# General Mandolin Topics > Vintage Instruments >  Harwood mandolins and guitars

## KanMando

I'm embarking on a personal research project. I'm seeking information on Harwood brand stringed instruments manufactured for and by the Jenkins Music Company of Kansas City.

By the way, my name is Robert Jenkins, and yes, it's the same Jenkins. It was a family owned business from its beginning in 1878 until it was sold by my father in 1972.

Being a guitar and mandolin player, I'm curious about these instruments. I've only seen one in person. It was a parlor guitar, very plain in appointments, being shown at a guitar show in Independence, MO. It needed major restoration, but the guy only wanted $75.00 cash. By the time I called my dad to get his recollections on the Harwood brand, and got back with the cash, it had been sold.

So, having become a regular browser on the Mandolin Cafe, I know that there has to be someone out there who can fill in the gaps. Mainly: who really built the Harwoods, and did Jenkins Music ever have its own shop and build them. My dad  does not have any documents, but does think that Jenkins did have its own shop for a while.

Here's what I've found so far by Google:

From http://www.mugwumps.com/faq.htm

Q: I have a small, flattop acoustic guitar made by Harwood. Aside from this specific instrument, I've never seen nor heard another Harwood guitar and, despite some digging, I've found nothing about this maker. I've never even seen the name on any used-instrument dealers' inventory lists. Can you enlighten me? BM
A: Harwood was a brand name used by J.W. Jenkins Company, a Kansas City, MO musical instrument dealers and wholesalers. They introduced the Harwood brand in 1885, which they may not have actually manufactured. Circa 1895 they established a factory and produced guitars and mandolins under the Clifford and the Washington brand names. Some guitars marked "Harwood, New York" have been seen. It is not known if these are also by Jenkins.


frets.com

and

harpguitars

Check out the drawing of the harp mandolin on this one. Unfortunately, no mando photos, but wow - those guitars were gorgeous.

Regards,
Bob

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## atetone

I am pretty sure that I have seen a few Harwood mandolins pop up on ebay over the years.
Mostly sort of middle of the road bowlbacks if I remember correctly.
Sorry I can't be of much help.

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## Jim Garber

Most likely Harwoods were built by one of the large MidWestern companies. Stores like Jenkins would have jobbed out their instruments to large manufacturers like Regal.

This flatback mandolin, for instance, has markings similar to others made by under the Supertone (Sears & Roebuck) label. Prob made by Harmony or Regal for Sears. 

I used to have a nice bowlback with the Harwood label. Unfortunately I sold it a few years ago. There are also some Harwood instruments that were labelled Harwood, New York.

I have a Jenkins catalog somewhere and will take a look and scan if you like where appropriate.

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## Jim Garber

Here is a rather fancy Harwood bowlback. The headstock actually resembles those made by the Joseph Bohmann Company of Chicago, tho I am not sure that these were built by Bohmann. He usually fitted his mandolins with his own patent tuners and the only thing that does connect to JB is the little pediment on the headstock.

I would guess that Jenkins jobbed out to various manufacturers over the years which might make tracking a little difficult.

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## Jim Garber

I love the inlay on the headstock of this fancy one (not the previous instrument).

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## KanMando

Jim - thanks for the photos. I would be grateful for scans of any old Jenkins literature you have. My dad would get a kick out of it too: he's 82 and a fount of knowledge when it comes to music merchandising, however, the Harwood stringed instrument era was before his time, although Jenkins Music did continue to use the Harwood name on pianos made by Aeolian in Memphis.

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## delsbrother

Bunch of stuff on Harpguitars.net.

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## KanMando

Yep - saw that. I'd love to get my hands on one of those instruments.

Bob

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## steadypluckinaway

I hesitate to share this link but I'll quit dreaming and let everyone else have a look

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## Jim Garber

I found one Jenkins catalog which I believe to be from the late 1930s/early 1940s. The only mandolins are Gibsons of that period with some Harmony and Kay guitars. No Harwoods.

I will continue to look.

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## allenhopkins

> I hesitate to share this link but I'll quit dreaming and let everyone else have a look


Ah, the Denver Folklore Center -- used to play there 40+ years ago, when I was at Ft. Carson down in Colorado Springs. Does Harry Tuft still run it, I wonder...?

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## steadypluckinaway

Yes sir he does, and he's a very kind and patient fella. I go in there a couple times a month to fondle the current inventory. They had a Jimmie Moon on consignment a couple years back and I must have spent four hours playing it one Saturday and Harry just sat there and smiled. Certainly not due to my playing, I am sure.

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## Jim Garber

I just came across this Harwood Bandurria right before this thread started. Rather unusual... tho the mandolin craze in the late 19th century was ironically started by bandurria players, there were v ery few manufacturers of bandurrias in the US. I have seen one made by (or for) Lyon & Healy and now this Harwood. Vega stated on their labels that they made bandurrias but I have never seen one and some folks have surmised that they called their 10 string mandolin/mandolas bandurrias.

The bridge on that one is a little odd and is not original. Usually these bandurrias have a glued-on bridge (sim to a guitar) combo with the strings going thru top a tailpiece. You can see the outline of the original bridge on the top.

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ollaimh, 

SanzoneGuitar&Mandolin

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## atetone

Now that's just cute!

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## KanMando

> I hesitate to share this link but I'll quit dreaming and let everyone else have a look


Man, the rosewood on that guitar is incredible. Whoever made this knew what he was doing. I'm getting a GAS attack.

Thanks for the link.

Bob

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## David M.

A buddy of mine has a Harwood fiddle that's a nice, well made one and has good tone. Fluted F holes, etc. I've tried to talk it off of him, but no chance...

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## KanMando

This process has been very enlightening. After seeing the photo of the bandurria that Jim posted, I went on ebay and did a search for "Harwood" in musical instruments. I turned up this:

<a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/Antique-Harwood-Alto-Sax_W0QQitemZ320116276805QQihZ011QQcategoryZ16232Q  QrdZ1QQssPageNameZW
D1VQQ_trksidZp1638.m118.l1247QQcmdZViewItem#ebayph  otohosting" target="_blank">alto sax</a>

Apparently the Harwood brand was applied to the whole gamut of instruments sold by Jenkins. The seller of this sax lives in Shawnee, Kansas, which is a suburb of Kansas City.

I did play saxophone in my youth, but never really developed the affection for it that I have for stringed instruments. I'm gonna pass on this one.

Bob

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## bgmando

Bob -- are you the songwriter Bob Jenkins who lives in KCK?

  Great thread. I'd never heard of Harwood guitars and mandolins. Now my eyes are wide open for them.

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## KanMando

> Bob -- are you the songwriter Bob Jenkins who lives in KCK?


No, although I'm often asked that question. I've never met Bob the songwriter, but Jim Curley at Mountain Music Shoppe knows him and says he's a Christian musician.

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## bgmando

Gutman, Frederick O. ( arranged by ) (VOB 5592) 
The / GUITAR / QUARTET. / THE HARWOOD GUITAR AND MANDOLIN CLUB, LOS ANGELES, CAL. / LESTER PAYNE, Director. ... 5 [The Florentine March.] / CLEVELAND: F. O. GUTMAN (1894), [1+1+1] pp. / 3 Guitars. Lithograph. 


Above could be tied in -- found at this website

http://library.csun.edu/igra/vol1/giuliani2.html

bg

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## bgmando

http://links.jstor.org/sici?sici=0734-4392(199124)9%3A4%3C353%3AKCMPTF%3E2.0.CO%3B2-5

Another interesting link -- note that the author of the paper is a librarian at UMKC.

bg

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## delsbrother

OK, the plot thickens. Payne also had some connection to Chris Knutsen:

The Mother of All Harp Guitar Orchestra Pictures, Spokane, 1902.

Is it just me, or do most of the Spanish Guitars in this picture look like they have the "Harwood" inlay block at the end of the fingerboard? Could they all be Harwoods?

Interesting that Lester Payne is in Los Angeles with the Harwood Club in the 1890s. I can do some more research here in LA on the Harwood Club and see what I can dig up. I would guess Payne would've performed around LA with the club, perhaps even on KHJ radio. How common was "Harwood" as a name? I suppose it's possible the group was NOT named after the brand...

I also wonder if Payne was still in LA when Knutsen arrived in 1915.

The LA Public Library has these two photos of LA Guitar-Mandolin Clubs from (according to them) the 1890s. I wonder if you can tell the makes of any of these instruments?

LA High School Guitar-Mandolin Club 1

LA High School Guitar-Mandolin Club 2

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## KanMando

I just thumbed through my not very comprehensive library of guitar books, and I did not see any other guitars with the distinguishing white block inlay at the end of the fretboard. Unfortunately, there were no Harwood photos either.

According to my father, at the turn of the century (1900), the only Jenkins stores outside Kansas City were in Fort Smith, Arkansas and Oklahoma City. He said they did have a mail order business, and this might explain the Harwood instruments on the West Coast. He also said that they did build some instruments in a shop located on the top floor of the building at 1015 Walnut in KC. 

Thanks for the info everybody. 

Bob

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## bgmando

Bob -- please contact me offlist at bgraham@kcstar.com -- thanks.

bg

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## Jim Garber

Boy these Harwoods seem to be showing up now that this thread started: Harwood Mandolinetto

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## David Newton

That's a fancy Harwood. Think that's Brazilian? Mandolinettos look neat, never played one. Much better than the whirly-gig mando that same seller had.

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## KanMando

Yeah - that looks like Brazilian to me. Very cool little instrument. I'd sure like to find one in better shape.

Bob

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## delsbrother

So, do you agree these might all be Harwoods? That sure looks like the inlay block to me, unless they're all funny tricks of light.

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## markishandsome

Maybe they got a bulk discount? They must be all by one maker, but more than one maker at the time was probably doing that block inlay. My father's Mastertone banjo does.

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## KanMando

I have found a few random guitars by big name makers such as Epiphone that had a white block inlay at the end of the fretboard, but they were not made during the Harwood era we're looking at. At that time, the guitars that appear most similar are the Dyer-J.F. Stetson-Lyon and Healy guitars and the Mauer (Larson) guitars. None of them have the block inlay. The Harwood appears to have used the white block throughout the entire line. I think the guitars in delsbrother's photo must be Harwoods.

Bob

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## Gregg Miner

Great topic. I am asked almost monthly about the Harwood brand...and I never have an answer!
Clearly, the "New York" stamp means that someone/some factory in NY built them for Jenkins - or is it a marketing gimmick?!
No one knows who/where. I cannot believe that the evidence isn't there or will turn up at any moment.
Robert would be in the best position to help us. The biz was sold? What happened next? Are all files long gone?
As stated on my page, the brand lasted for "30 years" - but if we include Mugwumps' 1885, then it's really 45 years!
Darrell - you have (as always) a good eye regarding those white rectangles on the Payne group's parlor guitars. The task now is to determine if any other builders/firms used a similar marker. Here's a new photo of the Payne School with a couple duplicate members (courtesy of pal Paul Ruppa, and not yet up on HG.net): http://www.harpguitars.net/iconograp...ool2-ruppa.jpg
Strange that/if piles of NY-built instruments for a Midwest firm ended up in Washington state!
Bob - I sold this "diamond in the rough" HG in December on eBay:
http://www.harpguitarmusic.com/listi...wood-11-07.htm
Funny thing is the buyer paid for it, but never sent his address or followed up afterwards...it is still here, and no email responses...anyone know my "statute of limitations" before I re-offer it?

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## KanMando

Gregg - great photo. It is rather strange that so little is known about the true origin of the Harwoods. I will talk to my dad and see if perhaps he has some old documents stashed away. I found some old clippings from the Kansas City Star from the 1920's that mention the mail order business and also that they employed a hundred instrument repairmen who worked in the building on Walnut street - in addition to the piano repair/refurb shop which was located in the warehouse at 20th and Wyandotte.

In an off list message to bg, I said that the main building at 1217 Walnut was torn down to build the parking garage for the AT&T Pavilion, although the art deco facade was retained. The warehouse was also recently torn down due to pcb contamination from leaking transformers that were stored there post Jenkins. It was actually an EPA hazardous site.
So I guess the short answer is yes, the records are probably long gone.

And Gregg - geez, I knew I forgot something. You can send that harp guitar to me.

Bob

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## bgmando

Bob -- Are Jenkins Music stores still active under the new ownership?
  Any chance the company stashed records in the limestone storage caves around here and forgot about them?

bg

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## KanMando

The last iteration of what was called Jenkins Music is now owned by and called Schmitt Music headquartered in Minneapolis. I'll talk to my dad soon and see if he has any ideas as to where any old records might be stored. It's a long shot since he sold the company in '72.

Bob

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## delsbrother

Wow, great picture, Gregg! Obviously more Harwood inlay blocks in that shot - and what's that thing in the front row, left (held by the small girl)? A laud?

Anyway, it seems likely that Payne's school had some kind of sponsorship relation with Harwood, similar to what Gibson had with its teachers, i.e. in order to take the classes you had to order an instrument. But can you imagine how someone in say, LA would get a Harwood shipped to them from NY in the 1890s?

I did some digging through the LA Times Archive and found evidence of Harwood Guitar and/or Mandolin Clubs in LA from 1895 through 1898. No specific mention of Payne with these groups, however.

Separate searches for Payne bring up several mentions of mandolinists - LESTER Payne is leading guitar and mandolin in clubs in Redlands as early as 1892, and as late as 1898. He was also in the Salvation Army, leading a group of mandolinists there. He's often referred to in stories as "Professor Payne," or as the leader of the "Guitar and Mandolin Club." Would that necessarily be the HARWOOD Guitar and Mandolin Club? Judging by the CSUN link provided earlier, it would seem so.

From the mid-teens to the '30s a "Lester Payne" was also a celebrated poultry farmer and State Fair Judge, specializing in Rhode Island Reds. In fact the State Fair Trophy for this breed is named after him! He evidently pioneered many new techniques in poultry farming. Could he be the same guy who was teaching guitar and mandolin in the 1890s-1900s? They lived in roughly the same area (Riverside County, CA). Is this guy playing Harwoods to the chickens? 

Interestingly, in 1923, ARTHUR Payne is playing mandolin on KHJ radio in LA (same year Knutsen played). Could he be related to Lester Payne? A son or a brother? There are several other mentions of Arthur Paynes, but none of them appear to be musicians.

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## bgmando

There's a Harwood community in Vernon County south of KC, used to be a country store hamlet. Don't know if the Jenkins family would have had kin there and used it on the guitar names?

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## KanMando

bg - I've done a little research on this too. The founder of Jenkins Music Co., John Woodward Jenkins, came to the Kansas City area from Chicago/northern Illinois. At one time, the company sold an "Elburn" brand piano, probably named after Elburn, Illinois, just west of Chicago. There is also a town called Harwood Heights in the same area, although the town was not incorporated until the 1950's. According to its web site, they don't really know where the name came from. Perhaps there was an old community called Harwood there back in the 1800's. 

Bob

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## Jim Garber

I did some archaeology in my music room and found (finally!) a few of the mandolin pages from a 1926 Jenkins catalog B, #14. here are the two Harwood mandolins. The photos of the one I posted previously in this thread resemble model B730.

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## delsbrother

Neat ad! Lessee, 1926-38 = 1888.

More than enough time for something that was "immediately famous" to make it to the West Coast in time for Payne's clubs in the 1890-1900s!

Can't quite make out what's written in the little triangle logo? Looks like the bottom reads "Harwood"? Curious lack of inlay blocks on these.

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## KanMando

Jim - thanks for the catalog scan. Here's a photo from the inside of the bandurria on e-bay that shows the triangle. The bandurria does have the white block inlay.

I talked to my dad yesterday, and now I have him all fired up to go digging through his old Jenkins memorabilia. Maybe something will turn up. He recalled seeing a photo of the Harwood shop years ago.

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## KanMando

This may be a rash assertion on my part, but it appears that the early Harwoods had the block inlay with the "HARWOOD" logo, and that there was no Harwood logo on the headstock. Later Harwoods had no block inlay, but did have "HARWOOD" on the headstock.

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## KanMando

I found this posting here:

guitar seminars

Bob...On the subject of your Harwood Stella 12-string. I have seen quite a few 6-string Harwood guitars but never a 12-string. That is intriquing! I would really like to see this guitar.

Back in the early 20th Century, there was a short-lived spurt of American 12-string making. Undoubtedly, more Stellas and Sovereigns were produced by Schmidt than all the other makers combined. But Lyon & Healy, Vega, Weymann, Holzapfel & Beitel, Harmony, Regal, Tonk (and apparently Harwood) all produced 12-strings. Additionally...Galiano, Bruno, Carl Fischer and several other distributers purchased instruments from Schmidt, Regal, etc. and put their own labels in them.

Only recently, I had a really big bodied Harwood guitar. It was a monster...around 16.5 inches across. But it did not have a long scale...25 inch scale as I recall. Anyhow, I can say without reservation that neither it nor any of the Harwood guitars I have ever seen were made by Schmidt. That is not to say that the one you have wasn't, mind you. That plant in Jersey City was making instruments and selling them to all manor of distributers. Harwood was a house brand for a distributer (or was it a retailer?). Now I must rely on memory (I actually have some notes on Harwood guitars somewhere, but forget trying to find 'em!). As I recollect, they were located some place in the mid-section of the country, maybe Ohio, Indiana, etc....? Often, these operations purchased their guitars from one or two of the larger makers, such as Schmidt, Regal, Kay, and so forth. However, none of the Harwoods I have seen had obvious earmarks indicating having been built by one of the "usual suspects". They had certain individual build qualities of their own. This leads me to believe that maybe they were really made by "Harwood" (or at least made to specific "Harwood standards"). From what I have been able to gather, Harwood guitars were pretty early...made in the teens or perhaps earlier. I doubt if your Harwood was made any later than 1925.

