# Technique, Theory, Playing Tips and Tricks > Theory, Technique, Tips and Tricks >  Mike Compton's pick grip

## Jon Hall

After reading Mike's interview yesterday, I tried his recommended pick grip. As I understood, he holds the pick loosely between the ball of his thumb, which I assumed is the first knuckle from the end, and the first knuckle(from the end) of the index finger. When I tried this my thumb and the first joint of my index finger are parallel to each other in a straight line. This is very different from the way I've held the pick when playing both mandolin and guitar. I have always held the pick between the pad of my thumb and the first knuckle of my index finger. My thumb and finger form an X.

When I tried holding the pick the way described I was astounded by the increased volume! I've played my Weber Absaroka for 10 - 11 years and have never heard that tone/volume before last night! I was even distracted from watching the Cowboys / Eagles game :Grin: 

The grip was fairly comfortable, though different, when playing a fiddle tune but felt very awkward when playing a tremelo or strumming. 

I would appreciate any comments and suggestions before I invest the time and effort at learning to hold the pick in such a radically different manner. I'm a semi-professional picker, earning about 20% of my income from teaching guitar and mandolin students and playing in 2 groups. Although I loved the results I don't know if I want disrupt my playing by relearning such a elemental technique.

Any advice and suggestions are appreciated.

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## Jeremy Darrow

I have taken a few lessons with Mike, and that pick grip, as I understand it, is one of many steps in Mike's extremely comprehensive approach to the mandolin. The difference in volume and tone IS dramatic. If you want to explore it more, you should get together with the man himself, either in person or online. I don't think it will be a big disruption to your playing, but it will be a shift of gears.


Best of luck.
Jeremy

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## Mattg

I was in Mike's workshop in Denver yesterday (great by the way) and he showed us the grip and, Jon, you have described it correctly. I get why he uses it because it really helps with that Monroe tremolo. Still, it's quite foreign feeling for me. I'm going to stick with it for awhile and see how it works.

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## Barry Platnick

I too was at the workshop yesterday and it was great.

Last summer at the RockyGrass academy And Leftwich was one of the teachers and he tried to get me to use the same grip now I've got one that is closer to that and it definitely helps with the tone. Its like you hand is on auto-dig in or something. but it feels really foreign at first. I am going to play with it some more.

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## Jon Hall

All of your replies are encouraging. I practiced with "the grip" yesterday and was pleased with every tune I played. A tremelo is still awkward as is strumming but I'm working on it. 

Does anyone use this grip for flat picking a guitar?

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## Jimmijames

Could someone take a picture? I'm having a hard time visualizing.

Jim

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## Fretbear

I've been trying that grip. The adjustment is subtle, but does seem to increase volume. I think it is from the increased looseness with which you can grip the pick, as opposed to it being more locked-up the other way. Jimmy Gaudreau used to use a three-finger grip that made the pick wind up in his fingertips, as opposed to further back, and this seems to be similar, but without that awkward feeling of the third finger.

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## Phil Goodson

Here you go.

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## AlanN

Those are some good close-up photos. I don't do it that way, I hold the pick closer to the fingertips. Just shows there is more than one way to skin a cat.

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## swampy

Love the Compton grip.

My brother plays Jazz guitar, and this is how he was taught to hold the pick in college. 

He told me it was like strumming with your thumb, or a thumbpick and the 1st finger was mostly an anchor to keep the pick steady. When I pick with my old grip it's as though I'm strumming with the back of the fingernail on the 1st finger. Definitely puts the focus on a different set of nerves.

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## Jock

I looked up Mike on Youtube to see if I could see and I figured it as Phil posted, quite a handy man on the mandolin is Mike so I found myself listening rather than watching  :Laughing: . It is different but I reckon there is more momentum being transfered directly to the pick from the wrist, hence more tone/volume, no extended fingers to absorb a little of the impact. I don't know if I'll be able to incorporate it but I'm going to give it a try.

One problem I've got with mandolin & tenor banjo is my pick is fixed in my hold and whilst I can correct the angle on the fly I'm not as dexterous with the pick as I am on the guitar. When playing the guitar I can quickly change the hold angle etc to suit what I'm trying to do. Hopefully I'll develop my mando/tenor pick hold dexterity with practice.

