# General Mandolin Topics > eBay, Craig's List, etc. >  Huge number of eBay Scam Listings

## MikeEdgerton

This listing is only one of more than 3,000 listings that just went up, many of them mandolins. Unfortunately eBay makes it really hard to report things. Just beware, they obviously compromised some poor unsuspecting sellers account.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Unk...oAAOSwiG1ah0uy

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David Rambo, 

Denny Gies

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## George R. Lane

Mike,
It says the listing has been removed.

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## Timbofood

The listing may be gone but, the scam remains! Honor is fleeting by the minute, save here at the Café!

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## MikeEdgerton

I had reported a few. It was pretty apparent what it was.

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gtani7

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## pops1

I have seen the same mandolin in two ads right after another with the same scam. Not too bright. He would have like 4 or more in a row, but would use the same mandolin, same pic. Ebay doesn't make it easy to report these things either.

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gtani7

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## MikeEdgerton

Same guy is back this morning, same ads different hacked account. Sems to favor accounts with a lot of positive feedback.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1927-Gibson...UAAOSwNt1aiCuU

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## gtani7

A lot of accounts have been compromised.  For example the Ome Juggernaut banjo, short auction < 24 hours, then there's a button below for "See full item description" when you click that, takes you to ebaydesc.com page that says "Buy it now only", "All bids will be cancelled", "do not message me thru Ebay" and other stuff.

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## MikeEdgerton

That's the same guy.

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## MikeEdgerton

He's gone again  :Cool:

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## pops1

I reported two of his ads this morning.

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gtani7, 

MikeEdgerton

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## MikeEdgerton

That's what has to happen.

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## pops1

He is a busy guy, reported at least 6 more this morning. What a pain.

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## gtani7

report a scam: not obvious at all so:

____________________________

scroll down to Description/Shipping tabs on the left, there's a *Report* link on the right

Report Category: Listing Practices

Reason for Report :Fraudulent Listing

Detailed Reason: You suspect listing is fraudulent

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## pops1

> report a scam: not obvious at all so:
> 
> ____________________________
> 
> scroll down to Description/Shipping tabs on the left, there's a *Report* link on the right
> 
> Report Category: Listing Practices
> 
> Reason for Report :Fraudulent Listing
> ...


Exactly what I did, like six times this morning.

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## HonketyHank

Question: is it not a violation of eBay TOS rules to include a link to an outside website or email address in the listing? This seems to be a regular feature of this guy's MO which should be easily detectable by the ebay police.

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## Jeff Mando

eBay should hire Rickenbacker's police -- they seem to catch every unauthorized use of the Ric name or image within hours of its listing.

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gtani7

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## MikeEdgerton

eBay could stop all that easily. It wouldn't be hard to filter out links. They choose not to.

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## MikeEdgerton

By the way, they just took him out again with a new account. I was looking at a $4.95 A2Z when they pulled all his listings. I didn't even get time to report it  :Cool: 

They still show up on the search but they are gone when you try to go tho them.

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## Jeff Mando

> I was looking at a $4.95 A2Z when they pulled all his listings.


Remember when eBay first started and legitimate sellers would list and underprice instruments like that?  Yep, the good ol' days......back then I spent about 18-20 hours a day just refreshing the new listings under "vintage guitar"  :Cool:

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MikeEdgerton

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## MikeEdgerton

I do. I bought and sold a whole lot of instruments back then.

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## MikeZito

My other hobby is collecting game used sports jerseys - and I have reported a couple of crooked listings to eBay, but they never seemed to do anything about them.

I just hate to think of how may people get taken by these crooks and give legitimate eBay sellers a bad name.

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## gtani7

Took a few days off, now they're back

-  GIBSON MANDOLIN STYLE F-4 W CASE INSTRUMENT

- 1927 Gibson Style H1 Mandolin

(and a bunch of others)

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MikeEdgerton

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## Jim Garber

It looks like one account hacked was rileysmimi. When you click button on the tab that says "See full item description" you get a page which in part looks like this:

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gtani7, 

MikeEdgerton, 

tonydxn

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## MikeEdgerton

If you have time go here and report the listing as being fraudulent.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/THE-GIBSON-...AAAOSw-o9ambsk

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## Jim Garber

Mike: I think that was one of the listings I went to above and did report it as fraudulent.

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## HonketyHank

We have seen this scammer's stuff over and over and over. Always the same listings (and mandolins is only a small fraction of what he/she/they/whoever list), always with a 24 hr auction but with the warning not to bid but rather do a buy it now but buy it now is not enabled, usually on a weekend.

But I don't really understand how they get their money out of the scam, nor how they seem to hijack account after account so easily. And I should think, for them to get their money they have to have hijacked the original account owner's PayPal account as well.

It makes me wonder. I mean how easy would it be to hijack MY ebay account and my paypal account, both? And you'd think that eBay itself could have some means of recognizing something so easily recognizable. I mean, I can recognize them just from any one or two of the following: the title, the thumbnail, the starting bid, the auction duration, the item description. Not to mention the photos.