Wow! A Harwood 12-string...this is really fascinating!

NH

http://www.guitarseminars.com/ubb/Fo...ML/007036.html

Another clue pointing to the Harwoods having been made by Jenkins?

Bob

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## Jim Garber

As far as the earlier Harwood mandolins, I would agree that they don't have the usual earmarks of known makers, however later ones I have seen and other mandolins pictured in the 1926 catalog pages I have resemble the American Conservatory line from Lyon & Healy.

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## delsbrother

Is this the one you sold, Jim?




How did it compare to similar makers' flatbacks - Martin's, Larsons', etc.?

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## bgmando

Bob -- Did Jenkins have stores in other towns in the Midwest besides KC, back in the day?
  Joplin, Springfield, Topeka?

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## KanMando

I'll have to get the chronology, but they had stores in Topeka, Salina, and Wichita in Kansas, a store in Fort Smith, Arkansas, and stores in Oklahoma City and Tulsa, Oklahoma. They also had stores in Joplin and Springfield, Missouri. There were also piano and organ stores in Amarillo and Lubbock, Texas, and Roswell, N.M.

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## LiamO

Hi all,
 I have a Harwood guitar with the New York logo. I'm not sure how old it is but it looks like it's from the early 1900's. It's a parlor size guitar with Brazilian Rosewood on the back and sides and it has the serial number stamped on the end of the headstock. It sounds really great but since I have three other guitars that I play a lot and this one I don't play at all I'm trying to sell it but don't know what they are worth.
 I've heard of these guitars before but never saw one until I got this one. I work at a small music store in Northern Cal. and when this came through I couldn't resist. Pretty cool instrument. The intonation is a little hard to dial in though. Someone changed the bridge (at least from the pictures I've seen of these guitars) so the saddle is really wide. I got it as good as it can get but there are still some slight problems.
Here's some pics if you're interested. http://carneyscorner.com/harwoodpics.html
 Anyway, that's all from me.
 LiamO

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## KanMando

Very nice rosewood on that one. More information for the database: "Harwood New York" stamped on back of headstock and a serial number on the end of the headstock. Also has the white block inlay on the fretboard. I wonder if there is any significance in the way the serial number is configured - with the "2" located above the "8575". 1902?

Thanks for the pics Liam. I don't know what it's worth. The one in Denver in a previous post was fairly ornate, but had a replaced top and non-original bridge.  They were asking $950.

Bob

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## LiamO

Hi Bob,
 I haven't had a chance to read all the posts but I'm wondering if this link has come up.
http://www.frets.com/FretsPa....od.html
 How do these guitars compare to the Martins of the same era and style. Mine has a great sound to it. Really big and open but nice and smooth as well. I hate to get rid of it but since I'm not a collector and live in a small space I need the room.
 Take care,
 LiamO

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## KanMando

Liam - I wish I could answer your question. For now, we'll have to take frets.com's word for it. As I mentioned before, they only Harwood I've ever seen in person was in bad shape and had no strings on it. 

George Gruhn and Walter Carter have a Q&A column every month in Vintage Guitar Magazine. You might get some answers that way as far as build quality and tone compared to the old Martins. You can e-mail questions to:

vguitar@vguitar.com

George Gruhn does appraisals for $50.00 - here's the link:

gruhn appraisal

Vintage Guitar also has free classifieds on its website:
vintage guitar

If you're a subscriber, you can also get free classifieds in the magazine.

Bob

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## markishandsome

I'd guess the 2 is a model number. Martin's parlor size guitars were called style 2 if I'm not mistaken. I have a similar guitar (Bay State label) with a similar stamp on the end with an E in the analogous location above the serial. The bridge is also similar, but without the big goofy saddle.

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## bluegrassforme

There is a circa 1927 flat back Harwood mandolin currently offered for sale at Retrofret.com,NFI.

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## KanMando

Here's a Harwood parlor guitar currently for sale on e-bay.

<a href="http://cgi.ebay.com/Harwood-Vintage-Antique-Parlor-Guitar-Luthier-Project_W0QQitemZ190207214881QQihZ009QQcateg
oryZ118982QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem" target="_blank">Harwood parlor guitar</a>

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## delsbrother

Don't know if anyone is still following this thread, but Gregg Miner just posted his yearly update  to the Knutsen Archives that has a bunch of new research on the Payne photo mentioned earlier. In it he details how he may have discovered the ORIGINAL photograph, and our subsequent efforts to catalog the instruments pictured. Well worth a read! BTW, lots of great new wacky instruments in this year's update, including my first-ever Knutsen purchase, a Harp-mandolin archived as HM-28. Woot! This mando got a thorough going-over by luthier Kerry Char, and now plays and sounds great!

Anyhow, back to the Payne photo. One surprise was Gregg determined the original image was actually FOUR photos pasted together! So it was possible that many of the instruments were re-used several times. It took some careful photo-interpretation to try to figure out how many of the instruments were actually unique. While Gregg concentrated on the Knutsens, I tried to look for Harwoods (mainly just by looking for inlay blocks - if we later find out there were other makers using them, I'm screwed!). 

In early drafts of the story, Gregg included a lot of my Harwood count. But his site is about Knutsen, not about Harwood or Payne. So we agreed to leave out the more esoteric stuff. I'll post it here just in case it benefits anyone doing Jenkins research, as this is probably one of the largest number of Harwoods photographed in one setting. I also have a detailed spreadsheet listing all the instruments that I can recognize and their positions in the (composite) photo. If anyone would like this file just PM me and I'll gladly share it. It is by no means a perfect document - I would ask others who are far more adept at bowlback mandolins to please look it over to see whether there are any errors. 

BTW I also did a lot of digging through LA archives for info on Lester Payne, the school's Director. It turned out he spent a lot of his life as a poultry expert in California - imagine that, *mandolins and chickens*, LOL!

Here's my Payne photo research I originally emailed to Gregg:

**

(Please note, my labeling system is slightly different from yours as I count every player - i.e. UL-1-1 would mean Upper Left photo quadrant, first row, first player from L-R)

*There at least 16 unique mandolins - as that's the number in the LR quad alone. Of these, 13 definitely have inlay blocks, so I would assume that to be the minimum number of unique Harwood mandolins.*

Within these 13, there are at least 4 "fancy" Harwood bowlbacks. IDed from the headstock, purfling, and body/bowl binding. I think it's the model pictured here. There are four of these in every quadrant except the LL, in which there are only three examples.

There are also at least 1-2 examples of at least 3 different Harwood models in each quadrant. 


*Of the 23 total parlor guitars pictured, 18 have visible inlay blocks.*

5 of the 23 are obviously unique (one of these a Harwood):
<ul>[*]UL-3-2 (natural finish, no inlay block, fancy fret markers, fancy purfling, some kind of inlay on headstock)
 [*]UL-3-4 (a larger but fairly plain guitar with dot markers, no inlay block) 
[*]UR-2-1 (natural finish, fancy markers, no inlay block, block inlay on headstock)
 [*]UR-3-2 (a spectacular black Harwood with a tree-of-life fretboard inlay + inlay block)
 [*]LL-4-1 (natural finish, floating bridge, hourglass-shaped tailpiece)[/list]
The rest can be broken up into three different types, all apparently Harwoods with inlay blocks:

<ul>[*]at least 4-5 black top, with dot markers 
[*]at least 2 black top, with fancy fret markers 
[*]at least 1-2 natural top, with dot markers (it is possible some of the ones that look black are really natural finish but just in shadow)[/list]

*So here's the smallest number of instruments required to take the picture:* 
<ul>[*]10 Knutsens 
[*]12 Other Guitars (8 with Harwood inlay blocks)
 [*]16 Mandolins (13 with Harwood inlay blocks, and 4 of those being quite fancy)
 [*]1 Waldo Mandocello
 [*]1 Harp[/list]
However it's worth noting the Cadenza caption specifically mentions 75 members playing simultaneously at the concert in Spokane - and there are 75 members pictured here. So it's possible NONE of the instruments are duplicated, and the photographer only spliced together the photos because he didn't have a large enough studio to fit the whole class in one sitting. Which would make all this counting a complete waste of time!

*Other Musings/Crackpot Theorizing about this photo and Paul Ruppa's other Payne/Harwood photos:*

The lower two quad photos are definitely taken from a different camera-subject distance (note how the adults in the upper quads appear larger). So it's possible some of the "mandolins" in the back rows of the lower quads might be mandolas. This might also explain some minor size variations in the guitars of different quads.

Considering the 1902 date of this photo, I wonder if Knutsen's "suite" of HGs was meant to impress Jenkins/Harwood (through Payne) into being a distributor? Funny how Dyer handles everything except WA and CA, two places were there's some kind of Jenkins presence. Or maybe this marked the beginning of a short-lived relationship with Jenkins (similar to how the Delano picture seems to commemorate Knutsen's brief foray into Kona production). Or am I getting my dates/events mixed up? 

I can find other mentions of the Harwood Mandolin and Guitar Club in LA before Payne, but none after him. There's no evidence they ever had as many members as pictured in WA, as the events they played were very small. I think the KC group was about the size of the Harwood groups in LA. #

I can find nothing about Payne that's non-poultry-related in the 'teens-'20s. And other than the 1890s references (and a few classified ads for used instruments), I can't find anything about Harwood as a brand in LA papers. 

Judging from the backdrops, the 1901 sheet music photo was taken by the same photographer as the 1902 Cadenza shot (Loryea). Maybe someone who could be tracked down in Seattle? I wonder if the negatives still exist in an archive somewhere. In any case, the earlier photo might have even been taken on the same day, though key people are wearing different clothes... The 1901 photo shows the true size of the photographer's studio, though.

Mr. Schermerhorn is playing mandolin in the 1901 photo, while a small child is holding the Waldo from the 1902 shot. Somehow I don't think she's holding down the bottom end in this group, so I'm betting either this kid is Schermerhorn's or Payne's (this would fit, as Payne had a small daughter). I would guess whoever owns the kid owns the Waldo.

The 1901 photo shows pickguards on many of the mandolins, but I can't make out any on the 1902 photo. Could you see any on the original? Maybe the photo is faded, or it's just gone through too many generations for me to see?

**

So that's it. Hope that helps somebody; if anyone out there could help me ID some of the bowlbacks or if you know any more about whether Jenkins ever dealt with Knutsen, I'd appreciate you letting me and/or Gregg know.

Darrell

----------


## BlueMountain

Thanks for your hard work, Darrell. It's good to have this stuff archived.

That photo of the Payne school disturbs me. The differences in lighting, exposure, focus, and head size from quadrant to quadrant is so "not quite right." For example, heads aparantly closer to the camera that look smaller than those that should be farther away. The effect reminds me of the cover of the Beatles' Sergeant Pepper LP. The brain senses that something isn't right.

The original photos would have been taken with a view camera and glass plate negatives in a studio with skylights. Probably there were four 8x10 inch negatives, or possibly 4x5. Contact proofs would have been made of these, then someone would have put them together, using a knife and glue. Then the composite would have been photographed. All in all, a rather successful shoot.

I used to live in a log cabin that is now about 215 years old. When the Payne photo was taken, my cabin in Pennsylvania was being used as a photo studio, according to the town history book. When I was restoring the cabin, I found about five hundred glass plate negatives poured down into a space between two walls. They were covered with dust. I washed them carefully and printed contact prints of a couple dozen--people from the town, shot in the cabin, with the usual background and props. I don't recall if there were any mandolins in the photos, but there may well have been. I gave the collection to the local historical society, where it is probably now rotting.

----------


## KanMando

Yesterday, Bill Graham and I took a trip out to our fine local fiddle shop, Wyatt's, to take a look at some Harwood fiddles that they had taken in as part of a lot purchase from a KC area collector.  In amongst the fiddles were several bowlback mandolins and one of them was this Harwood.  Of course I had to buy it, and since Bill already owns one (see Bill's column here:  http://www.mandolincafe.com/news/pub...s_001032.shtml), he declined.  This one is serial number 20182 and has the "Harwood - New York" oval stamped on the back of the headstock, and the Harwood trademark triangle stamped on the neck block.  It's in good shape, and other than the funky pick guard replacement, it appears to be all original.  Bill and I have also managed to acquire a Harwood guitar each.  Mine's under-going a bit of restoraration at Mass Street Music right now.

We're still researching the history of these fine instruments.  If anyone has come across any new information, please contact us.

Bob Jenkins

----------


## Bill Snyder

That is ashamed. If not for that bathroom wall pickgaurd that would be a fine looking mandolin. Is it still playable?

----------


## KanMando

Yeah - that pick guard is something else.  I posted a thread on the repair forum for advice on how to remove it.  It's glued on there solid.  But yes, it's very playable.  The strings are even in decent shape.  It tunes up fine and stays in tune.  The action is a little higher than I like, so I'll have to work on that.  It's loud, but doesn't sound as sweet as Bill's.  That may be due to the strings.

Bob

----------


## Brian Butchart

I have a Harwood parlor guitar I inherited from my grandfather.  He and my great grandfather had a music store in Warrensburg Mo.  My Harwood has the New York stamp (in a triangle) in couple of places.  If anyone would like to know more, let me know.

Brian

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## barney 59

I've had a couple of Harwood parlor guitars --I've tried to research Jenkins a little and pretty much found out nothing more than what has already appeared here. I kind of thought of Harwood  as my own little secret. The guitars were, I think, every bit as good as a Martin from the same period (+ - 1900) with a fraction of the cost. It was pretty common for music stores and distributors to have their own branded instruments made for them. There could be Harwood trumpets and things out there as well who knows?. With that said when you come across an old instrument like this you can usually make a pretty good guess as to the actual builders (it looks like a Regal made,A Schmidt or a Larson made etc.) The Harwoods were a little different, like it was a smaller scale builder and I've thought maybe they did make them themselves after all. I've never come upon a Harwood mandolin. Gee, with a member of the family involved who better to research this. County records? No old relatives with long memories? Names of old employees? I hope if you do find out something that you post it here.

----------


## KanMando

Barney,

Bill Graham and I are still researching the Harwoods.  The only living relative with a long memory is my father who was born in 1925.  This was after the Harwood's heyday.  The Jenkins Music Company records no longer exist unfortunately.  My father made an attempt to explore the old store at 1217 Walnut in Kansas City before it was torn down to make way for the AT&T Pavilion parking garage.  The doors were padlocked and he could not get in.  Since it was an historic building, AT&T was required to leave the original art-deco facade intact, and it now fronts part of the parking garage.

Bill and I are exploring some other avenues to dig up records from other sources.  

Bob Jenkins

----------


## Capt. E

There is a Harwood bowl-back on Ebay right now:  
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=330345300848

Very attractive instrument. Looks well made.

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## KanMando

Thanks for the link Capt. E.  As I've commented to several people, I've never seen two Harwoods - mandolins or guitars, that are exactly alike.  This one appears to have a non-original tailpiece and bridge.  I suspect the pick guard is non-original as well - I've never seen a wooden one.  Looks like it's in decent overall condition.  From the Harwood mandos I've seen, this one would be on the low end  of the hierarchy.  I have seen one that was even plainer - it appeared to have a pressed wood bowl instead of a ribbed bowl.  The wood in the bowl was very thin.  It did have a celluloid pick guard however.

Bob

----------


## jeff mercer

There is an old J.W Jenkins catalogue up on eBay that I just came across, & was reminded of this thread..

300336812735 ( perhaps a kind Cafe member could provide a link  :Redface:  ?)

The seller has posted some very detailed photos, & there's all sorts of interesting stuff in there...everything from those "reverse-scroll" Regal mandolins to Gibson F4's, Martin ukuleles, Gibson guitars etc.

Not my auction, & not intending to bid, BTW, just thought it might be of interest to those researching Jenkins/Harwood..

Cheers, all.
Jeff  :Coffee:

----------


## KanMando

Here's the link:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...fvi%3D1&_rdc=1

Sold for $120.  I wish the seller had been a little more  date-specific.  I have a copy on CR-ROM of a 1929 Jenkins catalog.  It includes several of the later era Harwood brand guitars and Mandolins that we suspect were not made by Jenkins, but probably made by Regal in Chicago.  The Harwood guitars in this catalog bear a very close resemblance to the Martins shown just a few pages later in the same catalog.

The 1920's Ebay catalog shows several Royal and Washington guitars and mandolins, which were Jenkins brands, but lower in the hierarchy than the Harwoods.  The Washington guitars bear a strong resemblance to Bruno guitars. Too bad he didn't show scans of the Harwood pages.  As far as we have been able to determine, the 1920's Harwoods were not made in Kansas City by Jenkins.

Bob

----------


## Michael Gowell

Gotta love the exotic harmonicas on the next-to-last photo of page enlargements.

----------


## KanMando

Yep - these old catalogs are fascinating.  Here's a link to a 1907/08 Bruno catalog that's up for auction now:

http://cgi.ebay.com/C-BRUNO-SON-N-Y-...%3D2%26ps%3D33

Check out the color drawings of those Hohner squeeze-boxes.  Amazing.

Bob

----------


## delsbrother

Bob, and others..

Gregg Miner's new Dyer Page in the Knutsen Archives has a link to a searchable PDF archive of Music Trade Review Magazine.

