# General Mandolin Topics > Looking for Information About Mandolins >  Fullerton mandolins - just the instruments

## Rick Cadger

if it's ok with moderators, i'd like to start another thread where we can discuss these instruments. just the instruments, not the pros and cons of various retailers. a bunch of us have bought, or ordered these mandolins, and those of us who have received them so far are very impressed.

please would those who got the other thread locked refrain from ruining this one as well. it'd be nice for those of us with a genuine interest in these very good value instruments to be able to share info, reviews and experiences.

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## Kero

I was gonna add to the now locked topic, while waiting to my Gloucester, i ordered one of these..

http://www.music123.com/Fullert....5.music

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## ApK

I had posted a link to a clearance model a few days ago and it's already sold out. Had I known the high opinion a lot of folks seem to have of them, I probably would have grabbed one myself (and allowed my wife retailiatory spending to make up for it.)
Has anyone done a direct comparison between the low-end solid-top 
Fulltertons and the laminate Rogue model, which is what I currently have? Do any of you have both?

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## mboucher

I would like to ask the fellow Fullerton buyers have you changed anything yet. i.e. different strings, tail piece, bridge, etc...

I'm still on the original strings. I have ordered an arm rest from Ederly, but it is on back order. But I was interested if anyone has made some significant changes, although I'm am enjoying it right of the box.

I agree let's keep it strictly to the instrument.

Mark

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## Kero

> I would like to ask the fellow Fullerton buyers have you changed anything yet. i.e. different strings, tail piece, bridge, etc...
> 
> I'm still on the original strings. I have ordered an arm rest from Ederly, but it is on back order. But I was interested if anyone has made some significant changes, although I'm am enjoying it right of the box.
> 
> I agree let's keep it strictly to the instrument.
> 
> Mark


I have a spare set of Thomastik waiting for the Fullerton :-)

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## Rick Cadger

> I would like to ask the fellow Fullerton buyers have you changed anything yet. i.e. different strings, tail piece, bridge, etc...
> 
> I'm still on the original strings. I have ordered an arm rest from Ederly, but it is on back order. But I was interested if anyone has made some significant changes, although I'm am enjoying it right of the box.
> 
> I agree let's keep it strictly to the instrument.
> 
> Mark


i have done a tiny bit of finishing on the f holes as they were just a tiny bit rough and untidy. as it plays and sounds so good out of the box i am inclined to forget changing the bridge or tailpiece for the moment.

i still plan to get a bone nut, as i just don't like plastic, but i'm gonna keep the original plastic one as a spare just in case!

bought a hard case for it, and as far as i am concerned, we cookin'!

i gave it a test run at our jam, and it was great. when i took a bathroom break, a friend played it. as i came back into the room i could hear my Fullerton ringing out through the din. it sounded fine!

i'm tempted to get a Tone Gard, and to make an armrest, but the mando itself doesn't seem to need anything changed.

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## Dan McIntyre

ApK, My latest post was in the General Discussion about Music 123. There I compared the Fullertons that I have played ( I still have the Gloucester and tried the Hammonton) against the two Rogues that I have played. My grandaughter and my nephew both have the Rogue A style and I have played them both quite a bit. The one my Nephew owns sounds a little better to me than my grandaughter's but it; may be because he takes lessons and keeps fresh strings on his. But the bottom line is both of the Fullertons that I have played and especially the Gloucester, that I plan to be buried with, are far, far superior instruments than the Rogues (sorry, MF). This is just my humble opinion and keep in mind, I'm no expert, but I'm 58 yrs. young and have been playing guitar for 50 yrs. and mandolin for about 4 yrs. and have been trying to learn the fiddle for about one yr. From what I have observed, the Fullertons beat the Rogues in fit and finish, construction, playability, volume, tone and in every catagory you can name. I also have read some wonderful reviews about their line of guitars and ordered my Parkdale, acoustic/eletric three days ago and it shipped yesterday. I know I sound like a Fullerton salesman but I have nothing to gain by my testimonies, except I hope somebody will keep selling this line of instruments. I'm just a poor, hard working stiff in NW Louisiana that appreciates a good value and if the quality control remains as it is with the Fullertons these are good investments for people like me who don't have thousands of dollars to spend on their hobbies.

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## Eric Selinger

I'm in! Should be here next week, and I can't wait.

Say, Flattop, what hard case did you get? I'm itching to take this on a plane flight or two in the next few months--

--E

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## ejkauf99

I was looking at that model guitar also. Is that real abalone inlay, or Mother of toilet seat? The guitar seems like another great deal. Better to take that out, and leave my Martin home! 
Ed

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## Yeti

I own 4 Fullertons and a Rogue A mandolin. There is no comparison between the Fullerton and the Rogue. The Fullerton surpasses the Rogue by leaps and bounds. As for there guitars I have 3 of them (12 string, resonator, and there all solid dreadnought) I have been extremely impressed with all of them. The only problem I have with them is that I have been pickn' way too much and not getting anything done around the house. It is sad that these instruments will most likely go the way of the dodo.

Has anyone picked up one of the Fullerton Fw35 ? I am thinking about getting one to keep in my bus.

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## ShaneJ

Anybody have any experience with the Fullerton Blackwood parlor guitar?

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## Jim Broyles

> Anybody have any experience with the Fullerton Blackwood parlor guitar?


Yes, it is sweet. I posted a picture of mine in the other Fullerton thread. I paid $169.50 + $19.95 S&H from a seller on eBay. When I first got it it sounded kind of mid-rangy but not honky. From playing it it has sweetened up and is surprisingly loud for as small as it is. I am trying to figure out a way to use it at church when I have to play acoustic.

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## Rick Cadger

> I'm in! Should be here next week, and I can't wait.
> 
> Say, Flattop, what hard case did you get? I'm itching to take this on a plane flight or two in the next few months--
> 
> --E


i just got a cheap f case - a Stagg. they are good, solid hardshells, but the fit isn't great so i'm remodeling the padding inside to give better support to the neck and headstock. also, either the padding wasn't positioned quite right, or the point nearest the neck is a couple of cm displaced from where it would be on the mando the case was modeled on (presumably a Gibson).

still, for £30 it's a perfectly adequate case, and once the padding is reworked it'll be a good one.

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## jim simpson

My Gloucester arrived yesterday. I tuned it up and it sounded fine, I took it to the Thursday night jam and fellow picker "tasted" it and was impressed with it. Another friend called Music 123 and ordered his yesterday. He was told they had 40 some left. I will eventually change the nut and tailpiece plus add an armrest. I am satisfied with it.

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## Jim Broyles

Jim, how was the bridge-to-top fit? Mine was perfect, but I remember that Ray had to have his Hammonton bridge fit to the body. Let me know when you order a tailpiece, maybe we can order two and get a discount. Your friend makes 5 Fullertons in our circle since I got mine.

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## Dan McIntyre

ejkauf, I'm not sure about the abalone on the Parkdale and I don't know realy how to tell the difference when mine arrives but from reading the reviews on the guitars on the www.ezfolk web site, they believe that the abalone is real. I'm also looking at the Montclaire Pro guitar. It has solid rosewood back and sides and solid engleman spruce top and real abalone in rosette and body inlays. I'm still loving my Gloucester. I was spending more time on the fiddles until my Gloucester arrived and now I'm back playing the mando a lot more than the guitar or the fiddle. I haven't customized mine in any way yet. I was using D'Addario J74's and J75"s on my other mandolins and I like that string. I would like to put an Allen tailpiece on it and maybe a toneguard and change out the nut, but I can't seem to find the time right now. Anyway it sounds pretty awsome to me just the way it came. Dan

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## jim simpson

Jim,
The bridge fit was good, doesn't need any attention. I have a 1st generation Price cast tailpiece hanging around somewhere and thought I would put it on. It is one-piece and fairly easy to do string changes. I wouldn't mind having another James tailpiece (like on my Daley) but don't want to sink much money into this one since i have the spare parts to upgrade a little. Even the action was where I wanted it.
Now I will be on a case quest!

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## Dave Cowles

I just opened the Gloucester that I ordered 4 days ago. Now, having both the Hammonton (which has been "played-in" for a couple of weeks) and the Gloucester, I can give a decent comparison. Having only now brought the Gloucester up to pitch, I can immediately tell that it will have a drier, woodier tone than the glossy Hammonton. This, I suspect is due to the satin finish, which almost looks like stained, unfinished wood. There is very little varnish on it, that I can see. Right out of the box, it sounds about 9/10ths as good as the A9's and F9's I've played, with the major weakness being in the bass notes. Intonation seems as good as one could ask for without touching the location of the bridge (the D course is maybe 1-2 cents off at the octave, the other 3 courses are spot on.) 

Fit and finish are fine overall, except for one very small filled area on the inside curve of the scroll. Unlike the Hammonton, this one does not seem to have any tailpiece issues YET. I look forward to spending a lot more time with this mando. I have no regrets over spending $200 each for these Fullertons. # 

Dave

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## hummingbird

Just got mine the other day. I like the appearance, the wood, the scroll, etc. quite a bit (never a big fan of sunburst, the combo of F sytle with very plain detailing really appeals to me, even not having the dots I like). Tone is nice, has a wonderful ring to it. Tuners are not great, but I figure I can get better ones at some later point (any recommendations on those?. Intonation however is a big issue. The bridge is quite slanted, and the inonation is suffering. The 12th fret harmonic is not even close to the fretted note. Can anyone tell me how to set intonation? I've never had do move a bridge before and do this. If I can solve this problem, it will be a very nice instrument and I'll be very happy with it. If not, then I will sadly have to return it. Help, I want to keep my mando!

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## ejkauf99

I just got my Gloucester this afternoon. The bridge was way down at the bottom of the f holes so I loosened the strings, and put it in place. I also had to lower the bridge quite a bit. The sound got better after playing for awhile. I was at work at the hardware store, and it was a slow day so I stood by the counter, and messed with it. The finish is nice except near the scroll where it is blotchy. The ridge on the scroll seems like it may have gotten rubbed, or compressed as the finish is discolored there also. I think I might have been sent a "B" stock instrument. unless this is the way a Chinese instrument is supposed to look. I don't know if I care much about this yet. Other than that it plays great. If it really opens up it would be great. I think that I might try heavier guage stings, and see what happens
Ed

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## Jim Broyles

Hummingbird, this is a pretty easy fix. Tune all your strings down at least a full tone - the notes don't matter but at least F-C-G-D. Put the bridge semi- straight, perpendicular to the strings approximately even with the points on your F holes. Use your tuner and play the 12th fret harmonic and the fretted note on the G string. If the fretted note is sharp to the harmonic, move the bridge toward the tailpiece. If the fretted note is flat, move the bridge toward the headstock. 1/16 of an inch is usually plenty. Check it again. When you have it so that the notes are the same, do the E string. The trick here is to leave the bass side of the bridge where it is and move the treble side, if necessary. You may have to go back and forth a bit, correcting the other when you move the one. Usually, once you have the G and E courses intonated, the other two are also good. Sometimes on a mandolin we have to settle for 3 out of 4.  Tune to pitch and check it again. You should be good to go.

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## Creekster

Okay I blame you all for firing up my MAS, which was in remission. What better than to rationalize something decent,cheap AND with a scroll, right?
My gloucester came in today and I'm in the same boat as Ed above. Splotch on the back (from filling a spot?)slight messiness on the scroll and a smallblack spot on the lower bass side. From 2 feet away, it looks as good as my A9.
No D'addario hang tags and no instructions with the wrench. Bridge slots on the G string are waaaay shallow and the one string keeps jumping to join the d course. Intonation is wayyyy off (28 cents at the 12 fret) 
Filed the bridge to accept the strings, set the intonation per Jb above and I'm off to the races.The bridge is pretty well fit to the top. I lowered the screws on it and the action is pretty good, as far as I can tell.

The thing is loud. Sounds a little tight, but the more I beat on it, the woodier it seems to get. Could be a keeper.

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## ejkauf99

Okay, My wife is an intelligent woman. She was home when the box was delivered so she knew something was up, but I get so many things delivered both to keep, and resell that she does not pay much attention. We were just having some drinks with our nieghbor tonight when I brought out the gloucester and started playing. It took a while but my wife commented that she never heard my playing sound that nice. Now I have A lyon Healy model C, two vintage Favilla flatbacks, Two Washburn bowlbacks, and a
really nice Maurer bowlback. None of them play as well as the Fullerton. Even with the finish flaws I am going to keep it. It's bound to get it's share of dings, scratches so what the hey as long as the sound and playablity is there.
ED

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## Jim Broyles

I'm tellin' ya!

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## Jim Broyles

Well, folks, I tried a Hammonton, because I could pick one up for $179.10 from M123. The fit and finish on this thing was durn near flawless. Had the prettiest non-flamed back I ever saw up close. The scroll was clean, action was close - I had to raise it a hair on the bass side. I also had to loosen the truss rod a little bit and move the bridge a little bit to set up the intonation. Nut slots were good on this one. One thing about the mando parts themselves - the tailpiece cover took a mess of playing with to get it to stay put. Kept popping off. I finally straightened the side of the cover and bent the bottom piece out a little and it stays put. There is a buzz on the open D - I couldn't really isolate it. It isn't tuners or truss rod, or tailpiece, or pickguard. I dressed the nut slots and the bridge saddle slots up and it was reduced, so I figure if I kept it and really got serious about getting a perfect setup, I could correct it. The main reason I'm sending it back is because the top is curling up to the outside of the F holes - the outside edge of the hole sits higher than the rest of the top, more so on the treble than the bass side. That and the D buzz made me decide not to keep it. It was agonizing, because I t sounded pretty good. Not as loud, nor as woody as my Gloucester, but I was going to set it up with different strings and make a nonbluegrasser out of it, even though it looks more BG than the Gloucester. I am still sold on this brand.

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## Eric Selinger

Mine arrived yesterday, to much amusement from my wife and kids. The intonation is a bit off (thanks for the tips on how to fix that), and one tuner a bit less firm than I'd like, but dang, this sounds and feels wonderful, and it's twice as loud as any of my other mandolins. Thanks to all of you for talking about this great deal!

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## Chad Stein

> Okay I blame you all for firing up my MAS, which was in remission. What better than to rationalize something decent,cheap AND with a scroll, right?
> My gloucester came in today and I'm in the same boat as Ed above. Splotch on the back (from filling a spot?)slight messiness on the scroll and a smallblack spot on the lower bass side. From 2 feet away, it looks as good as my A9.
> No D'addario hang tags and no instructions with the wrench. Bridge slots on the G string are waaaay shallow and the one string keeps jumping to join the d course. Intonation is wayyyy off (28 cents at the 12 fret) 
> Filed the bridge to accept the strings, set the intonation per Jb above and I'm off to the races.The bridge is pretty well fit to the top. I lowered the screws on it and the action is pretty good, as far as I can tell.
> 
> The thing is loud. Sounds a little tight, but the more I beat on it, the woodier it seems to get. Could be a keeper.


You guys are definitely a bad enfluence. I've only been playing about a month, and this will already be my second. Like the creekster its easier to justify to myself since its cheap, and you guys are giving such great reviews. Plus I travel a lot for work, this was my first week away from my firefly, and I was craving it every night.  

I figured I wouldn't go crazy if I had to check the fullerton, so why not bite the bullet. On that note I'm thinking of geting a travelite case. Any recommendations on where to get the best deal? 

thanks

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## racer122

Music123 has a nice well-padded gigbag that I use, it travels easy, and is decent protection. It's only about $20, as I recall.

btw, I ordered a Gloucester on Friday. Hasn't shipped yet, but I'm jonesing. (Oh, and I know you asked about a travelite case, but I was making an alternate offering.)

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## Jim Broyles

> ...I'm thinking of getting a travelite case. Any recommendations on where to get the best deal? 
> 
> thanks


$69.95 & Free shipping on eBay.

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## Dave Cowles

I think Elderly has the same Travelite case for the same price. 

Dave

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## Jim Broyles

Dave, it's $75.00 plus S&H at Elderly.

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## Dave Cowles

Oh, well, I'll just add one on to my next big order from elderly of Elixirs for the guitars and mandos - I'll never notice that extra $6.00, and combine the shipping charges. Besides, I'm boycotting Ebay purchases since I had my account hijacked a couple times.  But that's another topic altogether.

Dave

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## Jim Broyles

Well, that's up to you, but I don't think it's eBay's fault if that happens. I have been phished about a half dozen times, both on eBay and PayPal, but I copy the link and paste it to my browser. If it isn't legit, you can tell right away by the URL displayed. I would boycott sellers but not the whole site. I love Elderly. I have bought picks and a Tone-Gard from them, but I honestly can't see spending $11.00 more than I have to for something.

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## Chad Stein

> Well, that's up to you, but I don't think it's eBay's fault if that happens. I have been phished about a half dozen times, both on eBay and PayPal, but I copy the link and paste it to my browser. If it isn't legit, you can tell right away by the URL displayed. I would boycott sellers but not the whole site. I love Elderly. I have bought picks and a Tone-Gard from them, but I honestly can't see spending $11.00 more than I have to for something.


I see Giovana has them for 49.99 before shipping....

http://www.giannaviolins.com/Accesso...olincases.html

Any reason not to get it from them?

Also how do you guys think this would hold up in the cargo bay of a jet if it had to be checked versus a hard case?

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## Jim Broyles

Looks like with shipping it would be $59.99 at Gianna. No reason in the world not to buy from them. I didn't even think to check for Travelite cases there. I would definitely buy an Eastman case from them, and there's no question that when I can afford an Eastman mandolin, I'm having Steve 'voodoo it for me. Can't answer the question about holding up in a cargo bay. My gut says not as well as a hardshell case, and not nearly as well as a flight type case, or a fiberglass case such as the Eastman, or a Calton.

