand, you could really save a lot of money if you bought it there and were able to set it up yourself.  Rob Meldrum is a Cafe member who offers a free setup guide that has made it possible for people to do their own setup.

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## pheffernan

> I just called all the local stores, and Rufus' Guitar Shop indeed has one of the better deals with the Rover RM-50 for $199. I've heard both good and bad things about this instrument. It's a bit pricier than I had expected, although only by some $20-30. Probably the weak Canadian dollar. Prussin Music also sells the Rover RM-50B for $225, but are doing a 20% off sale on all instruments at the moment, bringing the price down to $180, which is in fact cheaper than the RM-50 at Rufus. Is there a difference between the RM-50 and the RM-50B? If the RM-50B is superior, I would assume that would be the way to go. I do believe both places set the instrument up for you as well.


The difference between $199 and $180 is negligible. Rufus Guitar Shop may well be willing to match the price at Prussin Music. At that point, my decision would be entirely determined by the quality of the setup each shop is known to perform.

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## Luwafer

Thanks for the replies, everybody! The look and price of that Russian flat top is tempting, but I suppose it's not the safest bet.

Ordering off of Folk Musician does sound tempting thanks to the superior setup. After shipping it would come to $192, although I'm not sure if that's in CAD or USD. If USD, that would come to $236 CAD (stupid exchange rate...) which would be a bit hefty. If, however, that is CAD, I'd consider that route. That said, does anybody know if Rufus or Prussin have decent or good reputations regarding setup quality? If so, those would be both faster (wouldn't have to wait probably two weeks for shipping) and cheaper than Folk Musician.

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## mrmando

I'd go for the Neil Russell if you can swing it. Handmade by a local luthier, will retain its value.

For every good Russian mandolin there are a hundred bad ones, I'll wager.

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## zedmando

I've visited Vancouver--and I enjoyed checking out Rufus'
A used instrument is good to start on (& can save you a bunch of money, possibly), but I'd buy used from a store if it's your first time.

Prussin's seemed to have low end stuff that didn't seem to be that good, and high end stuff way out of my price range (For all instruments)

Still a fun way to spend some time on a weekday afternoon.

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## Bruce Clausen

> I'd go for the Neil Russell if you can swing it.


Agreed. I played one for years-- maybe this one-- and it was excellent. But if it's more than you can spend, too bad.

Rufus and Prussin are both good shops to deal with in my experience.

Nice to see a Pampered Chef Mandolin & Juicer on the list for only $30!  :Smile:

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## JeffD

Can you borrow or rent a mandolin for a week, to see if you really love it? If you don't really love it, you saved a bunch of money. If you do love it you might could justify spending a bit more on your first purchase. Either way you win win win.

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## JeffD

That flat top looks like it could be good. If its in great shape and sounds good it might could make you happy for ever.

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## Luwafer

> That flat top looks like it could be good. If its in great shape and sounds good it might could make you happy for ever.


Are you referring to the Neil Russell flat top or the $80 Russian one?

Thanks for all the advice, guys. Seems my recommended options are:

A) Rover RM-50 at Rufus Guitars for $199

B) The Russian flat top for $80 (questionable or a steal?) 

C) Obliterate my budget and invest in the Neil Russell for $450. Pretty big commitment for a complete novice, I'm afraid.

Renting would be lovely but I'm afraid I live a bit away from Vancouver so I'd only really be able to stretch one visit in the near future.

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## mrmando

If you buy the Neil Russell and don't stick with playing it, you can get your $450 back out of it. But the Rover will never be worth $199 again. It depreciates the second you carry it out of the store.

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## Luwafer

> If you buy the Neil Russell and don't stick with playing it, you can get your $450 back out of it. But the Rover will never be worth $199 again. It depreciates the second you carry it out of the store.


Hmmm. This is true. Never thought I'd be tempted to splurge so much on something I've never even tried, yet here we are. Is there a way a complete amateur would be able to tell if the Neil Russell is truly a quality instrument when holding it?

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## pheffernan

> Hmmm. This is true. Never thought I'd be tempted to splurge so much on something I've never even tried, yet here we are. Is there a way a complete amateur would be able to tell if the Neil Russell is truly a quality instrument when holding it?


If your budget has doubled overnight, then I would join the chorus endorsing your selection of the Russell. Flattops are great instruments in their own right -- hand built of solid woods here in the U.S. -- only they require less time and labor to build. The savings is passed along to the consumer, making them a great instrument for beginners, but also one likely to stick around as a second / backup / traveler should you ever to decide to upgrade in the future. $450 is about what I spent on my first mandolin, a Mid-Missouri flattop, and I have never regretted that decision for an instant.

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## kkmm

I love the Russian one based on the look. If it sounds good, 80$ is very cheap.

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## JeffD

> I love the Russian one based on the look. If it sounds good, 80$ is very cheap.


That is what I was referring to. But I have no doubt the Russell could be very nice too. 

I just have a soft spot for flat tops. Some how they break me out of my bluegrass/oldtime rut (trench) and move me into the great big world of music on a mandolin.