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## kudzugypsy

when i re-worked my right hand technique a few years ago i stumbled upon this grip by watching of all things gypsy guitar players. this is the classic plectrum grip that was taught in nearly all the early turn of the century plectrum methods (banjo, guitar, mandolin) - and it works. by placing the first knuckle of the thumb over the pick (instead of the pad) you do seem to get more volume and a better tone - just a slight move, but it can make a difference - plus my tremolo was much smoother.

of course there are hundreds of great players with complete opposite approaches that work for them- your right hand is your personality on the instrument - so its actually good that there are variations imo.

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## Malcolm G.

I've been a quitar/banjo finger-picker for about 50 years, so didn't have too much flat picking experience to unlearn.
Thanks for the pictures, Phil.
I agree with everyone who says the grip is great.
BTW, the Blue Chip finish really helps here - to satabilize the pick's orientation (I have boney knuckles).

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## tree

> of course there are hundreds of great players with complete opposite approaches that work for them- your right hand is your personality on the instrument - so its actually good that there are variations imo.


As my 15 yr old would say, True Dat.

Wayne Benson comes to mind . . . I'm fortunate to live close enough to take an occasional lesson, and he has (I think) a unique pick grip, not at all like Compton's fairly traditional grip - and it works extraordinarily well for him.

He's obviously put in a mind-boggling amount of time with it, too.

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## Mattg

The photos that Phil posted look like what Mike was teaching us. One thing I noticed while watching Mike's right hand last Saturday is that his pick swivels about 45 degrees when he is doing tremolo. The pick really flops around yet he's got control of the thing. Still seems foriegn to me but keeping at it.

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## fatt-dad

He must have seen me playing one day and is now using the Papa Gordo grip.  Can't keep a good secret for too long, I guess. . .

f-d

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## BlueMt.

> He must have seen me playing one day and is now using the Papa Gordo grip.  Can't keep a good secret for too long, I guess. . .
> 
> f-d


Are you responsible for Windows 7, also?  :Wink:

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## Steve Ostrander

I keep trying this grip but it feels awkward. I think it works good for single note picking, but awkward for chopping.

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## Roger Kunkel

> by placing the first knuckle of the thumb over the pick (instead of the pad) you do seem to get more volume and a better tone - just a slight move, but it can make a difference - plus my tremolo was much smoother.


Yes indeed! Been trying it for a few days and I feel this small difference gives me huge results in speed, tone, and smoothness.  :Smile:

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## BlueMt.

I'm having a hard time with this grip but it sounds so good.  The tone and volume improvement, especially on my f-hole mando, is considerable.  I'm going to keep at it.

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## Jon Hall

I've been practicing "the grip" on both guitar and mandolin and it's becoming a little more comfortable. I've discovered that the increased volume enables me to lighten up and still maintain reasonable volume. As I said in my original post, it made a big difference playing my Weber but when I tried it on the lower end Kentuckys, in the local music store, I couldn't tell much difference in the tone or volume.

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## jasona

Here is a study of what many pros do wrt their right hands. I thnik John McGann has another page on this technique.

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## Mike Bunting

I don't believe that list is entirely accurate. I  sat within 4 feet of Compton in a lesson and his fingers do not touch the top as stated in the list.

I went and looked at some vids and sometimes a finger may touch the finger rest.

When he hits the double time part, it looks like he may get his pinkie in the rest.

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## AlanN

Tempo was good, love Frank's ideas here. And the harmonized chorus at the end.

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## Phil Vinyard

Saw Chris Thile last night from the front row, about 20' away, and from that vantage point would describe his grip as the same or very similar to Compton's. http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/sh...ad.php?t=58329 

Seemed to work out pretty well for him...

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## Ken_P

> Saw Chris Thile last night from the front row, about 20' away, and from that vantage point would describe his grip as the same or very similar to Compton's. http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/sh...ad.php?t=58329 
> 
> Seemed to work out pretty well for him...