I'm sure those of you more versed in Jenkins/Harwood history can lose yourself for days in there. I just did a cursory search and found the following:

From 1895:




> *Contract Cancelled.*
> THE contract of January, 1889, between John C. Haynes & Co., of Boston, and J. W. Jenkins' Sons, of Kansas City, for the exclusive manufacture of "Harwood" guitars by John C. Haynes & Co., and by which the sales of the popular "Bay State" guitars in certain territory was prohibited, was cancelled January 1, 1895, by mutual consent. Messrs. Jenkins' Sons are to manufacture the "Harwood" guitars upon their own premises, and Messrs. Haynes & Co. are free to sell "Bay State" guitars wherever they please. It is agreeable to state that' unbroken friendly feelings have existed from the first.


And from 1903:




> *SOME JENKINS LITERATURE*.
> From the J. W. Jenkins' Sons Music Co., Kansas City, Mo., we are in receipt of a beautifully printed brochure which conveys a comprehensive knowledge of the resources of their house which is so well and favorably known in the Southwest. The illustrations show exterior view of their premises and interior views of the offices and warerooms, the special parlors devoted to the Steinway, Vose, Knabe, Ludwig, as well as the recital hall on the fourth floor. There are also views of the piano repair department and interior views of the Jenkins factory, which is devoted to the manufacture of the Harwood guitars and mandolins.


Perhaps some more digging can find the actual brochure? Would love to see pictures of the factory..

In any case I hope if any Jenkins/Harwood scholars find anything new in there they post it here. I need to do some more digging on Payne.

Darrell

----------


## Mike Zimmerman

I have a Harwood mandolinetto...the strings are  a little high due to slight body warpage thru the years, but it still plays well and had a big voice for a tiny instrument..has a beautiful finish and original canvas covered trapdoor style case..(inserts into the end of the case)it has the shape of a guitar, but 8 strings and full length fretboard. smilar instruments found in 1902, 1904, and 1907 Sears and Roebuck catalog

----------


## George J

Hi Bob:   I hope you're still on that quest.   I have a Harwood parlor guitar, built approx 1930.   I did a bit of phoning and reading, and came up with some info that sounds credible.   

Sadly, I didn't write down the name or phone number of my best source... a guitar collector and merchant in Brooklyn.   
This fellow said your family company made many instruments, and contracted out the manufacture of many others.   Guitars, violins, mandolins, pianos.   At one point J.W. Jenkins' Sons was the largest retailer and distributor of instruments and sheet music in the midwest.  But you probably know that part.  

My interest was in their guitar business.   The fellow in Brooklyn said outside Kansas City, Jenkins was known as a wholesaler, distributing the major brands from Minnesota to Texas.   

In addition, they distributed instruments under their own brands:  Harwood, Washington, Clifford, Standard, and Royal.    Each brand was priced to be just below a comparable national brand.   Harwood was the top company brand, priced to compete with Martin or Gibson.  

Apparently these brands applied to a range of instruments.   I've attached a scan of the envelope that once contained a violin string.  It mentions all the brands, with no mention of particular instruments. 

For guitars, Jenkins would contract the manufacture on a year-by-year basis.  Most of the guitars were made in the Chicago area, by one of the big makers -- Harmony, Regal, Kay, Stromberg-Voisinet.   Jenkins would specify the features they wanted.   The lowest bid would come from a company that had surplus materials that year, or that had a slow year, and wanted to keep their employees on payroll.   

Most people believe Jenkins didn't keep detailed records of which contractors they used at different times.   You generally have to compare features and look for construction techniques that are associated with one company or another.   When in doubt, the best guess is Harmony, because they were the biggest maker of guitars at that time.  

Sometime around the turn of the century Jenkins built its own factory.  But I can't find information about which instruments they built there.   Maybe you have more complete knowledge by now.   

In the guitar world, the Harwood brand is associated with harp guitars.  I don't know if the Jenkins company focused its attention on harp guitars for that brand.   Or if the harp guitars were more likely to survive for decades, because they had to be built to take the extra tension of all those strings.    Many "regular" parlor guitars from that period were too lightly braced, and they came apart eventually.    

I hope this information is helpful.   I have some photos of my Harwood, before and after it was restored, which I'd be happy to send you.   Let me know.  

cheers,
George Jamieson












> I'm embarking on a personal research project. I'm seeking information on Harwood brand stringed instruments manufactured for and by the Jenkins Music Company of Kansas City.
> 
> By the way, my name is Robert Jenkins, and yes, it's the same Jenkins. It was a family owned business from its beginning in 1878 until it was sold by my father in 1972.
> 
> Being a guitar and mandolin player, I'm curious about these instruments. I've only seen one in person. It was a parlor guitar, very plain in appointments, being shown at a guitar show in Independence, MO. It needed major restoration, but the guy only wanted $75.00 cash. By the time I called my dad to get his recollections on the Harwood brand, and got back with the cash, it had been sold.
> 
> So, having become a regular browser on the Mandolin Cafe, I know that there has to be someone out there who can fill in the gaps. Mainly: who really built the Harwoods, and did Jenkins Music ever have its own shop and build them. My dad  does not have any documents, but does think that Jenkins did have its own shop for a while.
> 
> Here's what I've found so far by Google:
> ...

----------


## kdanr

I was trying to decide what to do with some very old magazines and a catalogue that I inherited.  The catalogue was from J.W. Jenkins' Sons Music Co.  In the catalogue were Harwood guitars.  I decided to google Harwood guitars, and that is how I found your post.  I do not know what year the catalogue is from, but it was with some Literary Digest magazines from 1900 and 1901.  The front cover is off, water damaged, and torn.  There is no back cover.  But the pages are still well preserved in spite of the rough shape of the book in general.  I would be happy to send this to you, if you are interested.  I was just going to donate it to a museum along with the magazines, but it would be nice for it to go to someone who might appreciate it more.  If you are interested, just email me at kdanr@yahoo.com
Dan





> I'm embarking on a personal research project. I'm seeking information on Harwood brand stringed instruments manufactured for and by the Jenkins Music Company of Kansas City.
> 
> By the way, my name is Robert Jenkins, and yes, it's the same Jenkins. It was a family owned business from its beginning in 1878 until it was sold by my father in 1972.
> 
> Being a guitar and mandolin player, I'm curious about these instruments. I've only seen one in person. It was a parlor guitar, very plain in appointments, being shown at a guitar show in Independence, MO. It needed major restoration, but the guy only wanted $75.00 cash. By the time I called my dad to get his recollections on the Harwood brand, and got back with the cash, it had been sold.
> 
> So, having become a regular browser on the Mandolin Cafe, I know that there has to be someone out there who can fill in the gaps. Mainly: who really built the Harwoods, and did Jenkins Music ever have its own shop and build them. My dad  does not have any documents, but does think that Jenkins did have its own shop for a while.
> 
> Here's what I've found so far by Google:
> ...

----------


## delsbrother

kdanr, are there mandolins and/or harp guitars in the catalog? Is there any way for you to post scans here?

----------


## KanMando

> Hi Bob:   I hope you're still on that quest.   I have a Harwood parlor guitar, built approx 1930.   I did a bit of phoning and reading, and came up with some info that sounds credible.   
> 
> Sadly, I didn't write down the name or phone number of my best source... a guitar collector and merchant in Brooklyn.   
> This fellow said your family company made many instruments, and contracted out the manufacture of many others.   Guitars, violins, mandolins, pianos.   At one point J.W. Jenkins' Sons was the largest retailer and distributor of instruments and sheet music in the midwest.  But you probably know that part.  
> 
> My interest was in their guitar business.   The fellow in Brooklyn said outside Kansas City, Jenkins was known as a wholesaler, distributing the major brands from Minnesota to Texas.   
> 
> In addition, they distributed instruments under their own brands:  Harwood, Washington, Clifford, Standard, and Royal.    Each brand was priced to be just below a comparable national brand.   Harwood was the top company brand, priced to compete with Martin or Gibson.  
> 
> ...


George - thanks for the information and the scans of the string package.  The store address, 921-923 Main Street, is the second home of the company in Kansas City.  From our research, we think that the original Harwood shop was on the top floor of this building before a separate factory was built.

Bob

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## KanMando

> I was trying to decide what to do with some very old magazines and a catalogue that I inherited.  The catalogue was from J.W. Jenkins' Sons Music Co.  In the catalogue were Harwood guitars.  I decided to google Harwood guitars, and that is how I found your post.  I do not know what year the catalogue is from, but it was with some Literary Digest magazines from 1900 and 1901.  The front cover is off, water damaged, and torn.  There is no back cover.  But the pages are still well preserved in spite of the rough shape of the book in general.  I would be happy to send this to you, if you are interested.  I was just going to donate it to a museum along with the magazines, but it would be nice for it to go to someone who might appreciate it more.  If you are interested, just email me at kdanr@yahoo.com
> Dan


kdanr - thanks for the offer of the Jenkins literature.  I would love to have anything you've got.  I sent a message to your Yahoo email.

Bob

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## KanMando

I just received this unique Harwood mandolinetto that I bought from a fellow Cafe member.  It has Brazilian rosewood sides and back, a mahogany neck, and spruce top.  The eagle inlayed in the pickguard is made from mother of pearl with abablone on the top of the wings.  This is the only Harwood we've seen that has a mother of pearl Harwood inlay in the fretboard.  All the others were ivoroid.  It has the oval "Harwood New York" stamp on the back of the headstock, and the Harwood triangle logo on the neck block.  There is a volute at the neck/headstock junction which we've seen on mandolins, but not on guitars.  It plays fine.  Really loud when strummed.   Very little sustain on individual picked notes - almost banjo like.

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## delsbrother

I was hoping you'd get that. She's a beauty!

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## Jimi C

@ Bob - 
I just found a J W Jenkins "Washington" model guitar and have been trying to find more info on it. It sounds AMAZING. Great tone. I've seen Washington guitars in old JW Jenkins Catalogs as far back as 1897. Mine has no label inside but has the number 320 stamped on the back of the headstock. It's in relatively good shape considering the age and has seen a couple repairs over the years. I've not been able to find another Washingon guitar online anywhere, though randomly enough I spotted the very one I wound up buying in an image here: 
http://www.jedistar.com/jedistar_vin...r_dating_w.htm

I recognized it by the scratches and the missing piece of binding. 
I'll post some pics of my guitar. Any info would be welcome. I had a repair man fix the binding and eventually plan to have the neck reset and take good care of it. It's a keeper. The store had it marked at $1200. A bit higher than they sold for back in 1897 where I saw them listed at $15!
http://chroniclingamerica.loc.gov/lc...ed-1/seq-2.pdf

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=1&theater

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=1&theater

Cheers! - Jimi

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## KanMando

That's a cool guitar.  Here are a couple of scans of the 1895 Jenkins catalog showing the Washington guitars.

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## KanMando

To all the Harwood afficionados here on Mandolin Cafe: at long last, the Harwood story will be told. Bill Graham and I have been working to uncover the history of these fine instruments ever since my first post back in February of 2008. We've collaborated on an article that will be in issue #23 of Fretboard Journal due to be released next week:

http://www.fretboardjournal.com/blog...-23-highlights

Bill wrote the article and did the interviews and photography, and I did most of the research.

I want to thank all the folks here on the Cafe who have taken an interest in the Harwoods and provided me with leads and information. In particular, I would like to thank Dan Rowan (kdanr) for sending me an original Jenkins Music catalog from about 1895. The catalog provided us with key information concerning the various models of guitars, mandolins, mandolin-guitars (mandolinettos), and banjos. Bill and I have put together a nice little collection of Harwoods which Bill photographed beautifully for the article. Unfortunately, I did not have the mandolinetto at that time, but photos of it are on this thread.

So check out the new issue of Fretboard Journal for the true story of the Harwoods. I don't want to scoop FJ, but I will be happy to answer any questions about the instruments after the magazine is released.

Bob Jenkins

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## barney 59

Fretboard Journal! The price of a Harwood just went up!

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## brunello97

Thanks, Bob. I look forward to reading this.  I have a Harwood bowlback in the queue for repair. This should bump it up a few places in line.

Mick

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## lisas560

:Mandosmiley: I bought a Harwood mandolin in an antique store in California 20 years ago :Mandosmiley: . The number on it is 20988. It says Harwood New York in an oval under the number. Inside neck (I think that's what it is) there is a triangle with Genuine Harwood Registered and inside that is Trade Mark. I haven't had a chance to take pictures. Looks somewhat like Bob Jenkins #56 on Apr 29-2009 but mine isn't shiny wood on back. Front white piece is same shape as mine, but mine is a marble wood color. Rear is same, but metal is black. Mine looks like Clark Harwood from Bill Graham photos Feb 24, 2009. Appreciate any feedback.

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## Jimi C

Thanks for the scans of the Washington guitars. Mine looks similar but the serial number on the back of the head stock reads "320". I wonder what year it was made? - Jimi C
http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater


http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater


http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater

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## KanMando

Bill Graham and I received our copies of Fretboard Journal #23 today.  The Harwood article begins on page 74.  Great layout with lots of beautiful photos by Bill.  Check it out.

Bob

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## MikeEdgerton

> Thanks for the scans of the Washington guitars. Mine looks similar but the serial number on the back of the head stock reads "320". I wonder what year it was made? - Jimi C
> http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater
> 
> 
> http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater
> 
> 
> http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fb...type=3&theater


There's a very good chance that these were made by another builder and simply labled as Harwood. This was a common practice in the the early 1900's. Your guitar has some similarities with the instruments described here and is almost a dead ringer for a turn of the century Harmony I had that had a Sears catalog number in it. Either way, *this* article has some interesting information with reference to the fingerboard dots.

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## creekroadguitars

Hi All,

The Fretboard Journal article convinced me to pull out a Harwood guitar I picked up a while back, but have neglected
to repair. That will definitely change now.

I'd love any help in dating this wonderful guitar. 

Thanks,

Kent

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## creekroadguitars

Sorry, I should have referenced my question to the Harwood mandolins and guitars thread....

Kent

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## KanMando

Kent's Harwood is a No. 6 Concert size and is the younger brother of my No.6.  Mine is serial no.10353.  Kent's is 10401.  I'm speculating they were made within a few weeks of each other.  They conform to the guitars shown in my 1895 Jenkins catalog.  No way yet to date it exactly.

Bob

----------


## delsbrother

Bob, can you conclusively ID any of the instruments in the Payne photo as Harwoods? I know Gregg and I are working under that assumption, but I was wondering if there were any definitive catalog matches.

----------


## KanMando

delsbrother:  

This photo?  http://www.harpguitars.net/iconograp...v2-6-miner.jpg

Or this photo?  http://www.harpguitars.net/knutsen/payne.htm

I'll tackle the first one.  This is a photo of the Kansas City Harwood Club with Lester  Payne seated at left.  I'll start with him.  I can't see the top of the mandolin, so I'll have to go by the face of the headstock.  I magged it up,and as usual, it doesn't appear to conform exactly to the mandolins in the 1895 catalog.  It's more ornate than a No. 65, but not quite as fancy as a No. 75.  It also appears to have a black top.  This would be a 28 rosewood rib mando. What we've found on the guitars and mandolins is that once you move up from the basic trim level or least expensive instrument of a particular model, the trim may be a combination or have characteristics of two models:  i.e., the soundhole rosette  and purfling on the body from one model, and the fretboard inlay or headstock overlay from another.  So maybe Lester's mandolin was a No. 70?  We do know from our research, and obviously from this photo, that Lester Payne visited Kansas City and made a call on the Jenkins Company.  I would assume he visited the Harwood factory which was only a few blocks from the store.  Maybe his mandolin is a custom model. The gentleman seated next to Lester appears to be playing a No.51.  This is a 21 rosewood rib mando.  I can't see enough of the other two mandolins to tell what they are.  The guitars are intriquing, because we've seen lots of photos of black top guitars, but we've never seen one come up for sale and they are not shown or mentioned in the catalog.  All the guitars in this photo appear to be basic trim level.  Starting with the bearded gentleman on the left, this looks like a big guitar.  This would be a No. 8 Artists' Grand model.  This was the biggest guitar being made by anybody at the time.  Bigger than a Martin 00.  I just had the opportunity to examine one of these and measure it.  It's just slightly smaller than a Martin 000 (Martin didn't make 000 guitars until 1911), and it's 4 7/8" deep - deeper than a 000.  The next guitar, second from left, appears to be slightly smaller.   That would make it a No. 2 Grand Concert.  The guy in the middle has a Washburn lyre guitar.   The next guitar, the black top, appears to be another No. 2 Grand Concert.   The last guitar looks big.  I'm thinking it's a natural top No.8 Artists' Grand.

BTW - All Harwood guitars were designed to handle steel strings.  In 1895, Martin made steel string guitars by special order only.

Bob

----------


## delsbrother

Actually, I was talking about the big Payne photo (the one with the Knutsens). I'm particularly interested in the fancy bowlbacks, and the spectacular tree-of-life inlaid guitar. I still believe this is the largest known photograph of Harwoods. Do you agree with the theory that people are sharing instruments in each of the four quadrants of the larger photo? Or do you think most are unique?

----------


## KanMando

OK Darrell (delsbrother):  I've had a chance to examine the big Class of 1902 Payne Mandolin and Guitar school photo and I really can't comment on whether it's actually a composite of four photos and whether the same instruments were used in each quadrant.  I just can't see it well enough.  I will say that it's a safe to assume that all the instruments with the white block inlay at the end of the fretboard are Harwoods.  I did a pretty extensive perusal of the old music trades journals from the period -1890 to 1910 - and I never saw any other guitars or mandolins that had an inlay like that.  The white diagonal stripe on the side of the bowl follows the edge of the border (usually tulip wood) and is a characteristic of several models shown in the 1895 catalog.  The only mandolin model that has a headstock with a straight or squared off top is the No.40, the least expensive model at $32.50.  All the other mandolins have what Darrell calls a "scroll and pediment" on the headstock.  So, what I see in this photo are low to mid-range mandolin models - No.40, 45, 50.  I can't see the tops well enough to determine if some might be the fancier No. 46 and 51 models with the elaborate purfling.  None of these mandolins has a lyre or anything else inlayed on the headstock face.  That starts with the no. 60 and 65.  The top of the line No.75 has a beautiful fern inlay on the headstock face and the headstock top edge is kind of a "W" shape.  The young man standing in the middle of the back row between the harp guitars in the upper right quadrant does indeed appear to be holding a top of the line No. 10 Grand Concert guitar like this one:  http://www.harpguitars.net/history/o..._Jorgensen.jpg.  The Grand Concert would be about the size of a Martin 00.  It's list price in 1895 was $175.