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## hummingbird

Jbmando, thank you so much for the clear and concise reply, that bascially fixed the intonation problem in about 10 minutes, and I didn't even need the tuner! I might tweak it a bit more, but its awfully good now; doesn't play as quite as well above the 12th fret, but honestly I'm not up that high that often anyway. And I think bigger frets might help with that. Really though, I'm quite happy with it. Maybe in a day or so with more playing time in I'll do a head to head comparison with my mid-mo. I can say though that I'm very happy with this one. I also ordered a fullerton classical guitar, should be here tommorow, I'm excited to see how that sounds, and gig bags for both. Just sorry I missed out on a couple of the others, like the 12 string and the parlor guitar. Oh well, I'm still doing quite well for march:D

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## jim simpson

Two friends have ordered Fullertons since I ordered mine. One friend joked that a Fullerton Fest would be in order - another "Loar Fest"!

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## Dan Krhla

You guys stink! I looked at the Gloucester in the past, and went with a Kentucky based on opinion here. &lt;doing math in head&gt; Looks like I might be the next one posting here that I ordered one and am anxiously awaiting my new toy. 

Ugh. 

We need a new thread on the best way to explain MAS, corporate mergers / buyouts, closeouts and 'have-to-buys' to the wives? 

Anyone have a good excuse for me?

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## Joe-TN

I ordered a Hammonton last Friday. Looking for the shipping notice. Hope it wasn't too late. 

WRT Mas and explanations, these purchase should need no involved explanation to one's bride:

It is a shopping truism that most women will immediately pay $2.00 for a $6.00 item they don't really need; Most men will not hesitate to pay $6.00 for a $2.00 item if they need it. 

So any guy who jumps on this bargain is just getting in touch with his feminine side -- see?

Joe-TN

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## Dan Krhla

> I ordered a Hammonton last Friday. Looking for the shipping notice. Hope it wasn't too late. 
> 
> WRT Mas and explanations, these purchase should need no involved explanation to one's bride:
> 
> It is a shopping truism that most women will immediately pay $2.00 for a $6.00 item they don't really need; Most men will not hesitate to pay $6.00 for a $2.00 item if they need it. 
> 
> So any guy who jumps on this bargain is just getting in touch with his feminine side -- see?
> 
> Joe-TN


I'll have to try to re-work argument that and come up with something. My wife is *definitely* not a shopper and I don't want this to cause me problems getting in touch with *her* feminine side.

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## Kero

The Greenwich arrived today (fedex) no mando yet, coming in snailmail for some reason..

Perfect intonation, good lows and highs ..just a touch of buzz on the low e, i'll fix that in a sec, put a string under the saddle..very happy about it. EXP addarios..

for canucks: altough this model sold out..Zero duty on it, 24 bux GST.

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## ejkauf99

Hey Kero. Is that real abalone shell used in the border on that guitar? I was going to order one when I odered my Gloucester, but I have two OM's already. One is a Martin om21, and the other is a 1931 Favilla f-8, a om18 copy. So I was trying to justify buying a Chinese copy of something when I already own the original. I do love pearl border inlay especially when combined with diamond fingerboard inlays.
Makes me get all dreamy eyed! 
Ed

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## Kero

> Hey Kero. Is that real abalone shell used in the border on that guitar? I was going to order one when I odered my Gloucester, but I have two OM's already. One is a Martin om21, and the other is a 1931 Favilla f-8, a om18 copy. So I was trying to justify buying a Chinese copy of something when I already own the original. I do love pearl border inlay especially when combined with diamond fingerboard inlays.
> Makes me get all dreamy eyed! 
> Ed


heck - how do you tell if it's real :-)

i'll snap a pic for you, alrite?

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## Thundercranium

The deed is done.

I ordered my Gloucester today. This is my first mando...I have finally succumbed to the MAS that has been hounding me.

I can't wait to learn how to play it!

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## ejkauf99

kero; The real abalone will have seams every inch or less. The fake stuff is a continuous strand of plastic stuff. a picture would be good. You could post a pic here, or mail it to me a Zygek@optonline.net.
thanks 
Ed

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## Kero

> kero; The real abalone will have seams every inch or less. The fake stuff is a continuous strand of plastic stuff. a picture would be good. You could post a pic here, or mail it to me a Zygek@optonline.net.
> thanks 
> Ed


both me & wife looked at it, with big eyes..:-).i think it's fake..will send you pics tho..

she likes how it sounds, so i will not sleep on the couch tonite..

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## ApK

I'm really regretting not grabbing one of those $49 Nottinghams I posted about last week. I was in the city today and found my self with some time to kill on 48th street so I checked out all the music stores, like Rudy's. Played a couple nice mandos, and then came home to my $29 Rogue...

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## Thundercranium

It's back ordered :-(

I hope I can still get one.

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## Jim Broyles

Where did you order it from, M123? If they don't get any more, go on eBay. There's shipping, but at least you can get one.

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## Bill Snyder

I don't know if they still have them in stock but Woodwind & Brasswind shows them for $199.00 here. Free shipping.

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## Thundercranium

I spoke with 123 and they do have them in stock. The guy couldn't figure out why the confirmation indicated they are back-ordered.

They are shipping it!

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## Kero

> Hey Kero. Is that real abalone shell used in the border on that guitar? I was going to order one when I odered my Gloucester, but I have two OM's already. One is a Martin om21, and the other is a 1931 Favilla f-8, a om18 copy. So I was trying to justify buying a Chinese copy of something when I already own the original. I do love pearl border inlay especially when combined with diamond fingerboard inlays.
> Makes me get all dreamy eyed! 
> Ed


i checked it again in the daylight, it is real..inch pieces..trying to make a closup shot..
Ordered a hard case, this thing deserves better than a ###### bag

better yet, youtube:

(will be few minutes before it is public)

Fullerton Greenwich

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## ejkauf99

Kero: after seeing that video short I called To see if any were left to be had. I spoke with a really nice salesman who said that the last three were spoken for. Then I mentioned My purchase of a Gloucester. He said that alot of cafe members were snatching them up, and asked why. It looks like I made a sale. Seems he's a fiddle player who was looking for a decent mandolin, but was unsure of what to buy. Now he knows. It appears that you got yourself a real nice guitar. Play it well
Ed

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## dlaf

I received my Hammonton a few days ago - excellent build quality and great sound and playability after a good setup. I am returning it for exchange only because the top is sunk very slightly (1/16") on the treble side and the outside of the f hole curled up ever so slightly. Must have been assembled that way because the neck was mounted tilting 1/16" lower on the treble side to match the top - it plays great, but I am particular. Music123 is great about returns, and I am confident that I will receive a keeper to replace this one. Sometimes it takes a couple of trys to get the right one sight unseen.

I bought a basic hard case on EBay for $34 including shipping (seller "musicvalue")

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## Kero

> Kero: after seeing that video short I called To see if any were left to be had. I spoke with a really nice salesman who said that the last three were spoken for. Then I mentioned My purchase of a Gloucester. He said that alot of cafe members were snatching them up, and asked why. It looks like I made a sale. Seems he's a fiddle player who was looking for a decent mandolin, but was unsure of what to buy. Now he knows. It appears that you got yourself a real nice guitar. Play it well
> Ed


Never had an accoustic, "only" classical ones, will try to do so..:-) the G run was the first to learn, right now i'm watching Tommy's Borsalino version(Emmanuel) see if i can pick it out...well..some of it :-)

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## Dave Cowles

Just an update on my two Fullerton mandos: The Hammonton was really nice to have, and got a lot of playing-in. Then the Gloucester arrived. Despite having one hinky fret that needs to be leveled (the 8th), it outshines the Hammonton in terms of dusty, woody fullness of tone. I think the Hammonton is better for Monroe-type BG playing, and the Gloucester lends itself to slower, sweeter playing. I'm keeping both of them, and thinking I should order a couple more to just keep in their shipping boxes for whatever comes up in the future.   

Dave

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## ejkauf99

I just came back from showing my Gloucester to a friend who specializes in building custom archtops, and mandolins. He thought it was pretty cool even though there was some roughness to it as far as the finish around the scroll and binding. He offered to spray a burst around the edges to hide all that. He also offered me a set of gold Gohtohs, and a gold tailpiece, and a F style pickguard that came back to him. Should I, or should'nt I?
Ed

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## Dave Cowles

Adding the burst to it would be strictly a matter of taste. I prefer the way mine looks out of the box, warts and all. I've found the tuners to be more than adequate, but the Grovers would surely be an improvement, as would the tailpiece. The factory tailpieces are junk, IMHO. I'll pass on the pickguard. I immediately removed the one that came on the Hammonton.

Dave

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## Jim Broyles

Do it, ej. You want to anyway, right?  Seriously, if it's a cast tp I'd switch mine in a minute. The stock one is pretty junky. Tuners - yes, these are adequate, but low end. Guard, I'm ambivalent - I like how they look in pictures, but I'm not crazy over them on my mando. Do you beat your mandolin? If so, do it if only to protect it and hold value. Burst finish - why not? It would certainly make your Gloucester stand out in a Fullerton crowd!!

BTW, I just ordered a Fullerton electric bass and if I like it, I'll sell my Turser Beatle bass copy. I wish my Hammonton had worked out, I did like how it looked and sounded.

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## Dan McIntyre

My Parkdale came in last Saturday and it is absolutely beautiful! It's the Fullerton top of the line Acoustic/electric. Solid Spruce top, solid walnut back and sides. It has real abalone border and diamond fingerboard inlays. Really stunning! It came out of the box with a great set-up, tuned down about half a step on each string. All I did was tune it up and the action was very low and easy to play with no buzzing anywhere! It played easier and sounded as good acoustically as my 1983 Gibson Gospel acoustic. I pluged it in to my Fender Princeton and the electronics are awesome, with great controls and easy access to the battery. I took it to church Sat. nite for worship band practice and played through the house system and everyone loved it. I took it by my son's house on the way home and let him play it (He's the real guitarist in the family) and he was astonished! He said he doesn't understand how they can manufacture a guitar this nice and sell it for $99 and free shiping that sounds and looks as good as guitars costing 2K to 3K. I'll take some pics and try to put them on anoather post later. I'm still loving my Gloucester more and more each time I play it. I'm thinking like Dave, I may need toarder another and keep it stored away for later! Dan

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## racer122

Got my Gloucester today, here's a quick review:

- Cosmetically I'd call it a 5 mph mandolin: It looks good going by at 5 mph. The finish is iffy around the corners of the neck / body joint, one of the points, and just here and there. It doesn't appear to have received much of a final sanding, as it is pretty rough in spots. 
- Sound: Intonation was off a bit, not a biggie. However, once it warmed up (I live in Aspen, it arrived at about 40 degrees) the sound jumped out of the mandolin. Really, really nice, woody tone, as others have described. Excellent volume / projection.
- Construction: Has a real solid feel. Good neck for my tastes, not so tiny and thin like some of the high-end models I've played, it just has a "right" feel. Also, feels really solid. 

I showed it to a mandolin friend (plays a Collings F that was hand-picked for him off the floor by Bill himself), and he was very impressed with the look (kind of given that it was a 5 mph look - ha) and the sound. 

Overall I'd give it high marks for sound. I'm a little sad that the finish wasn't a little better, but after all, it is an instrument, which should be more about sound than looks, IMHO.

We have a rehearsal tonight, so I'll be plugging it in via a Schertler, so I'll get another feel for it tonight. All in all, I'd say a real bargain.

----------


## AB Smith

Alright - been away for a little bit but I'm really happy to see a Fullerton thread.

I live in Fullerton, California so the model had a bit of a good selling point for me. I'd done a ton of research into models ranging from really inexpensive to about $1,000. I was particularly enamored of the Michael Kelley Dragonfly (love that vine-inlay since I have an electric guitar with a similar pattern. But then I started hearing some not-so-great stuff about the Kelleys so I decided to go with the Gloucester. If I didnt like it, heck I could just return it.

It took a while for me to get used to playing a real mandolin (started on an Ovation which is really just a tiny guitar with 8 strings). And I found myself baffled with stringing and bridge setup. I was able to quickly get everything up and running and evaluate it.

I loved the almost unfinished look of the instrument. The F-holes were a tiny bit ragged but I know I can get some fine-grain sandpaper and fix that. I noticed some areas on the body (joints) where the finish wasnt perfect but you really need to look at it with a microscope to notice.

I found a super-nasty flat spot on the 8th fret on the A string. I had to play with the mando for a couple of hours adjusting bridge height and location but I was eventually able to get all the strings sounding like theyre supposed to.

I am really impressed with the quality for the low cost. I was at the Temecula Bluegrass festival a couple of weeks back and I jammed with 5 different groups and was able to hold my own with all of them. The instrument has good projection (I dont use a Tone Gard) and looks fantastic.

Highly recommended at the price.

alec

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## Lee Callicutt

> The Greenwich arrived today (fedex)


I have reason to believe that the last Greenwich is headed my way. It disappeared from their website shortly after my order was confirmed. Haven't told the wife yet. I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it's going to be cool. Haven't had a decent steel-string acoustic in many a moon.

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## Creekster

Okay, I'm going to say I'm the luckiest guy in the world. Not only did my wife comment on the aesthetics and sound of the gloucester (thought it was my A-9 at first) but even as I type she has picked it up and is playing on it in the other room.

Quote: "You always look like you're having so much fun, I thought I'd give it a try."

I might not even have to return the other one I ordered once it gets here.....

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## ejkauf99

Hey pigdawg: If the wife gives you a hard time about the Greenwich just tell her you know a guy that will take it off your hands. That would be me! If it becomes a poblem just let me know. I missed my chance to score one for myself.
Ed

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## Lee Callicutt

> #I missed my chance to score one for myself.


I'll let you know if it becomes a serious domestic problem  . For a hundred bucks more, the Elwood Auditorioum looks like a serious contender, and they still have that one in stock. And the Steelman dreadnaught's nice for $99. Heck, that $49 dreadnaught's not bad!

----------


## Yeti

Here is a pic of my Fullerton famley.
From left to right. Winslow Resonator Guitar, Cumberland 12 string, Montclaire solid spruce and solid rosewood dreadnought, and in the middle is my Hammonton Deluxe.

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## Dan McIntyre

Yeti, Please give me your impression of the Montclaire. I have the Parkdale and am really pleased with it and also the Gloucester mando. I've got the $200 back in my paypal acct. from sending the Hammonton back and am seriously considering putting another $99 with it and getting the Montclaire before they are all gone. I already have a Gibson Gospel, a nice Washburn dreadnaught, the Parkdale and an American Strat. but that looks like maybe anoather deal too good to pass up. Dan

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## Yeti

I love it. I'm going to keep it for a very long time. It sounds grate, looks great, sounds great, plays great did I say it sounds great? The lows and highs are very clear. The neck fells so smooth. Out of the box the action is low. Good for finger pickn'. I changed out the strings to elixirs and now have a little buzz. I'm going to get the action raised ASAP. I think Montclaire and I are going to be good friends for a long time. It makes my Seagull sound like a Wal-Mart guitar. It is a well worth it.

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## MikeEdgerton

There is one more Fullerton Gloucester available at Music123 than there was last week. I sent the one that I ordered back. It's not that it was awful, it was ok. The fit and finish was less than spectacular but I expected that. Honestly the sound was just thin. I was looking for a festival mandolin that I could take to Windgap/Mudgap this year instead of my Gibson. I didn't expect it to match my Gibson or my old Eastman but I did expect more given the rave reviews it got here. I'm assuming I got the only bad one they ever made. Now I'm sweating out the return policy at Music123. It may cost me a bit to send it back. I already paid the freight going back and I'm waiting to see if they hit me with the re-stocking fee they list in the fine print. Music123 is owned by Guitar Center/musiciansfriend. I would say that the fire sale they are having on this line does not bode well for it's future. Hopefully your instrument fits your needs. Caveat emptor.

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## Dave Cowles

Sorry yours didn't measure up, Mike. The Gloucester I have sounds anything but thin. It certainly can't compete with my handmade F5 in the tone department, but it is a good measure better than any other low budget mando I've played, with the exception of one particular Rover which has had a James tailpiece and Brekke bridge added to it.

Dave

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## Jim Broyles

Yeah Mike, I know of three in my circle of jammers here in SE Pa, and we all love ours, and mine in most definitely NOT thin. Sorry yours was.

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## AppBrookie

I got mine earlier in the week, I am very impressed, this thing is LOUD!!!!!!!  I have had a Kentucky 675, Rover F(75, I think), Morgan Monroe MM-8, and the Gloucester blows them out of the water for 1/3-1/2 the price. I love the plain satin finish. I highly recommend this mandolin, I don't think you can beat it for $200.

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## Dan McIntyre

Mike, Just a note on the refund process at Music 123 (Woodwind and Brasswind). I sent the Hammonton back and got an email confirmation in about three days. I didn't see my paypal acct. adjusted and after two or three more days, I contacted them by phone (customer service dept.) and the representative looked up the order number and said I had a store credit for the full amt. and all I had to do was request it be put back in my paypal acct. She took care of it for me.

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## MikeEdgerton

Thanks for the tip Dan, I'll call them tomorrow. By the way, I've found that you are better off communicating with these folks via the telephone. I'm still waiting for an answer to the e-mail I sent them regarding how to return something. After several days of not hearing from them I called. They've received the mandolin back and did acknowledge that via e-mail.

