# Music by Genre > Old-Time, Roots, Early Country, Cajun, Tex-Mex >  Just out: The Milliner-Koken Collection of American Fiddle Tunes

## MONami

The Milliner - Koken Collection of American Fiddle Tunes
http://www.four51.com/UI/Customer.as...c-2d5b6006990e

Transcribed and Annotated by Clare Milliner and Walt Koken.
888 pages total.
1404 tunes in musical engravings, arranged alphabetically in 741 pages. 
Ten page introduction with explanations and examples. 
Main index arranged by title, with references to source recordings and cross references to similar tunes and titles. 
Key index arranged alphabetically by key. 
Tuning index arranged alphabetically by fiddle tuning. 
Artist index arranged alphabetically by fiddler, showing what tunes are included by that artist. 
Artist profiles section with brief bios of the 347 fiddlers/bands represented in the book. A majority of these fiddlers were born before 1900. 
Also a comments section with interesting information about the tunes and fiddlers.
Over-size format, easy to read, cloth hard bound in sewn signatures, lies flat, library/heirloom quality.
This is an essential resource and reference book for anyone interested in old time American fiddle tunes.

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## JEStanek

Thanks for the great news.

I've been looking forward to this since I met Walt Koken a few years ago.  This has been a life's work for Clare and Walt.  Time to pool my pennies.  This is a huge resource.

Jamie

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## Randy Smith

Got this two weeks ago--strongly recommended. If you like playing American fiddle tunes, I think you'll love this book. It's large but durable. The print is very *readable*.

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## JeffD

Ohhhh mannnnn...

Tunebook Aquisition Syndrome. I haven't been this anxious and shakey since I learned that the Christeson books were reprinted. My resistance is breaking down....


There I ordered it. A feeling of zen like calm comes over me.

Can't wait till it arrives.

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## John Hill

If only it was a pdf...

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## MalcolmSmith

This is one of the most important collections, especially for Old Time players, ever.  Walt Koken was a driving force behind the folk revival in the 60's and 70's as part of the Fat City Stringband, the Highwoods Stringband and other configurations.  He and Clare Millner have created a great collection - over 1400 tunes, but even if you don't read music it is worth owning for the careful research into each tune.  A must have!  My copy is already well used.

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## JeffD

Mine arrived yesterday. Gosh its a heavy thick one.

I read the introduction and front matter - wow. The book is really well thought out.

I can tell I am going to love it.

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## bones12

Wow, my copy arrived yesterday and it is a work of art and an obvious labor of love.  Aside from the transcriptions and sources, there is a section at the end with performers and notes of interest about them.  This is a large book that will have a large impact for those of us driven by old time music.  Doug in Vermont

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## JeffD

Guess what I spent this weekend doing!

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## JeffD

Spent a lot of time with MKC this weekend. So many gold nuggets in there.

I wish it were smaller and more portable, but a I am glad its hardcover and not comb-bound.

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## JeffD

Warning: do not read if you are at work

This fellow, Larry Warren, Brookfield, NH, one of the many unsung heroes of the internet, is posting recordings of all the Milliner Koken tunes. Not midi files, but actual recordings. He has gotten something over 1200 of the tunes posted already. I wasted an embarrassing  amount of time clicking through it this afternoon. Here is the link.

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Jack Roberts

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## MalcolmSmith

Larry is a good guy and a great fiddler.  This has been a true labor of love for him.  No profit, no accolades, just a great resource.  Of course you should buy Walt and Clare's book and then check out Larry's site.  Also, check out the Summer issue of Sing Out!  magazine, for a great article on the collection.

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## AKmusic

Thank you for sharing MONami and JeffD!  What an outstanding collection of tunes!  Hope you don't mind, I'm passing this info along.

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## JeffD

> Larry is a good guy and a great fiddler.  This has been a true labor of love for him. .


I would nominate him for folk hero status!

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## EggerRidgeBoy

I finally got to see the book for the first time last Wednesday at my weekly old-time jam. What a wonderful resource - guess I need to start saving up for my own copy. 

Clare and Walt are evidently planning to play all 1,404 tunes in alphabetical order at their booth at Clifftop next week, and I believe there are plans to record the marathon. I'm hoping to be there for a couple days mid-week, so maybe I'll get to hear a few "L" and "M" -titled tunes.

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## JeffD

> I'm hoping to be there for a couple days mid-week, so maybe I'll get to hear a few "L" and "M" -titled tunes.



Thats pretty funny. I made that joke a month or so ago - how old timey jams announce what key they are in, like this week its G, and next week they play in A.  So I piped up and said "In two weeks you are going to do only tunes that start with L."

