# Technique, Theory, Playing Tips and Tricks > Theory, Technique, Tips and Tricks >  Female mandolin players

## Barbara Shultz

Ok, I'm not quite sure how to ask this question... I've been playing the mandolin for about 2 1/2 years, I play Celtic & Old Time music, and I play the melody. I play with a group, and 99.9% of the time, we play sitting down. Until recently, I played without a strap, but have been having left hand pain issues, so I've been experimenting with the various ways to HOLD the darn thing, to resolve the pain issues. So, I've put the strap on it, and have 'relearned' to play without supporting the neck with my left hand, and let the strap do that. So, that brings me to just how to adjust the strap, where to have the instrument fall across my body. I decided to go to You Tube and search mandolin, and EVERY one of the videos is a GUY! My problem is that I'm busty, so I've either got to have the strap somewhat long, the mandolin almost sitting in my lap, and the mandolin under my bust. That's what I've been doing, but I'm thinking that getting it up higher might be better for my left hand position. I notice that some guys have the mandolin more off to their right side, almost tucked under their right elbow, some guys have them flat across their stomach or chest areas... and most of the guys hold their mandolin way higher than is comfortable for me.... so, I thought I'd give it a shot here on the cafe message board, to find out how many other female mandolin players there are out there, and how you hold your mandolin! Thanks!

Barbara

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## Barbara Shultz

Oh, I forgot to mention, I play a Weber Bridger A style, so my strap attaches at the peghead under the strings....

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## mandogerry

Some of the less endowed women among us have similar issues. I hold my mandolin lower than most men, who make up all of the local players except me, so I've gone by trial and error. I also hold the body of the instrument out from my own body at a bit of an angle. Let those without chest obstacles protest the lack of proper technique. I do have to add (all in fun) that some male players have a similar issue with large belly obstacles, which I think might account for how high they hold the instrument! 

There is a great thread on this board called "Women With Mandolins" -- If you put that phrase into the search box (no quotes), you'll get 35 or so pages (not kidding) of photos of women players famous and not so. Hope that gives you some ideas.

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## Stephanie Reiser

I am built similarly, but have never thought of how to hold the instument. When I am sitting I tend to hunch over the mando, I guess. It is only when I am standing with the strap that I have "geometric issues". Since I play alot of lead melody, I like the mandolin high on my body where I have better control. It's hard to explain how I hold the mandolin so I will just attach this pic of me at a recent jam.
I have noticed that alot of guys hang the mandolin low on the strap, like Sam Bush does.

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## maj34

I have had similar left-hand fatigue from playing without a strap. #I also play an A-style mandolin, and I attach the strap to the peghead. #Since mandolins sound better when not held against one's body, I like to rest the body of the mandolin on my right thigh, peghead pointing up at around 45 degrees and the peghead pointing away from my body. #The strap supports the instrument, and my left hand is relaxed. #In order to accomplish this, you have to put the strap around only your right shoulder, not around your neck.

I'm a man with no physical reason to hold a mandolin this way, but I do believe it encourages the best tone. #It sounds like this is the way mandogerry holds her instrument as well.

By the way, in what part of Iowa do you reside? #I'm in Iowa City.

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## sunburst

This is a situation that hadn't occurred to me, as a male mandolin builder, until I had a conversation or two with a female friend and mandolin player (link). I don't think she had resolved the situation as of the last time I talked to her, but I remember seeing Dawn Watson play soon after she had resumed playing after nearly debilitating hand and arm problems and subsequent therapy. She played with the mandolin over to her side, hanging from the strap sort of like a shoulder bag. I assumed it was because of the injuries and therapists recommendations for better hand and wrist position, but it might have been for her comfort too.

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## Khmando

Hi Barbara, 

Having played guitar for years, I have the strap on my left shoulder. That's where it feels most comfortable for me. I tried placing the strap over my right shoulder, like I've seen many mandolin players, but that felt really uncomfortable. I kept noticing that my right shoulder wanted to hunch up. I guess I have the mandolin pretty high up, right around my diaphragm. The other thing you might want to be aware of is the pressure you exert with your left hand. Sometimes players can push to hard into the back of the neck. That can contribute to left hand pain. Just a thought. 

Karen

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## sunburst

Male or female, the right shoulder just doesn't work for some of us (left shoulder for lefties), and is not an option.
I _hate_ shoulder straps on bag, cases, whatever, because the only way I can use them is to put my head through the strap. If I try to carry something with a strap on my same-side shoulder, it will simply slip off. It's the same with an instrument. It takes more effort to try to keep a strap on my right shoulder than to hold the instrument with no strap at all.