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## brunello97

Bob, all this talk has got me hooked in.  My FB journal copy is now in the mail.  My Harwood bowlback has serial number #30852 on the back of the headstock.  It has the triangular logo on the neck block. It is missing the tuner cover plate but there is a 'VI' stamped between the inset tuners. The other Harwood regalia is intact: headstock lettering, white fretboard band and side white binding slashes.

Hard to get a count on the ribs as the bowl is all mahogany and the grain is blurring most of the obvious joints. A little easier to see/count on the inside of the bowl where it appears that the staves are of irregular width. Very strange. I have owned quite a number of US and Italian bowlbacks and have 1. never seen an all mahogany bowl (thought this might not prove so uncommon) and 2. never seen such an obvious attempt to make the bowl appear seamless (which is super weird and delightful.) It is getting pretty hard to imagine this coming out of one of the large Chicago jobber shops. 

I'll get some photos up. It's dark out and I just tried some with a flash to no avail.  I'll try to get some up in the next day or two. I thought the serial number might help narrow it in for you. Any chance of posting some pages from the '95 catalog?

thanks!

Mick

----------


## Schlegel

Mick, you do see mahogany from time to time in American mandolins- I had a Martin Student model in all mahogany, and also an inexpensive Lyon & Healy.  Makes for a very light mandolin.

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## brunello97

> Mick, you do see mahogany from time to time in American mandolins- I had a Martin Student model in all mahogany, and also an inexpensive Lyon & Healy.  Makes for a very light mandolin.


It is a very light mandolin. Given all the mahogany going into furniture at that time I guess it is no surprise that material would be available but I hadn't seen it used singularly on bowls before.  Even the L+H brand bowls I have had used killer rosewood (or else maple alternated with mystery wood.) My 00 Martin student bowl was also rosewood. Maybe material availability guided some of the day to day choices on the lower end models.  I wonder if an early Martin catalog would  reference bowl material on their student models?

The very obvious irregular stave width as on this Harwood is curious. Was that apparent on your L+H and Martin mahogany bowls as well?  

Mick

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## Schlegel

No, they were pretty symmetrical.

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## KanMando

Mick, I just checked my 1895 catalog.  The No. 40 mandolin is all mahogany.  It has 19 ribs.  This is the only Harwood mando with a straight or squared off headstock top edge.  I think I've seen one of these.  It has a cloth liner on the inside of the bowl, so I don't think you'll be able to count the ribs from the inside.  

I don't want to wear out my welcome here on the Cafe, so I'm looking into setting up a Harwood site where I will post scans of the Harwood pages from my 1895 Jenkins catalog.  I also have a 1929 Jenkins catalog that shows the later Harwoods that were probably made in Chicago, and I have an early Bay State catalog.  Bay State made the original Harwoods for Jenkins until Jenkins started their own factory in Kansas City. 

Bob

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## brunello97

Wear out you welcome?  Bob, this kind of thread is exactly why I spend so much time here  :Smile: 

Thanks for checking in the catalog. My bowl has the familar Harwood 'scroll w pediment' headstock rather than the flat end you describe with the No. 40.  Sorry about the lack of pictures, I'll get some up asap.  It is a fairly modest model and there are some serious top cracks that my limited repair skills will be challenged to address. But I am growing more antsy about getting to hear how it sounds. 

A dedicated Harwood website sounds great, but by all means keep this thread alive with your research and discussion. Harwood seems to have a history that cuts across a wide swath of design, construction, outsourcing, labeling and marketing practices of stringed instruments in this era. (Not to even mention the playing..)  A really fascinating story enfolding.

Mick

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## delsbrother

Thanks for the analysis, Bob. Looking forward to your new site!

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## barney 59

The Fretboard Journey article quotes an old article that claimed that Harwood was producing 5000 instruments a year. Given the scarcity of Harwood instruments does that number sound plausible? That would make their production greater than Martin who never produced 5000 instruments a year until the late 40's.

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## brunello97

Here are some images of my Harwood, serial number 30852. Do the serial numbers offer any clue as to date/location of building?

A pretty modest example but I would love to hear some thoughts from the Harwoodists.

thanks,

Mick

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## KanMando

> Wear out you welcome?  Bob, this kind of thread is exactly why I spend so much time here 
> 
> Thanks for checking in the catalog. My bowl has the familar Harwood 'scroll w pediment' headstock rather than the flat end you describe with the No. 40.  Sorry about the lack of pictures, I'll get some up asap.  It is a fairly modest model and there are some serious top cracks that my limited repair skills will be challenged to address. But I am growing more antsy about getting to hear how it sounds. 
> 
> A dedicated Harwood website sounds great, but by all means keep this thread alive with your research and discussion. Harwood seems to have a history that cuts across a wide swath of design, construction, outsourcing, labeling and marketing practices of stringed instruments in this era. (Not to even mention the playing..)  A really fascinating story enfolding.
> 
> Mick


The Harwoods are really just part of a much bigger story, that being the story of the Jenkins Music Company and my great-grandfather, John W. Jenkins II, the son of the founder.  Too much to go into here, but when I get my Harwood site up, I intend to include a history of the Jenkins Co.  Let me just say that in the pre-phonograph, pre-radio, pre-tv, days of the late 19th century and early 20th century, the music industry in the U.S. was huge.  At the time of the economic collapse in 1929, there were over 300 American piano manufacturers.  Every small town had a brass band.  There were mandolin and guitar clubs everywhere.  Sheet music publishing was thriving and very competitive, to the point of being cut-throat, and the Jenkins Company was right in the middle of all this.  It's a fascinating era.

Bob

----------


## KanMando

There are no guitars or mandolins with "Harwood" on the headstock shown in the 1895 catalog.  My personal opinion is that these instruments were probably made later, at least after 1902.  None of the instruments shown in the famous Payne photo from 1902 has this logo.  Bill Graham has a guitar and a mandolin with logo headstocks, and they bear all the construction characteristics of the Kansas City made instruments, so there is no reason to suspect they were made elsewhere.  As Bill mentioned in the Fretboard Journal article, the addition of the logo to the headstock may have been a response to the Gibson instruments and their growing popularity.

----------


## KanMando

> The Fretboard Journey article quotes an old article that claimed that Harwood was producing 5000 instruments a year. Given the scarcity of Harwood instruments does that number sound plausible? That would make their production greater than Martin who never produced 5000 instruments a year until the late 40's.


I agree, 5000 instruments a year seems implausible.  Unfortunately, we have not found any records to confirm or refute that number.  The article that made that statement was a Kansas City business journal, and could certainly contain a bit of local boosterism.  The original article had etchings showing scenes from the factory - and a later article, which was essentially the same, has actual photographs of the factory.  There were a lot of instruments being made there.  They employed 25 people.  Let's assume there was a five day work week (may have been 6 days back then) .  That's 260 work days a year.  That would come to about 20 instruments a day.  The factory was highly mechanized, so I guess that figure isn't too unreasonable.

And yes, the scarcity of Harwoods is puzzling.  They were well made, high quality instruments.  Where did they all go?  The business journal article states that the Harwoods were being shipped "to all countries".  Maybe there's an undiscovered trove overseas.

Bob

Bob

----------


## HarHolz

re: harwood guitars

thanks to bob jenkins for his impressive efforts, and to bob graham for his fretboard article.

some questions and observations:

is anyone compiling a list of serial numbers of datable harwood guitars (or mandolins)?  i note on a different website (unique guitars), one blogger A.S. Jackson, notes he has a photo dating from 1898/99 of a relative playing a Harwood NY #5 with a 7566 serial number.  more of these kind of postings would help begin to figure out the absolute and especially the relative dating of the instruments.  does anyone else have any dated photographs of harwood instruments with known serial numbers.  until the ever elusive sales or shipping receipt of a harwood instrument turns up, this might prove a good method of general dating.

--does anyone know whether the KC (and/or Boston) "Harwood New York" numbered their mandolins, guitars (and other [stringed] instruments) in discrete numerical sequences, or intermingled the various types of instruments in one continuous sequence for all instruments? 

re: the white celluloid labels.  i recently purchased a harwood ny parlor guitar (serial number 10351).  on the HARWOOD white celluloid inset at the uppermost fret there is in very tiny type the words "BALDWIN & GLEASON LIMITED NY PAT".  this is nearly impossible to read, and directly on the lower edge of the white 'label.'  this appears to refer to the company that made these signature white labels.... as they were a NY engraving company active between ca. 1860 & 1900 (-ish), producing political buttons, and fine engraved printing for a range of purposes (or so a preliminary google search suggests).  -- i guess one could ask how long this company supplied Harwood (or Jenkins) with these signature labels?  did Harwood have a large supply on hand and continue to apply them even after Baldwin & Gleason folded?  Might this also provide a clue to Harwood in KC's  New York connection?  

also: as for the 5000 instrument per year claim.  does anyone know if this included stringed instruments only?  wasn't harwood (in KC) making Saxophones and Trombones, and other non-string band instruments as well.  Any sense of the percentage of each instruments they produced when? 

HarHolz

----------


## brunello97

> …. At the time of the economic collapse in 1929, there were over 300 American piano manufacturers.  Every small town had a brass band.  There were mandolin and guitar clubs everywhere.  Sheet music publishing was thriving and very competitive, to the point of being cut-throat, and the Jenkins Company was right in the middle of all this.  It's a fascinating era.
> 
> Bob


Bob, I loved the Fretboard Journal article (and in particular the great photography.) I dig what you are saying about the pervasiveness of live, community music. Just a fraction of the band shells, gazebos etc. that were built for these musicians on village greens, parks etc. must still remain.  How often are they used for music?  Always a pleasure for me to listen to if they are playing Sousa or Bach. 

I'm with HarHolz (love the German-o-pun.)  This Harwood investigation is just beginning. Is there an image + serial number data base in the works?  Maybe it will have to be this thread for awhile…

Harholz, I know this is a mandolin cafe, but why not post some images of your Harwood guitar here as well?

thanks!

Mick

----------


## KanMando

> re: harwood guitars
> 
> thanks to bob jenkins for his impressive efforts, and to bob graham for his fretboard article.
> 
> some questions and observations:
> 
> is anyone compiling a list of serial numbers of datable harwood guitars (or mandolins)?  i note on a different website (unique guitars), one blogger A.S. Jackson, notes he has a photo dating from 1898/99 of a relative playing a Harwood NY #5 with a 7566 serial number.  more of these kind of postings would help begin to figure out the absolute and especially the relative dating of the instruments.  does anyone else have any dated photographs of harwood instruments with known serial numbers.  until the ever elusive sales or shipping receipt of a harwood instrument turns up, this might prove a good method of general dating.
> 
> --does anyone know whether the KC (and/or Boston) "Harwood New York" numbered their mandolins, guitars (and other [stringed] instruments) in discrete numerical sequences, or intermingled the various types of instruments in one continuous sequence for all instruments? 
> ...


Ever since I started researching the Harwood instruments, I've been collecting photos and serial numbers.  Most of these are from ebay sales.  I don't know what the copyright issues might be on using these images.  I might be limited to a written  description with the serial number.  Let me just say that all the guitars we've seen on ebay are parlor guitars, with the exception of my own concert size guitar.  Even so, we have a pretty small number of instruments for the database - maybe 20.   In the abscence of any manufacturing, shipping, or sales records, we have no definitive way to date the instruments.  We can approximate the dates from old photographs like the Payne photos and my 1895 catalog, but that's about all we have now.  

We don't know if the serial numbers were mingled among the various instruments.  You and I have instruments that may have been made on the same day.  My No. 6 concert guitar is s.n. 10353, and your guitar is s.n. 10351.  Please post some photos.  I could not see any text anywhere on the Harwood inlay on the fretboard of my guitar.  It's so interesting that you dug up this tidbit of information.  Jenkins certainly had New York connections and we know that John Jenkins II and his brothers made frequent business trips there.  New York was by far the hotbed of piano manufacturing in the U.S.

Again, we don't really know if the Kansas City Harwood factory actually produced 5000 instruments a year, but if they did, it was only guitars, mandolins, harp guitars, mandolinettos, and bandurrias.  There are Harwood brand banjos in my 1895 catalog, but we don't have any evidence that they were made in K.C.  Haynes was making Bay State banjos at the time.  My assumption is that the Harwood banjos were probably made by Haynes.  We've never seen a Harwood banjo come up for sale, but the Bay State instruments surface once in a while.  

Jenkins did not make the Harwood branded band instruments, violins, and pianos.  The band instruments were made in Indiana,the violins were probably imported from Germany, and the pianos, in the early days, were made in Rochester, New York. The later Harwood pianos were made by Aeolian in Memphis.  

Bob

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## HarHolz

hello KanMando and everyone else:

thanks very much for your detailed review of what you have been doing to compile data on serial numbers and related documentation on the Harwoods.  i appreciate your cautious and conservative-professional approach to documentation & verification.  that said, can't a few more claims be ventured about these Harwood NY instruments, made at the Jenkins factory in KC.  in other words, let me float a few provisional hypotheses and invite you to shoot them down, or confirm them.

correct me if I am wrong, or let me know if these points cannot be supported (most of which comes from points you have posted or that appear in the Fretboard article):

1a.  the earliest of these instruments dates from 1894, when the factory in KC was opened [although there seem to be some earlier Harwood instruments made in Boston?.... i'm really fuzzy on these beginnings.]

1b.  what is the lowest serial number you have recorded/seen for the "Harwood NY" line?  [on the unique guitar site there is a Harwood NY #5, serial number 7566, that a blogger says appears in a photo dating from 1898/99 [must admit somewhat uncertain/fuzzy dates... but suggestive that the 7566 # was used no later than 1899.]

2a.  the last string instruments as 'Harwood NY' (in KC) was in 1930 at the latest (production may have stopped earlier).  [do you have any evidence, that instruments were made after that point?.... i'm thinking not.  looking in university library catalogues for the sheet music or any publications by J W Jenkins.... the publication dates stop in 1930.   did J W Jenkins complete fold by then?  in the wake of the stock market crash?]

2b.  what is the highest serial number on any of these Harwood NY (from KC) stringed instruments.     there is a serial number 26613 on the Retrofret website currently for a concert size Harwood for sale (they approximate 1915, but that date could be way off, or?]

3.  in 1899 there was a 'new line' of Harwood guitars (by Jenkins).  as announced in an advertisement posted on this site recently.  this seems to have introduced new models.

4.  ca. 1902, the Harwood name no longer appears on the headstock, only on the various trademarks (inside the guitar, and on the white celluloid tab.... all markings that were already being used [Bob Jenkin's well reasoned conjecture. in post #103]


5.  my questions about serial numbers involves establishing some general patterns... not only using the sequence to i.d. particular instruments.  are, for example the early Harp guitars numbered with lower numbers (but part of the same run of, what seems like about 30,000 instruments over a 45 year history of manufacturing??)


------

As for "Baldwin & Gleason Co Limited NY Patent" it is printed--engraved directly along the bottom edge of the white celluloid tab reading "HARWOOD" ON this parlor guitar i have:  serial number 10351.  this guitar is very similar to one appearing in the middle of the 2-page spread of 5 Harwood instruments in the new Fretboard.  I can well imagine that this telltale "Baldwin & Gleason....." text was trimmed away on most examples.
--Baldwin & Gleason, well, i looked up a few more things about them.  They were a fine engraving company in NYC, from ca. 1860--1901.  there is a NY Times article of december 23, 1901, describing the fire consuming their facility in NYC, burning celluloid creating fumes, etc....   Presumably they stopped engraving at this point.  One would think that the Jenkins Co., had purchased a big order of the Celluloid "Harwood" tabs earlier and had a big supply on hand that they continued to use, maybe til the very end.  Researching Baldwin & Gleason takes us fairly far afield from mandolins & guitars, and especially that the NY Times reported their factory being consumed in fire in December 1901.... the chance of sales records/invoices with Jenkins of KC lessens rather dramatically.... could be another dead end.  but it does supply the source of the telltale White Celluloid tabs.   B & G has some really impressive engraving work, including their own stationary & adverts,... that some rudimentary google searching will turn up for anyone. 

i'll try to photograph my Harwood soon.... I could not say with any certainty which # it is (6?).  my hypothesis is that it dates in the 1903-1907 years.  it is a simple parlor guitar, with the rosewood sides and back, spruce top, slotted headstock, a mere 3 inlayed dots on the ebony fretboard.  the bridge has been replaced recently, with a slightly smaller bridge leaving some glue marks around its edges.  the headstock is plain (no text or designs on it).  but very playable, great action ... i can't put it down.   it will take a few days however before i can.

my other thought, is that there were far fewer mandolins and guitars made that this ca. 30,000 serial numbers suggests.  how do we know that some numbers, series of numbers were not used.... or were reserved for other kinds of instruments (that were produced or only planned for production)?  maybe it is known, how can we be sure?  what speaks for that, or how can we rule that out?  (are we sure that the other four lines of guitars and mandolins, etc. (or 1 or 2 of them) overseen, marketed & owned by Jenkins did not share in this long line of 30,000 serial numbers?).  

i hope my questions are not too tedious.  and again, i appreciate immensely the work, KanMando has done, is doing, to clarify the Harwood story.  thanks for all the new information in your last post.   i'll think about it while i'm preparing christmas dinner.