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## Tighthead

Just a quick not to point out that according to the conversation that I had with a customer service rep, the one that MikeEdgerton sent back will be considered by Music123 as one of the "B-Stock" instruments. They call them "used." Just a head's up as I thought the "b-stock" designation must mean "blemished" but it actually means customer returns or instruments from the retail store floor.

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## MikeEdgerton

You'll know if you got the one that I sent back. The builder took the time to write the mandolin tab for "April in Paris" inside with a Sharpie before they closed it up. Just check it with a dental mirror and a light when you get it.

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## gospelman

I just took the plunge and ordered a Glouchester. I hope I get a good one and not a mandolin that one of you guys have already sent back. They wouldn't do that, would they?Anyway, I'm excited about getting a quality mandolin for a reasonable price.

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## Ed Lutz

I ordered a Fullerton Glouster (sp)? today. It's supposed to be here by this Friday. Hope it turns out OK. I had been at M123 several times in the past and poised at the checkout but lost my nerve each time. Today I panicked and jumped in to the fray. Us folks on a limited budget have just been given an opportunity to get another mandolin and have a reasonable amount of confidence in the product.

Interesting enough they did not have a case in their selection that would be needed for the mando. I jumped over to Musician's Friend and bought a nice hardshell for it. I will report the success or failure of this whole adventure in the coming weeks.

Thanks for everyone who has commented on this instrument. It helps to hang out here at the cafe and not have to go in completely blind. Special thanks to the moderators who provide the forum.

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## ApK

> I ordered a Fullerton Glouster (sp)?


Hey there, Shipmate,

I called m123 again on whim on Friday and found out they had the Nottingham available, even though it's gone from the website. Should ship out to me today, they tell me!

I see most folks here are talking about the more expensive F models...I hope the low-end A's are also good!

IT2 ApK, USNR

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## Ed Lutz

Apk,
thanks for the comment. I like my Kentucky 250S I have had for two years. Just replaced the strings on it and it seems to get louder as we age together. I hate to put it down but just couldn't wait to get an F style to see how it sounds. I have played a Gibson A9 and they just blow me away. They are loud and sweet but can't justify the cost. Hope you get a sweet A model. What kind and type of mando's do you have?

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## ApK

> What kind and type of mando's do you have?


THIS ONE.
Got it on sale for $29.
As you might suspect, mando is not my main instrument.
If the Notting ham doesn't work out as enough of an imporvement, I'm considering the Kentuky 250s or possibly the 162. But I hope the Nottingham works out....

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## Ed Lutz

Apk,
The link led me to a Rogue RM100. Is that the Nottingham?

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## aries753

Sign me up too!
I ordered the Glouster on Friday from WWBW in South Bend IN. I called them today because the preauthorized amount against my account that had been there all weekend disappeared. Found out it's shipping today FedX from SB and could be here tomorrow. 
While we were talking the sales rep did a quick check and told me that they had 34 of these in stock and 9 of them were going out today. 
This is either a heck of a deal or a very good marketing plan.:D 

As long as it plays and sounds good I'm happy

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## ApK

> Apk,
> The link led me to a Rogue RM100. Is that the Nottingham?


Man, I hope not.

The Rogue is what I have.

The Fullerton Nottingham is what I just ordered.

I'm hoping that the solid-top Nottingham is a noticible step up from the all-laminate Rogue.

ApK

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## Ed Lutz

Aries753,
I sure hope we get decent mandos. You'll get to preview yours first. Tell us about it when it comes in. Also, do you other mandos? I mentioned I have the K250s but also have two fiddles. I haven't touched them since I picked up the mandolin. Probably sell them one day. Maybe fund another mando purchase in the future.
Cheers.

Apk,
Hope your Nottingham is the step up you expect. Let us know.

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## RichM

I just noted that all of the Fullerton mandolins are part of a 10% off sale at Music123. That takes the Gloucester down to $179.99...

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## MikeEdgerton

The regular price is down to $189.00 minus the 10%. Shipping is still free. That's $170.10 or less than half of the original price.

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## Kero

According to my dear son a box waiting for me @home, 'looks' like a mandolin is in it...Yupieeeeeeeeee, stay tuned :-)

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## Rick Lindstrom

I've had my Gloucester for a little over a week. Funny thing about it is that a crack opened under each bridge foot when I brought it up to pitch- about an inch and a half long and headed toward the fingerboard end.

I'm not really too incensed about this, more like mildly amused, because this is just another data point to add to what has been an extraordinary fooforah over these mandos. I'm pretty sure that their "45 day guarantee" will cover it, and even if it doesn't, well it's not that much money anyway. I'm almost inclined just to keep it because, in truth, I like it better than my Weber Bridger or my Breedlove KO. It plays easier, and to my ear sounds nearly as good as either of those two. What a hoot.

Anybody else had cracks in the top?

Rick

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## Jim Broyles

No cracks in mine Rick. As far as I know, I have the "oldest" Gloucester on the Cafe. I got mine in November. I'd send it back. They'll send you a RMA number to get a label at FEDEX. Looks like they should even have to refund you a little money if they're down to $170 now.

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## Jim Broyles

Oh, by the way, a foofaraw (I'm not being smart, that's the only spelling I could find) is defined as 


> great fuss: a great fuss over something trivial


 I'm pretty sure seeking a good sounding and playing mandolin at an affordable price is not trivial to most of us.

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## Kero

Love it.

Tuned it up, just moved the bridge over a bit for intonation, height was almost perfect, very good sustain, easy on the fingers.

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## RichM

> The regular price is down to $189.00 minus the 10%. Shipping is still free. That's $170.10 or less than half of the original price. #


The mandos priced at $189/$170.10 are open box models; the new models are $199/$179. Given that open box models are inevitably returns from someone who wasn't happy with their mando, I'd pony up the extra $8.90 for a new one (and did!).

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## Dave Cowles

RickinFL, I haven't seen any structural flaws in either my Gloucester or my Hammonton. At the price, I agree it's tempting to just keep it, but those cracks will creep, and in a short time your cheap mando will be expensive kindling. Send it back. BTW, I think it's quite telling that you think your Gloucester sounds as good as a couple other mandos with a much pricier logo attached. Although we may be taking a ribbing and generating some snickers from some folks for snapping up these cheapos, #we're ahead of the curve on these, IMO. I'm just waiting for the "Dang, I wish I'da got one of those!" comments down the line. # 

Dave

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## Rick Lindstrom

In reply to jbmando (with due respect and no snarkiness at all intended) -

I used the term fooforah (or however I spelled it) somewhat in a tongue-in-cheek manner. No doubt there are various squires with multi kilobuck mandos who *do* think that an eruption over a sub $200 instrument is a bit of a tempest in a teapot.

I do agree that it's very cool to find a sweet deal like the Fullerton in today's world, and I really like mine, cracks and all. It even has a few finish flaws, but I won't mention those.

Rick

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## Kero

well, the finish on mine ain't perfect, but ...BUT :-)


Fullerton Gloucester

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## Jim Broyles

It doesn't work, Kero.

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## Jim Broyles

Does now.

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## Lee Callicutt

The Greenwich guitar arrived today, and basically I'm pretty stoked! Nicely packed, and detuned a whole step. Tuned up to pitch easily and well and sounding good in less than five minutes. Nicely balanced tone -- though it's not a Martin or a Taylor -- but I do think it sounds better and plays easier than my old Yamaha FG-180, which this guitar is replacing.

I was surprised to see a compensated saddle. Truss rod accessible from the soundhole. I'm not wild about gold hardware, but I think the buttons may swap out easily with MOP buttons -- the gears work smoothly.

The finish overall is very nice for the money. A little thin maybe between the soundhole and fretboard compared to the rest of the instrument, but not a problem at this price point. The inlay at the 17th fret is pretty well botched, but again at this price point I'm not quibbling. Maybe at full price I would, but not for $99, shipping included.

Bit of a buzz at the twelfth fret on the D string, but a little shim under the saddle should take care of that minor problem.

I realize there are those who may laugh at us over this Fullerton phenomenon, but it is good fun for the price point. Now I'm Jonesin' after the Elwood or a Blackwood even. After all, I have to ask myself: If a $99 guitar is this good, how good is the $199 model?

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## M. Hollen

You guys are officially a bad influence on me.:p #Just ordered the Gloucester.

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## Thundercranium

My Gloucester arrived today. It looks great, with only a slight imperfection around the scroll.

I've never played a mando before, but I'm no stranger to them, having played guitar and sung bluegrass with a few great pickers. I tuned it up, hit one of the few chords I know, and it sounded like someone killing a cat. When I checked the intonation I could not get a harmonic at the 12th fret, but I could on the 13th.

Can someone help a technical deficient? Do I move the bridge forward, backward, or up or down? Is there a link someone knows that describes this process?

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## Rick Lindstrom

If the harmonic is at the 13th, you need to move the bridge toward the fingerboard.

A good way to set the approximate position is to measure the distance from the fingerboard edge of the nut to the center of the 12th fret. That distance is the distance that the center of the bridge top should be from the center of the 12th fret. In other words, the 12th fret should divide the distance between the nut and bridge equally.

That's a starting point. Play the harmonic on the 12th, and then the fretted note on the 12th. If the fretted note is sharp, move the bridge a little towards the tailpiece and test again. If it's flat, move it the other way. When it's in the right place, the notes will agree pretty much. I usually use a chromatic tuner when I do this, but it's not that hard to set it by ear. Also, you should have your string height set where you want it before you set the intonation.

Rick

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## Rick Lindstrom

I forgot to add that when setting the intonation, I leave all of the strings slack except the outer two (one of the E's and one of the G's)- this makes it easy to move the bridge. You should set the position for both of the outer strings by testing the harmonic and fretted note. You may wind up with the bridge slanted a bit, but thats OK.

Rick

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## Thundercranium

Many thanks, I'll give it a try!

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## Jim Rowland

Interesting thread. By the way,Kero,your attribution of that famous remark about Kerouac should read "Truman Capote". It was made on the Johnny Carson show.
Jim

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## Rick Lindstrom

I'm adding this to say "kudos" to Music123 for the superb customer service they gave me this evening when I called about the problem with my Gloucester (I posted earlier about a cracked top):

I told them the story and they immediately said "send it back- we'll replace it and cover all the shipping". They gave me a number to take to a local shipping place which will generate a prepaid shipping label, and they are shipping an advance replacement tomorrow. What more could I ask for?

Excellent customer service of this sort is all too rare in today's world, so I have to say "Bravo Music123!". They will definitely stay on my list of people to do business with. Hopefully this quality won't be lost in their new incarnation.

Rick

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## Yeti

Thats cool. They didn't offer me the advance replacement. It took about 2 and a 1/2 weeks to get mine replaced.

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## Rick Cadger

just got a nice piece of bone. gonna carve a new nut for my Gloucester this evening. wish i could source a decent cast tailpiece in the UK. any suggestions without having to order from USA?

i was going to put a more expensive bridge on it, but the more i play it the more i think the current one is doing a fine job. guess i'll leave it unless i decide to swap out for a Fishman pickup bridge.

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## Kero

> Interesting thread. By the way,Kero,your attribution of that famous remark about Kerouac should read "Truman Capote". It was made on the Johnny Carson show.
> Jim


Truman was a thief :P

btw: David Susskind's show, not Johnny's

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## Ed Lutz

OK...here it is. I ordered it on Monday this week and it came an hour or so ago on Thursday. And I could not be more pleased from the start of the ordering process to receipt of the Gloucester and it's out of the box setup. This mando is loud, the sustain is terrific and the fit and finish is greater than I could even imagine for this price point. There is only one place, near the neck and where it joins the body on the G string side where there is a small place which is an off color stain. Also the f holes have a slightly rough edge on them. But THAT IS IT! ZOWIE! 
The fret board is STRAIGHT, the action is just where I like it, the bridge is spot on and I love the way it looks.
This bad boy is all I could want in my world and exceeds my needs.

Thanks again to the members of the cafe who ventured out and bought one back last year. They bolstered my confidence and encouraged me (unknown to them) about the success' and failures with this mandolin. 

Too me it is an extradordinary instrument for the price! I pray that other folk who have repeated the process will have a fine instrument and the success I have had in this adventure.

I look forward to many happy times and tunes with the Gloucester.

Thanks again everyone and to M123 for making it so available.

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## GypsyWayne

I won't go into a lot of details but I was/am involved with these instruments and sourcing them in China. Xie Xie! All the talk here has not fallen on deaf ears. Can't say what the future will be for Fullerton but all the glowing reviews here do help. 

I was curious if anyone caught on to the theme in the names of all the acoustic instruments? The Batsto should be a dead giveaway. 

Thanks
Wayne

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## MikeEdgerton

They were named after places in New Jersey.

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## Soupy1957

Ok, I did some investigation, and near as I can tell, these "Fullertons" are made in Asia, by Aria Corp..

here's a link to an Aria example:

Aria

-Soupy1957

P.S.: they don't show the Fullerton models, but I note an F-Style there, as shown.

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## Soupy1957

Ok, I did some investigation, and near as I can tell, these "Fullertons" are made in Asia, by Aria Corp..

here's a link to an Aria example:

Aria



-Soupy1957

P.S.: they don't show the Fullerton models, but I note an F-Style there, as shown.

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## Soupy1957

If you had to choose between the Gloucester or Hammonton, it sounds as if MOST of you would go "gloucester." Am I right?

-Soupy1957

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## DryBones

Too bad they don't make them in a lefty

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## Bill Snyder

I am just curious, but what lead you to the conclusion that these are made be Aria? BTW all of the mandolins on Aria's site are mahogany back and sides.

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## Jim Broyles

> Ok, I did some investigation, and near as I can tell, these "Fullertons" are made in Asia, by Aria Corp..
> 
> here's a link to an Aria example:
> 
> Aria
> 
> 
> 
> -Soupy1957
> ...


Holy double post, Batman! Actually, they are probably made by Daewon. At least all but the Gloucester appear to have "Rally" counterparts. Maybe GypsyWayne will verify this.

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## M. Hollen

I am now among the ranks of happy gloucester owners. #It came today and I must say that is one dandy little mandolin. #I couldn't put it down, much to my wife's chagrin. It seems all the "hype" is well deserved.

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## ApK

> They were named after places in New Jersey.


Holy Local Geography, Batman!

Here I am, a New Jerseyian, born and raised and I just assumed they were places in England (which, of course, most of them also are.)

Cool, an additional reason to appriciate my new Nottingham!

By the way, I got my Nottingham tonight! #I'm very pleased. #It sounds noticably better than my Rogue (even my wife noticed the improvement), intonation is right on, and it doesn't have any bad frets or any other problems I could find, and that's all I ask of it.

I notice it doesn't have a truss rod. #Do the other models? #Do most mandolins have them?

ApK

p.s. #I used the Batman line before I noticed jb did as well....

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## Jim Rowland

Kero:
I sit corrected.
Jim

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## MikeEdgerton

You're from Jersey and you missed that?  Perhaps you missed the ukulele they sell called the Secaucus.... (I'm from Monmouth County).

Regarding Soupy's post, I'm gonna speculate on two things here. Number one is I don't think either company listed built them, and the second is that GypsyWayne isn't going to give up the source. I could be wrong and do have an eraser on my pencil although I've never used it.

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## M. Hollen

The Gloucester has one. Most mandos do have truss rods. Some are not adjustable. I don't know about the Nottingham. Maybe GypsyWayne has the scoop on that.

----------


## Kero

> Kero:
> I sit corrected.
> Jim


sit tight alors and grow..:P

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## Jim Broyles

> You're from Jersey and you missed that?  Perhaps you missed the ukulele they sell called the Secaucus.... (I'm from Monmouth County).
> 
> Regarding Soupy's post, I'm gonna speculate on two things here. Number one is I don't think either company listed built them, and the second is that GypsyWayne isn't going to give up the source. I could be wrong and do have an eraser on my pencil although I've never used it.


Mike, maybe not, but the Hammonton is a clone of  this one.

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## Jim Broyles

They need to name one the Boonton, and another the Mahwah.

----------


## Kero

> just got a nice piece of bone. gonna carve a new nut for my Gloucester this evening.


hey flats, how did the new nut worked out?

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## MikeEdgerton

> Mike, maybe not, but the Hammonton is a clone of this one.


And it's also a clone of a few dozen others. The Hammonton never appealed to me in the first place as it is the same as all of the other inexpensive pacrim F5 copies. I can almost guarantee it was built by a different company that the company that built the Gloucester. If you look at the Gloucester, warts aside, it was a closer copy of the Gibson model, right down to the truss rod cover. If you look at the literally dozens of brand names of the inexpensive pacrim F5 copies you'll see that same base headstock inlay along with the rest of the features on the Hammonton.

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## dlaf

The Hammonton that I received and returned for replacement because of minor top sag, was made at the Daewon China factory in Dalian, Northern China. The inspection sticker with the Daewon name on it was on the back of the headstock along with made in china, and that is the Korean company's new China factory. I had an early Fullerton electric guitar Mosrite copy that was advertised as made by Aria.

Other than the 1/16" sag on the treble side ("open box"), the mandolin was excellent - can't wait for the replacement!

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## MikeEdgerton

> The inspection sticker with the Daewon name on it was on the back of the headstock along with made in china, and that is the Korean company's new China factory


That would be proof positive that the Hammonton is the same mandolin everyone esle is selling under other brand names but I still don't think the Gloucester came from the same factory as the Hammonton.