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## Barbara Shultz

Thanks for your replies! I seem to hold my instrument pretty close to how Stephanie is in the photo she attached. One of my issues with my hand has been my thumb, and am working HARD on concentrating on hardly pushing or squeezing with my thumb AT ALL! Another issue was that I seemed to be jamming the side of that joint where my index finger attached to my hand, into the neck, so have slightly turned my hand. I am trying to also concentrate on getting the palm of my hand/fleshy part of my thumb totally away from the neck. I've ALSO started working on how I'm holding my pick... so needless to say, I'm spending MOST of my time practicing on how to HOLD everything differently! I do have a tone guard on my mandolin, and an armrest, which both help with the tone. I wear my strap over my left shoulder. I live in Central Iowa, about 20 miles from Ames, about 50 miles from Des Moines. The group I play with all live in Des Moines, so I drive there twice a week to practice with them; am heading out soon! We do try to go to the Fiddler's Picnic there in Iowa City every year. Here's a link to our band's website:

Barbara The Flatland Ramblers

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## mandogerry

To follow up on maj34's message, I do keep my mandolin de jour pointed at about a 45 degree angle upward and keep its body away from my own, but I somehow can do this with the strap over my left shoulder. (I'm a leftie, but I play rightie.). Like john, it doesn't work for me with the strap just over my right shoulder -- makes me hunch my shoulder. 

Two other helpful things I've discovered over the past couple of years, to avoid chest obstacle and general stress-on-hands problems: 

(1) Adjust your strap length so your mandolin rests at the same place, whether you are standing and sitting. 

(2) Play an A model, not an F! I find my Big Muddy/Big Tubby the most comfortable mandolin I've ever played, maybe because it has a compact but deep body that naturally holds it further away from me. My Weber Hyalite, another A with a larger arched body and longer neck, is OK but less comfortable. But those F-model strap holders (scrolls) are just a nuisance for me.

Great topic, by the way.

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## JEStanek

One thing that may help with seated position is to put your case under your left foot. Note how Stephanie is supporting and raising her left leg with her right foot. This gives a natural slope/pocket for the mandolin to rest into between your thighs (with or without the lap point. I could never get comfortable with the strap on my right shoulder (male playing right-y). I often stack my feet when sitting to elevate the left thigh. Using the case (or a hoity toity classical guitar footrest) makes more ergonomic sense.

Jamie

PS. I've seen plenty of male mando pickers with cabinet maker's disease have to play their instruments high or out more... Cabinet maker's disease - when your chest falls into your drawers.

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## JeffD

I have to go with Jamie on this - when I play strapless I need to put my foot up higher. In a jam I use my case as a foot rest. At home when I practice without a strap I use a regular foot rest.

It really helps.

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## mandogerry

Barbara, I just played your group's version of "Barlow Knife" on CD Baby (an old-time song I really like). If that's you playing the octave mandolin part, I don't think any of your body parts are a problem -- Sounds great.

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## nolady

Terrific topic. I'm a beginner with the same positioning problem. Using the strap while sitting helps a lot.

Also this short delightful video helps keep my memory fresh as to how to hold the mandolin, This is how my instructor
showed me, politely not mentioning any body protuberances

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## Barbara Shultz

MandoGerry... Thanks for checking out our songs.... the CD was recorded before I joined the Flatland Ramblers... so, it wasn't me... 

NoLady, did you mean to link to a video clip? 

Thanks for the input! I've messed with my strap length, but it seemed to be a little long today at practice, so I'm going to mess with it again. Since it's a leather strap, with just a couple of slits for adjustment, and the hassle of getting it under the strings on the peghead, it's not easy with just one person, but I'll persevere! 

Barbara

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## otterly2k

I use a strap whether sitting or standing... helps to keep my playing position consistent. And I have found that it is really important to free up the left hand from having to do ANY of the work of holding the mandolin (or guitar or banjo) up -- this allows me more flexibility and movement, better left hand posture, etc. 

Like you, I put the strap over my left shoulder. I hold the mando squished against my right breast, and then angled forward about 45 degrees away from my body, as well as about 30 degrees angled up. Give it a try... I think if you hold the mandolin lower, there is a tendency to have to hold your left wrist at a very awkward angle. Yes, the bosoms can be a bit of an obstacle. Fortunately, they are *um* squishable.