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## Mike Black

I just want to give another shout out to this great collection.  My wife got me a copy of this for my birthday earlier this month.  

* This has to be the greatest old-time fiddle book ever! *  

 I love that the book talks about how old-time tunes tend to have a"whisper down the line" effect that leave them as a watered down "festival version".  And they are trying to preserve the intricacies of the tune by transcribing them from source recordings.

It's expensive, but worth the price.

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## Jim Garber

I wonder tho, Mike, what percentage of old time musicians actually learn tunes by the dots. I never did prob until relatively recently and would still go back to the original or older recordings.

The book also serves a dual purpose of being a great weight for pressing flat fiddle bridges.  :Smile:

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## JeffD

I was paper trained from the beginning. I have developed a good ear but I still use the dots, and I learn best from the dots, and then fine tune the tune with a recording, or better, with others playing it.

But yea, that might be kind of inauthentic. I go back to what the unselfconscious old time musicians really did, was, what ever it took. And if a fiddler could read he probably did.

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## JeffD

I was paper trained from the beginning. I have developed a good ear but I still use the dots, and I learn best from the dots, and then fine tune the tune with a recording, or better, with others playing it.

But yea, that might be kind of inauthentic. I go back to what the unselfconscious old time musicians really did, was, what ever it took. And if a fiddler could read he probably did.

Thing is I can sit down with that tome, and a pot of coffee, and expose myself to more tunes than I could hear in three or four jams, and pick learn a handful of them in a few hours. The book already has a few coffee rings on it.


And it is good for pressing leaves. I used it to press a gigantic maple leaf.

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## Jim Garber

No criticism from me for learning from the dots. I just never did in my earlier old time fiddling days -- well maybe just learning some of those English tunes. Now i read a lot on mandolin so i can pickup most fiddle tunes from the paper. OTOH I find i still need to truly listen to the recordings or watch a live musician to get the true nuance. I don't mean authenticity in the manner of learning one way or the other just that the dots don;t really do the tunes justice in the final analysis.

Just put a notated southern tune in front of a classical player who is unfamiliar with fiddle music and... well, you know what that will sound like.

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## Mike Black

> No criticism from me for learning from the dots. I just never did in my earlier old time fiddling days -- well maybe just learning some of those English tunes. Now i read a lot on mandolin so i can pickup most fiddle tunes from the paper. OTOH I find i still need to truly listen to the recordings or watch a live musician to get the true nuance. I don't mean authenticity in the manner of learning one way or the other just that the dots don;t really do the tunes justice in the final analysis.
> 
> Just put a notated southern tune in front of a classical player who is unfamiliar with fiddle music and... well, you know what that will sound like.


I totally agree with you Jim.  I guess that's why the website with all the recordings was also developed.

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## Jim Garber

Yeah, that slippery-hill web site is amazing.

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## Markus

> OTOH I find i still need to truly listen to the recordings or watch a live musician to get the true nuance. I don't mean authenticity in the manner of learning one way or the other just that the dots don't really do the tunes justice in the final analysis.


Good point. There's nothing I like more on a winter's night than sitting around home playing through some fiddle tune book. 

I can get the right pitches in roughly the right rhythm ... but unless I hear the song, the feel is all wrong. It doesn't `drive', it's not unlike your classical player. Listening to a song whose melody jumped out of the book at me can be such a revelation, after working out a version based on the dots. It's remarkable how close those dots get, most of the time - yet I still need a listen or two [at least] to understand where the dots lack expressiveness.

There's a couple songs that I learned out of fiddle books, only play alone, that I've never heard - after a year fooling around with them, the do have their own nice feel and drive. I'm at the point where I'm not sure I want to hear the original, because I know mine ain't it but I sure like mine. Perhaps it's time to call my version something else, as it's the notes and general rhythm and a good tune - but an old-time fiddler would look at me funny when I called it by another tunes' name and no doubt it is not recognizable as the name I learned it under.

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## JeffD

I would agree that every tune I have learned from a book had to be fine tuned by actual listening to one degree or another. But when you have been in playing the genre long enough, you do get the feel of it, and do a pretty good job just from the dots. Still needs to be fine tuned in a jam, but its pretty close. An example from IT, I can read a jig or a hornpipe from a tune book and I have done jigs and hornpipes enough that I will do a creditable job on the tune, not ever having heard it before. It may be tweeked a little in the jam, but I will be most of the way there.  

I am newer to OT, so I don't have the OT chops as yet, but its coming, its coming.

Its not one or the other, its best to have both. The ears so you can pick up how things really are played, and the dots so you are not limited to things that others are playing or are on youtube or recorded. I would find it a major handicap to only play things I have heard.