I agree that the grip is pretty close, but the attack is very different. From Compton's interview, he says he keeps the pick very flat while he's picking, as opposed to Thile, who angles it quite a bit for a much smoother pick stroke.

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## Pete Hicks

I use the same grip as Mike.  I think it was taught to me by my jazz guitar teacher at NYU, Barry Galbraith.  The picks flexes so that the pick always drives down into and through the strings (toward the soundboard). If the pick pushes the strings sideways too much or pulls them away from the top, you get a buzzy weak tone.  On the upstroke, the pick flexes the other way to push down toward the instrument as well.  A loose grip on the pick is essential for this.

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## Darren Bailey

I've been trying this grip for a couple of days. After twenty years of guitar playing and much less time mandolin, this feels like a radical change to me. At first I found I just couldn't hit the strings with any accuracy, it felt very frustrating. After a couple of hours it began to seem more natural and now my original grip doesn't feel right, although i'm still not completely relaxed with this "new" (to me) grip.
At first I started feeling a strain along the back of my hand, just above the pinky. I adjusted the position of the pick slightly and this went away.
There is a definite improvement in the volume but I'm not sure about the tone.
The main difference I've noticed is that it has lifted my hand up off the bridge. Playing mandolin I've always rested my hand on the bridge, but this grip lifted it off without me being aware of it. 
Feels much beetr chopping and ok for tremelo, but I'm still not up to the same speed I was at previously when picking. I feel like I'm past the point of no return now and am going to keep going with this position, I feel optimistic about it. I'd be interested to hear how other people are finding it if they've recently changed.

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## fishtownmike

I feel it's more important to find a grip and a pick for that matter that work for you instead of trying to mimic your favorite mandolinist. Everyone is different including your hands and fingers. I have seen some people do things a certain way that are truly physically uncomfortable for me and things like this can lead to injuries. I have been holding my pick the way i have for close to 30 years and it's what works for me but may not be right for you.

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## Perry

I've been holding the pick my way (I hold my pick with three fingers similar to Wayne Benson) too long to change though I've tried the Compton grip. I'm a big fan of the tone he gets...very big and fat. It's like I'm just starting out when I use a radically different pick grip then I'm used to.

If you are fairly new to picking though I'd give the Compton grip a serious attempt.

Everyonce in a while in mid tune I'll change to that type of grip for chopping; it's helps fatique to change positions once in a while I think. Also I find the Compton grip easier to attempt on a guitar for some reason.

I think Dan Crary puts four fingers on his pick!

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## tree

It's never too late to change a "bad" habit - I'm living proof.  I changed my pick grip from the "Clapton grip" to the "Compton grip" after 30+ years of ingraining the "Clapton grip".  It was worth every bit of frustration, discipline and force of will that it required.  The benefits were less fatigue, better tone, better playing overall, and elimination of the pick rotating or otherwise shifting position during play.

That said, it did take more time and effort than I really wanted to devote to it, but in the end it is definitely a goal that can be accomplished.  It's mostly a matter of putting in the time it takes to get through the steep part of the learning curve.

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## Perry

If a pick grip is not like "so and so's" it doesn't make it bad; just different. Agreed if it is something really holding you back from what YOU want then it's worth struggling through it. 

There's one thing you can't do with a clenched fist grip and that is to use your pick and fingers to strike strings simultaneously. Very handy for chord melody stuff.

p.s. What is the "Clapton" grip?

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## RHBoy

Great advice on grip change.  I've been working on this grip for about 3 hours and I must echo the general results-definite pronounced increase in volume.  It seems that older picks I had decided did not have the right sound for me sounds great now.  Less tension in the arm has also resulted.  It does feel a bit clumsy, but I'm sure it is the user and not the technique  :Smile:   Heck I was clumsy before, but now I'll have louder mistakes with more tone  :Mandosmiley:   Thanks for the great advice-I haven't been this jazzed about a new tech for a while!