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## nolady

Oops - here's the link # 

http://www.tothestage.com/MediaDe....aId=352

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## mandogerry

I took a razor tool to two of my leather straps and carved new holes exactly where I wanted them, just long enough to squeeze the end button through. (That's pretty much what the manufacturers do, they just have better tools.) No problems after a year or so; there is a lot of solid leather space between their holes and mine.

Marilynn Mair, mandolinist extraordinaire, holds her instrument directly over her right thigh. There is a good photo of her here:
http://www.marilynnmair.com/
That looks quite squishy-potential to me. And my Big Muddy is so much smaller than some other mandolins that I can't imagine playing it so far to the right. I hold mandolins more like Amanda Lyn does in her photo above.

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## Barbara Shultz

NoLady, thanks for that link, that was great! 

MandoGerry, yes, cutting a slit where I want it will be the answer... it's just that I haven't found that exact spot yet, and when I do....!!

Otterly2k, how you described how you hold it, is pretty much how I'd say I hold it.... so I guess I'm just down to the tweaking part!

Thanks everyone!

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## Mike Buesseler

Hey Barb, while reading this post, I picked up on CD reference, went to CD Baby and downloaded it! Wonderful music! I just love that straightforward, honest style you folks have. I like your tempo and arrangements a lot. In fact, I had a copy of your "Rock the Cradle Joe" I found on iTunes...never knew it was YOU! (I'm the friend of Ron's, btw, who helped you with buying that Bridger, in case you don't remember...) Nice work!!

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## farmerjones

Rhonda Vincent's webpage has lots of pictures too. 

Hi! im over buy Sioux City. You may already know David M. and Jessboo?

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## Jonathan Peck

Regardless of how high or low you are holding the mandolin, the pain could be the result of playing with a bent wrist. Try and play with your wrist as straight as possible with your fingers up high on the figerboard so that you can reach across and get those low strings (g string) fretted without having to apply to much pressure. Think of your fingers being bent at the knuckle instead of laying flat across the fingerboard.

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## Barbara Shultz

Hi, thanks for the tip; I will concentrate when working on figuring out just the RIGHT position for the left hand, to keep try to keep my wrist straight!

Barb

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## Stephanie Reiser

I use different grasping-of-the-neck styles for different situations. For Example, an Em chord and some other open-stringed chords I will go with a classical guitar grasp supported on the back of the neck by my thumb only. WIth a bluegrass-type 4-fingered chord I often nestle that neck shaft right down deep in my hand. 
I can't say that I use the same method in all situations.

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## Barbara Shultz

Thanks! I'm guessing by the number of hits this thread has (over 1000) that either there are LOTS of female mandolin players lurking, OR guys read threads about females! 

My thumb pain is down in the lower joint and the 'meaty' part of my thumb. I *think* that my problem is that I'm squeezing too hard with my thumb AND I have a tendency to keep my thumb like its GLUED to that spot on the neck when playing. I *think* that I need to concentrate on figuring out a way to hold the strings down hard enough with my fingers to get a clean note, with MINIMAL opposing pressure on my thumb, if that's possible.. is it? 

One thing I've tried doing is trying to release my thumb squeeze whenever it is possible; practically taking it clear away from the neck momentarily... when I started trying to evaluate what could be causing the pain, I noticed that I seemed to play with a death grip on the neck.. not only pain in my thumb, but in the joint of my index finger where it joins my hand, from being jammed too hard against the neck. 

So, I've been working on holding the mandolin with my hand in the shape of a "C", with my fingers and palm arched away from the neck. I've been experimenting with my thumb being on the side, not quite up to the fret board; my thumb being further up, the tip peeking over the fretboard, and my thumb being back behind the neck. 

I've noticed that when I'm trying to practice leaving my fingers on the strings (fighting the flying fingers syndrome) I tend to be squeezing harder. I've never seen it addressed when you are trying to not have flying fingers, and it's said to leave your fingers down on the string until you need it somewhere else, are you supposed to keep pressure on it as well, or just keep it there on the string, but not pressing down? It's taken some doing to order those fingers to stay put, and, thus far, near impossible to make them stay on the string, release pressure, but exert pressure with the next finger.... is this what I should be aiming for? 

As I've said before, I am playing melody of celtic & old time music, not bluegrass, not chop chords, no breakneck speed.