----------


## ApK

> That would be proof positive


Actually, it would just be additional evidence, not proof. #It's certainly possible that the same factory can make instruments based on similar patterns for different companies on different machines with different specs and different materials. #Short of visting the factory and looking, you'd have to have the two instruments on hand and examine them, I think, to be sure.

----------


## jwsamuel

> You're from Jersey and you missed that?  Perhaps you missed the ukulele they sell called the Secaucus.... (I'm from Monmouth County).


It's probably because music123.com grew out of a small retail chain called Zapf's. They closed all their stores and went to Internet only and were based in Cherry Hill, NJ.

I am waiting for the Camden model.  

Jim

----------


## MikeEdgerton

I knew they were originally a Jersey company, I seem to recall early catalogs having an in-state address. You notice they didn't have a Piscataway model.

----------


## MikeEdgerton

> Actually, it would just be additional evidence, not proof.


The point I'm making is that the Hammonton models aren't anything special, they are simply the same model branded Fullerton that is sold by dozens of companies. The Gloucester on the other hand was a new breed. I've never seen another model like that sold under another brand name.

----------


## RichM

I didn't know about the Zapf's connection! I bought a few guitars in the old days from Zapf's in north philly. Man, that was an old-school music store... not many of those left!

I received my Gloucester yesterday, and add me to the list of those impressed with what less than $200 can buy. I'm perhaps not as hyperbolic as some-- it certainly won't replace your Gibson or even your Eastman. However, the quality is comparable to most mass-produced PacRims, and in some ways, much nicer.

The smart thing about the Gloucester is the lack of ornamentation and heavy finish. It has a spare, elegant look very similar to the Gibson F9. And no doubt the lack of half-an-inch of polyester glop covering the mando gives it a tone that's quite pleasing.

My experience was pretty consistent with others. Minor finish issues (some uneven staining on the top and the fingerboard), although the scroll and neck joint on mine are flawless! Nicely finished frets, usually the crappiest thing on a PacRim. Overall, very nice presentation, and very pleasing appearance-- probably the best looking cheapo mandolin I've seen.

The bridge placement on mine was waaaaaay off, so that was the first thing to correct. The action was set quite high, but so was the bridge, so it was a minor task to fix that up. Once I had all that worked out, I tuned 'er up, and.... not bad. Not bad at all. Quite loud, and a satisfying (if not particularly refined) bluegrass woof. A little ragged and not as focused as I'd like, but much better than I'd expect for $179.

I would recommend this mando as a starter or a beater. A world-class instrument it's not, but it meets the basic requirements (intonates properly, holds tune, can be set to playable action), and has significantly better tone than anything I've heard at this price point (although that's not saying much-- I've never before played a sub-$200 F-style that sounded even a little good). 

My final assessment? If you're starting out, you'll be happy with a Gloucester. It meets all of the requirements of a student instrument, and hugely improves on its competition (ie, Rogue, NY Pro, and those mysterious no-name mandos that pop up and eBay all the time). If you're more experienced, go in with your eyes open-- the Gloucester is a heck of a good deal, but it's not a miracle. The value of the Gloucester far exceeds the price (heck, I usually spend more on a case than I spent on this mando).

----------


## MikeEdgerton

> ...it certainly won't replace your Gibson or even your Eastman. However, the quality is comparable to most mass-produced PacRims, and in some ways, much nicer.
> 
> ...If you're more experienced, go in with your eyes open-- the Gloucester is a heck of a good deal, but it's not a miracle. The value of the Gloucester far exceeds the price...


I would agree with all that.

----------


## Kero

> The action was set quite high, but so was the bridge, so it was a minor task to fix that up.


Did you adjusted the truss as well?

----------


## GypsyWayne

Few things...

I will neither confirm or deny sources for the product. 

I'm originally from Jersey as was Music123 and all of these were developed when M132 and myself were still located there.

My intention with the Gloucester was to have an istrument with the same specs as the Hammonton at a lower price point by removing the "frills". Same as the Gibson F9 concept. I'm not a luthier and didn't spec anything out in great detail on construction beyond woods, inlays etc.. Just looked at MANY samples from all over china and chose the best, as well as visiting the factories. Some models, like the Batsto and Steelman for example, has as many as 6 protypes from 6 different factories. 

All of the instruments should have been set up in our shop to when there were received from china. I wouldn't doubt that some got missed or some have developed issues while sitting in the warehouse for a year. 

Neck on the Nottingham should have a reinforcement rod in it, but indeed no truss rod. To be honest I never even noticed that. 

Oh and if anyone has Blackwood parlor guitars, a lightweight back pack style case is on the way! 

I planned on doing a Camden and Newark model but the factory could not figure out how to incorperate the hidden drug compartment and first aid kit. :-)

----------


## MikeEdgerton

> I planned on doing a Camden and Newark model but the factory could not figure out how to incorperate the hidden drug compartment and first aid kit. :-)


Ouch.

----------


## Walter

Will the Newark and Camden models have a compartment for a concealed fire-arm. Or, maybe a pepper-spray-pouch.(?)

----------


## DanPhillips

I'm glad I stumbled upon this thread in my search for an F style mandolin. My Gloucester is on the way! I'm a very new beginner, but I was looking to pay quite a bit of money to get a nice F mando to learn on. This one saved a lot of cash (I wanted an Eastman mandovoodoo'd and may get one when i'm a more experienced player). This is my first post, but I stumbled to this thread from the original, and I wanted to note that MF has an F-type hardcase for 39 dollars + 5ish shipping (which is what i ordered).  40 Dollar Hard Case @ MF. Has anyone taken the plunge on the Elwood acoustic guitar?

--Dan

----------


## Ed Lutz

Dan,
I noticed you ordered the MF 39.XX hardshell case. I just received mine yesterday to go with my Gloucester. It fits just fine except a couple of issues. The case is well made and feels durable for my mando. It seemed too snug at first as the point on the lower body does not have a matching notch for it to go in. But, the lining is thick and plush so it fits in there just fine. There seems to be a little too much height on the neck support (no cradle notch for it)as it lifts the back up and I can get my finger/s under the mando. body. I stow my strap there now. Nevertheless, I will keep it. Love the Gloucester more today than yesterday.
Cheers,
Ed

----------


## ApK

Hmm...Would Steve voodoo a Gloucester?

----------


## Jim Broyles

> Hmm...Would Steve voodoo a Gloucester?


Not to speak for him, but I imagine for the normal price of the process, he'd voodoo any mandolin. I further believe that he would tell you if he didn't think the voodoo would do much good. I am thinking of sending him my Gloucester when the fundage looks a little better.

----------


## Joe-TN

Just FYI, the Hammonton fits very nicely into the shaped Eastman F-5 case (comes with the 515); Steve Perry lists those on his web site at $45.00. I would expect the case would be equally suitable for the Gloucester model.

I'm quite happy with the Hammonton -- different sound from my Eastman 515, and not as fine a finish, but really pretty good. I have no experience with Pac Rim mandolins other than the Eastman, but can't imagine finding any other solid spruce and maple instrument for under $200.00. Don't think I would have considered either the Hammonton or Gloucester at their "regular price", but I'm very pleased with what it is.

Joe

----------


## DanPhillips

Ed,
Thanks for the info on the case. I have an MF hardshell case for my A-style and it has the same issue. I bit the bullet and ordered the Elwood Acoustic guitar as well. I'll give my evaluation (from a beginner's perspective) when it arrives. I don't currently own a guitar, and I couldn't pass up a decent one at that price. 

--Dan

----------


## aries753

My Gloucester came Wed and I finally have had a chance to look at it. Fit and finish are very good, the bridge was way back by the tailpiece, the strings are nice and low at the nut. After moving the bridge and tuning it sounds promising. The low strings are a bit twangy, the strings are almost copper colored. Any ideas on what the strins are?
Has anyone changed strings yet? What brand and sizes are you using? I'm still working on chords so single notes need to sound good.

I also discovered that it won't fit in the Gator mando case that I have.

----------


## Jim Broyles

I think they come with D'Addario J-74s on them. I have had Bill Monroe's (great sound) J-75's (great sound) Fender PB (believe it or not, great sound but a shade bright at first) and a generic set from a bulk seller on eBay, purchased back when I knew next to nothing about mandolin strings - .011, .013, .024, .036 - thin tone, low volume) and my current set - J-74s. The D'Addarios are the only good sets I can buy locally, and they are out of J-75's most of the time. Why won't it fit your case? Too long, too wide? My Gloucester fits perfectly in my TKL fitted (mando shaped hole for the body) rectangular case. Which Gator mando case do you have?

----------


## Ed Lutz

jbmando,
My Gloucester had a D'Addarios tag in the box but no info. as to what they were. I noticed they made my fingers somewhat tender compared to my ghs "bobby Osborne" type. Also I noticed a buzz/brappp when I fret the A string on the eighth fret. This occurs nowhere else that I have found so far. Any thoughts?
Change that to the 9th fret vice 8th. (F#)

----------


## Dave Cowles

That's the same area where my Gloucester needs a fret leveled, except mine is the E course on the 7th fret. Somebody at QC missed those, but it's no big deal to me, 5 minutes worth of work.

Dave

----------


## Jim Broyles

Well, I'd check the action and I'd check the neck for bow. You want a slight dip in the middle of the fretboard. If it's humped up or even flat you will get fret buzz. How's the action? Too low of action will cause buzzing as well. You could have a high fret. Check here for ways to tell: Frets.com setup info.

----------


## mythicfish

Names for future models: Exit 10, Exit 124 ... you get the idea.

Curt ... from NJ

----------


## Jim Broyles

I got me a new Hohokus archtop.

----------


## Ed Lutz

jbmando,
thanks for the information. The neck looks slightly bowed downward in the middle as you suggested, the fret action is perfect for me with no issues with buzzing from the nut not set to the right height. I have to investigate that fret with a magnifying glass when I find it around here somewhere. I can't find my steel pocket ruler right now (It's around here somewhere too) to check for proper height with adjacent frets but that should expose the culprit when that task is completed.

As always, the folks here at the cafe' come to the rescue again. I love it! 

However, DMCowles, what ordinarily takes five min. to do something doesn't work for me anymore. (See above comment on misplaced stuff - ha)
Did you fix your seventh fret? What will you do? Burnish if it is too high, or tap it to a lower height? Sounds like fragile work fraught with Murphy's Law for me.

----------


## aries753

jbmando,

You may be right about the strings, they look similat to a set of J74's that I have. (sometimes I'll buy a random assortment of strings and have not put them on anything yet)and then I forget what strings are on what mando.

My Gator case is the lightweight case that they make. The mando is too long for the case.

----------


## Jim Broyles

Wow, I wonder what gives with that case. If I ordered one off the measurements they list  here , I'd expect my Gloucester to just fit, including the strap button.

----------


## MikeEdgerton

> Names for future models: Exit 10, Exit 124 ... you get the idea


Ok, warn me next time. I almost choked.

Exit 7, Exit 98.

Maybe they could use old chain store names... Bambergers, Korvettes....

(sorry guys, Jersey joke).

As long as they don't name them after former Governors.

----------


## Rick Cadger

> Originally Posted by  (flattop @ April 05 2007, 06:51)
> 
> just got a nice piece of bone. gonna carve a new nut for my Gloucester this evening.
> 
> 
> hey flats, how did the new nut worked out?


just did it this afternoon.

i took the opportunity to lower the action there too. my Gloucester now has the lowest action of any of my mandos and plays SO easy. no buzzes - didn't need to tweak the trussrod at all!

no appreciable impact on the sound, i just feel better knowing the nut is bone instead of plastic!

this was the first nut i ever made from scratch, and a great job i did too! ::modest - not!::

i'll post a pic sometime.

loving this mando!

----------


## Kero

[QUOTE= (flattop @ April 09 2007, 12:46)]


> Originally Posted by flattop,April 05 2007, 06:51
> 
> just got a nice piece of bone. gonna carve a new nut for my Gloucester this evening.
> 
> 
> i'll post a pic sometime.
> 
> loving this mando!


please post..:-) what kinda file you used to slot the not?

i got a decent strap today, played few mandos in shop.. kentuckys, trinity colleges...Glocester holds it's own proudly..first jam will be next sunday..

Loved the Trinity College jumbo frets..soundwise, about the same as the Fullerton.

----------


## Rick Cadger

i got a set of feeler gauges and some nut files from StewMac. i play J74s, and from memory the files i got were .013, .016, .028 and .042.

i reckon this was money well spent. making a nut isn't too difficult if you take your time and pay attention to detail - i took a couple of hours to make sure i got it right, and i had a couple of spare blanks in case i screwed up. this job was going top get done properly even if it took me a week!

now i'll be good for any future nut work on any of my mandolins.

----------


## chaoscat

Ok, you guys raving about these Fullerton guitars, it's your fault. I just ordered a Fullerton Pro Auditorium and talked my son into to buying a left handed Parkdale. It's on your head. My wife says I already suffer from TDMG syndrome. ( too damn many guitars.) I just hope they live up to the glowing reviews.

I did not buy the Gloucester, though it was very tempting. Instead, after visiting a local store, I fell in love with a Kentucky KM 172 - bought it on the spot.

----------


## Jim Broyles

Nothing wrong with an oval-hole A. I wish Fullerton made one. No, I don't, I'd buy it and I have too many instruments already. How does the Kentucky sound? What do you play on it?

----------


## Kero

> .013, .016, .028 and .042.


i just ordered some, did some ugly work with sandpaper on my other mando's nuts-bridges, a fix will be good for those too

----------


## chaoscat

The Kentucky 172 that I have has an amazing sound. It has wonderful sustain and projection. Pluck the G string and it rings with a beautiful tone forever. There is no thunk-thunk in it. I'm a fiddler and guitarist, so I'm new to the mandolin, but I played Fenders and Epiphones in the Sam Ash stores (F's and A's). None of those came close to the sound and playability of this instrument.

----------


## DanPhillips

Music123 sent me the wrong mandolin! Much to my dismay, I opened the box to find a pennington model (i would've kept a hammonton). The sad part is that all the manifests had the correct model number and the pennington box was labeled correctly as a pennington which means they just grab a box and pack it up rather than ensuring they are packing the correct item. They sent me an RMA slip and are giving an advanced replacement (I've received no shipping notice or tracking number). Hope my Gloucester comes in soon! Does anyone know any secrets to get information out of the music123 CSRs? There seems to be a real disconnect between shipping and customer service.

--Dan

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## MikeEdgerton

Don't even attempt to get information via E-mail, you have to call them. I returned a mandolin to them and I can say I'm still waiting for the answer to the e-mail I sent (a few weeks ago) but that they were quite prompt when I called them on the phone. They credited my credit card with no problems for the full amount I paid.

As for the shipping error, they probably pull by model or lot number and not by the name on the box. It can also be that their pick list goes by warehouse location. One box gets put away wrong and the order has a shipping error. There are many things that can go wrong there.

If they ship you a Hammonton send it back for the Gloucester.

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## Chad Stein

Guys help a newbie out who is a new owner of a Gloucester. If you look at my fretboard from the side I can see a gap under one of the frets, almost as if the cut for the fret went too deep. Is that an automatic return? 

Other than that I'm pretty happy with the little guy for the money. But I don't want to absorb a fatal flaw because of my ignorance. 

Thanks

----------


## Jim Broyles

Dan, I second what Mike said. If they send you a Hammonton, play it a little - just enough to get a good feel for how it sounds and plays, but then send it back for a Gloucester. You will be glad, IMO. The Hammonton sounds good, but I honestly believe they hit the jackpot with the Gloucester. I have played two Hammontons. One is a friend's and the other I ordered. I did not keep mine but I A/B'd it with my Gloucester for myself and for my wife, who prefers the sunburst look to the antique satin, and we agreed that the my Gloucester was louder and woodier than the Hammonton. Not that the Hammonton was bad sounding, because it wasn't. We just preferred the Gloucester. I think my friend's Hammonton is nice sounding, but again, slightly thinner than and not quite as loud as mine.

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## Jim Broyles

Steindawg, does the fret flop around, or is it solid? Is there a void in the area you are talking about? Can you post a picture?  How to post a pic.

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## DanPhillips

Thanks for the responses guys. I'll call them again in the morning. I think I will put the full court press on them until I have the confirmation that the Gloucester is shipped as I'd hate to have it sell out while I wait on them.

--Dan

----------


## Rick Cadger

> Guys help a newbie out who is a new owner of a Gloucester. If you look at my fretboard from the side I can see a gap under one of the frets, almost as if the cut for the fret went too deep. Is that an automatic return? 
> 
> Other than that I'm pretty happy with the little guy for the money. But I don't want to absorb a fatal flaw because of my ignorance. 
> 
> Thanks


as jbmando said, a pic would help judge.

that said, you may not need to panic. the fret slots in fingerboards may vary in depth, and the tang length on different fretwires may also vary. so long as the fret is level and firmly seated it is probably no biggie. all else being in order you would never have noticed if the fretboard had been bound.

on one of my old mandolins ALL of the fret tangs finish way clear of the bottom of the slots, but the frets are fine and the instrument is a great player.

can you post that pic?

----------


## dlaf

> If they send you a Hammonton, play it a little - just enough to get a good feel for how it sounds and plays, but then send it back for a Gloucester.


Wow - it will cost full shipping (both directions) to send back the Hammonton. That means that it will cost approximately $40 more for a mandolin that lists for $150 less than the Hammonton. My replacement Hammonton is on the way, and if it sounds as good as the one I returned, I can't see paying more for less - but then I've never been one to think that the lack of finish makes an instrument sound better.

Just my opinion...