HarHolz

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## HarHolz

hello:

attached are photos of this harwood parlor guitar, mentioned in previous posts, with close ups of the celluloid inlay reading in TINY type:  "Baldwin & Gleason Co. NY Limited Pat]

hopefully the affiliation with B & G might lead to something more.

Does anyone know which model this is?  it does not have the inlay zip down the middle of the back, somewhat less fancy that others posted recently.  must be the basic model from those years.  

HarHolz

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## KanMando

Thanks for the photos, HarHolz.   I re-checked the logo on my guitar, and there is a little remnant of the manufacturer's text on the bottom, but nothing I can read.  

Your guitar is a No.1 Standard Size.

Bob

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## KanMando

I'm going to address HarHolz's questions in post #108:

1a. the earliest of these instruments dates from 1894, when the factory in KC was opened [although there seem to be some earlier Harwood instruments made in Boston?.... i'm really fuzzy on these beginnings.]

The Jenkins company had a five year agreement with the John C. Haynes company of Boston to manufacture guitars and mandolins under the Harwood name.  This started in 1889 and ended in 1894.  The Haynes company also made the Bay State instruments that were widely distributed in the U.S.  I have an 1890's Bay State catalog, and the guitars and mandolins appear to be very similar to the Harwoods.

1b. what is the lowest serial number you have recorded/seen for the "Harwood NY" line? [on the unique guitar site there is a Harwood NY #5, serial number 7566, that a blogger says appears in a photo dating from 1898/99 [must admit somewhat uncertain/fuzzy dates... but suggestive that the 7566 # was used no later than 1899.]

That's going to take some digging on my part.  I haven't really compiled the photos and serial numbers into an organized database yet.

2a. the last string instruments as 'Harwood NY' (in KC) was in 1930 at the latest (production may have stopped earlier). [do you have any evidence, that instruments were made after that point?.... i'm thinking not. looking in university library catalogues for the sheet music or any publications by J W Jenkins.... the publication dates stop in 1930. did J W Jenkins complete fold by then? in the wake of the stock market crash?]

From our research we can find no evidence that Jenkins continued to manufacture the Harwoods after 1911.  We do suspect that parts that were left over after the factory was shut down, such as the white block fretboard inlays and engraved tuner covers, were shipped to whoever Jenkins contracted to make the Harwood branded instruments for them.  There is speculation that that may have been the Larson brothers at first, and then Regal later on.  

No, Jenkins Music Company did not shut down during the depression, but continued to operate under the original family ownership until 1972.  In fact, they moved into their famous store at 1217 Walnut in downtown Kansas City in 1932.  This building is in the National Register of Historic Places.  Only the art deco facade remains today.  The economic collapse of 1929 took a huge toll on piano manufacturers in particular.  Jenkins was already out of the instrument manufacturing business by this time, but Martin and Gibson managed to survive the depression.  In 1929, Jenkins sold Harwood brand guitars, but they also sold Martin, and they were one of the largest Gibson dealers in the U.S.

2b. what is the highest serial number on any of these Harwood NY (from KC) stringed instruments. there is a serial number 26613 on the Retrofret website currently for a concert size Harwood for sale (they approximate 1915, but that date could be way off, or?]

Once again, I'll have to look in to that.  

3. in 1899 there was a 'new line' of Harwood guitars (by Jenkins). as announced in an advertisement posted on this site recently. this seems to have introduced new models.

I searched the forum for this reference and didn't turn up anything.  

4. ca. 1902, the Harwood name no longer appears on the headstock, only on the various trademarks (inside the guitar, and on the white celluloid tab.... all markings that were already being used [Bob Jenkin's well reasoned conjecture. in post #103]

Actually, the Harwood name does not appear on the headstock of any instruments before 1902.  We don't know when the headstock logo first appeared, but it was after 1902.

5. my questions about serial numbers involves establishing some general patterns... not only using the sequence to i.d. particular instruments. are, for example the early Harp guitars numbered with lower numbers (but part of the same run of, what seems like about 30,000 instruments over a 45 year history of manufacturing??)

You're right.  I need to correspond with Gregg Miner and find out what he has to say about the harp guitar serial numbers.  I have never personally seen a Harwood harp guitar.

I can't say I'm very optimistic about getting the serial number/manufacture date issue resolved.  Unless some records are uncovered here in Kansas City, I think the best we may be able to do is approximate dates.  I would really like to find some more Jenkins catalogs from the 1890 - 1925 period.

Bob

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## HarHolz

thanks Bob for all of the history of the the Jenkins Company.

i still think a list naming/describing of 6 to 12 Harwood instruments and their serial numbers, would go a long way toward sorting out the sequence, if not the absolute dating of the guitars (and maybe the mandolins too).  just through my casual looking around the web, one finds serial numbers on Harwoods from the 7000s to ca. 30000.  Is it your hunch when Jenkins'  KC, Walnut St. stringed instrument factory closed in 1911, that the last serial number was then used on a Harwood, and maybe the last celluloid inlays on the fretboards?  you seem to think that the use of the celluloid inlay-blocks continued with the next manufacturer....which would also suggest that the serial numbers sequence might have gone on and on too, well after 1911?

just looking around the last 20 min. online, i turned up a J. W. Jenkins & Sons, ad "Good Things to Buy for Christmas" from the KC Journal, December 21, 1897.   there are some details about Harwood (and Jenkins' other) guitars for sale.    i post it here.

also: the other Jenkins advertisement from 1900, i mentioned, and you could not find, is found in Post #70 above.  the vertical text up the side notes the new models of Harwoods for 1899.

apologies for my misunderstanding that the Jenkins Co went under after the crash of 1929.  but it would appear that their sheet music business ceased in early 1930 (to judge by the absence of copyright dates on their vast publication of sheet music through 1929). 

do you have a best guess for the year (or range of years) for 10351 & 10353 ?  is your 10353 a Number 1 as well?  

catalogues, pre 1911, i guess are what you most want?   there is a catalogue in the Missouri History Museum library's online catalogue for _Jenkins bargains in sample and used band instruments_, published by Jenkins Music Company, 192_?.  it is described as a "folded sheet".   i'm not sure if band instruments would have included guitars and mandolins in the 1920s, or mostly brass and drums.

all best,

HarHolz

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## delsbrother

That's interesting ad copy there..  "_Orange_ Colored tops"?

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## brunello97

Thanks, HarHolz for posting the ad.  I notice that the Clifford, Washington, and Royal lines are featured by not "Harwood", though it is mentioned in the intro copy. Hard to make much of from the illustrations except for the unique shaped scratchplate, which does resemble one that has been posted here.

For me, the detective work on these old mandolin makers (here and in Italy) turns up equally fascinating information about the times, places and process from which they emerged.  Directly to the left of the ad is an article discussing Maine's experience with Prohibition. I recently read "Last Call" on the history of Prohibition and watched Ken Burns PBS documentary on the subject. Very interesting to see a contemporary article on the topic.

Mick

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## KanMando

In the course of doing research for the Harwood article, I scanned many, many, pages of the Kansas City newspapers from the period, as well as city directories and old photographs of Kansas City.  It really gave me a new appreciation for my home town.  One thing that surprised me was that at the turn of the century, the population of Kansas City, MO, was about 350,000.  Photographs from that time show that the town was very compact and built up.  There was little evidence of the urban-suburban sprawl that we have today.  A lot of people were living in a relatively small area.  In 1878, my great-great-grandfather lived within easy walking distance of the original Jenkins store in the 600 block of Main St.  One of the articles I ran across, I think from the 1920s, mentions that my grandfather, Paul Jenkins, was going to manage Jenkins' new "suburban" store at 31st and Main.  Anyone familiar with Kansas City now would hardly consider that area to be suburban, and it's only twenty blocks south of the downtown store.

Bob

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## KanMando

Re:  post #114.   

Mick, I cringe every time I see that photo of my Harwood bowlback with that textured white plastic pickguard.  It was obviously non-original and has since been replaced with a more period-correct tortoise guard.  It's shown in the close-up photo in the Fretboard Journal article.

Bob

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## brunello97

Sorry, Bob. I should scan the image from FB journal and replace it.  :Frown: 

I just thought the specificity of the shape of the SP in the illustration was noteworthy. No mistaking that it was 'drawn from life.'

Mick

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## Masterbilt

> attached are photos of this harwood parlor guitar,


HarHolz - lovely looking guitar! Hope to have the chance to play it once ...  :Wink:

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## brunello97

A cursory search turned up this Harwood bowlback for sale at a guitar shop.

http://www.tommysguitarshop.com/cat/...ndex.cfm?p=235

I didn't see it referenced in the thread, so thought to get some images of it up. Some general similarities to mine, but virtually all the details are different.  A particular note is the neck/head joint: not a simple or common detail. I've seen it on Martin bowlbacks and other east coast builders. (No assumptions being made here.)

Looks like a nice mandolin. $1K? Well...

Mick

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## pfox14

Not much to add to the Harwood discussion, but here's the cover of Gibson's first issue of their in-house magazine "The Mastertone" with a really nice picture of the display window of J.W. Jenkins Music in Kansas City.

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## arkyrover

> I'm embarking on a personal research project. I'm seeking information on Harwood brand stringed instruments manufactured for and by the Jenkins Music Company of Kansas City.
> 
> By the way, my name is Robert Jenkins, and yes, it's the same Jenkins. It was a family owned business from its beginning in 1878 until it was sold by my father in 1972.
> 
> Being a guitar and mandolin player, I'm curious about these instruments. I've only seen one in person. It was a parlor guitar, very plain in appointments, being shown at a guitar show in Independence, MO. It needed major restoration, but the guy only wanted $75.00 cash. By the time I called my dad to get his recollections on the Harwood brand, and got back with the cash, it had been sold.
> 
> So, having become a regular browser on the Mandolin Cafe, I know that there has to be someone out there who can fill in the gaps. Mainly: who really built the Harwoods, and did Jenkins Music ever have its own shop and build them. My dad  does not have any documents, but does think that Jenkins did have its own shop for a while.
> 
> Here's what I've found so far by Google:
> ...



Bob - just read the article in Fretboard Journal.  Was very excited to find it.  I have a Harwood violin (Stradivarius model) and possibly a Harwood taterbug mandolin that has had the headstock replaced.  Fretboard changes about 1/2 way up.   My family comes from NE Ks (Jackson Co.) so imagine that they bought from Jenkins...

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## KanMando

> Not much to add to the Harwood discussion, but here's the cover of Gibson's first issue of their in-house magazine "The Mastertone" with a really nice picture of the display window of J.W. Jenkins Music in Kansas City.


That photo is also in Spann's Guide To Gibson 1902-1941.  It dates to 1925, so this would have been the company's third location in downtown Kansas City at 1015 Walnut.  That may be a Loar-signed F-5 mandolin there in the center back.  Jenkins was one of the largest Gibson dealers in the U.S.

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## delsbrother

I wonder if Loar ever visited that location. He toured all over; I would think he might've stopped by large Gibson distributors to see how things were going. Any listings of Loar's group playing in the area?

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## pfox14

Here's a brief 1932 article on Jenkins new building in Kansas City also located on Walnut Street.

----------


## pfox14

Just found this 1903 article that was published in The Music Trade Review specifically mentioning Jenkins' own factory being dedicated to the manufacturing of Harwood mandolins and guitars.

----------


## KanMando

> Here's a brief 1932 article on Jenkins new building in Kansas City also located on Walnut Street.


This was a wonderful building.  It's on the national register of historic places.  Sadly, only the art-deco facade remains today.  I was talking to my father about the building a while back and he said that it was one of the first "air conditioned" buildings in Kansas City.  This was done by having huge blocks of ice delivered daily and placed in a basement room.  I don't know how the cool air was circulated to the rest of the building.  Anyway, this didn't last long.  Once my great grandfather saw what the ice was costing him, he stopped the practice.  Another funny thing about the building was the clandestine employee lunch room.  The elevators only went to the ninth floor, but there actually was a partial tenth floor that could be reached by a stairway.  The lunchroom was up there, and they had great, cheap food cooked on the premises.  Apparently, the Kansas City Health Department never caught on.

The musical merchandise department, where the stringed instruments were sold, was located on the mezzanine that over-looked the main floor.  It was all wood-paneled.  

Bob

----------


## KanMando

> I wonder if Loar ever visited that location. He toured all over; I would think he might've stopped by large Gibson distributors to see how things were going. Any listings of Loar's group playing in the area?


delsbrother - I did a quick search on the Music Trade Review acrchive and found this from May 1924:

MTR

The story is in the right-hand column with the headline "Gibsonians To Go On Widely Extended Tour".  They didn't make it to Kansas City on this trip.  I'll do some more digging to see if I can find whether they ever came to KC.

Bob

----------


## pfox14

Bob, do you know where Jenkins had its factory? I would imagine that it was Kansas City. Was the Harwood line made in the late 1800s thru WW1 or thereabouts? No mention of the Harwood line in any of the 20s or 30s info I have.  I did find a couple of Harwood/Jenkins ads from the 1890s to the early 1900s.

----------


## brunello97

Nice description of a nice-looking building, thanks.  Happy to see that it hasn't escaped  the wrecking ball, though the storefronts look empty on GoogleMap.  Is the 'theater' inside still intact? 

Mick

----------


## KanMando

> Bob, do you know where Jenkins had its factory? I would imagine that it was Kansas City. Was the Harwood line made in the late 1800s thru WW1 or thereabouts? No mention of the Harwood line in any of the 20s or 30s info I have.  I did find a couple of Harwood/Jenkins ads from the 1890s to the early 1900s.


pfox - the factory was located at 1417 Walnut.  We think the original shop was probably located on the top floor of the store when the store was at 921-923 Main Street.  I just read a reference to the factory having been built in 1893, so they were up and running when their agreement with the Haynes company ended in 1894.  We don't know exactly how long the Harwood factory was located at 1417 Walnut, but Bill Graham uncovered a story in the Kansas City Star from 1911.  There was a fire in the Jenkins store, which at that time was located at 1015 Walnut.  The story mentions that the guitar and mandolin factory, which was located behind the store, was not damaged.  This being the case, the factory must have been on Grand Avenue, the next street east of Walnut, and was separated from the store by an alley.  This is the last reference we have found for the Harwood factory.

----------


## KanMando

> Nice description of a nice-looking building, thanks.  Happy to see that it hasn't escaped  the wrecking ball, though the storefronts look empty on GoogleMap.  Is the 'theater' inside still intact? 
> 
> Mick


It didn't entirely escape the wrecking ball.  What used to  be the store is now a parking garage with a beautiful art-deco stone and wrought iron facade.  So no, the theater is gone.  I  used to play my piano recitals in that theater.  

Bob

----------


## Pete Summers

I remember that Jenkins building on Walnut St. very well. I spent many an hour as a teenager trying out records and albums in the playing booths they had on the first floor. I also gave a knee knocking piano "recital" in their auditorium as a kid. 

Jenkins also published a lot of sheet music, especially ragtime around the turn of the 20th century. It was a wonderful music store and a Kansas City landmark. Too bad it's gone. They don't have music stores like that anymore. They sold everything musical.

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## KanMando

> delsbrother - I did a quick search on the Music Trade Review acrchive and found this from May 1924:
> 
> MTR
> 
> The story is in the right-hand column with the headline "Gibsonians To Go On Widely Extended Tour".  They didn't make it to Kansas City on this trip.  I'll do some more digging to see if I can find whether they ever came to KC.
> 
> Bob


OK - Here we go.  The Gibsonians did come to Kansas City in May 1926 in conjunction with the Silver Jubilee of the American Guild of Banjoists, Mandolinists, and Guitarists.  Here's the story from the MTR archive.  Gibson and the Gibsonians are mentioned on the both pages of the article.   Jenkins Music Co. is also mentioned.  Of course, LLoyd Loar had left Gibson by this time.

MTR 1
MTR 2

----------


## brunello97

Here's another Harwood bowlback, this from a shop down in SA.

http://www.guitartex.com/instruments...e-guitars.html

Classic Harwood pickguard shape but the headstock is a curious blend of a straight shape and familiar end profile. Also, has the "Martin-esque" head/neck detail that shows up now and again. No serial number noted, unfortunately.

Mick

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## Jim Garber

> Classic Harwood pickguard shape but the headstock is a curious blend of a straight shape and familiar end profile.


Headstock looks like Bohmann... wasn't there a connection? Didn't JB make some Harwoods?

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## brunello97

> Headstock looks like Bohmann... wasn't there a connection? Didn't JB make some Harwoods?


Don't know…, but would be interested in finding out. Most of the Bohmanns I have in my files are the more extreme design examples.  Jim, don't you have (or have had) a Harwood?  Seems, I recall.

Mick

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## Jim Garber

I used to have a nice Harwood bowlback but I got a call a few years ago from the prop guy for Jersey Boys. They were looking for a mandolin to played in an Italian restaurant. The Harwood was one that was readily playable and they accepted my price, so it went.

----------


## brunello97

> I used to have a nice Harwood bowlback but I got a call a few years ago from the prop guy for Jersey Boys. They were looking for a mandolin to played in an Italian restaurant. The Harwood was one that was readily playable and they accepted my price, so it went.


Cool. Did you ever see the footage?  I've heard of the show, but have never seen it.

Was it this one in the upper left? Obverse looks like the same model as mine. Weirder coincidences have occurred… Mine's missing its FLA extension, or whatever it is they call that dangling bit of Missouri (which is probably more appropriate.)

