# Music by Genre > Orchestral, Classical, Italian, Medieval, Renaissance >  Nmc: sting does dowland

## PhilGE

Believe it or not:

*Sting Enters His Elizabethan Period*

RealOne Videoclip

The new CD website.

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## margora

There has been an extensive discussion of this CD on the lute discussion group of the Lute Society of America (you can find a link at www.worldguitarist.org). Suffice it to say that there is a wide diversity of opinion.

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## Eugene

Some of the chat on the Dartmouth lute list regarding this has been downright contentious. While I will not call the effort "wrong" for its choice of lute type, I will say that after looking forward to its release for many months, I was disappointed in the sound (based only on online samples, but based upon those samples, I'm not at all likely to buy).

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## Amandalyn

I have this Cd for sale. It's just not my cup of tea, when I saw the Tv interview on Sunday morning Sting played "Fields of Gold" on the lute, and I thought this type of material would be on the album- but not. So if anyone is interested- $10.00 and I'll ship it. Email : amandalyn@bellsouth.net

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## billkilpatrick

well i think it's great. i've been playing it as i prepare dinner for over a week now and with a libation of something wonderful from scotland in one hand and a spatula (or whatever) in the other i find i'm singing along with sting - dowland in the kitchen ... great!

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## John Kavanagh

I listened to the clips, and all I can think is I wish he'd done this 20 or so years ago, before he toasted his voice... Can you imagine the voice that sang "Roxanne" on, say "In Darkness Let me Dwell" or "I Saw my Lady Weep"?

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## vkioulaphides

... thought I'd keep you all posted on latest sightings: 

Sting doing the Dowland Thing (with lute AND theorbo, although the theorbist was the only one I saw playing Sting was merely _holding_ some lutoid or other) as part of the lighting of the tree in New York's Rockefeller Center.

The Early Music Establishment (or was it _Mafia_?  ) may have to take pause... we are speaking of *visibility* here, Q-factors, and all that harsh, pragmatic stuff that makes up, oh... "What Is That Thing Called REALITY", and all that jazz.

As usual, I cast a blank vote. I am too much of a skeptic to be moved, either way. A cold, Grecoroman shrug is all I can offer...

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## margora

"Sting doing the Dowland Thing (with lute AND theorbo, although the theorbist was the only one I saw playing Sting was merely holding some lutoid or other) as part of the lighting of the tree in New York's Rockefeller Center".

Victor, was it a theorbo or an archlute? The latter is what Edin has been playing (as far as I know) in his gigs with Sting.

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## Neil Gladd

> "What Is That Thing Called REALITY"


I thought that was Cole Porter, not Dowland...

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## Eugene

The reports I'd heard had Edin with archlute for the NY appearances...which is pretty much the same thing as a theorbo to the untrained eye, like _Dreissena polymorpha_ vs. _Dreissena bugensis_ (HA, a little mollusc humor from Lake Erie for y'all!).

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## billkilpatrick

> The reports I'd heard had Edin with archlute for the NY appearances...which is pretty much the same thing as a theorbo to the untrained eye, like _Dreissena polymorpha_ vs. _Dreissena bugensis_ (HA, a little mollusc humor from Lake Erie for y'all!).


... clam up! or i'll muscle in and mollusc ya'.

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## vkioulaphides

> "The reports I'd heard had Edin with archlute for the NY appearances...which is pretty much the same thing as a theorbo to the untrained eye."


Yes, probably... I only took one, glancing look, and my eye by my own, candid admission IS most certainly untrained in such matters.

But all that is largely beside the point, the point being that, whatever _artistic choice_ notwithstanding, Sting has gotten Dowland, in ONE performance, more (televised) visibility than the entire Early Music Establishment has mustered in DECADES. Cause for pause, as reality knocks on the door...

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## Bob A

Forget Dowland: someone needs to get a bowlback into his hands . . .

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## Eugene

> ...Sting has gotten Dowland, in ONE performance, more (televised) visibility than the entire Early Music Establishment has mustered in DECADES. Cause for pause, as reality knocks on the door...


I agree. #In spite of my appreciation of this fact, this same fact has been the major source of irritation to a small contigent of the zealots of HIP (i.e., historically informed perfromance) who protest "wrong" choices in lute type, string configuration, technique, etc. #Whether admitted or not, jealousy is obviously at play here. #Frankly, I'm not fond of what I've heard from this collaboration, but there is plenty of Dowland on record and accessible that does appease the HIP crowd and much of which appeals to me personally. #If this project brings more attention to it--and draws more potentially good players to explore the instruments and repertoire--I say it has done nothing but good whether I choose to buy it or not. #I can say it with little fear of reprisal here, so "Chill out, HIP-sters."