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## MikeEdgerton

Before I'd spend $80.00 on the Russian mandolin I'd buy a Rogue from www.musiciansfriend.com for less than $50.00 USD. I don't know how they handle shipping to Canada. Will it be setup? Most likely better than the $80.00 Russian flatback. If you're looking for cheap that's cheap.

http://www.musiciansfriend.com/folk-...ndolin&index=1

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## Barry Wilson

I played a couple of these and have a denver soprano ukulele... this is new with warranty. they are about as good as the epiphones https://www.long-mcquade.com/25935/G...e_Sunburst.htm

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## Luwafer

> Before I'd spend $80.00 on the Russian mandolin I'd buy a Rogue from www.musiciansfriend.com for less than $50.00 USD. I don't know how they handle shipping to Canada. Will it be setup? Most likely better than the $80.00 Russian flatback. If you're looking for cheap that's cheap.
> 
> http://www.musiciansfriend.com/folk-...ndolin&index=1


I'm afraid after shipping it's about $110, so a Rogue would in fact cost more than the $80 Russian.

I'm mostly torn between the $80 Russian and the $450 Neil Russell, at this point. There seems to be very limited information on Neil Russell, although what little there is seems mostly positive. Of course, there is zero information on the Russian, so I suppose the question is whether the Neil Russell is worth $370 more than the Russian in terms of quality.

My main concern is that I have no idea what to look or listen for in a mandolin, so if I were to "try" it during a meeting with the seller, I would have no idea if it's good or not.

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## JH Murray

The big thing to do is go and try both in person. If the seller can play, you can get a chance to hear it. Do you have a guitar playing friend you can take along? Get a stiff guitar pick to take along. Check to see if the neck is straight, that there are no cracks in the body or at the heel of the neck. Make sure all 8 tuners work.(The tuners alone on the Neil Russell are worth more than the Russian mandolin)  Fret each note on each string all the way up the neck to make sure they all sound clearly with no buzzing. Listen to how the notes ring out when you pluck them. If it sounds dead, that's not a good sign. Look at the frets to make sure they are not worn. If the Russian's frets are worn, a refret will cost more than the instrument is worth. If it is playable, the Russian can be a good cheap starter, but in a few months you'll be looking for something like the Neil Russell. Odds are the Neil Russell will be much better quality and may be all you will ever need. It also has good resale value, more so than the Russian ever will.

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## Jeff Mando

It is possible to "over research" an $80 purchase.  By that I mean it is better to get a mandolin in your hands and start playing, rather than to be still deciding on what is the best deal and find yourself 6 months from now still without a mandolin.  If you have the interest, go for it.  To be honest, chances are your first mandolin won't be your last.  No biggee, you'll find another you'll like even better.  Just go for it is my suggestion.

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## RayMan7

If it was me I would go with the $80 Russian mandolin. You'll be spending more on any new mandolin, (I'm near Vancouver to so I know all about shipping/currency rate) and at $80 you can't really go wrong, as they go for at least that on eBay all the time. In my experience it's much easier to get a nicer sounding oval hole mando than any cheaper f-hole, plywood or solid. With new strings and a set up I'm willing to bet that it would be a nice sounding instrument for the price. Plus, I've seen it posted for a while, chances are you can get it cheaper  :Wink:

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## allenhopkins

You have *another thread* going on the $80 Russian mandolin, so let me reiterate what I said there: you'd be better off, if you don't want to spend the $450 for the Neil Russell, following Mike E's advice and buying a new entry-level Rover or Kentucky.  More than the mysterious Muscovite mando, but less than the Russell, and you can get a shop set-up which is pretty crucial for a first mandolin.

The Russian mandolin lacks an adjustable bridge and a truss rod, and its tuners look a trifle crude to me.  May be a bargain, may not be, but unless price is your overwhelming consideration, IMHO you're taking a bit of a chance.

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## Luwafer

Thanks for all of the responses, everybody. Given me a lot to think about. Overall, I feel that despite the resale value and everything appealing about the Neil Russell, it would probably be safer to go with something cheaper so I can get a feel for the instrument. I'm sure somewhere down the line when I know what I'm doing, I can invest in a more expensive instrument.

I'm leaning mostly towards the Rover RM-50 at the moment. It seems that for starting out, the setup is ultimately the most important. Anybody know of a good setup place in Vancouer?

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## pheffernan

> Anybody know of a good setup place in Vancouer?


Rufus' Guitar Shop claims to perform one on its website:"To ensure every instrument sounds its best, the in-house repair department performs all necessary set-ups and quality checks before they "hit the wall"."

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## Luwafer

> Rufus' Guitar Shop claims to perform one on its website:"To ensure every instrument sounds its best, the in-house repair department performs all necessary set-ups and quality checks before they "hit the wall"."


That's what they told me when I tried calling them, although whether this setting up is truly a proper mandolin setup or just tuning and slight modifications to make it functioning is another question...

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## pheffernan

> That's what they told me when I tried calling them, although whether this setting up is truly a proper mandolin setup or just tuning and slight modifications to make it functioning is another question...


So ask them that question.

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## Verne Andru

I'm in Vancouver. The mandolin scene is pretty barren, but has picked up in recent years. In addition to Prussian and Rufus, there's Tom Lee's second floor downtown that has mando's, etc. Terminal Ave Long and McQuade has started stocking more mando's of late and have a nice selection of Eastman's, Epi's and Gretches last time I was in. If you have a car and some time, there's a well stocked Guitar Center in Bellingham.

There's a ton of junk floating around on Vancouver's CL's. I'd stick with a Rover, Gretch or Washburn on the low end.

As for setup, Bud at Prussian is pretty good for basic stuff. I've not used Rufus. My go-to guy is Paul Iverson - he's in the North Van Tom Lee. He was Bryan Adams original bass player and does a ton of work for big guns. If he can't do it, it can't be done. Super great guy to boot.

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