# General Mandolin Topics > Vintage Instruments >  1924 f5 fern loar signed

## JAK

Spotted at Mandolin Central's website. Brief, but interesting history, and a few good pictures. No financial interest; just interest!

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## Jonathan James

Yeah, the pics are AMAZING. #Tony mentions on his site that he played it out at a private party recently and was blown away...

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## Ray(T)

And only $200!

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## f5loar

I've played this one back when Cain had it and $200K would be a steal for this one. Fern Loars are in a league all unto their own. It's the ultimate virzi Loar and it's got the fern pattern the way Loar wanted it to be.

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## Five

I played it also at the party. Very impressive.

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## hanknc

yep

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## bgmando

For those of us who will never play a $200,000 Loar -- what tonal qualities did this particular instrument have that blew everyone away?

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## evanreilly

Okay, who took the handle off that case??
Otherwise, a rather nice looking package!

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## hanknc

A primo Loar played by the hands of a master ...it just can't get much better than that. I only wish the circumstances had been happier. The Virzi...I dunno...I think maybe it helps more evenly disperse the frequency response. Does that make sense? It was only the second Virzi intact Loar I had been around though. I'll let the experts describe that. I think the provenance of the instrument and the hands who have played it and the sense of it being a historically important instrument were really what made me want to share my thoughts.

Anyways we got to hear it being played by a master. Actually two masters. Tony was on guitar that evening. Jeff Foxall was on mandolin. 

Farewell Ken!

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## f5loar

If you heard Jeff Foxall playing this Loar then you heard it at it's maxiumn capacity for ultimate tone and power. While many here may not know who Foxall is I would compare him to a cross between Grisman,Bush and Rieshman with a bit of Big Mon thrown in. Case handle? Gibson didn't have quality control over their case supplier(Geib)and those Loar handles or many of them did not hold up after 80 years. Many failed after 50 years. I believe it was thin leather wrapped around cheap imported jute cord. They just fell apart from long term use of the sweet from your hand.

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## Five

Very nice summary of Jeff's playing. When the music started I knew right away that this was not Jeff's mandolin ( a very nice mandolin in its own right) however this mandolin seemed to fill the room with its presence. It helps to have someone like Jeff playing also he is a fantastic musician. I am with hanknc on the Virzi, I have only had my hands on a couple.

Farewell to a good friend and mentor

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## Darryl Wolfe

> A primo Loar played by the hands of a master ...it just can't get much better than that. I only wish the circumstances had been happier. 
> 
> Farewell Ken!
> 
> Farewell to a good friend and mentor


Excuse my ignorance, but what am I missing here?

Regards

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## Glassweb

It's nice to see Virzi Loars finally getting the respect they have so long deserved. You can be sure that if Monroe's mandolin had a Virzi in it (and he didn't rip it out) all the grassers would be seeking out the Loars with a Virzi. Sure, the Virzi works better in some mandolins than others, but the ones in which it functions effectively have shown time after time to have exceptionally beautiful tonal qualities and response. Ultimately, it all comes down to the individual instrument... but there's no reason for any dealer or collector to diminish the value of a Loar F5 just because it has a Virzi installed. In fact, I'd devalue the ones from which the Virzi has been removed just on the originality factor. Any agree/disagree?

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## mandophil(e)

I think if a Loar had a virziectomy 20 years ago, it is what it is. #I would certainly hate to think of anyone considering a removal at this point. #

I agree with Glassweb--there are some killer virzi'ed Loars out there. #I think people are starting to wake up and realize how incredible these instruments are. The ones I've heard/played don't take a back seat to any other Loars--plenty loud, great cut, and incredibly sweet, complex tone.

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## hanknc

Darryl, the circumstance to which we referred was the recent passing of a dear friend's father and the funeral services which we attended.

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## Darryl Wolfe

Thanks Hank. I thought maybe I had missed something closer to home/someone I was acquainted with. Regards

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## chris

I had this posted in the builders section. 
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is a short story you may enjoy.
This summer one saturday morning, I was plying my Virzi Loar on the front step. I was not pikin loud nor hard. The neighbor girl named CJ rode up on her bicycle and said hi Chris. I asked what she was up to and she replied, I thought I would come over and listen to to play. I asked CJ where she was when she heard me playing and she replied, at home in the back yard. # CJ lives almost a quarter of a mile away from me with plenty of trees inbetween.

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## f5loar

Sounds like me when I'm pickin' my Virzi Loar on the front porch surrounded by the Black Mountains of North Carolina.
It just bounces off the mountain tops and I can hear the neighbors 1/4 mile away clap after each song! I think Bobby Osborne made the best statement in support of a Virzi. He took his out of his Dec. '24 Loar and Sonny told him he couldn't hear it anymore and Bobby had it put back in. Nuff said about the power of the Virzi!

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## mandophil(e)

I play mine on my deck just outside of Seattle, and my friends in San Francisco tell me how much they enjoy it. 

But seriously, the virzi's do something pretty amazing with the tone and volume. You can feel the whole instrument vibrate in your hands in a way that a non-virzi Loar (or any other mandolin) doesn't do.

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## Five

Why does the Virzi have this effect on the mandolin and why do no current builders use the Viriz. Any thoughts.

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## mandophil(e)

Lynn Dudenbostel uses them from time to time. I think virzi's got an undeserved bad rap as "tone reducers" and just fell out of favor.

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## Five

Any reports how the Dudenbostel with the viriz sounds. Does it compare in anyway with the older Gibsons?

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## grandmainger

> Why does the Virzi have this effect on the mandolin and why do no current builders use the Viriz. Any thoughts.


Jamie Wiens also uses Virzi (codenamed Wienzi  ) as are a few other builders. There are *MANY* threads about Virzi and their "benefits" in the Builders area. Here is a selection...
 
Germain

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## Soupy1957

Well, ya'll talked about the $200K Gibson, but nobody posted a link to see it????
  -Soupy1957

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## Jonathan James

go to: www.mandolincentral.com

and check under Vintage Instruments...

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## Jonathan James

Looks like this beauty is "On Hold". Congrats to the lucky buyer...

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## dryseptember

Hey, what number was this one?

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## don richards

To f5loar(above): "....Sonny said he couldn't hear it.." ya' beat me to the punch.., errrr post. Sonny in "true form" - Yep! 'nuf' said. Moose.  #

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## JAK

Looks like it went from "hold" to "sold" as it no longer appears on their list of mandolins for sale (Gryphon Stringed Instruments).

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## f5loar

What Fern Loar are we talking about here? Starts out being at MandolinCentral and ends up being sold at Gryphon?
Same Fern?

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## dryseptember

i didn't see a fern at gryphon. I thought that the Loar at Gryphon was a flower pot.

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## JAK

The Loar at Gryphon was/is a flower pot. It was a different instrument than the one at Mando Central, if I'm on track here....

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## JAK

Whoops, my mess-up when I recently posted the Loar at Gryphon was sold; got it mixed up from the one at Mando Central. Anyway, the one at Gryphon was listed at 175K, the one at Mando Central was, I think, listed for more. In any case, from viewing both websites it appears that they are both gone.

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## Darryl Wolfe

The one at Gryphon was the one our late friend Cliff owned. It is indeed gone and presumably sold. The one at MandoCentral has changed hands a couple of times, and I believe it was the Benny Cain slightly restored Fern Loar.

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