----------


## MikeEdgerton

> I've never been one to think that the lack of finish makes an instrument sound better.
> 
> Just my opinion...


I think history has already proven you wrong, but that's just my opinion.

The Hammonton and the Gloucester may have the same brand name but there are a few more differences than just the finish.

----------


## Jim Broyles

> Originally Posted by  
> 
> If they send you a Hammonton, play it a little - just enough to get a good feel for how it sounds and plays, but then send it back for a Gloucester.
> 
> 
> Wow - it will cost full shipping (both directions) to send back the Hammonton. That means that it will cost approximately $40 more for a mandolin that lists for $150 less than the Hammonton. My replacement Hammonton is on the way, and if it sounds as good as the one I returned, I can't see paying more for less - but then I've never been one to think that the lack of finish makes an instrument sound better.
> 
> Just my opinion...


No, it won't. If there is a defect in the Hammonton or if it is the wrong item, they will give you an RMA. I have returned things to M123 enough to know what I'm talking about. Furthermore, the relative list prices mean nothing. In my opinion, the Gloucester is and always has been the superior value in the Fullerton line. It's their problem if the cost of carrying the Hammonton was higher than that of the Gloucester. The Gloucester is most certainly not less of a mandolin, regardless of the retail prices. Further-furthermore this was in response to a customer who bought a Gloucester already and said that he would keep a Hammonton were it shipped by mistake. My belief is that he will prefer the sound of the Gloucester over the Hammonton. I would not tell you or anyone else to send back your Hammonton and get a Gloucester, although, in my opinion, the Gloucester is superior in construction, fit/finish and sound. The Hammonton is shinier and has more abalone and a pickguard. This does not enhance the tone and volume. This is not an opinion, but an observation based on playing them both.

----------


## dlaf

Sorry - I misread the post and thought that he had received a Pennington instead of a Hammonton - that makes better sense. I too, have bought from Music123 ($4000+) and they do have an excellent return policy.

Please explain just how the Gloucester is superior to a Hammonton in construction and finish.

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## Jim Broyles

He did receive a Pennington. He said he was returning it, but would have kept a Hammonton. I'm saying if he _does_ get a Hammonton he should play it but still send it back because the Gloucester sounds better. The Hammonton I received had a top which was warped due to the climate changes it underwent, or carved too thin, but it curled up to the outside of the f holes. If you looked at the mandolin from the end, across the top, you could see that the wood point at the bottom "ball" of the f hole was higher than the rest of the top on both sides. I also happen to think that the finish is too thick on them and that they would benefit by a stripping and refinishing. To me, the antique walnut satin finish is superior to high gloss polyurethane.

----------


## dlaf

Sounds like I might have received your returned Hammonton initially when I ordered an "open box" - it also had some curling of the f-holes. If the new one also arrives with any issues, I will return for a Gloucester. At 2 1/2 weeks wait for the return, I'll keep the Hammonton if it's problem-free.

My comments on the lack of finish being undesirable is really unfairly based on my experiences with guitars (electric and acoustic) over the last 40 years - taking into consideration the beating and subsequent depreciation that they take when there is little protection. I respect your opinion as I have only dabbled in mandolin playing for years, and am just now trying to get serious about it.

Thanks for the info.

----------


## Jim Broyles

You might have. Mine was received back on March 28.

----------


## Jim Broyles

Here's one, private.

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## Chad Stein

> Steindawg, does the fret flop around, or is it solid? Is there a void in the area you are talking about? Can you post a picture?  How to post a pic.


JB I won't be home till Saturday, but I will post a pic then. The fret doesn't move at all, but there is a definite "void" beneath it when viewing from the side.

----------


## DanPhillips

Music123 overnight shipped my replacement Gloucester today. I can't wait to get it! The actual return process was suprisingly easy with their fedex return system. I just had to stay on top of customer service.

----------


## Jim Broyles

I hope their CS stays this good after the takeover. I like this company.

----------


## DanPhillips

I actually think that their customer service will improve. Music123 is slow on shipping things out as there doesn't seem to be much communication between the phone CSRs and the warehouse. Once the ball got rolling they did just fine though. Musicians Friend seems to have much more smooth operation. Orders are shipped much quicker and they have the same trial/return policy. I think if the fullertons stay around somehow we are in for a win/win situation!

----------


## Truckadero

Another happy Gloucester owner here. Also my first post to the cafe. Hello! Have had my Gloucester for about 2 weeks now. The tone just gets sweeter as I learn how to work the instrument and make it mine. Really enjoying the forum. Pick on!

----------


## Jim Broyles

Welcome Truckadero.

----------


## Bike Mike

I don't post often but lurk constantly.
This thread caused a Gloucester purchase a couple weeks ago, and I am very happy with it. It has some finish blemishes, but everything else seems to be in good order. 
  I don't know what kind of strings came with it and it was rather "twangy" at first but after a couple weeks of almost daily playing it is sounding much better.
  I keep it in my workshop where it is handy for 'end of the day plunking around', and will be my traveler/beater/boat mandolin. 
  Happy owner here...

  Mike

----------


## Jim Broyles

They come with D'Addario J-74's, however, used ones which are returned are sold and there is the possibility that the strings have been changed by the person returning it.

----------


## Rick Cadger

on that subject, although the strings on mine when it arrived looked and sounded new, and felt like J74s, i did change them the day after i did the nut upgrade, and a set of brand new, no-doubt J74s have made a big difference! We are now LOUDER than ever.

ABed the Fullerton with an Eastman at our jam. the other mando was oval hole, so there were the tonal differences you'd expect, but to me they both sounded equally good. although neither was on a par with a vintage Gibson, they both seemed easily up to slugging it out with many a more expensive instrument.

i just keep getting happier here

----------


## Rick Cadger

by the way, did i mention what a great job i did on that nut replacement?

----------


## Bill Snyder

> Originally Posted by  (jbmando @ April 10 2007, 22:36)
> 
> Steindawg, does the fret flop around, or is it solid? Is there a void in the area you are talking about? Can you post a picture?  How to post a pic.
> 
> 
> JB I won't be home till Saturday, but I will post a pic then. #The fret doesn't move at all, but there is a definite "void" beneath it when viewing from the side.


The fret tang should NOT go to the bottom of the slot but the slot should not be so deep as to cause concern about the structural integrity of the fretboard.

----------


## DanPhillips

My Gloucester came in today! I love the sound! There are a fit and finish issue which is to be expected, but i love the look and sound. I'm so glad I came across this thread. I saw that some people are replacing their tailpieces on these. What kind of a difference will that make other than visual?

--Dan

----------


## Jim Broyles

A cast, rather than stamped, tailpiece theoretically will transmit the strings vibrations more efficiently due to increased mass and better contact with the mandolin's body. The solid one-piece aspect will eliminate one source of unwanted noise due to buzzing or vibration of the top, plus it won't keep falling off.

----------


## ApK

One peice? #You mean no cover? #How do you change the strings?
I know I'm being lazy here, but could someone please throw me a link to information about these different kind of tailpieces?

----------


## Jim Broyles

Scroll down for a bunch of mando tailpieces.

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## ApK

Whoa. #Almost all of those tailpieces cost more than my mandolin! #Guess I'll stick with stock for right now....

So, as I can glean from the photos, one-piece tailpieces simply don't hide the string connection points, and rely on texture, engraving and other ornamentation to make it look nice?

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## Jim Broyles

The cover keeps the player from getting clothing and skin snagged by the string hooks and the sharp parts of the strings themselves. There is nothing inherently wrong with having the string connections be visible. One of the prettiest tailpieces is the  Hamlett.  Sold by Cafe contributor "Sunburst." $70.00 for a nickel/chrome one. I'll have mine sooner or later. Not cast, but solid and one piece.

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## DanPhillips

&lt;warning - beginner question&gt; My Gloucester sounds great, but the action is a little high. By lowering the bridge would that lower the action? Or will i need to make other adjustments to lower the action but keep the sound correct. Any help is appreciated. If anyone knows of a good mando shop near the Tulsa, OK area, please let me know.

Thanks,
Dan

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## Jim Broyles

Adjusting the bridge will lower your action. Individual taste will dictate where you set the action, but bluegrassers tend to have fairly high action for more volume and better tone.
I just Googled  this.   Might help.

----------


## DanPhillips

Thanks JB, I may just leave the action high, because I really dig its sound right now, and I wish to play bluegrass eventually. Those Hamlett tailpieces look pretty sweet. I think I will save up for one of those or an allen. One more thing, I seem to have a similar gap under a fret as was mentioned above. It seems sturdy, Should it be of concern?

--Dan

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## Jim Broyles

Dan if you can put a picture of it on the Cafe, I'll take a look at it. I'm not a luthier, but I'm a decent woodworker who has played fretted instruments for more than 45 years, and I'll let you know what I think. Maybe we can get a builder to look at it and give us the scoop. I'm going out and won't be back until about 9:30-10:00. BTW, a friend of mine has a James TP and it is SWEET. Just more $ than I got.

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## mythicfish

More NJ-based model names for Fullerton:

The Soprano
The Fugg-ed-a-bow-dit
The Corrupto
And also one named for the state bird: The Mosquito

Curt from Jersey

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## Dave Cowles

Tracy Latham posted this on the Bluegrass Forum after I started a thread about the Gloucester, and he bought one:

"I got my Fullerton Gloucester in yesterday. It immediately needed the bridge straightened and moved so the intonation was close. I'm impressed. This mandolin beats out every new budget F mando I've ever tried in a music store...Epiphone, Michael Kelly, Alvarez, and Kentucky. In fact, there is a used Gibson F9 for sale at the local Guitar Center now that is not as good as this instrument. 

It sounds woody and open, and it has volume. It is louder than the handmade mando I got in trade for my A-9 (a sunburst F-5 copy)...but not as pretty. Where the neck is connected to the Fullerton's top, there is less wood to kill the sound. I think whoever designed the Fullerton did us a service by not including the useless part of the fretboard that sits under the sweet spot on most F-5's and makes horrible clicking sounds when you accidentally hit it with a flat pick.

I was on the hunt for a great budget mando, and this seems to be it. I've not had the opportunity to try an F model Eastman yet, but I'm so happy about the Gloucester, I'm not as fired up about the Eastman."

The beat goes on...

Dave

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## jim simpson

I mentioned in "Groupings" that a friend (okay, RayQ) and I have been calling the Gloucester the "Fullertone". It seems to fit. Ray has a couple of Pricetones.

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## Dan McIntyre

dlaf, I agree with jbmando. If you will call customer service (888-226-3123) or 888-590-9700 and explain your situation, give them the order # and inv.# from the shipping invoice, they will work expediciously to correct the situation without cost to you. They will pay for the return shipping if there is any defect or mistake in shipping. If you are not dependent on the fret inlays on the fretboard, then go for the Gloucester. It has the side dots which work very well for me and I compared them side by side. The Gloucester beat the Hammonton, hands down! I also prefer the F9'ish, plain, uncluttered look. Dan

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## MikeEdgerton

Just a note about side dots vs front dots. You might think you need front dots but truthfully once you start playing you'll never be looking at the front of the fretboard, you'll be looking at the top of the neck. I would have thought I needed those front dots too.... until I bought my first vintage mandolin with front dots and no side dots. I could hardly play it until I got the side dots on it. Don't get hung up on front dots.

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## M. Hollen

I had to send my Gloucester back for an exchange. I had the same issue jbmando had with his Hammonton. The top was curling at the f holes. CS was great. No issues, free to ship back. Now waiting anxiously to get the exchange.

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## Bill Snyder

I am amazed that people actually look at the dots. Maybe it is because I grew up playing viola and then got a classical guitar I just never give dots any thought. I put them on the mandolins I have built because... well because they are on other mandolins I guess, but I did not put on side dots. 

I guess if I ever set out to build any to sell I will need to think about side dots and fretboard dots.

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## Dan McIntyre

Mike is right about the side dots. When you are playing, you are looking down on the top side of the neck and not on the fretboard. Bill, about playing a mandolin without fret markers, I suppose if you have learned to play a fretted instrument without them or have some formal training on a fretless instruments it might be a non-issue but for guys like me who are self taught to play by ear (guitar, bass, mandolin) it's pretty important to have them, at least on the side. It's a lot easier to land in the right location with the moving or sliding chord forms and also much easier to land in the correct "box" when playing the lead patterns and scales. I guess they could be considered a type of "crutch" in a sense. I have seen very talented musicians who can just wail away, and play great riffs all up and down the neck without ever looking at the fretboard. They have such a mastery of the fretboard that I'm sure that fret markers are of no concern to them. For me, however, I hardly ever use a capo, so I use the index finger as a bar and use the "caged" system (moving chord forms) to play up and down the neck (guitar), and I certainly have to refer to the dots often to land in the right positions. Mandolin playing for me is similiar except the chord forms are different but all the forms and double stops and solo patterns are repeatable and moveable so I need to know where I'm goingwhen I'm changaing positions on the fretboard. Excuse the long thread, and this is probably getting way off the subject matter, except to say the Gloucester has the side dot markers and that is basically all you need for fret markers. Dan

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## MikeEdgerton

I've been playing guitar for 40 years and mandolin for about a yearand a half. I use the side dots to know where to start. In thinking about it I can turn off the lights and sit in the dark and play maybe 90% of my mandolin breaks and probably 99% of my guitar breaks but honestly, I'd still need the side dots as a reference on both instruments. If in fact you can play without them I admire your ability but certainly don't aspire to it. If Lloyd thought there should be side dots and Bill never carved them off with his pocket knife then who am I to argue?

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## dlaf

I received my second Hammonton yesterday, and it is really flawless except for VERY slight curling of the outside of the f-holes - mainly the bass side, and only raised about 1/32". If you run your hand across the top, the point doesn't snag like it did on the first one I received (plus the first one's fretboard was tilted to the treble side). Is this anything to worry about? Like I said, after a quick setup, I can't find anything else wrong cosmetically or structurally - plus it sounds great. Nice and woody - but then my last mandolin was an Ovation/Applause!

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## Bill Snyder

Well after reading your posts on side dots I figured out the difference between ya'll and me. Ya'll play better than me.  
I don't think they are a crutch for people that use them. I just never new to pay attention to them I guess. I would have to go grab a mandolin to be able to tell you where they are (except I know there are two at the twelfth fret).

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## MikeEdgerton

If you can play without the dots I don't think I play better than you. I need to look to play.

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## Bill Snyder

You have not heard me play, but the dots would not improve my playing.

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## Rick Cadger

i need to look when i play. side dots are enough.

i would also suggest that fretboard dots are an incentive to hold the instrument at a bad angle

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## relakst

Man, I am a sucker when I hear that people like something. Within 30 minutes of reading this thread, I too am a new owner of a mandolin I can't even pronounce the name for. Any help there? (for the pronunciation, not the MAS. I like MAS)

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## Jim Broyles

You didn't tell us which mando you bought, but I assume it's a Gloucester - 2 syllables, accent on the first one. Pronounce the first syllable to rhyme with "how" - then "ster." GLOW-ster. It can also be pronounced GLOSS ter.

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## relakst

Yes, you assume correctly. Thank you. Now I can tell people what I bought. The Glowster. Can't waitster.

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## MikeEdgerton

How to buy a used Gloucester for more money than a new one.....

Gloucester

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## Jim Broyles

Amazin' innit?

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## MikeEdgerton

What can I say, there's one born every minute  

It's too bad they didn't go out and try to find the price of a new one to compare it to.

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## DanPhillips

Alright, Here are a couple of pics of my Gloucester. One is of it in all its glory and the other two are areas of concern. 
unfinished portion under fretboard

Small gap under fret


Should any of these things be of concern? I love this mandolin! Just put some Gibson Bill Monroe strings on it.

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## MrTidy

I got one also, and mine doesn't have the unfinished area under the tiny extension. Also my fret slots are all filled. Life is good,

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## Rick Lindstrom

Whaddaya want for $200.00?    

In all seriousness, forget about the blemishes and just play it! I've had two now, and they've both had all manner of warts, but it just doesn't matter. I believe the blemishes and flaws will become part of the growing "Fullertone" mystique. Something tells me that these mandos will be legendary in time. Probably won't fetch as much as a Loar, but I bet you'll always be able to sell it for what you have in it(which is more than you can say for the majority of the multi-kilobuck mandolins out there now).

I love my Fullertone!

Rick

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## DanPhillips

Rick,
I'm not concerned with blemishes unless they can affect playability. I'm sure the unfinished spot likely won't but I wished to check with the folks here anyway. The unfilled portion under the fret might. As a beginner, I'd fill remiss in not asking. It sounds great for 200 bucks, but I want to know if those are problems that affect lifespan and playability of my fine 200 dollar instrument. I'm also considering getting a Hammonton so I'll have one of each.

--Dan

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## Jim Broyles

Hey Dan, don't those Bills sound fantastic on your Glouce? Honestly, my fretboard is nearly perfect where the fret slots are concerned, but I don't think yours should concern you too much. Maybe we could get a builder to take a gander at it, but if those frets are solid, I'd just play it.

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## DanPhillips

Thanks JB,

The Bills really make it sing. Now that the concern is taken care of, it's on to Step 2... Learning how to play!  

--Dan

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## Rick Lindstrom

Dan-

My response was very much tongue in cheek- that's what the multiple smileys were about. Sometimes it's hard to convey nuance in text postings.

I feel like the Gloucester is an incredible instrument for $200.00, and I'm glad I have one. It appears that the blemishes you've found are strictly cosmetic, and you shouldn't concern yourself overmuch with them. The gaps under the frets are of no consequence unless a fret end is actually loose; in that case a drop of superglue is just the thing to take care of that. I've checked your photo, and it looks to me that the frets are solidly down.