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## MikeEdgerton

He has another account out there already.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Unk....c100005.m1851

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## MikeEdgerton

I've also found out that eBay jumps a little faster when you report it as an offer to sell outside eBay than they do when you say it's a fraudulent listing.

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gtani7

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## MikeEdgerton

A quick scan this morning pops up one mandolin but the listing has been removed. I'm sure they will be back  :Cool:

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## colorado_al

> My other hobby is collecting game used sports jerseys - and I have reported a couple of crooked listings to eBay, but they never seemed to do anything about them.
> 
> I just hate to think of how may people get taken by these crooks and give legitimate eBay sellers a bad name.


Wait a minute. We're allowed to have other hobbies besides mandolin?

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## your_diamond

> Wait a minute. We're allowed to have other hobbies besides mandolin?



Well if we are allowed other hobbies, I want this SCAM 22 ft long Shuffleboard because it has FREE SHIPPING! http://r.ebay.com/wgoub7 Free shipping?!?!? It's gotta weigh 1000lbs.

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## Kevypel

> If you have time go here and report the listing as being fraudulent.
> 
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/THE-GIBSON-...AAAOSw-o9ambsk


Hi Mike I am trying to figure out how to spot a fraudulent post on ebay

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## Jeff Mando

1.  Usually a popular or rare item is priced Waaaaay too cheap.
2.  The seller asks you to go off of eBay to complete the sale.

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## pops1

I keep reporting the Gibson mandolins for a couple dollars and when you hit description it goes to a buy it now instead of the bid it is supposed to be. He puts them (about 6) up every few days or so.

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## HonketyHank

Before I start thinking about a bid, I check as much as I can about the listing and the seller to see if I see warning signs.
Check "other items" listed by the seller. Does the item kinda go with the others? Check the seller's feedback. Does he show a record of inactivity, then all of a sudden he has stuff for sale but no recent feedback? Does he have feedback as a buyer? Is it at all related to what he is trying to sell? Does the seller respond intelligently to a question about the item? Are the pictures decent? I won't bid on a mandolin if the pictures are fuzzy. Fuzzy pictures could be on purpose or they could be just because the seller doesn't know how to take a decent picture. In either case, they could be covering up significant problems regardless of whether the seller knows they are problems. These are all different kinds of "yellow flags" to me. If I see several yellow flags, or if they are so yellow that they are almost red, I back out. 

These listings we have been talking about are easy to spot if you have been watching ebay. They are familiar, the same items, the same pictures, almost the same words, fonts, colors, instructions.

I have refrained from participating in several auctions based solely on a nagging suspicion about a yellow flag. Maybe I lost out. But I didn't lose any money on them, nor did I have the inconvenience of making a claim through ebay and a return.

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## MikeEdgerton

> Hi Mike I am trying to figure out how to spot a fraudulent post on ebay


I'm sure you're not the guy posting these things Kev but if you were and you wanted to know what was tipping everyone off you could then change your way of doing things so rather than tell you it's probably best that you just hang around and tell us about your interest in the mandolin.

If I recall you're into woodworking, right?

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Explorer, 

Jesse Kinman

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## tonydxn

Been seeing these posts for months and felt sure it must be a swindle. Thank you guys for confirming it. I'll try to report any more I see.

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## gtani7

and it starts again

- GIBSON MANDOLIN STYLE F-4 W CASE INSTRUMENT

- Vintage Unknown Mandolin With Case b904

- 1927 Gibson Style H1 Mandolin

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## Denny Gies

Mike, you're not getting paid enough.  Great info as always from you.  Thanks.

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## MikeEdgerton

> and it starts again
> 
> - GIBSON MANDOLIN STYLE F-4 W CASE INSTRUMENT
> 
> - Vintage Unknown Mandolin With Case b904
> 
> - 1927 Gibson Style H1 Mandolin


I predict those will be gone soon  :Smile:

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## MikeEdgerton

Amazingly enough when the auctions were reported eBay only took down the items reported instead of looking at the entire account. Pretty silly but then again somebody would have had to work.

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Jess L.

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## LadysSolo

Found one today, instrument listed for $10.00. clicked on "more information" for a description, and it was listed as "buy it now only, for $1500.00" And I was to click on the link to be taken to where to pay. I don't think so.....

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## bratsche

I once saw a scam similar to these on Amazon, of all places.   Was looking for a particular discontinued ukulele, got sent from the search engine to Amazon, where it was still listed, but it said "this item is currently unavailable".   I noticed that at the bottom of the description, there was a link to other seller/s selling this same item, "new from $xxx.xx", which was a dollar amount significantly lower than what I had seen them for previously (when you could find them).  