Thanks for ALL the help!!

Barbara

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## Jonathan Peck

Too much tension!!! Try this as a warm up - For twenty minutes play slowly and as sofly (quietly as you can). Let your fretting hand and picking hand be as soft and relaxed as possible. Don't squeeze the neck, don't squeeze the pick, don't push down hard with your fingers on the fingerboard. Feel the relaxed back and forth motion of you wrist - it's OK if the pick falls out of your fingers. Check your shoulders and make sure that they are relaxed as well.

As far as keeping your fingers down, I fret the note and keep the note fretted - that is, I don't have to do anything to to pick the note again except lift my next finger. This is difficult to do at first without tension, so play very slowly and relaxed. The more relaxed your hand is, the less tension you'll have and the more finger independence you'll also have....except this isn't enough - you won't be able to do this w/o tension until your fingers stretch out, so practice for a few minutes everyday, or better yet, find a song that incorporates this excercise in it. For example I like the 'B' section to Big Sciota.

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## Barbara Shultz

Thanks again! I will keep this ALL in mind. I am lucky enough that on most days, I can spend about 4 hours practicing. One complaint that my co-band members have about my playing, that I've been working on is PLAYING LOUDER! So, once I master the practice tips you've given me, I need to figure out just HOW you play LOUD without tension! Any pointers on that one?

Barb

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## Jonathan Peck

Yes, if you are not using a heavy pick then try one. 1.4mm is a good thickness for playing with more volume. You could also try heavy gauge strings. Lastly, try different mando's out until you find a loud one. 

For technique, you could use a longer picking motion and use momentum to drive through the strings. You can still do this from the wrist, but you could also add a little arm motion to help drive the pick. 

Also, make sure you move you whole hand to the string being picked and don't just angle your hand to reach down and get those higher strings. If your palm is anchored to the bridge or just behind it, you wont be able to move you hand so easily.

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## Hondo

Have you tried a low set up and lighter strings? 

Regarding volume, experiment with your pick attack - you'd be surprised what a small difference in angle can do.

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## Stephanie Reiser

The pick selection mentioned above was right on, I think. IN fact, I use a different pick for guitar than I use for mando. You'd be surprised how many people even some guys, use such wimpy picks with barely any mass to them. For starters, I would not go with anything thinner than a 1.14mm. The right pick can make your instrument sound entirely diffferent.

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## mandogerry

Oops, hondo just opened another can of mandolin worms....the setup question. Your Bridger might be similar to my two Webers (and maybe others). Both are A models, and both bridges were originally set up too high for my taste. Even the adjustable bridge on the Hyalite couldn't drop down quite far enough. So the trusty sandpaper came to the rescue again, shaving off just a wee bit at a time off the base, very gently. If you go too far, you will create string buzz against the frets, and have a nasty mess if your bridge isn't adjustable so you can raise it a hair again. You supposedly sacrifice some volume as you lower the bridge, but that beats pain any day for me.

And yes, lots of folks of both genders seem to be looking at this topic. Maybe the "Women with Mandolins" topic has lost some of its recent steaminess.:D

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## Barbara Shultz

Let's see, I've been using 1 mm pick, but I looked in my vast pick collection, and found one 1.5 mm pick, so I'll give that a try. My Bridger does have an adjustable Brekke bridge, and I've fiddled with that, but can't really tell any difference. Man, getting out sandpaper and trying that, that's kinda scary! I'm not sure what strings I have on here right now, I've bought a variety of strings, and have tried different ones each time. I can check tomorrow when I go to practice with my band, that's where the book is that has a record of when the strings were changed, and what I put on them. 

I know that as much as I've been trying to figure out just the position/technique for my left hand, then I've got the whole RIGHT hand to work on! I realize that the tiniest change in angle, just how you hold your pick, etc., makes a huge difference in how it sounds.... up to this point, I've played with my fingers curled under in a loose position, but I'm trying to change that to where the three fingers are in a relaxed but 'extended' position, to see if that makes a difference. I had been 'loosely' anchoring my right hand on the 'weber wood nymph' that is mounted on the strings behind the bridge; anchoring isn't really a good description, I had been very lightly having the base of my hand near my wrist, touching it, to give me a reference point of where I was, but I've changed that. I have an armrest mounted, and where my arm goes across that, is the only 'anchor' I have now. I do move my whole hand from string to string, not just angle my hand. I know that this is like being able to pat your head and rub your stomach... the real challenge for me, is to try to increase the momentum of my stroke, without increasing the pressure that my left hand exerts on the fingers, and the grip I have on my pick!