Enjoy that mandolin- it's certainly a far better instrument than most people have a s first one, and please forgive me if I offended you by being over-exuberant.

Regards-

Rick

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## DanPhillips

Rick,

You didn't offend me, but I didn't want you to think I bought this just to have a purdy mandolin.  Although, it does look nice even with its flaws. 

On a completely different note, I did get the Fullerton Elwood guitar in that I ordered and had to send it back because it had a good sized crack running up the fretboard. The tone on it was really good and the body of the guitar looked great, but the fretboard was an allout mess. Rough looking even. So, with that being sent back I must decide where to reallocate that money &lt;I justify it as money already spent!&gt;. Would the Hammonton compliment the Gloucester in the collection or just be overkill? I also have a banjo in mind if i don't go with a backup fullerton mando.

--Dan

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## Dan McIntyre

Dan, I'll throw in my 2 cents worth. I ordered the Hammonton first and then the Gloucester and compared them side by side just the way they came. The Hammonton had 2 or 3 very small finish flaws and the Gloucester is almost perfect (fit and finish and set-up). I kept the Gloucester and sent the Hammonton back because I preferred the sound and the looks of the Gloucester. Not that there was anything wrong with the Hammonton, because it sounded better to me than any other pac rim F-style or A-style that I have played, it just didn't have the dry, woody tone and F9 looks that I love from my Gloucester. For my $200, I would order another Gloucester and just hang on to it. If I had not bought the Parkdale acoustic/electric guitar from M123, I would have probably ordered another Gloucester myself. I still might if they don't sell out. I'm making some good overtime this week and next and if the right fiddle don't come along between now and payday, I may go ahead and pull the trigger! If they discontinue these Fullertons, especially the Gloucester, I'll probably be upset because I didn't get another one when I had the chance. Tell us what you decide to do! Dan

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## aries753

On my Gloucester there is just one spot umder the end of the fret board that is not finished. The picture of Dan's mando is the same as mine.
I held the Gloucester up next to my Washburn and foud out wht it does not really fit the Gator case that I have. The Washburn is a good 1/2" shorter. The difference in length is all in the headstock.
Has anyone tried Ted's JM11s yet? How do they sound?

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## Jim Broyles

Click for JM-11 Info.

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## Chad Stein

> Dan-
> 
> My response was very much tongue in cheek- that's what the multiple smileys were about. Sometimes it's hard to convey nuance in text postings.
> 
> I feel like the Gloucester is an incredible instrument for $200.00, and I'm glad I have one. It appears that the blemishes you've found are strictly cosmetic, and you shouldn't concern yourself overmuch with them. The gaps under the frets are of no consequence unless a fret end is actually loose; in that case a drop of superglue is just the thing to take care of that. I've checked your photo, and it looks to me that the frets are solidly down.
> 
> Enjoy that mandolin- it's certainly a far better instrument than most people have a s first one, and please forgive me if I offended you by being over-exuberant.
> 
> Regards-
> ...


Guys the gap under my fret look almost identical to Dan's pic. I tried to take a shot this weekend, but my cheap camera couldn't get a clear shot. I am planning to drop the Dragonfly off for setup on Saturday. I think I have the shop take a quick look as well. 

I also now know how to check for the curling you guys were talking about earlier

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## jim simpson

Is there a conclusion of whether the tops are solid but pressed into shape? If so, then I guess they still carve the scroll. In the past, the absence of a ridge on the scroll was a givaway for a non-carved top. I don't mind if it is pressed as it sounds as good as it does (Gloucester).

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## Dave Cowles

Jim, I'm the one who made the assumption the tops are pressed, partly because there is no hint of a recurve at the edge of the top, and also because I didn't see the "carved" descriptor in the specs before "solid spruce top." I haven't investigated beyond that. I just play it a lot. # 

Dave

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## relakst

Wow! If nothing else the shipping was lightning-fast to Canada. Ordered the Gloucester on Friday night and it was delivered today!

First impressions are good. Finish is not perfect but then I haven't seen any, at any price point, that were perfect.

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## DanPhillips

I caved to Mandolin Acquisition Syndrome and bought another Gloucester with my returned guitar money. I think I will use one of them as my experimental upgrade mando and keep the other as a stocker. I cannot wait until finals are over so I can get some more playtime.

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## Jim Broyles

I'd love another Gloucester to do just what you're talking about, Dan.

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## Rick Cadger

me too. can't justify it to the missus though.

mine got more compliments at this week's session. must remember to post pics of that nut job.

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## ApK

What's a 'stocker'?

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## jim simpson

"What's a 'stocker'?"

I don't know but the movies stars always seem to complain about them.

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## Jim Broyles

Har har. My friend, Jim, he's a real card. He oughta be dealt with! 

Apk - stocker = left unmodified, i.e., "stock."

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## DanPhillips

Any suggestions on good strings for this mandolin? I'm running the Bill Monroes on my current one and they sound nice. I want to try a different type on the new mando.

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## Jim Broyles

Why don't you give the FireWires a try? They sounded great on my Kentucky 250S, but I haven't tried them on my Gloucester yet. I hear Red Bear isn't selling them any more, but you can buy them direct, or maybe for a little less money somewhere else. You might try the JazzMando JM11s too, if you think you might like a flatwound string. There's always Elixirs and the D'Addario EXP's too.

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## Kero

My collegue, jam buddy just tried to order a Gloucester, they are out :-(

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## Jim Broyles

M123 says they are getting more in 2-3 weeks.

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## DryBones

> me too. can't justify it to the missus though.
> 
> mine got more compliments at this week's session. must remember to post pics of that nut job.


who you calling a nut job?

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## Jim Broyles

Better than calling some one a tail-piece, ain't it?

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## ApK

Something to add to the list of "things that sound dirty but aren't."

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## Kero

> Originally Posted by  (flattop @ April 18 2007, 07:41)
> 
> me too. can't justify it to the missus though.
> 
> mine got more compliments at this week's session. must remember to post pics of that nut job.
> 
> 
> who you calling a nut job?


Mine too, guy said when handled it, played few notes on the Fullertone:

-Cute.

Then picked up his Collings, kicked Southern Flavour, leaving me salivating for his axe :-)

MAS never stops.

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## MikeEdgerton

> M123 says they are getting more in 2-3 weeks.


That's B stock. That probably means they expect a certain number of returns. It's probably based on experience across all of their lines.

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## dlaf

> M123 says they are getting more in 2-3 weeks.


It's best to confirm with a salesman whether or not there will be more in 2-3 weeks. It's kind of stock message they use when they sell out of an item. As I understand, Musicians Friend, the new owner, wasn't interested in continuing with the Fullerton line.

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## dlaf

Even though this is a Gloucester-heavy thread, I have a question on my Hammonton - it is a beauty, but the bass side f-hole point is slightly curled about 1/32" up, and the treble side f-hole is not symetrical - closer to the edge than the bass side. It sounds and plays great to me - any reason for concern?

Thanks in advance...

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## Dave Cowles

If it sounds and plays great, play it and enjoy it, and forget about the cosmetics. It's a $200 mandolin.

Dave

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## Rick Cadger

i'd agree with Dave. so long as it doesn't look like the rest of the top is sinking there's probably no serious problem.

at that price, i'm another who isn't bothered by a couple of minor cosmetic issues.

but then i'm just a nut job, aren't i?

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## Kero

What looks like to be the best string so far for the Gloucester, i still have the original(j74?) on it, have a spare set of Thomastik, dunno if it is worth the try or not..
?

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## DanPhillips

My second Gloucester came in. It's nice and loud, but it has some sort of resonant buzz on all of the strings (Seems a little less on the A string). No D'Addario hangtags this time so I'm wondering if I just got some bad strings. I tried moving the bridge to no dice. It doesn't sound very good all tuned up. I may end up sending this one back. Anyone have any ideas what it could be?

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## Rick Lindstrom

Dan-

I'd try snugging up the truss rod a tiny bit just to be sure it has some tension in it, and I'd also have a look at the tailpiece area to make sure the cover isn't loose and that none of the strings are buzzing in there. 

Look at the tuning head region to make sure nothing is loose there- screws, knobs, bushings, etc.

Also possible your action is set too low- you didn't mention if it was only on open strings or not. Just a thought.

Rick

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## Dave Cowles

The tailpieces on these are the most common source of noise. I've had to fiddle around with them on both my Gloucester and my Hammonton to eliminate rattles and buzzes.

Dave

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## Loren Bailey

Ok, add me to the list of satisfied Fullerton Gloucester owners. Mine arrived today.

I am fairly impressed. Fit and finish is good, intonates perfectly, bridge fits fairly well (I'll have to do some slight sanding), frets are good, nut is ok, tuners hold. I don't think you could ask for much more. I am anxious to get some good strings on it to see what it will do. If it never opens up an further it's still a decent mando. It will work excellent for what I bought it for, a camping, outdoor, business trip mando. It's as good if not better than any import I've played and even gives the few Eastmans I've played a run for their money. It's not going to kill any banjos and it makes me realize just how really good my Phoenix is. For $175 delivered it is a definite 2 thumbs up though!

Loren

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## DanPhillips

Thanks Rick and Dave! Snugged up the truss rod and that buzz disappeared. The strings are still pretty tinny, but it is nice and loud. I think I might try some firewire strings that jim mentioned or maybe jazzmando? jm-11s. 

--Dan

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## bluespiderweb

> Music123 sent me the wrong mandolin! #Much to my dismay, I opened the box to find a pennington model (i would've kept a hammonton). #The sad part is that all the manifests had the correct model number and the pennington box was labeled correctly as a pennington which means they just grab a box and pack it up rather than ensuring they are packing the correct item. #They sent me an RMA slip and are giving an advanced replacement (I've received no shipping notice or tracking number). #Hope my Gloucester comes in soon! #Does anyone know any secrets to get information out of the music123 CSRs? There seems to be a real disconnect between shipping and customer service.
> 
> --Dan


Hi folks,

Same thing happened to me, Dan! I got a Pennington but I ordered a Gloucester. They said they would rush me out another mandolin, and I'd have it by the end of the week...then I got it the following Wednesday! First they said I would have to wait until I returned my Pennington-and I wasn't too happy-but then they said they would put a hold on my credit card in case I didn't return it within 30 days, and gave me an RA#.

I'm very unimpressed with the customer service there-I asked that a supervisor call me back, and it was 3 or 4 days later when they did. Good thing I didn't wait on that call, and ordered another with the "hold" on my card instead.

Funny though, I seem to prefer the tone of the Pennington so far over the Gloucester-this laminated Pennington mandolin really rocks! It's amazing, that for $89 it can sound that good.

It may be the Gloucester needs to open up-I think it is starting to, but I still like the chimey, bell like ring I'm getting from the Pennington.

Now, I've ordered a Hammonton all solid wood to compare with these two, and I'll pick the winner(s) for my tastes. I may just hang onto the Pennington-maybe it's just an exception, but at that price I doubt it can be beat-at least the one I got!

How did yours sound to you Dan? Anybody else get a Pennington to try?

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## Dave Cowles

Barry, I think the Gloucester has a sound all its own, and if you like the sound of the Pennington better, you'll prolly really like the Hammonton. My Hammonton has a crisper, grassy sound that lends itself to Monroe style playing, and the Gloucester almost begs for a thicker, rounder pick and a softer touch, although it does have a great chop. If you're not interested in the warmer, woodier sound, the Gloucester may not be your best bet. Of course, YMMV.

Dave

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## harleymando

this has got to be the best job of reviewing a product i ever seen!.keep up the good work! im ready for yall to review the new kentucky ovals.

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## bluespiderweb

> Barry, I think the Gloucester has a sound all its own, and if you like the sound of the Pennington better, you'll prolly really like the Hammonton. My Hammonton has a crisper, grassy sound that lends itself to Monroe style playing, and the Gloucester almost begs for a thicker, rounder pick and a softer touch, although it does have a great chop. If you're not interested in the warmer, woodier sound, the Gloucester may not be your best bet. Of course, YMMV.
> 
> Dave


Thanks Dave-interesting observations about the different tone! #I may just have to hang on to the Gloucester for the full time to see if it grows on me, and how it sounds by the time I'd have to send it back.

Yes, I'm very interested in seeing how the Pennington/Hammonton comparison turns out. #You would think that the solid wood mando would win out, normally.

I may have to change the strings on my Gloucester just to see if I'm missing something without a known brand on it-no hang tags on mine when I got it.

But, great fun-I haven't had a mando for quite some time, and I'm glad these were available at these prices to get me interested again!

Thanks to all for reporting on these!

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## Jim Broyles

> Barry, I think the Gloucester has a sound all its own, and if you like the sound of the Pennington better, you'll prolly really like the Hammonton. My Hammonton has a crisper, grassy sound that lends itself to Monroe style playing, and the Gloucester almost begs for a thicker, rounder pick and a softer touch, although it does have a great chop. If you're not interested in the warmer, woodier sound, the Gloucester may not be your best bet. Of course, YMMV.
> 
> Dave


Funny, but it's the exact opposite for me. My Gloucester PICKS! (not rocks) for bluegrass. Great woody chop - sounds like Bill when I'm playing along with him. My returned Hammonton was a little brighter and not as loud.

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## Dave Cowles

My Gloucester has a great chop, and does just fine for bluegrass, it's definitely louder than the Hammonton, but has an almost oval-hole tubbiness to the sound. That's why it feels like it wants to play "Before the Cold Wind Blows." *

* Blue Highway

Dave

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## Chad Stein

My first real revalation today..and you guys are going to laugh. 

I didn't realize there were multiple tensions where the strings would tune to pitch...so mine were way loose. And therefore I wasn't that impressed with the Fullerton. Was playing in a shop on some new MMs today and noticed the tension was significantly different than mine. Got home, tightened her up properly, and now she is downright loud and barky. Now I see why everyone was so impressed.

----------


## jim simpson

steindawg,
That is funny! Years ago I received a pretty decent mandolin in the mail. I had 24 hrs. to keep it or send it back. I tuned it up to tension and thought it didn't sound too good. I then thought I'd check it with my tuner. My gosh, I was way too low. I then tuned it up to correct pitch and it came alive. I've learned to not trust my ears alone without the tuner.

----------


## Chad Stein

> steindawg,
> That is funny! Years ago I received a pretty decent mandolin in the mail. I had 24 hrs. to keep it or send it back. I tuned it up to tension and thought it didn't sound too good. I then thought I'd check it with my tuner. My gosh, I was way too low. I then tuned it up to correct pitch and it came alive. I've learned to not trust my ears alone without the tuner.


Jim maybe I am loosing my mind but I was using my tuner to get it in pitch. And the stuff I have been playing was on tune..it was just really loose so I was getting a ton of buzz...and not much volume.

Am I off in the concept of a string being in pitch at multiple tensions?!?!?

----------


## Bill Snyder

If you tune your a string to a 440 A and then slack it up and re-tune it to a 440 A again it is going to be the same tension. You could tune an octave low to a 220 A like the one on a 6 string guitar tuned to standard tuning. 
It is still an A, but an octave lower and it would be very low tension and not have the tone you would expect.

----------


## Jim Broyles

> Originally Posted by  (jbmando @ April 18 2007, 14:01)
> 
> M123 says they are getting more in 2-3 weeks.
> 
> 
> That's B stock. That probably means they expect a certain number of returns. It's probably based on experience across all of their lines.


I think they get products in right from the factory, and not previously owned, which are designated as B stock. I have a 5 string bass labeled Fullerton FCDC5DLX - AB - Stock, with a received date of 11/09/06. It was marked up on the back like buckle rash, but the frets were in serious need of dressing. I would bet nobody had ever owned it before.

----------


## Rick Lindstrom

Uh-oh .....this discussion is beginning to drop down the list! Isn't there any more to say to keep it alive?  

I'm still loving my Fullertone.

Rick

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## DanPhillips

I have my backup Gloucester in and in its nice case. I'm now trying to decide whether I want to keep it or send it back. If I keep it, I will likely try to strip/refinish it, etc. My other option is to pull the trigger on a stewmac kit and make my own (I really want to for a summer hobby. Of course, my main gloucester just keeps getting better and better!

----------


## Lee Callicutt

> Uh-oh .....this discussion is beginning to drop down the list! Isn't there any more to say to keep it alive?


No mando content, but I'll chime in with a report on my Greenwich, 000 guitar purchase after several weeks of playing and scrutiny.

I'm very pleased with the tone and playability. #Numerous picky little #flaws I can find in the finish, but none that I can find with the intonation, sound, etc. #Even the slight buzz I originally noticed at the 12th fret on one string seems to have largely gone away unless I really force it to the surface with excessively hard picking.

My original intent was to forego a case purchase for a $99 guitar, but I'm starting to shop around for a case, if that's any indication of how I feel about the worthiness of the instrument.

Not just a good guitar for the money, but a GREAT guitar for the money!

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## MikeEdgerton

> I think they get products in right from the factory, and not previously owned,


I imagine they *DID* get B stock items from the factory, but I seriously doubt that they will get any new stock in from the factory. What they had here was a fire sale (nothing burned but the prices) to get rid of a line they obviously don't intend to stock. 