Jeff

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## tree

> If a pick grip is not like "so and so's" it doesn't make it bad; just different. Agreed if it is something really holding you back from what YOU want then it's worth struggling through it. 
> 
> There's one thing you can't do with a clenched fist grip and that is to use your pick and fingers to strike strings simultaneously. Very handy for chord melody stuff.
> 
> p.s. What is the "Clapton" grip?


It's how EC holds his pick - lightly pinched between the pads of thumb and pinky.  I was mostly self-taught (pick grip particularly), and it was definitely holding me back from learning how to flatpick acoustic instruments.  My pick was rotating and shifting and sometimes flying across the room, which was not conducive to learning (unless you're learning to swear).

The old grip still works for me on electric guitar, especially for short, staccato upstrokes - because I can trap the pick on the end of my thumb with my index finger, and that allows for a very controlled, short movement.  It also allows me to drop the tip of my middle finger down, braced against my thumb, to just barely touch the top of the string I'm picking.  I can get a little chimey thing going (think the second break in Bellbottom Blues).

Oddly enough, I find myself switching between my old grip and the Compton grip at various times, on electric.

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## bagpipe

> It's how EC holds his pick - lightly pinched between the pads of thumb and *pinky*.


That has to an error. Pinky?

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## BlueMt.

I've been trying this grip for a few days now and though the tone and volume increases are great I'm having a couple of problems.

I play with the heel of my right hand lightly touching just on or behind the bridge and this grip moves my hand closer to the strings sometimes causing some unwanted muting.  If I move my hand towards the tailpiece it takes me out of my sweet spot.  

The other more serious problem is that the extra curling of the index finger seems to introduce just enough extra tension to cause pain in my wrist and forearm.  Anyone else experience this?

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## tree

bagpipe - great photo.  Index finger is what I meant, don't know how pinky came out instead.

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## Rob Gerety

I changed my flat pick grip about a year ago to something close to this.  It seemed very awkward for strumming and tremolo at first.  After a few weeks it seemed completely natural.

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## fishtownmike

> It's never too late to change a "bad" habit - I'm living proof.  I changed my pick grip from the "Clapton grip" to the "Compton grip" after 30+ years of ingraining the "Clapton grip".  It was worth every bit of frustration, discipline and force of will that it required.  The benefits were less fatigue, better tone, better playing overall, and elimination of the pick rotating or otherwise shifting position during play.
> 
> That said, it did take more time and effort than I really wanted to devote to it, but in the end it is definitely a goal that can be accomplished.  It's mostly a matter of putting in the time it takes to get through the steep part of the learning curve.


Bad habit? So everyone who holds a pick different then Mike Compton has a bad habit?

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## tree

No - see quotation marks around "bad".  It was bad for me.

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## mandohack

I was using this grip last summer but slowly started putting the pick further out to the end of my thumb because it seemed that it provided a little more dexterity, but I could hear the tone thinning out so I increased the pick angle across the strings to compensate. I have never been a real Compton fan but this thread has let me know that my initial grip wasn't wrong afterall. Beefier tone with less work in my opinion. I have really enjoyed the process of getting a good tone and I think this is where a mandolin can teach the player good technique.

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## YusufGatewood

> I've been trying this grip for a few days now and though the tone and volume increases are great I'm having a couple of problems.
> 
> I play with the heel of my right hand lightly touching just on or behind the bridge and this grip moves my hand closer to the strings sometimes causing some unwanted muting.  If I move my hand towards the tailpiece it takes me out of my sweet spot.  
> 
> The other more serious problem is that the extra curling of the index finger seems to introduce just enough extra tension to cause pain in my wrist and forearm.  Anyone else experience this?


I get the exact same problem.

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## Gelsenbury

> I use the same grip as Mike.  I think it was taught to me by my jazz guitar teacher at NYU, Barry Galbraith.  The picks flexes so that the pick always drives down into and through the strings (toward the soundboard). If the pick pushes the strings sideways too much or pulls them away from the top, you get a buzzy weak tone.  On the upstroke, the pick flexes the other way to push down toward the instrument as well.  *A loose grip on the pick is essential for this.*


My emphasis - because it tallies with my recent experience. I'm only starting out, but the day I relaxed and held the pick somewhat more loosely brought about a big change in the sound of my playing too. The notes sound cleaner, the chords softer, and whilst some of you have spoken about increases in volume I find that I can now much better *control* the volume at which I play. Good advice here, thank you Mandolin Cafe!