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## Eugene

> Forget Dowland: someone needs to get a bowlback into his hands . . .


There was an article run a few years back--and I have no recollection of where, why, content, etc.--that did picture Sting casually lounging with a bowlback, what looked to be a ca. 1910 L&H product. Now, if only that bowlback in his hands would generate a recording project. Alison...?

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## Paul Kotapish

I've listened to the album and heard Sting interviewed extensively about the project, and while it's not my cup of tea--I'm not particularly fond of Dowling's songs nor of Sting's interpretations of them--fair play to the man for striving, growing, and learning something new--or rather, in this case, something very old. 

I think Sting's real contribution here is demonstrating that a musician's progress need not be measured solely by how unique and "creative" each subsequent project is. I reckon that most mandolinists have a firm appreciation of the value of learning from elders and from tradition, but that notion has been almost entirely annihilated from popular culture in favor of the myth of progress. 

If I'm not always moved by the results, I always applaud when a popular artist is willing to confound expectations in order to explore venerable traditions and bring heritage treasures to the attention of the sheepish public.

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## vkioulaphides

... and, of course, my dour commentary is not to be taken _terribly_ seriously. The entire tree-lighting event should be better known (in _liturgical_ terms) as The Feast of the Egregious Miscasting. # 

Last year, Rod Stewart singing "I've Got My Love To Keep Me Warm"... # #Now, Rod is one of my all-time faves, and a rocker par excellence, with his peerless falsetto growl and all. Having said all that, asking the poor man to maneuvre all the slinky chromatics in the aforementioned _jazzy_ tune is cardinal sin; he couldn't carry that tune if his LIFE depended on it. 

Ditto this year. Ms. Aguilera gave a truly moving vocal performance --which, typically/paradoxically earned her only a lukewarm applause-- to the multimedia skating of Sasha Cohen. In the painfully feeble one-handed clapping that followed, the singer graciously gave a bow to the skater. The audience had largely missed the point.

But I am ranting. Once an impresario, ALWAYS an impresario. I am still, incurably thinking of the magical, but oh-so-vague "point of contact", where the John/Jane Performer somehow touches John/Jane *Listener*'s life. If Sting can do that --and I truly cannot tell whether he succeeded in this with his Dowland, lutes, archlutes and all-- he is to be applauded wholeheartedly; if not, it does not make one bit of difference whatever ELSE one can say about his performance.

Let go, Victor, let go... #

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## billkilpatrick

> Last year, Rod Stewart singing "I've Got My Love To Keep Me Warm"... # #Now, Rod is one of my all-time faves, and a rocker par excellence, with his peerless falsetto growl and all. Having said all that, asking the poor man to maneuvre all the slinky chromatics in the aforementioned _jazzy_ tune is cardinal sin; he couldn't carry that tune if his LIFE depended on it. 
> 
> ...
> 
> But I am ranting. Once an impresario, ALWAYS an impresario. I am still, incurably thinking of the magical, but oh-so-vague "point of contact", where the John/Jane Performer somehow touches John/Jane *Listener*'s life. If Sting can do that --and I truly cannot tell whether he succeeded in this with his Dowland, lutes, archlutes and all-- he is to be applauded wholeheartedly; if not, it does not make one bit of difference whatever ELSE one can say about his performance.
> 
> Let go, Victor, let go... #


afore ye go ...

i'm one of those john listeners who connected with sting's dowland recordings in a way that i never would have with the conventional, HIP presentation - all swashbuckling staginess and duddley-do-right diction.

unlike the rod steward recordings you mention, sting's renderings are not pastiche. #to me, the music and the poetry actually meant something to him (sting) - much more than a collection of jolly-nice, sentimental songs from the 1940's (alà stewart) or a devious entree (as has been suggested) into the enormously popular (?!?) extremely lucrative (!?!) early music market.

i think we should hold any cross-over criticism we might have in reserve - in the event of a "pavarotti sings sting" cd under the xmas tree this year.

- bill

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## lightnbrassy

I know little about playing the lute. But as a casual listener, compared to Renaissance and Baroque recordings I do own, Sting's playing sounded HARD and bare. But this is just from a couple of clips I heard ... and watching him play on a television tribute to James Taylor.

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## dj coffey

PBS Great Performances last night broadcast Sting and others discussing Dowland as well as some video takes of his and Edin's performances in various settings evocative of the period.

I was gifted the CD - was some what put off by Sting's approach to singing - but I am ill-informed on the standards of the age in spite of years of listening to mostly instrumental early music.

As a result of seeing the PBS special, I downloaded a couple of hours worth of lute performances from i-tunes. Very listenable without the singing! # # #I don't know if that will appease the HIP people or not.