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## Jack Roberts

I just pulled the trigger on this book.  I have a couple of collections, including Ryan's Mammoth, but I just couldn't resist. And I agree it's better to have both notation and real sitting-in playing, but I'll take notation alone whenever I can get it, because I get NO time for sitting-in anymore.

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## Jim Garber

Jack: Also note that Jeff linked to recordings of most, if not all of these tunes:




> This fellow, Larry Warren, Brookfield, NH, one of the many unsung heroes of the internet, is posting recordings of all the Milliner Koken tunes. Not midi files, but actual recordings. He has gotten something over 1200 of the tunes posted already. I wasted an embarrassing  amount of time clicking through it this afternoon. Here is the link.

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Jack Roberts

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## Jack Roberts

Well, I got my book yesterday, and I lost a lot of much needed sleep last night working through some of the tunes.  Listening to the recordings and comparing them with the transcriptions is quite demanding in some cases.  But with careful listening it is clear that Clare Milliner's transcriptions are excellent.  

I have been listening to the Berea recordings for the last few years, but as my hearing gets worse, I am finding it harder to learn by listening.  It is terrific to have this resource.

No bar-lines in the notation gets a little getting used to, but I'm getting the hang of it now.

The only problem is when I put the book on my adjustable height music stand, the stand sinks...  This is one heavy book.  

Thanks for the introduction to this great resource.  That's what I love about the Mandolin Cafe. (besides the cool-cat red hats.)

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## JEStanek

I saw a friend's copy of this this past weekend.  It is a Tome, it is huge, it is a treasure chest.  I need to save my nickels.

Jamie

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## Jack Roberts

> .... And they are trying to preserve the intricacies of the tune by transcribing them from source recordings....


After another late night with this amazing book, I really appreciate the fact that the editors have not only transcribed the source recordings in a single variant, but sometimes with two or three different variations in how the tune was played.  This is a great resource for how the improvisations were made.  The intricacies are notated clearly, even though the original recordings are not clear in a lot of cases.  The transcriber certainly had a good ear.  

Besides being a tune book, it is also a course in improvisation techniques.  I don't think the price is unreasonable.  No designer coffee for 3 or 4 weeks and i'll have the cash to pay the credit card bill.

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tangleweeds

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## JeffD

> I saw a friend's copy of this this past weekend.  It is a Tome, it is huge, it is a treasure chest.


Indeed. I think of most tune books that way, but this one in particular. Its not only a good way to find a particular tune you heard or heard of, but the book rewards random dips. 

Not too many things have as much value per dollar spent, as this one book.

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## JeffD

Has anyone come up with a creative way to lug that book around? 

I was thinking of one of those bamboo teapot handles you can get at any craft store, and some pieces of leather shoelace. What have you folks come up with? Its large enough that a set of wheels and a pull string is not entirely nutty.

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## Jack Roberts

> Has anyone come up with a creative way to lug that book around? 
> 
> I was thinking of one of those bamboo teapot handles you can get at any craft store, and some pieces of leather shoelace. What have you folks come up with? Its large enough that a set of wheels and a pull string is not entirely nutty.


I fold mine up and store it in the pick compartment of my A-1's case.

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## Jim Garber

> Has anyone come up with a creative way to lug that book around?


I was thinking of having a Calton case made for it.  :Smile: 

Actually, I think the intent was as a reference work. I can't imagine sitting around at a festival and playing directly from it.

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## Jack Roberts

> ...Actually, I think the intent was as a reference work. I can't imagine sitting around at a festival and playing directly from it.


I'm transcribing (on paper or with Sibelius) the pieces I'm more interested in because I don't want to mark up the beautiful book with bowing direction and fingering notes (for fiddle and mandolin respectively), time signatures, bar lines, and directions for the sequence of parts to better match the recordings.

So I have a growing collection of transportable sheet music, although with my hearing problems I'm not sure I can play in jams or festivals any more...

The book itself is too big even to keep on a bookshelf.  I have it on a dictionary stand.

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## JeffD

> Actually, I think the intent was as a reference work. I can't imagine sitting around at a festival and playing directly from it.


Well Walt and Clare are doing just that, once again, at various festivals. One tune after another. 

But I agree, ordinarily I would not lug it to a jam. But as soon as possible after a jam I have got it out to look up some tune I just heard.

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## flagstaffcharlie

Dear Santa Claus,

I only want one thing for Christmas this year...

 :Smile:

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## JeffD

If you are trying to justify the purchase, think of it this way. When you buy the book, put a piggy bank next to it, and every time you open the book or turn a page, put a quarter in the bank. Soon enough you will have the book paid for, and if you continue, you will soon be saving for a new manodlin.

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## Jim Garber

Makes a very nice paperweight or old time coffee table. That book weighs a ton.

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