Mick

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## Jim Garber

Yeah, that was the one. I never took any other pics of it.

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## KanMando

I've set up a WordPress site for the Harwood instruments.  It's a work in progress, but I do have all the Harwood pages from the 1895 J. W. Jenkins' Sons catalog posted.  I will add the Clifford, Washington, and other stringed instruments eventually.  Here's the link:

http://harwoodguitar.wordpress.com/

Bob

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## brunello97

Looks great, Bob, a nice start for your project. I will have to map these against the Harwood mandolin images I've collected.  What do you suppose they mean by 'oval ebony fingerboard'?  A radiused fingerboard?  With this catalog as a sole guide my Harwood looks like a hybrid of a Style 40 body with at 45-50 type headstock. The fretboard is quite flat though. I look forward to seeing the site as it grows!

Mick

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## KanMando

Mick - as I've mentioned on several occasions, we've never seen any two Harwoods alike, and other than the bottom of the line parlor guitars, we've never seen an instrument that conforms exactly to the ones shown in my catalog.  That your mandolin looks like a hybrid of the Style 40-45-50 does not surprise me.  I'm guessing that the "oval ebony fingerboard"  means a radiused board.  I just took a look at my bowlback, and if it has a radius, it's very slight.  On the other hand, the guitar fingerboards are highly radiused.  When I had my No. 6 model re-fretted, Mike Horan at Mass Street Music flattened the board to a more modern, flatter radius.

Bob

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## bgmando

Regarding the bowlback used in Jersey Boys, when Bob and I first started working on the Harwood project, I mentioned it to Joe Payne, who has played the guitar parts in the pit band and had bit parts onstage in Jersey Boys from its opening show on Broadway and continuing.
   He mentioned they had a Harwood bowlback in the instrument lineup and he had played it. Small world.

bg

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## Matt the Mead Maker

Could someone please post a picture of a Harwood label that would go inside the instrument?  I'm repairing a Harwood mandolinetto that's missing it's label and has a crack running down the middle of the back plate. I'd like to put a label in there to hide the repair work visible through the sound hole. I'll remove any serial number type of info. Thanks a million!

----------


## KanMando

Matt - we've never seen a Harwood with a paper label.  On the guitars, the double oval with "Harwood New York"  is stamped on the center brace of the back, clearly visible through the sound hole, and the triangle logo is stamped on the neck block.  On the mandolins and guitars, the "Harwood New York" oval logo is also stamped on the back of the headstock.  Photos of the logos are on post #40 and #75 of this thread.

Bob

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## brunello97

Matt, would you post some pictures of the Harwood mandolinetto when you get a chance? Either in before or after condition (or ideally both).  I look forward to seeing the revitalized instrument...

Thanks!

Mick

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## Matt the Mead Maker

You bet - I'll definitely post before and after pics here. I'd rather wait until the project is complete because having such a beautiful instrument in disrepair drives me nuts and I'd feel better if I could show you all the final project. I'll probably include a video so you can hear how it sounds. 

Thanks for the info on the labels, Bob. This thread has been really helpful!

----------


## Diamond Dave

New to this site...any info would be greatly appreciated...

I received this Mandolin about 40 yrs ago from my G. Grand Mother who received it from her cousin when she had passed in the mid 60's. I had searched several years before but got nowhere....It is a Harwood, S/N # 20516
Would like to know what year it was made and approx. worth....FYI, not wanting to sell it.

Thx

----------


## bgmando

We've never had a serial number list to match up with production years. We're hoping for some receipts to show up in a case someday. For sure probably one from between 1895 and 1911.
   Your mando is quite similar to the one owned by Bob Jenkins.
   Values vary greatly. But it's usually in low three figures. 
   Thanks for posting yours, and be sure and check out the Fretboard Journal story on Harwoods.

Bill Graham

----------


## Charles Johnson

Now for something completely different:

----------


## Jim Garber

Nice one Charles...  I would also say that that pickguard was a later add-on. I bet there was never a pickguard on this guitar and  i am pretty sure that if there was it was not that one.




> Very good condition. Harwood guitars were distributed By Jenkins Music Co. of Kansas City. This was probably made by Regal or Bruno in Chicago around 1920, give or take a decade or so. Has nicely figured Brazilian rosewood back and sides, solid Adirondack spruce top, and ebony fretboards. Body is about the size of a 00 or 000 size Martin. There are some repaired top, back and side cracks but all were professionally repaired and cleated. Original tuners. I think the bridge may be replaced as it looks newer, even though it is Brazilian rosewood as well. The neck was reset, the frets were dressed and the guitar was set up by luthier Dave Sheppard. Plays nicely and has a unique sound with the six string harp neck. Very playable instrument ready to go. Comes with a large, heavy home made wooden hard shell case

----------


## MikeEdgerton

Bruno, to my knowledge was always a distributor and never a manufacturer. Does anyone have a source that shows that Bruno actually was a builder? I'd beinterested in seeing that.

----------


## brunello97

Not to sidetrack what is slowly building as a great thread dedicated to Harwood, but following up on Mike's comment here is a link I found to a couple old C. Bruno & Sons musical instrument catalogs.

http://www.archive.org/search.php?qu...uno+%26+Son%22

A little disappointing to find the mandolin page missing from the 1881 catalog, but a lot of interesting instruments nonetheless.

They must of had a wide network of sources for their product lines.

Mick

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## barney999

Hi all.  First, thanks to all (especially Bob Jenkins) for all the work bringing forth information about Harwood instruments.  It's appreciated !  

When I first acquired my Harwood guitar, probably 10 or 15 years ago, there was virtually no info on Harwood.  I heard various vague stories, but nothing confirmed.  One fellow told me he saw John Cephas playing somewhere (I forget where it was. I think in the midwest) with a sweet-sounding Harwood.  (I think that's who it was. I could be wrong about the name, but it was a known acoustic bluesman). The story went that he asked John if he would sell it, and the response was something like, "Hell no".  In any event, it's great to see all the information that's been brought to light. The 1895 Jenkins Catalog is a major find.

My Harwood's serial number is 20821. Based on the 1895 Jenkins Catalog, it appears to be either a No.1, 2, or 6.  It's a very plain guitar -- no fancy inlays or adornments.  The back is one-piece, with a number of hairline-like cracks.  

Has the serial number scheme been deciphered yet ?  I thought I read somewhere that it might be the 821st guitar made in either 1902, or maybe the 2nd year of production.  Can anyone shed a light on that ?

I was also curious if anyone would know its value. I think its in fairly good shape, except the bridge has lifted up and it has a number of hairline cracks in its back.   I'm going to be making a major move and I'm limited on what I can bring with me.  I'm on the fence about taking it with me, although my wife's not. :-) 

Thanks.

- barney

----------


## 77hotrocks

Hi I just wanted to reply to your search for information on Harwood guitars.  I have one serial number 18205.  Mine has the Harwood New York logo on the head stock.  This has been passed down we believe from my wifes great aunt who we think lived in Illinois.  We are in are late 60's so I believe she must have aquired it new.  It is in fairly nice condition.  However I am thinking about having it restored to like new.  what are the thoughts on doing such.

Thanks Dennis
573-374-9667

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## Bill Snyder

Dennis, forgive me for pointing this out but you might not want to post your email address or phone number on a public forum.
In about 30 seconds someone can find out your full name and your spouses name and your home address. They don't have to have access to any high prices software or search sites to do this. 
By using the edit function you can remove this information from your post and if any member of the Mandolin Cafe wants to contact you they can do it by clicking on your name and using the Private Message function that maintains your privacy.

----------


## bgmando

Dennis -- If you want to play it, I don't think it needs to be like new but it doesn't take too much to have a good luthier make sure things are solid, work on the nut and if need be the saddle to make things playable. Depends on what kind of shape it's in.
   If it plays nice it's good to go for me.
   They're not worth tons of money usually $400-$800, so you don't want to get too deep in on repairs unless you just have lots of sentimental value for it and just wish to do so. I would never refinish a guitar.
   They do sound nice after some setup work by a good luthier. A light sound but pretty.

bg

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## bgmando

p.s. Post a photo of it front and back if you get a chance.

bg

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## 77hotrocks

thanks bg
I took it into my shop and the said three of the frets need reinstalling getting the tuneing rails freed up and  a new set of strings,  should be ready to go.  Its in pretty nice condition.  Sounded good the way it was.

Dennis

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## mrdogrose

First post here, just wanted to show my c1900 Washington, produced for Jenkins. It's incredibly responsive. Note the single remaining original tuner button--real bone. Bridge was replaced. It had been a wall hanger for 30+ years--with the strings under tension originally. The pins were missing, & someone had whittled twigs--with the bark still on & jammed them in the bridge. A regular peg would fall through the holes in the original pyramid bridge. The warped top could not be straightened all the way, but it still plays beautifully. My favorite guitar.

----------


## Jimi C

Wow. That's the only other Washington I've seen online. How did you date it? I have one too. The number on the back of the headstock is 320. I've guessed that mine is pre-1900 but am not sure. (see P.4 of this thread for my previous post). My Washington has amazing tone. I had a luthier do some restoration to it since it wasn't in really good shape when I picked it up but it's my #1 acoustic now. 





> First post here, just wanted to show my c1900 Washington, produced for Jenkins. It's incredibly responsive. Note the single remaining original tuner button--real bone. Bridge was replaced. It had been a wall hanger for 30+ years--with the strings under tension originally. The pins were missing, & someone had whittled twigs--with the bark still on & jammed them in the bridge. A regular peg would fall through the holes in the original pyramid bridge. The warped top could not be straightened all the way, but it still plays beautifully. My favorite guitar.

----------


## Jimi C

Here are some better pics of the Washington before I had it restored.

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## brunello97

Nice guitar, Jimi.  I'm loving this thread where everyone is contributing images of their Harwoods.

Mick

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## KanMando

Here's a little Harwood mandolin eye candy.  This is a Harwood No.46.  It's the first Harwood we've seen that exactly conforms to the one shown in the 1895 Jenkins catalog.  Thanks to Cafe member "mofiddler" for alerting me to this one.


Bob

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## brunello97

Very nice, Bob.  What a round bowl form.  I also like the neck joint 'collar' detail a lot.  I love these Harwoods, hardly any two alike.  Certainly doesn't remind me much of obvious Chicago sources.

Does this belong to "mofiddler" or did he find it online somewhere?

Mick

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## Jim Garber

> Here's a little Harwood mandolin eye candy.  This is a Harwood No.46.  It's the first Harwood we've seen that exactly conforms to the one shown in the 1895 Jenkins catalog.  Thanks to Cafe member "mofiddler" for alerting me to this one.
> Bob


That is interesting, Bob, but I actually posted one just like it in this post above.

Here is more of that particular one from eBay October 2003. Is there something different from this one? The only thing that does look different to me is the tailpiece -- the jpegs in my files of that tp resemble similar ones on Martin bowlbacks, which of course, really doesn't mean much.

----------


## Jim Garber

BTW there is another one on CL -- or is this the same one?

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## brunello97

Jim, it looks like the SN on your CL Harwood and on Bob's recent post are the same.  The 'fancy' model you posted looks very similar but for the engraved tuners and the location of the SN relative to the Harwood oval on the back of the headstock.  Well, I guess the MOP position markers on the FB are different as well.  I love these Harwoods.  For me, along with Favilla and Ricca some of the most intriguing US bowlbacks.  

Mick

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## KanMando

I bought this Harwood from an individual in Springfield, MO who had it listed on Craig's list.  It's about a three hour drive from Kansas City. It is the same one shown in Jim's CL post.  It does not have the fancy engraved tuner plates like the one in Jim's earlier post.  No, it did not belong to "mofiddler", but he sent me a PM to alert me to its listing on the Springfield CL.    BTW,  Bill Graham came over tonight and we tuned it up to pitch for the first time.  The tailpiece is not original, but doesn't look too bad.  The strings are bronze and in pretty good shape, and they are chenilled at the loop end.  It seems to be holding tune fine, and really started to come alive after about an hour of playing.  The seller thought it had not been played for about 60 years. The neck angle is fine and this little gem is fully playable and has decent intonation.

----------


## mofiddler

Wow... that looks way nicer than I expected when I saw the listing on CL. I was really tempted to increase my collection, but am glad it went to a good home!

----------


## KanMando

As I mentioned in an earlier post, the last reference we have found to the Harwood guitars and mandolins being made by Jenkins in Kansas City was in an August 31, 1910 story in the Kansas City Star about a fire at the Jenkins Store located at 1015 Walnut.  The report stated that the guitar and mandolin factory located behind the store was not damaged.  I surmised that the factory must have fronted on Grand Avenue, the next street east of Walnut.  I have found what must be a photo of that factory.  

The tall building in the center is the R. A. Long Building, 928 Grand, built in 1907.  The tall white building to its left is the Commerce Trust Building at 922 Walnut built in 1906.  What we're looking at here is the intersection of Tenth Street and Grand Avenue, looking north down Grand.  The tall white building down the street is the Scarritt building, 818 Grand, built in 1907.  In the foreground, facing Grand Avenue, is a two story brick building.  If you look closely, above the second floor windows, you can see that there is a sign that says "J.W. Jenkins Sons Music Co."  This postcard dates from 1907 - 1915.  This is the final Kansas City home of the Harwood factory.  The Jenkins store remained at the 1015 Walnut location until its new building at 1217 Walnut was completed in 1932.

Bob

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## KanMando

Here's a little Harwood/Jenkins memorabilia:

----------


## delsbrother

Bob, have you checked the fire insurance maps of the city? There were several companies (here in LA we had Sanborn maps, and they were instrumental in me finding old Knutsen addresses for Gregg Miner's site); many are available online or through your public library. These maps would list the business along with the physical shape of the building.

----------


## brunello97

Sanborn maps should be available for most Midwestern cities as well.  I believe Keef was able to turn some up for some of Lyon + Healy's sites in Chicago while researching his book on Washburn. Sanborn maps are a treasure trove of information. In addition to building footprint information, they also often make note of factory locations inside, particularly if they involve hazardous or 'flammable' activities.  More and more Sanborn maps these have been turning up on line:

http://mulibraries.missouri.edu/spec...sanborne.htm#k

Here is a page of KC Sanborn maps from 1896

http://digital.library.umsystem.edu/...+city+missouri

They are pretty high-resolution scans.  Don't know my way around town, Bob, and I got distracted looking for early BBQ establishments  :Wink: 

Mick

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## brunello97

Bingo. 

Here it is 921-23 Main St. (from the letter Bob posted)

http://digital.library.umsystem.edu/...art=1;resnum=7

"Manufacturing Musical Instruments" is noted on the map.

Fun way to delay going to work on a Monday morning.

Mick

----------


## Jim Garber

Interesting a connection with Rohlfing & Sons. I bought a bowlback with their store label because I thought it looked Larsonoid and it turned out to be a Maurer stamped inside on the neck block. Lots of cross-pollination back then in the mid-west.

----------


## brunello97

> Interesting a connection with Rohlfing & Sons. I bought a bowlback with their store label because I thought it looked Larsonoid and it turned out to be a Maurer stamped inside on the neck block. Lots of cross-pollination back then in the mid-west.


I was thinking of your mandolin when I saw that, Jim. Didn't the LarBros do a lot of work for Maurer or  under their aegis?  Did Maurer make anything of their own?

Mick

----------


## Jim Garber

I believe that the Larsons bought the rights to the Maurer name and made instruments under that name until they used Euphonon later on.

----------


## KanMando

delsbrother and Mick: Thanks for the info on the Sanborn maps.  I'll see if I can find the ones that show the factory in the 1400 block of Walnut and the one behind the store at 1015 Walnut.  The map that shows the Jenkins location at 921 Main seems to confirm my dad's recollection that the original Harwood shop was on the top floor of that building.

Bob

----------


## KanMando

I found this Sanborn Map that shows an instrument factory  at 1405 - 1407 Walnut.  The map is from 1939.  The address for the original Harwood factory was listed as 1417 Walnut in the early 1900's city directory.  I don't know if the address numbers were reconfigured at some time, or how often the Sanborn maps were updated.

1400 Walnut area

----------


## KanMando

OK- this seems to be further confirmation that the Harwoods were not built in Kansas City after 1911 or so.  At the site of the Harwood factory, the southwest corner of 10th and Grand, this Sanborn map from 1939 shows a building that was built in 1912.  So the old two story brick factory building was torn down, and 19 floor building was put up on the site.

10th and Grand

----------


## brunello97

Great stuff, Bob, thanks. These Sanborn maps are like a precursor to the Google Map street views: both tantalizing and frustrating simultaneously.  

Not sure exactly when my Harwood bowl was made, but it might have been at the 921 Main Street location.

Mick

----------


## KanMando

Mick, yes, these Sanborn maps are fascinating.  Here's some more:  this map from 1896-1907 shows the Jenkins store at 1015 Walnut - wholesale and retail music.  Directly behind the store, fronting on Grand Avenue, appears to be the piano warehouse - piano storage.  The corner lot at 10th and Grand appears to be vacant at this time.  This is the future site of the Harwood factory.  This map must be after 1902 because Jenkins did not move to this location until then.  So, the Harwoods were still being made in the factory at 1417 Walnut at this time.  

Jenkins store and warehouse

----------


## brunello97

Bob, we used to pour over these maps when I was in architecture school.  Lots of interesting construction information notated on them as well. 

It would be fun if a someone with a connection to the Rohlfing or Stahl music emporiums turned up here at the MC. I'm a dedicated Modernist, but this kind of historical tracking is very enjoyable for me.