People bought these instruments up but they bought them at give away prices. Music123 and Musicians Friend won't continue to sell items at a loss just because they sold a bunch of them at very low prices. They said they would have B stock items (that link was specifically to a B stock listing) back in within a few weeks. I'm going to hazard a guess that they plan on X number of returned instruments. I guess it's possible that they could have had instruments that were already in the supply chain (on the water as they say) but I wouldn't plan on the continuation of this line and certainly not at these prices. If in fact they were to bring in more Gloucesters (and honestly that would be all that I would bring in if I were them), they would have to get their price for them. This company has to make a profit and volume isn't going to make up for the lack of it.

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## Truckadero

okay I'll bite. This has been a fun thread, and, my guess is...will probably keep dropping down the list as other great mando deals and new products arise. 

The Gloucester opportunity appears to be over for now. They are no longer listed on the m123 site. I have bought two. The second one I am giving to my brother as a birthday gift. I also bought a Hammonton which went to a friend who is in his 3rd week now of playing mandolin. These were great starter instruments. The Gloucester especially.

Once again...MAS has taken hold. I am now in the market for an upgrade! Will always keep my Gloucester though. Thanks to all in this thread (jbmando!) for the turn on to these great and fun instruments. Pick On!

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## Rick Cadger

fair point, Mike, but i think many people would buy these at the original list - or at least somewhere between list and the clear-out price. especially after the buzz that started here, and which has spilled over onto several other music boards.

with a product that has already built up a cult following and good rep, i would find it surprising if they couldn't pitch the prices of these a bit higher and still sell them in reasonable volume.

but then i'm a marketing professional, and i love a challenge!

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## Kero

> f


I just ordered a Prucha tailpiece(22 bucks)from Greg Boyd i'll let you know if the changes is just cosmetic, or more..

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## MikeEdgerton

> fair point, Mike, but i think many people would buy these at the original list


I'm sure they would too, but I only think that about the Gloucester. jbmando basically found a sleeper and the dropping prices drop-kicked the sales. Everyone that bought one of these should repay him by sending him a few bucks. He paid more than anyone else did.

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## Tighthead

In my phone conversation with a sales guy, he kept referring to "used" instruments in response to my question about why the "B Stock" was higher priced than the regular instruments. He described them as "the newest form of 'used' possible" meaning customer returns or instruments that had sat on their retail store floor for a time. He actually never described them as 'blemished' or seconds. In fact, he tried to re-assure me that they were just as good as the 'new' ones, they just couldn't be sold that way.

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## dlaf

I've purchased many instruments through Music123, and have found that B Stock can be anything from a return or display with no issues to a cracked top direct from the factory. Regardless of condition, the are always ready to make good on the purchase.

I once received a guitar with the previously mentioned cracked top, returned it for a B-stock which was the same guitar with a poor amateur repair, then returned it for another B stock that only had a 1/4" finish blemish.

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## Rick Cadger

just a quick note to say *do the nut upgrade!* i swapped back and forth between the bone nut to the plastic original and back to the bone one (which i have finally glued in place). the difference is audible. with the bone nut, open chords sound a bit brighter and sustain more. on closed chop chords - no noticeable difference apart from the improved action.

although the Gloucester is quite playable as it comes, lowering the action at the nut makes such a difference. also, tuning is better now. i think there must have been some minor binding on the D course with the plastic nut. tunes straight to pitch now with no jumps, and holds it spot on.

sounding better every day.

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## Kero

> j


how much would you charge for a bone nut for my Gloucester?? :-) other than shipping?...

using j74's, like it low-low, lowered my plastic one..

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## mboucher

I'm interested too

Mark

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## Ed Lutz

Me too also....

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## aries753

Me too,me too!
I changed the strings and the nut slots have an interesting shape. 
The G and D look like they were made with the side of a diamond shaped cutting tool. They have a defined "V" shape to them. I think the original strings sat to high in the "V" which is why the Ds sounded "funny".

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## Rick Cadger

oh wow, if i were a pro this could have been a revenue stream!

sadly i wouldn't dare do work for someone else's instruments and charge for it. 

seriously, guys - for the price of a feeler gauge, four StewMac nut files and a few bone blanks, and with the help of the instructions on the StewMac site and the info on frets.com, anyone can do this if they take it slow. 

you don't have to glue the nut in place until you've given it all the tweaking and testing it needs. after the Fullerton i made nuts for two of my other inexpensive mandolins. i ruined one blank because the feeler gauge slipped and i filed a slot way to deep, but the other two went great. i found that the main trick is to make sure you finish the slots nice and clean after filing. i use 600 grit wet and dry paper. it smooths the bottom of the slots and takes just a fraction more material off the slot width to make sure nothing binds. a quick dusting of pencil lead and Bob's your uncle.

if the cost of blanks is an issue for you you might want to get advice from one of the experts in the builder forum. otherwise i think it's a great learning exercise.

a few bits of advice from a beginner's-lucky rank amateur:

- read the instructions on the websites
- start with feeler gauges stacked a little higher than the final action you're after, then work down gradually
- start by marking the precise string spacing with a pencil, then scoring with a sharp knife
- slope the slots back toward the headstock. a break angle similar to the angle at which the headstock slopes works fine on the Gloucester
- go slow. take hours if you need to

for me, the hardest part was holding the nut firm in place and the feeler gauges in place as I was filing (not enough hands!). i didn't trust to filing down to a pencil line - i filed until contact with the gauges. that's why i say go slowly.

i must post those pics.

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## Lee Callicutt

> if the cost of blanks is an issue for you


Cow bone's a whole lot cheaper than the sweat you can put into it!

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## Yeti

It looks like the Fullerton Hammonton Deluxe is sold out.

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## pager

Hi Gang!
I got into the Fullerton offer a bit late. When I ordered mine on Tuesday of this week, all that was left was the Pennington. It was on sale at 10% off so at $89.00 which included shipping, I thought "what the heck!". After I ordered, I remembered the $50.00 Rouge that I bought from Musicians Friend on a spur of insanity and it was horrid. Unplayable. I sent the Rouge back. 

I started to worry that my $89.00 Fullerton Pennington would be the same. Well, it arrived yesterday - and I am really impressed! It is all laminated, but it has a decent sound. It even has a good chop. Heck, I'll even take this to festivals to jam on. Right out of the box, the fret work was finished well. The frets are nice and level, the neck was dead on straight, the fret ends were dressed very well. The nut cut perfectly. Nice pearl inlay logo work on the headstock. I have played much more expensive mandolins that I cannot say that about. 

I moved the saddle back about 1/4 of an inch, and the intonation is dead on. Lowered the action to where it is so low it plays itself, with out any buzz or fretting out. Impressive. The finish, is very nice. The binding is good. The tuners are very smooth and it stays in tune. I keep picking it up and thinking "HOW can this be an $89.00 mandolin?"  

To sum this up, I feel it is a mandolin that is worth about 4 times what I paid for it. It plays VERY easily ... really effortlessly, and sounds better than other all laminated mandolins I have played. It sounds very similar to my friends F620 Kentucky!

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## mboucher

SO what is your take on the fact that it has been about a month since the Gloucester has been on the website and no notice from Music123 on the site about any more coming?

Is that it? all done? and Musicians Friend is slowing let them go away.

Mark

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## jim simpson

The Gloucester will soon be a hot collectible! (tongue in cheek). I recently saw one on Ebay that had the tuners and tailpiece upgraded. It even had a hardshell case. 
I found a new shaped case for mine for $6.00 - so the shipping was 27.00 - still the total price was in keeping with the low price of the Gloucester. 
It seems like the perfect mandolin to experiment with, like making it a black top or sunburst. I remember seeing an F9 that was being sold after someone rebound and sunbursted it. They should have waited as Gibson now offers them that way.

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## MikeEdgerton

If you do a search on music123.com using the keyword Fullerton you'll get 5 pages of items. All but one is marked Closeout, Open Box, or B Stock. I'm going to assume they just missed marking the amplifier that isn't marked. You can draw your own conclusion using that information. I seriously doubt they are clearing out the old stock to replace it with new stock.

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## CML

I've played guitar for my own enjoyment for the past 20 years and just recently bought a cheap fiddle and am taking lessons. So I thought I'd get a mandolin too since it's the same tuning.

I have been doing searches on this site for the past couple weeks on recommendations for a first mandolin and had decided to ask my wife for a $195 Kentucky KM-150S from Elderly for Father's Day. Then I ran across this thread on Monday and kicked myself for missing out on the Gloucester. Even the Hammonton was sold out by then. 

I really like the F shape better than the A shape, but had pretty much decided to "settle" for an A. I REALLY wish I could have gotten one of Gloucester or Hammontons. I saw the Pennington, but didn't want to get a laminate and have it turn out to sound like ####. I even called Music123 to ask if they would be getting anymore in. The saleman I talked to (and he was definitely just a salesman so don't take his word as gospel) said they would not be getting anymore in and the line was done.

So then I re-read through this thread and saw that both bluespiderweb (Barry) and pager really liked the Pennington and thought it sounded good and played well. Then I also noticed in the picture of the Pennington that it has a truss rod and pretty much looks identical to the Hammonton, only real difference being the laminate woods. So I figured I'd go ahead and order one for $99. If I don't like it I can return it in 45 days. But I'm hoping I do like it and it can serve as my starter mandolin for awhile.

I know the laminates aren't supposed to sound as good or loud as the solids. But do laminates encounter any problems durability-wise more than solids? Do the tops cave more often than solids?

Barry, did you get in your Hammonton? How does the Pennington compare to it?

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## Jim Broyles

The laminates can sound pretty good and nearly as loud as a solid top, but from what I can gather, they won't really improve with age. What you get is what you'll always have.

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## Dave Cowles

Thought it was time to chime in with an update here, since I have had both the Gloucester and Hammonton for a few weeks. They both get played a lot, but I'm finding that I like the feel of the neck on the Hammonton a little better. It is improving in sound, despite still wearing its original strings, and the Gloucester is sounding fuller and tubbier the more it gets playtime as well. Since I already have a handmade F5, and will have my new handmade A style in hand from the builder shortly, I plan on selling one of the Fullertons. It's going to be hard to pick which one stays when that time comes. Right now, I'm very glad I bought both models. 

Dave

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## Jim Broyles

pager, you are saying that about a Pennington, but I'll guaran-dang-tee ya my Gloucester will stand up to any mando it has jammed alongside.

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## Lee Callicutt

Is it a dead certainty that the Pennington is all laminate, or possibly just a solid top with laminate back and sides? 

The reason I ask is that while I was at work today, I was sitting browsing through the 123 catalogue that came with my guitar, and I remember looking at the pre-discount/closeout pricing on the Pennington and Hammonton and thinking that they were awfully close for the Pennington to be all laminate?

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## Jim Broyles

As certain as we can be without a direct revelation from the principals involved. Check the mandolins on this  site. This is where we think they are made. DFM-10 = Pennington, DFM-70 = Hammonton. Interestingly, none of them = Gloucester. We don't know where it comes from. The wording in the descriptions indicates laminate for the 10, solid for the 70.

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## Lee Callicutt

> The wording in the descriptions indicates laminate for the 10, solid for the 70.


Granted, however my Washburn is also a dead ringer for the AM50-DSL which the Dae Won site specs with mahogany sides and back, but I assure you that my Washburn has maple back and sides, which tells me that Washburn specified those materials changes for that model and Dae Won was happy to provide it as such. 

Music 123 may well have made a similar minor change in specs as an upgrade from Dae Won's standard model.

Hope springs eternal!

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## Lee Callicutt

Okay, curiosity has gotten the best of me and my wallet. I just pulled the trigger on one. I'm satsisfied that if it's made by the same guys that made my Washburn it's a solid value. 

I'll let you know.

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## bluespiderweb

> "I know the laminates aren't supposed to sound as good or loud as the solids. But do laminates encounter any problems durability-wise more than solids? Do the tops cave more often than solids?
> 
> Barry, did you get in your Hammonton? How does the Pennington compare to it?"


Hi Colin,

Yes, I first ordered a Gloucester, got a Pennington by mistake, and then got the Gloucester, and I still like the Pennington best. #I also got the Hammonton, which I liked the least. #It seemed to have a thicker finish and was heavier, and just didn't have the tone, especially in the bass. #It was very well made-no runs, nicest woods, and workmanship was as good as my Pennington, but it just sounded a little dull. #

I also ordered another Pennington which wasn't as good as the first one I received. #So, I think you need to judge them individually, really. #The set up seems to be hit or miss-how well the bridge is fitted may alone be responsible to how well it sounds-the Hammonton bridge was the worst fitted, and had a tone to match.

The second Pennington was not as nicely finished either-it had some large areas of thicker spray, so maybe overall it just had too much finish on it also. #I think the bridge was fitted OK, but can't remember exactly now. #The first Pennington was made like a high end instrument
-fit and finish were great, and the tone was very surprising for a laminated mandolin.

I think the Gloucester sounds pretty nice, but it doesn't have that chimey ring of that first Pennington, but it does have a nice tone, just very different. #I may return my Gloucester, or sell it to someone instead if they are interested. #In time, the Gloucester may sound better overall, since it's all solid woods, and will probably age better.

In answer to your question about laminated instruments-they are probably more stable, and stronger in general than an all solid wood instrument, as long as the construction is done properly. #It has been said that they won't improve much in tone, but probably do to some extent, especially after break-in, just not to the extent of a solid wood instrument.

Anyway, I would be interested to hear what you think of your Pennington, so let me know how you find it. #I had to adjust the truss rod on mine, and still have to do some nut filing to lower the action at the nut a little for easier play. #The Gloucester was set up very well though, but the Hammonton needed a little help too.

Still, for the money, they were some great deals, no matter which one you ended up with. #With the right set up, and some playing time, they will no doubt sound even better. #So, I hope you get a good one! #Let me know.

Take care, #Barry

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## CML

Thanks for the great follow-up Barry. I'll keep my fingers crossed for the condition of my Pennington and I'll be sure to post pics and do a review. Please let me know if you decide to sell your Gloucester.

Thanks again,
Collin

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## bluespiderweb

You're quite welcome, Collin. Sure, I will let you know if I decide to sell the Gloucester.

But after playing them both today, either the tone of the Glou is growing on me or it's starting to open up-it sounded pretty nice today!

And, today the Pennington sounded a little stuffy, so who knows-could be the more humid weather too, along with who knows what other factors at the moment.

Yes, hope your Pennington arrives quickly and it's a good'un too!

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## Rick Cadger

for those of you who have the Gloucester, what do you think of the finish? i like the simple colour, but the matt texture doesn't do it for me... SO, i've started polishing mine up to get a bit of gloss going on.

i noticed that the spot by the bridge, where my pinky strokes as i play, had worn to a high gloss! i was really surprised.

i bought some auto colour restorer - a very fine liquid abrasive that does not leave residue - and did a bit of preliminary experimental polishing. it'll take me a bit of time working carefully, but i've already got a bit of a shine happening. i don't want to use too much of the compound, so it'll mostly be a long, labour-intensive buffing process with coarse then finer cloths.

polishing back the finish will also thin it even more - and it's already a relatively light finish - so certainly shouldn't hurt the tone and volume any... may even help.

i love this mando so much. it's good solid quality, and cheap enough to experiment with. 

i'm getting a new camera tomorrow (birthday gift from my lovely wife) so i'll finally post those pics i keep promising.

i'm so impressed by this cheapie that i'm tempted to consider adding a Bovier or one of the new Kentuckys to the collection.

my session mate has an Eastman, but it looks like the bridge is waaaay high, and the varnish seems very soft and easily damaged... so despite the nice sound of it i'm not too tempted by those.

but, heck, i could happily carry on just with this Gloucester as my main axe. played it at a gig on wednesday with a transducer and a Fishman GII preamp into the desk. i need a better pickup, but it still sounded good.

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## bluespiderweb

Hi Flattop,

I like satin finishes if they are done well, but the Gloucester's finish is a little rough in some areas, besides being satin finished. I'm not complaining, considering what I paid, but it could be better.

I've thought about rubbing it out a little too, but hadn't thought about the finish restorer you are using. Dupont white polishing compound usually works well on finishes, if you go easy (and you know what you're doing). A light touch is best on a damp rag too. Yes, be careful, the finish might not be very thick! Let us know how it comes out.

I'm not touching mine until I decide I am keeping it though!

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## mando-picker

Hey guys, yall might have already said but who has the fullerton gloucester for sale now , I see that music123 dont, musicians friend dont. where can it be bought? Thanks

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## Jim Broyles

I think you have to buy one from a picker. Unless some eBay biz bought a bunch and they're holding out before they offer them for sale.

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## CML

My Pennington arrived Saturday and I love it. It is beautiful. I haven't found any blemishes. It was setup pretty good before it shipped. No problems with the frets, bridge fits well, and intonation is great. I lowered the bridge all the way down and there is no fret buzz and the intonation is still right on.

The only thing I need to do is open up the nut slots for the 2 G strings because they currently sit on top of the slots instead of in them. So fingering the first fret on the G strings is a little tougher but hasn't made me want to detune the mando yet to fix it, but I'll eventually get to it. I'm just having too much fun playing it right now.

It sounds great to me. Granted I don't have much experience with different mandos, but I do have plenty of guitar experience and I know what sounds good to me. The sound is plenty bright and sweet. It's seems to have enough bass and volume to it but I'm no expert on how it compares to other mandos. But it sounds great to me!  

I can definitely attest that this mando is well built. The finish is excellent, beautiful. Seriously, I haven't found a flaw yet. I love the colors, and the cream binding. The hardware is not expensive, but definitely adequate, and I doubt better hardware would make it sound much better. If I were to upgrade anything, it would be the tailpiece and the nut, but they are not bad at all and definitely do their job. The nut just needs the lower 2 slots opened up a bit which is very easy.