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## Rex Hart

I have been experimenting with Mike Compton's pick grip and have found that my speed and tremolo have greatly benefitted from this. My only problem is that I seem to lose tone. Anyone else having this problem ?

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## Jason Kindall

> I have been experimenting with Mike Compton's pick grip and have found that my speed and tremolo have greatly benefitted from this. My only problem is that I seem to lose tone. Anyone else having this problem ?


Hmmm...  I've found just the opposite.  My tone got thicker and fuller as long as I keep the wrist loose.  When I tense up I get the volume but a thinner and tinnier tone.  I think the wrist is the key.

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## Barbara Shultz

Isn't the grip being discussed, Mike Compton's, the same as what was being called Dan's Power Grip a while back?

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## Cheryl Watson

> That has to an error. Pinky?


He uses his pinky to turn the volume up/down while he is playing.

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## Cheryl Watson

Any mandolin style that you need to pick fast and clean will not work (IMO) with the Compton grip. That grip works well for rubbing the strings which is a very true Monroe style. I sometimes use MC's grip (when I am playing the most chordal of the Monroe tunes) but usually use a slightly modified version of MC's grip.  My style is not pure Monroe, but a hybrid of modern clean picking and Monroe style (not as clean as Butch Baldassari played, but not as "dirty" as MC (if that makes any sense at all).

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## Mike Bromley

Gee!  That's always how I held my pick.  I must admit it gets a nice pfithwang outta the strings. :Grin:  :Mandosmiley:  :Popcorn:

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## Mike Bunting

> Gee!  That's always how I held my pick.  I must admit it gets a nice pfithwang outta the strings.


Gotta love the old pfithwang!  :Smile:  That's a gooder!

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## Mike Bromley

> Gotta love the old pfithwang!


Has a nice ring to it, huh? :Laughing:

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## Mike Bunting

> Has a nice ring to it, huh?


Oh, yeah.

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## re simmers

I can see a real advantage to this grip.  It makes sense.   But I can't seem to pick the fast fiddle tunes with this grip.   The pick tends to want to spin around.   I thought about using "liquid nails" but I can't coordinate the caulking gun with my left hand.   
Any tips?

Bob

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## Mike Snyder

Just put that tube of adhesive in yer bench vise and crank her down 'til it pops, then sop up the gravy. The pick grip thing, I've got smallish hands and the MC grip moves me away from the "sweet spot". It does enhance tone and volume, so it's a trade off. My real problem is arthritis in the index finger first joint. That tight bend gets painful.

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## Andrew B. Carlson

This was a great thread to happen upon. This grip improved my sound. With time, my hand will stop trying to go back to the old way. This has also helped my knuckle dragging quite a bit! I'm sure glad I have a big TAD Blue Chip though. A normal teardrop wouldn't have fit that well.

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## Miss Lonelyhearts

"He told me it was like strumming with your thumb, or a thumbpick and the 1st finger was mostly an anchor to keep the pick steady."  As a long-time banjo picker, I like the mental image this gives me. Now off to go try it.

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## Crabgrass

The MC grip is pretty much what I stumbled on first.... But here's a funny. When I read the first post in this thread, I misread "ball of the thumb" to mean the _base_ of the thumb, where it meets the palm  :Smile:  Now you want volume? Try that 'un! Not very practical though, sort of like playing with an amputation.

I do wonder why they don't make picks a whole lot bigger, longer, and fatter. Seems like it would allow you to brace the pick more firmly (which gives volume) with less strain on the old joints.  :Confused:

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## Bob Bronow

So glad I stumbled upon this thread! After trying "the grip" I noticed an immediate improvement in tone clarity and control. Makes me want to play for the rest of the day!  :Mandosmiley:

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## Pete Braccio

Add me to the list of converts. Wow! I can't believe the difference in tone.

However, I'm having a he'll of a time playing rhythm with this grip. I'm hoping that will come in time.

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