Mick

----------


## delsbrother

Yes, I would say the maps and the newspaper archives were the biggest help to my Knutsen research. If you can find the original maps, they are extremely interesting to view. First of all, they are HUGE books - each page is like 18x24 and there are hundreds of pages (in LA, at least). It's like the Monster Book of Monsters. The other cool thing about them is they were constantly updated, so you can track an address through time. The drawback to this is (at least in LA), if there was some change between major publications, they would just paste a piece of paper over the area in the old map and draw the new building right over it. Instead of "liquid paper" it's REAL paper, LOL. This can be really frustrating when you're looking at a map online because you can't tell what's under there. Sometimes if you're viewing the actual map, however, you can make out what was once there by reading through the patch. You feel real _Indiana Jones_ doing it, too.  :Smile:

----------


## brunello97

> Yes, I would say the maps and the newspaper archives were the biggest help to my Knutsen research. If you can find the original maps, they are extremely interesting to view. First of all, they are HUGE books - each page is like 18x24 and there are hundreds of pages (in LA, at least). It's like the Monster Book of Monsters. The other cool thing about them is they were constantly updated, so you can track an address through time. The drawback to this is (at least in LA), if there was some change between major publications, they would just paste a piece of paper over the area in the old map and draw the new building right over it. Instead of "liquid paper" it's REAL paper, LOL. This can be really frustrating when you're looking at a map online because you can't tell what's under there. Sometimes if you're viewing the actual map, however, you can make out what was once there by reading through the patch. You feel real _Indiana Jones_ doing it, too.


Or Jack Nicholson in "Chinatown"…  Aachoo!

It does look like some of the KC maps have some overlaid paper on some key sites of interest, though hard to tell if these were amendments or 'corrections'.  I graduated from UT School of Architecture just when computers were taking hold, but we learned how to 'French Cut' repairs in to hand drawings rather than overlays for corrections.  My hunch is, like you say, these are updates as those inlay techniques are pretty old.

Mick

----------


## KanMando

I think I might revise my previous statement that the Harwood factory was built on the vacant lot at the corner of Tenth and Grand.  It's hard to tell because of the angle of the photo, but there  may still be a vacant lot just north of the Jenkins building shown in the postcard.  In that case, the mandolin and guitar factory mentioned in the fire story was probably in the same building as the piano warehouse.

Bob

----------


## delsbrother

Bob, have you been to these sites in person? Sometimes there are clues left over that are neat to find. I went downtown looking for the old Schireson shop, and while the building had been replaced, there were remnants of painted Schireson signage on a wall overlooking the site. 

Darrell

----------


## KanMando

Darrell - I've probably been to these sites numerous times not knowing anything about the history.  Of course I went to the Jenkins store at 1217 Walnut many times, as it was still open until I was in college.  I'm going to make a trip downtown and see what's there.  I know that the 1400 block of Walnut was torn down and became part of the Power and Light District (a big corporate entertainment area adjacent to the Sprint arena).  Looking at the Google satellite views, it  appears that the old buildings in the 1000 block of Grand and Walnut have been replaced as well.

Bob

----------


## brunello97

I guess I have been sleeping on the job.  This Harwood bowlback must have gone under my radar:

Harwood bowlback

Mick

----------


## onewent

Very interesting reading, and thanks to all who've contributed.  I can add this guitar to the discussion.  It appears identical to Jimi Cs Washington a few posts back.  I attached a photo of the headstock decal, and the paper label .. there is no stamped name or number on the headstock.  This example is missing its tuners, so, Jimi C if you read this, could you post photos of yours?  ..I'd like to track down a pair.  BTW, this a Grand Concert-size guitar, 14.5" across, with a 25.5" scale.  It's pretty nicely made, with what appears to be a cedar neck w/ an ebonized fingerboard.  The bridge is the original 'flat' pyramid, like on the previous example.  Perhaps this one was made by Harmony?  A few of the ladder braces are glued on a bias to the bridgeplate/brace.  Any attempts to date this era of Washington guitars?  The tuners could be a clue.  Regards, Tom

----------


## Jimi C

I wound up doing a bit of restoration to my Washington. It needed to be refretted but the fretboard was too brittle for the repair man and he wound up having to replace it. He also reset the neck and rebuilt the bridge. (the bridge was cracked and would have fallen apart soon. It already appeared that my Washington had had some poor repair work done to it over time. The binding was missing from the neck (my luthier replaced it when he put on the new fretboard). There was also what appeared to be some work done to the back of the neck. It was almost a "V" shape but it looked like someone had modified it by adding a strip of wood on the back. Between that modification and the original flat fretboard it was a bit tough to play. I sanded down the back of the neck and refinished it so it plays beautifully now. The new fretboard has a 10" radius. 
So mine is a bit modified now but it sounds so damn good I had to put some time and $ into it to make it last another 100 years. What is the number on the back of the headstock of yours? Mine is "320". Whatever that means. 
It is my primary gigging acoustic. I play a lot of fingerstyle on it with picks. It sounds great for the John Fahey tunes I like to cover.
I took some pics of the tuners for you. I left them rustic. It looks cool that way. My guitar was missing the "Washington Label" in the sound hole. More pics of yours?

----------


## Jimi C

Pics of the bridge and neck restoration. Including a couple pics before restoration that show the strip of would on the back of the neck.

----------


## Jimi C

MUCH better playing condition now.

----------


## Jimi C

Here's a pic of my guitar online before I owned it. I'm not sure where it was taken. I wound up buying it at a local guitar shop in Superior Wisconsin. They picked it up while on a road trip south somewhere. http://www.jedistar.com/jedistar_vin...r_dating_w.htm

----------


## brunello97

Another Harwood mandolin has surfaced from a shop in California which a new member has posted on this thread:

Harwood Bowlback

I replied to her query by linking her to this conversation and will post a few pictures of her Harwood for the comprehensive thread.

These Harwood mandolins are fascinating to me.  This one, #10 in my files, while having some details in common doesn't match any of the 9 others.   

Mick

----------


## madelinez

You can't tell from the photo, but the screws on the back of the head there have patent dates of DEC '89 and AUG ' 91. The tail piece has a patent date of OCT '86. If that is helpful to anyone.

----------


## pfox14

> I believe that the Larsons bought the rights to the Maurer name and made instruments under that name until they used Euphonon later on.


That is correct. Robert Maurer had been around since the 1800s, and the Larson brothers were working in his shop when they bought out the business and continued manufacturing that brand name.

----------


## brunello97

Another Harwood bowlback has emerged on ebay, the first of the dozen examples I have in my files that actually matches another one.

Harwood bowl 11

A modest model with ambitious pricing by the seller.

Mick

----------


## dudetob

I have a Harwood guitar that I would sell. I'm in Lee's Summit, Mo. LMK if you might be interested.


[QUOTE=KanMando;502838]I'm embarking on a personal research project. I'm seeking information on Harwood brand stringed instruments manufactured for and by the Jenkins Music Company of Kansas City.

By the way, my name is Robert Jenkins, and yes, it's the same Jenkins. It was a family owned business from its beginning in 1878 until it was sold by my father in 1972.

----------


## brunello97

Please post some photos, dude.  This thread is a nice compendium of Harwood instruments and would benefit from the inclusion of yours. I'm sure I speak for others in saying we enjoy seeing it.

If you would like to sell it, you might generate an ad for the "classifieds" section of the Cafe.

Mick

----------


## brunello97

Beautiful Harwood bowlback on the ebay right now.  One of the nicest I've seen:

Harwood bowlback

Nice way to start the day....

Mick

----------


## Jim Garber

> Beautiful Harwood bowlback on the ebay right now.


Looks like it was re- or over-finished. Seller says prob ivory tuners but they look like they were plastic and starting to disintegrate. Those side markers are quite strange. The headstock is reminiscent of Bohmann. There may still be some connection there.

----------


## KanMando

Very similar to my No. 46 in post #164 in this thread.  I referred to the 1895 catalog, and as usual, this bowlback does not conform exactly to the models shown.  As I said in post #164, my No. 46 is the only Harwood we've seen that conforms exactly to the model in the catalog.  Differences:  fretboard inlays, rosette inlays, pickguard.  My No.46 does not have the fret indicator inlays in the neck, nor do any of the Harwood mandolins in the catalog.  Nice mandolin.  

Bob

----------


## brunello97

> Very similar to my No. 46 in post #164 in this thread.... and as usual, this bowlback does not conform exactly to the models shown. 
> 
> Bob


I know that's right.

How about that nutty scratch plate?  I love the top color on these.  I had a Ricca bowlback some years ago with almost a similar hue, though with a bit more of an orange cast.

Mick

----------


## brunello97

Another Harwood bowlback has turned up on the ebay, this time a 12-string (?!)

Harwood 12 string bowl

Looks to be in pretty rough shape.

Mick

----------


## Jim Garber

Just wha6t you need, Mick. A broken 12 string bowlback!

----------


## brunello97

> Just wha6t you need, Mick. A broken 12 string bowlback!


Yikes, no.

These Harwoods grow ever strangelier.  I wouldn't be surprised to find out of the 8754 mandolins that were made that there were 8611 different models....

Mick

----------


## Thor Halvorsen

I have a bowl back that looks like the top farthest left one (hardwood). Curious, I located a number that is written/etched on the brace in the inside of the top of the sound hole, just underneath the fretboard, looks like 1917. Also on the inside face of the bowl against the neck is the trademark triangular stamp, and on the back of where you tune the strings is the numbers 403 20, atop a metal plate on the back of the tuning board which also bears the name harwood. 

Mine also has its original case (wanna see pictures?). Thank you for your help too. This is the first older instrument I've now the chance to own and look forward to getting more historical info on it. 

Thor

----------


## Jim Garber

> I have a bowl back that looks like the top farthest left one


I think Thor is referring to this photo of my ex-Harwood and a few others.

BTW I sold that Harwood to the prop guy from the Jersey Boys show. I wonder if they still use it. Supposedly it was used in a scene in an Italian restaurant and one of the actors was to play it. I never did see the show. I should have asked for tickets as part of the deal.

----------


## KanMando

> Yikes, no.
> 
> These Harwoods grow ever strangelier.  I wouldn't be surprised to find out of the 8754 mandolins that were made that there were 8611 different models....
> 
> Mick


Well Mick, they made four models of the 12 string:

----------


## KanMando

> I have a bowl back that looks like the top farthest left one (hardwood). Curious, I located a number that is written/etched on the brace in the inside of the top of the sound hole, just underneath the fretboard, looks like 1917. Also on the inside face of the bowl against the neck is the trademark triangular stamp, and on the back of where you tune the strings is the numbers 403 20, atop a metal plate on the back of the tuning board which also bears the name harwood. 
> 
> Mine also has its original case (wanna see pictures?). Thank you for your help too. This is the first older instrument I've now the chance to own and look forward to getting more historical info on it. 
> 
> Thor


By all means post some photos.  

Bob

----------


## Jim Garber

> Well Mick, they made four models of the 12 string:


Bob: What year is that catalog?

----------


## KanMando

> Bob: What year is that catalog?


Jim - There's no actual publication date printed anywhere in the catalog, but there are several references in the catalog that indicate it was published in 1895.  It also jibes with Kansas City newspaper advertisements from that time.

Bob

----------


## Jim Garber

That would make a lot of sense also since the ostensible connection with Bohmann who was active around that time. The left one definitely looks like his work.

----------


## brunello97

> Well Mick, they made four models of the 12 string:



Thanks, Bob.  It is comforting to see that the catalog 12 string doesn't match the one for sale on ebay..... :Wink: 

Jim, I don't see the Bohmann connection. Yet.... But I know better than to doubt you. :Smile: 

This is one of my favorite ongoing threads here.

Mick

----------


## brunello97

Another Harwood mandolinetto on the ebay:

Harwood Mandolinetto

Action looks pretty dicey, like some top sinkage or neck rotation.

Mick

----------


## KanMando

Still another Harwood mandolinetto:  http://www.ebay.com/itm/VINTAGE-EARL...item461040b56a
This one looks like it's in really good shape.

Bob

----------


## brunello97

That one does look in fine condition, Bob.  Here are some photos of it for the thread compendium. Hadn't really noticed the sharp V profile neck in the previous mandolinetto. 

Mick

----------


## KanMando

My friend and occasional band-mate, Patti Nance, was going through some old photos that had belonged to her parents and had been stored in her attic for eight years.   She came across this one and posted it on her facebook timeline.  Of course, I recognized the mandolin and guitar right away.  The mandolin player is Adolph Steffens, Patti's great-uncle.  He was born in 1889 and lived just east of Kansas City.  What a great photo.

----------

brunello97

----------


## brunello97

Another Harwood bowlback has turned up on the ebay.

In true Harwood fashion, it looks quite a bit like mine, except for the parts of it that don't.  :Wink: 

Mick

----------


## KanMando

I saw this last night, Mick.  A low end model as  the bowl is not ribbed.  The interesting thing about this one is the engraved and dated tailpiece cover.  It's the first time we've ever been able to correlate a date and a serial number.  Serial number 24558 apparently was built in 1906.

----------


## brunello97

Or at least sometime before 1906....

Note it still has the Martin-like neck / headstock joint, which later models like mine (SN 30852) do not.  Say what you will about the 'unribbed' bowl, this one, like mine appears to be mahogany, which is altogether rare as a bowl making material from my experience.  Rock solid to this day.  Not a crack or a split to be seen.  Curious construction, which is yet another thing which makes these Harwoods so interesting.

Mick

----------


## Bill Snyder

It looks ribbed to me. I can see glue lines spaced out regularly. The mahogany used just matches up well to the piece to its side.

----------


## brunello97

> It looks ribbed to me. I can see glue lines spaced out regularly. The mahogany used just matches up well to the piece to its side.


Yeah, Bill, mine is certainly 'ribbed' in its construction (as this most recent ebay Harwood bowlback is.) In some lighting it almost does appear solid though, as you said, the mahogany grain blends.  I'm impressed with how stable it is, given how many cracks or separations I've come to expect in RW bowls.

Not exactly sure what Bob was referring to when he said 'unribbed' but I guessed maybe _alternating rib material or linings_ or something.  A solid carved out mahogany bowl would be something.  Something kind of weird, for one.  

Mick

----------


## oldwood

Hi friends, I have really enjoyed reading this Harwood thread and thanks especially to Bob Jenkins (KanMando) for starting the thread and providing some great background information on Harwood instruments.  It was great to read the Jenkins' Harwood catelog posted on-line.  I was looking at it yesterday and it has helped me identify my Harwood guitars - I have what I believe is a Standard 1 parlor Harwood guitar from what I was told was circa 1900 (serial number about**: 18150).  I have a second Harwood parlor that appears to be a version of the Standard 5/6 Concert model that dates to near 1920.  I will try posting pictures of both guitars here in the next week and we can discuss further.  I do notice very few ads for Harwood parlors versus others like Washburn, so Harwoor parlors appear to be relatively rare and hard to find.  The workmanship is high quality.

----------


## brunello97

> Hi friends, I have really enjoyed reading this Harwood thread and thanks especially to Bob Jenkins (KanMando) for starting the thread and providing some great background information on Harwood instruments.  It was great to read the Jenkins' Harwood catelog posted on-line.  I was looking at it yesterday and it has helped me identify my Harwood guitars - I have what I believe is a Standard 1 parlor Harwood guitar from what I was told was circa 1900 (serial number about**: 18150).  I have a second Harwood parlor that appears to be a version of the Standard 5/6 Concert model that dates to near 1920.  I will try posting pictures of both guitars here in the next week and we can discuss further.  I do notice very few ads for Harwood parlors versus others like Washburn, so Harwoor parlors appear to be relatively rare and hard to find.  The workmanship is high quality.


Awesome, oldwood.  I look forward to seeing pictures of your guitars.  I don't play guitar often but I really do like 'parlor' guitars....

Mick

----------


## KanMando

"It looks ribbed to me. I can see glue lines spaced out regularly. The mahogany used just matches up well to the piece to its side.
Bill Snyder"

"Yeah, Bill, mine is certainly 'ribbed' in its construction (as this most recent ebay Harwood bowlback is.) In some lighting it almost does appear solid though, as you said, the mahogany grain blends. I'm impressed with how stable it is, given how many cracks or separations I've come to expect in RW bowls.

Not exactly sure what Bob was referring to when he said 'unribbed' but I guessed maybe alternating rib material or linings or something. A solid carved out mahogany bowl would be something. Something kind of weird, for one. 

Mick"

I'm certainly no expert on bowlback mandolin construction.  I just took another look at the photos and I agree it could have ribs, but take a look at this photo where the bowl constricts at the neck junction.  I would expect to see some distinct joint lines here.
If not, I agree with Bill that the grains were lined up extremely well.  I have personally inspected a low end Harwood here in Kansas City that most definitely had an un-ribbed bowl.  It reminded me of an Ovation guitar.  The bowl was very thin and the mandolin was much lighter weight than my ribbed Harwoods.  Maybe someone knows whether it is possible to heat, steam, and press a thin piece of mahogany into a bowl shape.

Bob

----------


## Bill Snyder

I still see the ribs.

----------


## brunello97

I hear you, Bob.  I'm looking at my mahogany bowl Harwood right now and it almost looks as if it was _machined_ not built up of ribs / staves.  But on close inspection I can find the joints.  The joints are a bit more visible on the inside of the bowl than on the finished outside.  It too, is featherweight.  

Man, we're so spoiled by all this beautiful rosewood that we can sniff at that low end mahogany!  :Wink: 

I'll admit I've yet to string mine up.  The top has a couple cracks that need attention and it is missing the tuner plate cover.  It needs a nut and bridge (which are easy enough to make.)  I should get after it this summer.  