Who knew that learning the songs would be the EASIEST part of playing the mandolin!!

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## Jonathan Peck

Being a hockey player, I had a natural golf swing and could hit the ball a country mile straight down the fairway...then I started to analyze my golf swing and it took all the fun out of playing the game...not to mention that my game fell apart.

The best advice I can give you is when you practice, practice good technique...but when you play, just play and don't worry about it. Good technique comes with time, and growth comes in incremental steps. When you practice technique, try and work on one thing at a time and then build on that as it becomes natural and you don't have to think about it anymore.

Also, if you're playing 4hrs a day, you might get more volume if you change your strings every 2-3 weeks. When I practice alot, my strings go dead in a couple of weeks. When I play out alot, they go dead even faster. OTOH, some players prefer dead strings, so I guess it's personal preference.

As far as set-up - It might be a good idea to bring your mandolin in to a luthier and have it looked at/adjusted to maximize ease of play. My first mandolin was a Weber and I was getting shooting pains in my fingers all the way up my arm until I had it set-up locally....then it played like buttah'

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## Barbara Shultz

Thanks again, for ALL the advise. I get together with my fellow band members usually twice a week, and we play; and it's great fun, and when I'm there, I just am thinking about our playing together, and don't get to think much about the little things, that we've been talking about today But, I feel that the problems that I have, are due to minute things that if I try to figure it out, adjust them, will improve how I play. I've been working on these individual things all day, while these posts have been going on... I'll play s-l-o-w-l-y, concentrating on just my left hand, repeatedly. Then, speed it up. Then, I'll play the same thing, this time concentrating on my RIGHT hand. FWIW, the song I've been practicing while doing this has been Carolan's Concerto... and it's been fun!

Thanks again, Barb

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## Stephanie Reiser

Well, we have examined this issue quite extensively. One last bit of advise that I can give you is to perhaps go to a good mandolin instructor, and perhaps he can help you with your technique, and even comment on your instrument's set-up. I had been playing along merrily for years until I had the opportunity to take a 3 hour lesson from Mike Marshall. Boy, he showed me alot of what I was doing wrong, everything from holding the pick to holding the neck. I had thought I was something of a hotshot on mando, but he really helped me quite a bit. I would reccommend something like that to you, perhaps. You are probably a good mandolinist, but we can all use a coach at times, to observe and point little things out.
Maybe this is not a good analogy, but even the best baseball pitchers have coaches who observe them and help them with the minutia or their mechanics.
I'm sure you are doing most just fine and can play many of us into oblivion.

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## Bruce Evans

I play a lot more ukulele than mandolin. I have a ukulele playing lady friend who is not only well endowed, she is robust. She simply lays her uke horizontally on "the top shelf," as she calls it, and strums it there. Is it the best playing posture? No! Of course not. But, ya gotta do watcha gotta do. 

Her physical characteristics make it really difficult for her to slam dunk a basketball too. On the other hand, it's real easy for her to see where she is putting her fingers.

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## Barbara Shultz

I totally agree with trying to analyze your playing, and trying to figure out where your technique needs improving. I've noticed that many times, on songs, when I seem to find a spot that I ALWAYS stumble, can't get the timing right, etc., when I slow that measure down, and truly watch what I'm doing, I find that it's something like my pick direction! 

I wouldn't be so sure that I could play ANYONE into oblivion! I got started on playing stringed instruments LATE in life, so I'm just putting in overtime, trying to catch up  

Barb

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## JeffD

> but we can all use a coach at times, to observe and point little things out.
> Maybe this is not a good analogy, but even the best baseball pitchers have coaches who observe them and help them with the minutia or their mechanics.


It can be frustrating.

While I need help over here, the coach says I need to re-learn this part over here. Yikes!
 


"You need to breath in during the up stroke and out during the down stroke. Don't hyperventilate during the tremolo."

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## Jonathan Peck

> Thanks! #I'm guessing by the number of hits this thread has (over 1000) that either there are LOTS of female mandolin players lurking, OR guys read threads about females! #


it's a southern thing

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## Barbara Shultz

Jonathan, just wanted to let you know that your tip to keep concentrating on keeping my left wrist STRAIGHT has been MOST helpful in my playing! I knew that I was letting something 'collapse', but now by knowing in my head that it's my wrist, it gives me something direct to aim my thoughts at! BTW, I loved that last photo... while I am in Iowa, I was born and raised in Texas, so I know all about THAT SOUTHERN THING!