Enough rambling. I love my Pennington.
THANK YOU Bluespiderweb (Barry) and pager for the reviews that convinced me to go ahead and get one. No regrets and no returns here. I got a beatiful looking and sounding F mando for $99!  

And thank you mandolincafe.com. This site rocks.

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## CML

Front

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## CML

Back

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## pager

Congrats on the Pennington, CML! I knew you would love it. I certainly love mine and I have been playing it and leaving my other mando's in their cases. They are getting jealous. It is just such a fun mandolin to play. At $99.00 they are giving them away. Mine was built well too. Great fret work, no flaws, intonation dead on. Effortless action. I had mine along at a festival this weekend and people could not believe I paid less than $100.00 for it. I could have sold it twice but I just told them to go to the site and buy one while they are still available. 

I played it side by side with a Kentucky F-620 and a Kentucky F-630. The Fullerton certainly sounded as good - I really think better than the Kentucky's! I realize we are talking about inexpensive mandolins here. That is my point. Here is a $100.00 mandolin that stands up well in the sound, fit, action and construction - to the $400.00 - $500.00 Kentucky F 620's and 630's. They are so good for $100.00 that it seems crazy! I can't imagine there are too many left for sale. Once they are gone at this price, there won't be any second chances.

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## bluespiderweb

Hey Collin,

That's great that your Pennington is a good one too, and that you're very happy with it! Yes, amazing instrument for $99! 

Your description of it matches mine almost exactly-the only thing I have to do with it is file the nut slots too (I did adjust the truss rod though). The fit and finish are really nice, I agree-it's a real pretty mandolin, with a great tone! Have fun!

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## Rick Cadger

ok, i finally posted pics in THIS THREAD

sorry for the poor quality. there is a fraction too much depth still in the nut slots, so i'll sand it down when i have time, but it plays and tunes so well that i am in no hurry!

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## Lee Callicutt

They've just lowered the closeout price on left-hand Steelman dreadnaught guitars to $59.99. 

Lefties don't often get breaks like that.

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## MikeEdgerton

The first Fullerton has hit the classifieds. Your chance to grab that elusive Hammonton you wanted but missed.

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## Lee Callicutt

Yeah, I saw a hot-rodded Glouchester on e-bay last week.

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## cooper4205

for $400! twice the going rate from 123

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## Lee Callicutt

> for $400! twice the going rate from 123


I wouldn't read too much into that, though. If I recall, that was a pretty expensive tailpiece he'd put on that mando -- can't remember what else he'd done, or if a case was included. 

I do remember seeing a Johnson MA-120 a while back on e-bay that the owner had put a nice little bone saddle on. Reserve was set higher than the bidding. I contacted the seller to ask what his reserve was, thinking I might spring for it, and was absolutely floored at what he wanted -- something like $350! I just didn't feel like the saddle made it anything other than a Johnson MA-120.

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## cooper4205

Don't worry, the only thing I'm reading into that auction is the fact that the seller hopes to make money of someone who doesn't know any better. the tailpiece wasn't worth enough to jack it up $200, thats for sure. normally mods don't equal a higher price on used instrument, at least not when I had one or two souped-up Pac-Rims that I sold (the mods did, however, help me get my asking price, which was what i paid for the mandolins but not a penny more)

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## Lee Callicutt

Well, I had the Pennington in my hands briefly this afternoon, but upon cursory inspection, I found a pretty good crack in the finish and missing chip of binding from the lower point, so back in the box it went.

Looked pretty good otherwise. The bridge appeared to fit the top well. The fret edges felt good. Rough looking finish under the fingerboard extension, but that doesn't really surprise me.

I was tempted to tune it up, but I didn't want to risk it, so I went ahead and boxed it back up for an exchange.

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## Sheryl McDonald

I've been reading this thread for while... long enough to get in on the Hammonton deal, but not long enough to get the Gloucester [which, from all the discussion, sounds like a great Mandoin]. I've never had the opportunity to break in a new mandolin, and my first reaction to the Hammonton was --wow! how loud it is [and wow - how it has no depth]. I've been trying to play it for at least 30 minutes a day, and it's been breaking in rather nicely. It's starting to develop a woody sound. I'll be curious to see how it turns out, with regular playing. 

But for those of you interested, I just noticed that music123.com has the Hammonton and Pennnington models back on their website again. Do a search for Fullerton Mandolin.

Sheryl

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## MikeEdgerton

The Pennington never left. The Hammonton they have listed is an "Open Box" (Read Return).

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## Yeti

I have had my Hammonton for 5 months and every time I pick it I'm impressed. I love it about as much as I love my wife.

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## Dave Cowles

Since my Hammonton was due for a string change, I installed a set of Gibson Monels on it four days ago. It is sounding better and better as time passes. I know this mando is about the same as the Morgan Monroe, made in the same factory (Dae Won), etc., but it sure seems to have a lot going for it by comparison. I'm starting to like it more than my Gloucester, but I'm convinced part of that is due to playability. The Hammonton neck feel better to me, and it also feels like there is a radius to the fretboard. The Goucester's board is flat. Nice to have both of them, though.  

Dave

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## Lee Callicutt

> I was tempted to tune it up, but I didn't want to risk it, so I went ahead and boxed it back up for an exchange.


A pathetic self-quote, but I've had the second Pennington in hand for a day now and thought I'd give a report. 

First -- kudos to Music 123 for Next Day shipping another instrument when they knew I was doing a return. They were even very helpful in giving me the location of a remote authorized Fed Ex shipper for the return when I was having trouble with a local-yokel, rip-off Fed-Ex "authorized" shipper on my way out of town for a long weekend.

Ah, but the mando: Woodier sounding than I would have ever thought for a laminate. As the owner of ovals, I now see what the f-hole is all about -- very cool and "woofy". 

I managed to break a string from the E course while fiddling back and forth with the initial set-up, but once replaced she tuned nicely to pitch and stayed there overnight. The bass side foot of the bridge seems to be an excellent fit, while the outside treble edge of the bridge foot shows a little "air," but still sounds very balanced across the fingerboard. I'm impressed that it sounds as good as it does, and can only imagine what a fresh set of strings and proper bridge fitting will do for it. 

Again, a thousand little things I could nit-pick about, but at $99 for an "F," I'm not gonna' quibble. The largest flaws would be blush in the finish on the neck side of the scroll -- and I hesitate to call this a "flaw" rather than character -- but the left bottom rim bout is blonde w/o any "burst" at all, with the "burst" beginning to the right of the tail-piece
 But hey, I don't see that asymmetry when I'm playing it, and it doesn't affect the sound or playability of an instrument which surpasses my expectations for the price point, so all in all, I'd call it a most excellent beater!

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## relakst

I also have both the Gloucester and the Hammonton. 
The guy at 123 told me I got the last Hammonton! If this is true, I apologize to any one who missed out.

Anyways, the Hammonton is truly wonderful and played well right out of the box. And it looks great!

The Gloucester has an issue where the bridge is as low as it will go but the action is still high. I will have to look into a fix for that.

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## Caleb

I'm sure this question has been addressed in 14 pages, but.....  

Why did 123 stop selling these Fullertons? As a matter of fact, I cannot find anyone selling them now.

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## Dave Cowles

Slacker, Music 123 was bought out by GC. Apparently, the bean counters in management decided to discontinue the Fullerton line. They ran closeouts on them, as well as Fullerton acoustic guitars. In the case of the mandolins, they seemed not to know that they had a line of low-budget, diamonds-in-the-rough until the Cafe groundswell. If I were they, I'd be rethinking putting them back in the lineup. # # 

Dave

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## MikeEdgerton

Fullerton was a brandname owned by Music123, a "house" brand sourced from multiple builders. You wouldn't find them anyplace else. You might find the same instrument being sold elsewhere under different brand names. I can guarantee you'll find the Hammonton and the Pennington, they are cookie cutter import models. Now, if you find the Gloucester under another brand name that would be a bit more of a find. I seriously doubt you'll find it at the fire sale price they went for when 123 closed them out. 

I received the latest Music123 catalog yesterday. Not a Fullerton in it that I saw and only three or four mandolins, none to write home about.

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## Rick Lindstrom

It'd be interesting to start a "Gloucester Registry" and find out how many Mandolin Cafe folks have one (I do). Guess we can't start a serial number registry since they don't have 'em.

Rick

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## pager

I noticed this morning that the $99.00 Pennington's are now history at Music123. GLAD I got mine when I did. Geez. I am playing it twice as much as I am my expensive mandos. It is just so much fun to play! Actually, I bought mine for $89.00 when they were having the 10% off sale. $89.00 including shipping. That was almost a crime.

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## Caleb

How much were those natural finished F-styles going for at the end?

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## Jim Broyles

Best price I saw was 179.00

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## Jim Broyles

> It'd be interesting to start a "Gloucester Registry" and find out how many Mandolin Cafe folks have one (I do). Guess we can't start a serial number registry since they don't have 'em.
> 
> Rick


I know three other guys in my jamming circles who have them. One is primarily a guitar player, one is a guitar/resonator guitarist and the other other is our own Jim Simpson. One other guy I know owns a Hammonton. They all got the inspiration from me and my Gloucester as far as I know.

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## Caleb

> Best price I saw was 179.00


Wow, sorry I missed the boat. 

Story of my life.....

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## bikebum

I have a Glouster. I guess a serial number could be carved/branded on it. Hmmm where to put the Ser. No. 

Jerry

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## Ed Lutz

bikebum:



> I have a Glouster. #I guess a serial number could be carved/branded on it. #Hmmm where to put the Ser. No.


Why not see if all the owners could be rounded up here on the cafe some way and say jbmando or whomever started the G. stampede start it with ser. no. 001 and then determine who was next there after by date ordered and increment the number to be assigned by the group chair or ?? and then we could establish the register mentioned earlier? If someone returned their first purchase it could still be given a number posthumously and add their return if they got one and have it fit into the date sequence. 

I think there is a thread(or link)on an effective way to make a label for your mando., and how to glue it down effectively. I just can't remember where I saw the info. It may have been at frets.com or something like that.

If someone read the mail and then ordered/received one without revealing it, maybe give it a Letter suffix i.e. 2A or ?? if they cared to jump in the fray at some point established by date of purchase and entered in the record at the proper place by the keeper of the sacred list. 

All this being said, this project may be to cumbersome to sort out and administer but maybe worth a look/see if there is any interest.

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## Jim Broyles

> Originally Posted by  (jbmando @ May 22 2007, 14:44)
> 
> Best price I saw was 179.00
> 
> 
> Wow, sorry I missed the boat. 
> 
> Story of my life.....


You?? I bought mine in November, before the big shakeup, for $269.10, and thought it was a good deal.

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## Caleb

Anyone have one of those natural finish F-styles that they'd like to sell?

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## bikebum

Slacker, try asking in the 'Wanted' section of the classified ads. There are probably some folks like me that bought a Glouster just on a whim. I had bought mine with the idea of giving it to my grandson but he hasn't expressed any real interest in it yet. He seems to have eyes on my Gibson A-9 that I just bought new a few months ago. 

I think the Glouster was an excellent buy, but I far prefer my Eastman 514 and my Rigel Q95. My preference is for oval hole mandos.

Jerry

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## Lee Callicutt

> I noticed this morning that the $99.00 Pennington's are now history at Music123. #


The one I returned last Thursday should soon show up as a B instrument.

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## Eric Selinger

I've been playing my Fullerton pretty much non-stop ever since I got it. One thing I've noticed, though, that maybe you all can help me with: a little buzz, not from the frets, but from open AND fretted strings when I play it nice and loud. Not instantly, but a split-second after I hit the note, as though the vibration were settling into the instrument and adding a little distortion. The D string's the worst; the E after that. Any suggestions about what might be causing this, and how to cure it?

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## MikeEdgerton

Weave a piece of leather through the strings below the bridge and above the tailpiece. If you don't have leather fold up a dollar bill. Did the problem go away? If not do the same above the nut below the tuners.

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## Rick Lindstrom

I think someone had that problem earlier in this thread (or in another thread involving the Fullertons), and the solution was to check the truss rod and make sure it had some tension in it. If it's completely loose, it may rattle in the slot. In that case snug it up a tiny bit- just enough to get some tension in it, but not enough to alter the neck relief.

Rick

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## Eric Selinger

Thanks, Mike! I'll give that a try tonight.

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## MikeEdgerton

That is assuming you're hearing some harmonic overtones. As pointed out, if the truss rod (or the tuners or the tailpiece) are loose that can be an issue as well. From your description it sounds more like an overtone. I do have an eraser on my pencil that is well used, I've been wrong before.

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## Eric Selinger

Hi, Mike--

Tried the leather--didn't make much difference, though. Futzed with the bridge & action a bit, and raising it somewhat seemed to help. I found an older post from Flowerpot that describes what I'm hearing, I think:




> Some mandos will respond well to a light or medium touch, but if you're in the big jam and really need to lay into it, it breaks up, sort of like a speaker being overdriven to the point of distortion. But others will keep putting out the volume, and still maintain a clear tone with lots of projection no matter how hard you drive it -- it's like a set of speakers that sound just as clean at 200 Watts as they do at 1 Watt, or a car that grips the road like glue at 120 MPH.


So maybe I just need to back off a bit with the pick, or try a different one, so that I get the volume I want w/o the sound breking up?

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## Truckadero

I had the same buzz appear in my Gloucester. Became quite annoying to the point of making the instrument unplayable. Turned out to be the truss rod. As Rick suggested, a slight adjustment cleared it up. I'd give that a try if your picking style adjustment doesn't work.

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## Eric Selinger

It was the truss rod! One little adjustment, and I can play at top volume with no buzz in sight, so to speak. Not that anyone would acutally want to hear me play at top volume, but I can dream....

Thanks, everyone, for the help!

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## Rick Cadger

i must be nuts, but MAS is kicking in again.

despite how impressed i am with the Gloucester, and saying that i wouldn't easily sell it, i am thinking of putting mine up for sale to move up a level.

i have a couple of decent mandolins, but none of them is a real bluegrass axe. 

later in the year i'm planning to spend a couple of grand on a pretty good new mando and an acoustic amplifier - but i find i'm also tempted to go for one of these relatively cheap, but well liked Asian models in the meantime. 

i'm tempted to go for a trip down to TAMCO to check out the Eastman and Bovier Fs around the £500 level as i currently have almost that much lying around crying "spend me". if i were to sell the Fullerton Gloucester and add that money to the pot i'd definitely have enough for either an Eastman 515 or 605, or a Bovier Tradition plus case.

what do you reckon? am i crazy?

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## Jim Broyles

I owned a 515. I had to sell it a while back for financial reasons and in my humble opinion, the Gloucester, at least mine, is much more of a bluegrass axe than the Eastman. To me, the Eastman had the modern shimmering sound, but the Fullerton has the vintage woody tone. I would like to own them both, but I think the Gloucester is much better suited for bluegrass. FWIW, I played a jam buddy's '76 Ibanez last night, and when I handed it back to him, his girlfriend said innocently, "That one (the Ibanez) is much quieter than that one (my Gloucester)" I played it down, but she was right.

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## arbarnhart

I switched to nickel wound and got the blues machine sound I was looking for from "Chester". I have only had a couple of more experienced players check it out so far, but the opinions were extremely positive. I think you will have to spend quite a bit to get an upgrade that isn't just cosmetic (inlays and better known name on the head stock) and even then any difference in sound is likely to be subjective and subtle. Like JB, I find the volume to be very good. I see instruments as falling into three broad categories - junk which is pretty much unplayable, "OK" which includes some starter laminates and other things that hold a tuning, are fretted properly and have a decent sound but usually have issues with volume, sustain and/or tone. And finally, there is the good category, which is narrower (IMO) than the others in that the sound of the instruments will really only be distinct (assuming same type of A or F holes and similar strings) to musicians looking for a very specific sound. I think the Gloucester is a good instrument. I think my Washburn oval A was also; I changed largely because I wanted a natural wood instrument and based on the feedback it looked like I get get a good F pretty much on par. But I got the Washburn when I was playing a Rogue that was just OK.

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## Rick Cadger

changed my mind.

i think I'll keep the Gloucester.

i had put it up for sale on a couple of other sites... but i can't do it.

if i get rid of my last couple of guitars and a tenor b*njo, i'll be able to keep the Fullerton and get another mando!

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## Kero

> what do you reckon? am i crazy?


no, you are not...i'm saving for the next axe too, might be a breedlove or jbovier...

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## Rick Cadger

so glad i decided not to sell this mando!

it gets played for a couple of hours a day and i swear it is sounding better all the time.

after reading some advice from Paul H. in the builders section i slackened off the tuner screws a tad and tuning the Gloucester is transformed. that tweak along with the bone nut have made this the most stable and easily tuned of my mandolins.

if they brought out more of these i would definitely snap one up for a spare!

i'm still going to fit in a shopping trip to Trevor's as soon as time allows, but no way am i parting with this mandolin. i've been comparing it with my session mate's two Eastman mandos. at first i thought his A5 style Eastman had an edge on volume, but now i can't hear any distance between them, and tonewise i'll take the Fullerton.

the A4 style Eastman he has is a different animal. the oval hole makes it sound fatter and bassier than the Fullerton, but it can't chop to save its life!

unbelievable, these things.

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## Rick Lindstrom

I'm still loving mine, and it does seem to be playing in, or I'm learning to draw the best out of it- whatever.

It'd be cool to have a "Fullerton Gloucester- a year later" thread if someone could remember to get it going when the time comes.

Rick

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