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## margora

"PBS Great Performances last night broadcast Sting and others discussing Dowland as well as some video tackes of his and Edin's performances in various settings evocative of the period."


My wife and I watched an enjoyed it very much. We are definitely into HIP so this is, to be sure, different, but the show as very well done and the songs were performed with understanding and attention to detail. I personally like the rhythmic energy he brings to "Can She Excuse" (compared with typical performances) and "In Darkness" was very effective. Also, excellent commentary from Anthony Rooley and excellent shorts of Edin's thumb-under right hand technique.

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## Eugene

I really enjoyed that program too. #Your take on can she excuse is interesting, Bob. #That's one of my very favorite Dowland songs, and Sting's interpretation put me right off. #For me, I felt like Sting's approach "muddied" the inherent rhythmic drive of the song. #I much prefer the interpretations of the Julian Bream consort, e.g., from 1962 (instrumental) and again in 1988 with tenor Robert Tear. #Again, I want to emphasize that I am not a Sting naysayer; while I am appreciative of his efforts here, it is not always to my personal taste.

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## JEStanek

I stumbled upon the PBS show and really enjoyed it. #I also really enjoy the CD. This would be my first foray into old music like this and consider Sting an entry point to exploring something I may previously never considered. #For that reason alone, I'm thankful. Since, people here posting include some HIP newbies, can some of you more steeped in this music suggest some other recordings "we should own", please.

Thanks!
Jamie

edit: It was this CD that inspired me to get the Allexander book/cd of renaissance and medieval music for mandolin.

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## margora

"For me, I felt like Sting's approach "muddied" the inherent rhythmic drive of the song. I much prefer the interpretations of the Julian Bream consort, e.g., from 1962 (instrumental) and again in 1988 with tenor Robert Tear."

I enjoy the Bream, too. Rhythmic energy is not the same as accuracy or clarity, so I take your point. Last night on the way home from the PMO rehearsal I was listening in the car to a recording of the First Book of Songs by the lutenist Chris Wilson and the singer Rufus Muller. This is an outstanding recording, very HIP (and cheap, too, it has been reissued on Brilliant) -- perfect as a reference, if one is planning to perform Dowland songs (which I did, a few weeks, ago with the singer I work with). Their version of Can She Excuse is crystal clear rhytmically, superb diction, perfectly accurate and so on -- but it doesn't quite have the energy. Sting pounces on the lyric right away, sounding a little rushed, impetuous, abrupt in his phrasing -- to me, just like the Earl of Essex, or as I imagine he was. So the inherent energy of the piece comes across to me. However, I wouldn't want to learn this song (or any of them, for that matter) by listening to the Sting recording.

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## margora

"I stumbled upon the PBS show and really enjoyed it. I also really enjoy the CD. This would be my first foray into old music like this and consider Sting an entry point to exploring something I may previously never considered. For that reason alone, I'm thankful. Since, people here posting include some HIP newbies, can some of you more steeped in this music suggest some other recordings "we should own", please."

Well, you can't really go wrong with anything by Paul O'Dette and Ellen Hargis, or the Wilson-Muller recording I mention above (go to www.berkshirerecordoutlet.com, and search on Dowland), or anything by Emma Kirkby and Anthony Rooley (again, go to www.berkshirerecordoutlet.com). For the solo lute music, the 4-CD set by O'Dette is outstanding and readily available on Amazon or Ebay at very good prices. I also like Hopkison Smith's recording of Dowland's lute music (search on Amazon).

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## margora

Addendum on HIP recordings: if you like the Sting, other names to look into would be Rolf Lislevand's and/or Stephen Stubb's various recordings on ECM, or especially anything by Jordi Savall and his group Hesperion.

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## dj coffey

> Well, you can't really go wrong with anything by Paul O'Dette and Ellen Hargis, or the Wilson-Muller recording I mention above (go to www.berkshirerecordoutlet.com, and search on Dowland), or anything by Emma Kirkby and Anthony Rooley (again, go to www.berkshirerecordoutlet.com). #For the solo lute music, the 4-CD set by O'Dette is outstanding and readily available on Amazon or Ebay at very good prices. #I also like Hopkison Smith's recording of Dowland's lute music (search on Amazon).


i-tunes has Paul O'Dette. I also got some performed by Nigel North that sounds - to my untrained ears - of similar caliber.

The prices aren't bad - one - I think North's was $6. the other was $8.

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## JEStanek

Thanks, Robert! I'll look into those.

Maybe Sting's CD can be the Oh Brother Where Art Thou to older music and get more people into it.

Jamie

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## margora

"I also got some performed by Nigel North that sounds - to my untrained ears - of similar caliber."

Nigel North, indeed, is of the same caliber. He is in the midst of recording a Dowland cycle (solo lute music) for Naxos.

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