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## David M.

> Hi! im over buy Sioux City. You may already know David M. and Jessboo?


And don't forget MAJ34 who's in Iowa City.

Don't know Barbara, but have seen these guys at the Fiddler's Picnic jamming.

Barbara: I'm in Muscatine, so yall ought to come to our Thurs. night old time jams at Round The Bend Music on 2nd street. It can be fun, most of the time. And I'm a transplant Southerner, too.

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## Tracy Ballinger

[QUOTE= (David M. @ April 15 2008, 15:27)]


> I'm in Muscatine


I've been to Muscatine! My in-laws lived in Davenport. But they moved to Florida a year ago, so I don't anticipate returning to Iowa anytime soon!

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## HddnKat

> Thanks! #I'm guessing by the number of hits this thread has (over 1000) that either there are LOTS of female mandolin players lurking, OR guys read threads about females! #


Great thread! #I've had that whole 'positioning' discussion with my instructor, a guy, and finally had to come right out and point out that there was a very different distribution of surface area that I was finding #a way to get around. #I also notice that when I play sitting down, if my knees are too high, then the instrument is a little too high for my right hand, and I find myself shifting everything further to the right across my body to accomodate my right arm. #I still haven't really resolved the best place to hold my A-style when standing, but reading all the discussion here has made me think twice about ever buying an F-style. And then on alternate songs I put 'Mandy' down and pick up a 6 or sometimes 12 string, and open a whole different can of worms.

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## Barbara Shultz

Hi to everyone! Saw this old thread of mine had been replied to, so I thought I'd follow up!

I now play almost all my instruments with a strap, whether I'm sitting or standing. We prefer sitting ('cause we're old and lazy, haha!) but realize that in a performance, standing seems to encourage us to be 'higher energy' (we're not blue-grassers, we play old-time & Celtic, but a little energy there doesn't hurt!). 

I use the strap, and concentrate on my left hand NOT 'holding' the neck, I let the strap hold the instrument. I also use my right forearm, where it touches the mandolin, to help stabilize the instrument. This releases the tension in my left hand. I've been working hard on the position of my left hand, and have seen vast improvements in the pain/tension area, AND in my ability to play cleaner and faster!

I might suggest a way to figure out the best way for your own body, to determine where to hold the instrument. Assume the position (standing or sitting) without an instrument, and position your arms/hands in the most comfortable position, pretending you are holding your mandolin. Keep relaxed, arms down by your side. Make sure your left wrist is straight, or slightly arched (not tilted back like you are holding a waiters tray)and your fingers are arched, like you are holding an orange in your hand. Now, put your mandolin in that spot. I have found, with my left hand, that rather than letting the mandolin neck rest in my palm, I tilt my hand so that the palm of my hand is facing slightly to the right, rather than facing toward the ceiling. I try to hardly even have my hand touching the mandolin neck (although that's hard); the main contact areas when playing are the side of my upper thumb joint, and my fingers; and very slightly the base of my first finger. I have to concentrate on arching my hand away from the mandolin neck, but find that as I am more successful in doing this, the tension melts away!

Hope ya'll are having a good summmer! 

Barb

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## Bertram Henze

To separate the holding-in-place task from the actual playing is such an essential and basic thing in the violin family (in fact it is the first thing I learned in my violin lessons) that I wonder why it is not equally normal in the mandolin world.

And it is not just a female issue - everybody needs that.

Bertram

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## Ken Berner

Another male intruder here (a Southerner), with a reminder or observation or two.

Holding the mandolin back away from the body, produces better tone and volume. This means that we all might sound better if we hold the instrument with the tailpiece end snug against our body (somewhere between the hip and breast), thus keeping the back free to vibrate.

Everyone should utilize a mandolin strap, even if it is just a strip of rawhide, which is just what I use. This will take strain off your "neck hand", which would have also been supporting the neck instead of just making notes. I wear the strap when sitting and standing, the latter being a little more difficult because when sitting I play with the mandolin positioned at more of an angle. When standing I really have to crane my neck to better see the fretboard. I think the only way to avoid looking is to practice in the dark!

I noticed that another Weber owner was having difficulty with high action. My '99 Beartooth came that way and after I lowered the Brekke bridge as low as it would go, I sanded down the bottom of the SADDLE, not the base of the tailpiece. I later found out that STE will provide you with a not-so-tall saddle, which should solve the problem. By the way, this replacement saddle is not notched.