I clicked the link, and there were pictures of the instrument, and a short blurb by the "seller", who had no feedback, saying that if you're interested in buying the instrument, to contact him directly at an email address, rather than through the Amazon link.  I was very suspicious, knowing this stank on ice, but contacted him at the email address and played dumb.  After a couple exchanges, I said I would be interested in buying it, but planned to put the item in my Amazon shopping cart and purchase it like any other purchase, because I wanted a record of the transaction.   Within 10 minutes, the ad vanished into thin air, and I could find no trace of the seller's name on Amazon!  He probably changed it, and was busy laying the same trap with a different rare and nonexistent item for "sale".  So not even Amazon is safe from these lowlifes, it seems...

bratsche

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## MikeEdgerton

It's actually pretty interesting what we as a community can teach a scammer when they ask the right questions of us  :Cool:

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## Jeff Mando

It goes without saying that they are playing on our greed.  That is, everybody likes a bargain and most of us have a "wish list" greater than our disposable income.

20 years ago, the internet and eBay was in its infancy.  I was working at a vintage guitar shop.  When custom color strats were $25K, my boss found one online that looked real nice in Yugoslavia (or some such place) for $3,000.  He almost ordered it.  He "wanted" to believe that their economy was so different than ours that $3,000 was a lot of money to them. (it was, but that is beside the point)  Anyway, it took a lot of convincing to talk him out of buying it.  Keep in mind, back then there was no Paypal.  Online deals were done with Western Union or bank wire transfers, having no recourse if something goes wrong.

Another collector I knew was crazy about Zemaitis guitars and owned four of them.  At the time they were going for $35K-50K.  One guy had one in London for $5,000 looking for a USA buyer.  Insisted on Western Union.  My friend says, "I'll take it" if my buddy can meet you at the Western Union and examine the guitar when you pick up the money.  Never heard back from him.............

I'll probably butcher his quote, but Ed Roman from Roman Guitars said something to the effect of "there are two ways to know if a vintage guitar is real  -- if it is dirt cheap at a yard sale or it is super expensive (at a vintage shop) -- otherwise, if it is just a little too cheap, it is probably a fake...."

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## MikeEdgerton

In the early eBay days I was buying lots of real vintage instruments cheap. I just don't see those deals anymore.

I remember my friend Tony buying a late 60's Gibson Hummingbird for $450.00 bucks. The original receipt was in the pick pocket of the case for $450.00. The seller thought they were cutting a fat hog by selling it for what they paid for it so many years before.

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## gtani7

They seemed to be taking a weekend off but now

_GIBSON MANDOLIN STYLE F-4 W CASE INSTRUMENT_

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## MikeEdgerton

Apparently today eBay doesn't care how many people are scammed. Reported and they are ignoring it. He had to put a credit card number down that worked when he put the auctions up. I can gurantee it's a stolen card but as long as eBay gets paid they really don't care.

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## Explorer

> Hi Mike I am trying to figure out how to spot a fraudulent post on ebay





> I'm sure you're not the guy posting these things Kev but if you were and you wanted to know what was tipping everyone off you could then change your way of doing things so rather than tell you it's probably best that you just hang around and tell us about your interest in the mandolin.
> 
> If I recall you're into woodworking, right?


Totally not suspicious....

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## MikeEdgerton

> Totally not suspicious....


Indeed  :Cool:

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## HonketyHank

Hi Mike I am trying to figure out how to spot a fraudulent post on MandolinCafe ...  :Redface:

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## ollaimh

> Wait a minute. We're allowed to have other hobbies besides mandolin?


yeah tar and feather him, blasphemer

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## ollaimh

> We have seen this scammer's stuff over and over and over. Always the same listings (and mandolins is only a small fraction of what he/she/they/whoever list), always with a 24 hr auction but with the warning not to bid but rather do a buy it now but buy it now is not enabled, usually on a weekend.
> 
> But I don't really understand how they get their money out of the scam, nor how they seem to hijack account after account so easily. And I should think, for them to get their money they have to have hijacked the original account owner's PayPal account as well.
> 
> It makes me wonder. I mean how easy would it be to hijack MY ebay account and my paypal account, both? And you'd think that eBay itself could have some means of recognizing something so easily recognizable. I mean, I can recognize them just from any one or two of the following: the title, the thumbnail, the starting bid, the auction duration, the item description. Not to mention the photos.


i also wonder how they make their money? maybe they suck people into answering then get them to pay from a private accont and take the money and run. they would only need a few to be gullible for this to pay, but the real issue is e bay isn't very vigilant about noticing these accounts that want outside payment

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## MikeEdgerton

They simply sell the item outside eBay for a very low price. Then they don't deliver it because they never had it. They end up with somebody's money and the somebody ends up with nothing. These transactions don't take place inside eBay or Paypal. That's how they make money. The victims are happy to be buying a $4,000.00 mandolin for $400.00.

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## gtani7

He/she/they've been quiet this weekend, or they're on vacation at their villa in the South of France or they're not listing banjos/mandolins/Rickenbacker basses, the 3 things I've noticed on their listings.

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## gtani7

back to Ebay business as usual this AM: 

_1927 Gibson Style H1 Mandolin_

_1924 Gibson A-2Z Snakehead Mandolin Blk Top_

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## MikeEdgerton

They both appear to be gone already.

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