 I hope some of this will be helpful to someone in their playing and I hope that your mandolin journey will be a joy!

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## Barbara Shultz

Ah, the subject of looking at your mandolin when playing! I have found that I play MUCH better when I close my eyes, and visualize my fingers and the fretboard. 

I find when practicing, and I'm working on a certain thing with my right hand (either pick direction, or angle, or whatever), I like to play and look at my right hand, but look at it like I was a different person... OBSERVE what my hand was doing, and concentrate on doing it whatever way I'm trying to practice. When I'm doing this, I totally forget about what the left hand is doing. Other times, if I'm practicing on something concentrating on my left hand, I'll just stare at my left hand, and watch what it's doing.  

When I'm just playing, I find that if I close my eyes, and LISTEN to the music that I'm playing, and concentrate on making the music that I'm playing on the instrument sound just like the music that I'm playing in my mind.... that is when I really enjoy the music that I'm playing. I especially love to do this when I'm playing with my people.... I love to close my eyes and listen to the sound of the music we are making together.... 

I play in a band, and there's nothing like seeing photos of yourself on stage, to get you to give some thought to that! I've found that when I'm looking at my instrument when playing, I look mad. It's just really the look of great concentration, but I end up looking mad! So, it's a good thing to practice NOT looking at your instrument, but rather, smiling happily off into space! You never know when someone might end up taking your picture!

Barbara

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## Jim Broyles

Yeah, Barbara, you look ready to tear someone's head off in your avatar.

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## pasturepicker

If you are singing, you can't look at your hands or the fingerboard and still keep your mouth on the mic. #It's good to practice backup without looking.

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## kww

> So, it's a good thing to practice NOT looking at your instrument, but rather, smiling happily off into space!


There's a mandolin player in one of our local Bachata bands that has the look mastered. He has a way of using his left hand that leaves you convinced he's not really moving it at all ... the fingers move, but the whole back of his hand just stays completely steady. He fingerpicks, so no wide motions of the right hand ... just that same dead still hand with the fingers hitting the string. He just stares into space. First glance, you don't even realize that he's playing, and it takes a bit to figure out where the mandolin music is coming from.

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## Bertram Henze

A good test is practising in front of a large mirror - if you don't get confused by the lefty look of your own fingers, you're disconnected from about any kind of visual distraction.
The difficult part is to stay concentrated in that detached attitude while watching your fingers play - often I can't remember if I played the A part twice already or not...

Bertram

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## zoukie

Look at me on my You Tube:

Susi on You Tube
I do sit down, though. 
But, when standing up, you might want to try to hold the mandolin more sidewards, pointing the peghead sort of forward instead of to the left. Then the mandolin will get away a bit from your body. If you don't know what I mean I can send a picture.

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## ELSOL102

I just started playing mandolin 2 months ago, but I am very busty, and I just let my right breast over the mandolin top...I play standing up in the streets and subways as a singer. Really this is the only way I can do it otherwise the mando is way out in front of me...hopefully nobody notices the maneuver to get it in this position...he he

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## ELSOL102

Oh, I also let the neck go out forwards a bit...this is actually better for the arm too...& let my right breast over the top of the thing...only way I can play...I prefer to play standing up when performing. 
 Regarding pain...proper posture, and exercises...hold arm out straight fingers pointed to sky...bend back fingers slowly...then turn fingers to floor, bend fingers towards you slowly...then, fingers pointing to sky again. bend each finger back one at a time...this stretches tendons. Also shake hands. Take rest periods and rest hands inbetween...do these exercises and shake hands...listen to your body so you don't get serious injuries...

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## billkilpatrick

below is a picture of a pear shaped oud, designed for female players - could be the impetus for some specialized mandolin luthery:

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## ELSOL102

Well this is what they tell you when playing guitar as well...
   "and it's said to leave your fingers down on the string until you need it somewhere else, are you supposed to keep pressure on it as well, or just keep it there on the string, but not pressing down?"
   When I stand I hold the mandolin just under my right breast...seems to be the only way I can do it when standing...I had an A style now I have an F style...and just started playing 6 weeks ago...I play guitar also...I am playing in the streets and subways this way...searching for a way to play 3 to 6 hours without harm...also looking for help to play better...maybe a good DVD...I'm a singer...

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