A mahogany bowl? Whose idea was that?  (Particularly when maple was a plentiful option...)  Part of the reason I love these Harwoods.  

Mick

----------


## KanMando

Mick - the un-ribbed Harwood that I inspected had a fabric liner inside the bowl.  I'm guessing that it was used to reinforce the bowl.

Bob

----------


## oldwood

Sorry for asking something that may have been discussed here previously, but how does the sound of the Harwood mandolins compare with other mandolins of the same period?  As far as the sound quality for Harwood parlor guitars, my Harwood (standard 1?) really sounds exceptional imo - not a big sound, starts our bright but morphs into an ancient mello sound on the sustain.  Love that old wood sound!  The smell with nose to sound hole is also ancient wood!  I tried to upload a few cut and paste photos here the other day but realize I need to to upload jpg files instead.  Should have some photos up by next week.  Jim

----------


## KanMando

Bill Graham describes the sound well in this Mandolin Cafe column from a few years back.  Bill plays his Harwoods on a semi-regular basis, as do I, and I think we agree that they are fine sounding instruments.  Here's a link to the article:
http://www.mandolincafe.com/news/pub...s_001032.shtml

Bob

----------


## brunello97

A fairly fancy Harwood Bowlback on the ebay this morning.  Very nice detailing on the top and inlay on the headstock.  No SN it seems.

Mick

----------


## KanMando

This appears to be a No. 60.  I don't know where the seller got the 1889 date.  


Bob

----------

brunello97

----------


## KanMando

I took a closer look at the Harwood in post #234.  It is not a No. 60 as it has 24 ribs, not 21 as described in the catalog.  Also, the ribs all appear to be rosewood, not mahogany and rosewood.  This puts it somewhere between a No. 60 and a No. 65 which had 28 rosewood ribs.  So, the trend continues.  We have not seen a single Harwood - guitar or mandolin - that exactly conforms to the ones shown in the catalog, and we have never seen two Harwoods that are exactly alike.

----------


## brunello97

> ....So, the trend continues.  We have not seen a single Harwood - guitar or mandolin - that exactly conforms to the ones shown in the catalog, and we have never seen two Harwoods that are exactly alike.


 :Wink: 

Mick

----------


## brunello97

It's been awhile since a Harwood has turned up so this one is welcome even if it is in pretty rough shape.

Appears to keep the 'no two alike' streak going.

Mick

----------


## brunello97

A nice looking Harwood bowlback on Ebay this morning, albeit in need of some repair.  Features the same mahogany bowl and headstock profile as mine, and without the "Harwood" headstock inlay.  It has much more interesting neck to head joint as well as a nice termination to the fretboard.  SN is 24558.

I am up to 15 Harwoods in my file and, still, no two of them are alike.  :Smile: 

Mick

----------


## Gregg Miner

Hello all. I'm preparing a new Harwood update (I really need to do a whole rewrite, but who has time?!) - and wonder if anyone has heard who might have snagged the last two recent eBay Jenkins catalogs?  One was c.1916, the other c.1907.  I have a limited budget for research materials and they went pretty high.  I was hoping for scans from a couple pages, and as is typical, I never seem to see research emanate from these things.
Meanwhile, in case Harwood geeks missed this blog...though this discovery was harp guitar-specific, it was one of the most mind-blowing I've yet come across: http://harpguitars.net/blog/2014/01/...arp-guitarist/
Plus a couple more new specimens presented here: http://harpguitars.net/blog/2014/01/...uitar-updates/
Best,
g

----------

brunello97

----------


## Gregg Miner

Hey all. I located the 1907/1908 catalog and got the pages I wanted from my very generous friend Lynn Wheelwright.
So here's the new beast: http://harpguitars.net/blog/2015/01/...d-lyre-thingy/
I also started on a complete rewrite of my Harwood article.  If anyone has new historical info or thoughts, please contact me privately.
Best,
g

----------

brunello97

----------


## delsbrother

Gregg, Lester Payne is also in Redlands, CA in the 1890s.

----------


## arlotone

I just purchased a Washington parlor guitar from a private seller here in Portland, Oregon. It had been recently restored by Kerry Char. It looks great and really sings when I fingerpick ragtime songs on it.

I read this entire, epic thread to learn what I could about it. It looks very much like the "No. 601" in the 1895 catalog that Bob Jenkins posted. There is no logo on the headstock and no number stamped anywhere, but that same "tomahawk" logo is printed on the inside of the sound hole and on the neck block. I noticed that other photos of Washington guitars, as in posts 191 and 192 above, use a different logo printed on the headstock. Is this a clue that those guitars are from a later date range?

My guitar has what could be a serial number printed in ink, directly on the wood inside the soundhole, but it is so badly faded that I can't make out any of it. I tried adjusting levels in Photoshop, but had no luck. Maybe someone else can get something from this.

One difference I see from the 1895 catalog image is my headstock is taller, with an extra inch or so of wood extending past the tuners. The guitar pictured in post 160 above has the shorter headstock as in the catalog, but it has six individual tuners compared to two sets of three like mine and the catalog image both have.

I also noticed, but don't think anyone has mentioned, that the 1897 newspaper ad in post 112 shows the following hierarchy of brands, from top to bottom: Harwood, Washington, Clifford, Royal.

The seller guessed this guitar was manufactured by Washburn because of the similarity of the internal bracing. I could try photographing the interior if anyone would like to follow up on that.

----------

brunello97

----------


## arlotone

A couple more thoughts about this Washington guitar:

- The 1895 catalog says, "Every genuine Washington guitar or mandolin is stamped with trademark 'hatchet' and our name 'J. W. Jenkins Sons.' Look for it; we make them." It seems like one of the big questions here is whether or not Jenkins actually built these instruments. Does anyone read that as a literal and accurate statement that they built the Washington instruments themselves?

- I thought the "hatchet" logo was a reference to Washington state, which might have been associated with Native Americans at the time these were made. But my bandmate thought it was a reference to George Washington and his childhood hatchet. Others have suggested the brand was named after a small town near Kansas City or New York (I'm guessing there's a town named Washington in almost every state), but that wouldn't explain the hatchet.

----------


## hudbutter

Here is a guitar I found at a yard sale for $10. I put $500 into it and I love it. I think it's a Harwood.

----------


## brunello97

Another Harwood bowlback mandolin is up for sale on the ebay.  My files are now at 17 examples without any two being matches.

The headstock looks a bit odd as if there were some damage and removal of material.  Hard to say for sure.  Harwood used a number of different headstock profiles, including their classic (Mannerist actually) broken pediment style--which I do quite like.

Mick

----------


## brunello97

> Another Harwood bowlback mandolin is up for sale on the ebay.  My files are now at 17 examples without any two being matches.
> 
> The headstock looks a bit odd as if there were some damage and removal of material.  Hard to say for sure.  Harwood used a number of different headstock profiles, including their classic (Mannerist actually) broken pediment style--which I do quite like.
> 
> Mick


Oh, I forgot the link to this most recent Harwood on the ebay.

Mick

----------


## oldwood

Gregg, thanks for posting - I own what are I beleive the same two Harwood models that you posted in your original Harwood article in Frettboard Journal.  Love them!  I will try contacting you at some point with some additional thoughts on your planned update.  Given their scarcity at auction, it doesn't seem there are many of the old Harwood guitars around anymore - yet it looks like there could have been as many as 40,000 or more produced back in the day.  Obviously, one sees plenty of Washburns on the market - but sadly few Harwoods?    

hudbutter, nice looking guitar you posted - and it looks similar to a Harwood.   I don't know if Harwood ever produced guitars without the "Harwood" bone marker at the base of the frettboard?  Also, does your guitar have a serial number stamped on the top of the headstock?  Best, oldwood

----------


## Cethera

Herea a link to photos of my Harwood parlor guitar, serial number

6 / 7263

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?...9282989&type=3

I bought this guitar from a friend in Paris.

----------

brunello97

----------


## brunello97

Another Harwood on the ebay.  And again no match for any of the other 17 in my files.

This one appears to be in pretty good shape.  SN 7668 w the Harwood / New York stamp on the back of the headstock.

Mick

----------


## delsbrother

Mick, I may have asked you this before, but do any of the instruments in your files match any of the Payne Music School photo instruments?

----------


## brunello97

> Mick, I may have asked you this before, but do any of the instruments in your files match any of the Payne Music School photo instruments?


I haven't really checked, but should do just that.  Here is another link to that photo on Gregg's site.  Unfortunately, a lot of the kids are holding the mandolins at odd side angles.  Was that part of the teaching method?

The differences between the Harwoods I have in my files are pretty subtle, but obvious: different headstocks, scratchplates, tuners, name stamps, purfling, bowl materials, bling. Sooner or later I'm going to come upon a match.  :Wink: 

Mick

----------


## hockeydave

Hello, I just this past week heard of Harwood guitars when a friend of mine was thinning his collection and on his list was an old parlor. It appears to be a Harwood however it seems to differ some from the descriptions in this thread and from your photos. I did locate the FBJ from the fall of 2011 and ordered it. I am looking forward to it's arrival soon so I can read the article. The serial number stamped on it is in the 35xxx range which is higher than any that have been mentioned in this thread.

Here are some pics.... Dave

[IMG][/IMG]





[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

[IMG][/IMG]

----------

brunello97

----------


## Bill Snyder

That is a good looking guitar. How does it play and sound?

----------


## hockeydave

Bill, It plays nice and sounds really good, especially when played with bare fingers. The strings are the same strings that were on it when the previous owner purchased it a number of years back. He said he never changed the strings because he liked the way it sounded with the old strings on it.

Dave

----------


## Gregg Miner

OK, gang: I did it: http://harpguitars.net/blog/2016/06/...afraid-to-ask/
As always, donations to our non-profit donation are welcome to ensure this material is available for future generations.

----------

brunello97, 

KanMando

----------


## oldwood

hockeydave, that is a good looking Harwood guitar - did your friend already sell it?   I have a Harwood that looks very similar to yours and also have a smaller Harwood parlor.  I think the serial number for your Harwood places its manufacture somewhere in the vicinity of 1920.  My Harwood serial number is 38,XXX and said to be around 1925.  If you get a copy of the FBJ article on Harwood you will see that one of the guitars in the photo also looks like the model above.   These really are fantastic instruments if you can get one in good shape.  I recommend stringing with lower tension silk and steel to avoid having the neck warp.   The action on my similar Harwood is higher than should be but playable and great sounding.  Cheers, oldwood

----------

brunello97

----------


## StevenWayne

Interesting topic. My mother worked for Jenkins Music in downtown KC when I was a kid. This would have been in 1966 and 67. I don't know exactly what she did. Office work though. I'll ask her. She's about to turn 77!
I still live in the greater KC area and have seen Harwood instruments from time to time. None lately.

Edit: I just called my mom because I was curious about what she did there. She was in the accounting department and also filled sheet music orders for schools.

----------

brunello97

----------


## hockeydave

Oldwood, Thanks for the input on the serial numbers and strings. I ended up buying the guitar so yes, my friend did sell it.

Dave

----------


## brunello97

In keeping with the Harwood "No Two Alike" theme here is a 12 string harp-bandurria.  It has the "NY" stamp on it but I'm not sure just what that tells us.  Muy weirdioso.

Mick

----------


## Jim Garber

> In keeping with the Harwood "No Two Alike" theme here is a 12 string harp-mandolin.  It has the "NY" stamp on it but I'm not sure just what that tells us.  Muy weirdioso.


"Harp Bandurria" I guess would be sort of closer or really short-scale 12 string guitar. The scale is 17.5 inches — closer to mandola.

----------


## brunello97

> "Harp Bandurria" I guess would be sort of closer or really short-scale 12 string guitar. The scale is 17.5 inches — closer to mandola.


Thanks, Jim!  I was talking to two students while typing in that note....blew the detail.  Just edited it for posteriority.

At least they made _one_ of them.  

The Jenkins catalog page describes the mandola as having mahogany ribs--which my Harwood mandolin also has.  Haven't seen this often.

Mick

----------


## brunello97

With this Harwood mandolin on the Ebay I may have seen the first pair of Harwoods that match.  Maybe-but for what looks like a metal SN plate on the end of the headstock.  In which case the very Butch Hancock "no two alike" streak continues.

Mick

----------


## brunello97

This quite plain Harwood mandolinetto keeps the streak alive.  
Note the Harwood-New York stamp on the inside.

Mick

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## gweetarpicker

Here is a link from Greg Miner's website with lots of history.  Also I have a 320 page 1928 Jenkins catalog...band and orchestra instruments, ukes, violins, drums, mandolins, guitars, banjos, etc.  Various brands including used instruments that were reconditioned in their shop.  

http://www.harpguitars.net/history/harwood/harwood.htm


www.vintagefrettedinstruments.com

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brunello97

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## brunello97

Thanks!  Check the thread out if you have a chance.  It was started some years ago by Robert Jenkins, scion of the Jenkins store family. 

Greg Miner's site has come up frequently for reference as well as a number of catalogs: '95, '24, '29, I think.  Not sure about '28 but I encourage you to check and see as yours could make a nice contribution.  It has been hard for me to keep track of all the Harwood mandolins because so many different variations show up.

Post some select catalog pages if you can.

Mick

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## KanMando

Bill Graham and I got to take a look at this large-body Harwood at Winfield back in September.  This guitar is the size of a Martin 000 and has mahogany back and sides.  Like the guitar pictured in post #253, this also has a paper label inside and "HARWOOD" inlaid on the headstock.  The visible serial number is 5470, but the owner says that using enhanced photography, he was able to make out that it's actually 35470, which conforms to the usual five digit number beginning with 3.   The bridge was replaced sometime in the distant past, but otherwise it's all original and playable.  It sounds nice and has plenty of volume.  That's Bill playing the guitar.

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brunello97

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## andrewbazeley

Hello from England! I recently bought an old Harwood at an auction here, and - after trying to research where and when it was made, became fascinated with the mystery attached to this brand. I even obtained from the USA (at great expense!) the Fretboard Journal no. 23, with Bob's article.

My little beauty is serial no. 20819, and my guess is that it was made around 1905. But I wonder if the stamps inside might be an aid to dating? I know that most models have the oval "Harwood New York" on the back of the headstock and on the inside back. But mine has the triangular "trade mark" stamp on the neck block. I wonder whether this carried on throughout the production, or whether it stopped at the end of the KC factory?

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brunello97

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## Nathan Johns

Look at my post about identifying my J.W. Jenkins and Sons bowlback mandolin.

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## brunello97

> Look at my post about identifying my J.W. Jenkins and Sons bowlback mandolin.


Here's a link to that post.

Mick

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## NursingDaBlues

On Craigslist in Denver. NFI.



https://denver.craigslist.org/msg/d/...542898954.html

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brunello97

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## Jim Garber

> On Craigslist in Denver. NFI.
> 
> 
> 
> https://denver.craigslist.org/msg/d/...542898954.html


It does seem to match the catalog page they posted but I did not see any identifying marks that said Harwood or even the small ivoroid marker that appears on fretboards. That bone bridge looks non-original. Could be a nice mandolin tho.

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## brunello97

Well, the catalog page include on the CL listing shows the "Harwood" name inlaid on the headstock, which the image lacks.
While very nice, the CL mando looks like it may well be a Regal, which were perhaps the makers of the mandolin in the Jenkins catalog as well

Mick

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## Jim Garber

I agree with you, Mick.

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## KanMando

Here's a photo that was just posted by John Lawson, the curator of the Old Town Kansas City 1850's - 1900's facebook group.  This is the Central High School (Kansas City, MO) Mandolin Club, 1902.  I can identify three Harwood mandolins and one Harwood guitar.  There may be others, but their logos are hidden.

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## NickR

Very nice photo- Edwardian charm and solidity personified in this group shot of young people and their teachers, I assume.

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## KanMando

Another find by John Lawson.  Here's a vintage photo from turn-of-the century Kansas City.  This is the Mascot Mandolin Club from 1902.

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brunello97

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## Noteworthy

I just stumbled across this interesting thread. I happen to have two 100 year old Jenkins catalogs...one from 1915-17 and the other from 1919-1920. If anyone here is interested in buying one or both, let me know. Will let them go for $210 each + shipping. Good condition and all intact. Not cheap admittedly but unusual, quite rare and did I say 100 years old!

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## pops1

> I just stumbled across this interesting thread. I happen to have two 100 year old Jenkins catalogs...one from 1915-17 and the other from 1919-1920. If anyone here is interested in buying one or both, let me know. Will let them go for $210 each + shipping. Good condition and all intact. Not cheap admittedly but unusual, quite rare and did I say 100 years old!


Might want to move this to the classifieds, not the place to sell things in the forums.

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## Hockey Puck

HI Noteworthy,

Does either catalog include Clifford guitars? I have a terz parlor guitar that was dated by someone to be from around 1895. I'm wondering if the Clifford brand was offered from 1915 - 1920.

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## Noteworthy

> HI Noteworthy,
> 
> Does either catalog include Clifford guitars? I have a terz parlor guitar that was dated by someone to be from around 1895. I'm wondering if the Clifford brand was offered from 1915 - 1920.


Yes both catalogs have Clifford brand guitars, the later one more so. Here's some pics:

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## Noteworthy

I'm sorry if I overstepped pops. Feel free to move them to the classifieds or just delete my post. Or is that something I have to do?

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## KanMando

Here's another photo from John Dawson's Old Town Kansas City Facebook page.  This is from Westport High School in Kansas City, MO circa 1905.

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brunello97

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## NickR

There is an identical harp guitar on ebay- right now, for sale- virtually unplayed it is reckoned. It is a Sears, Roebuck "Supertone"- a Harmony made instrument which was a company that Sears had just acquired. I have a Washington mandolin- it may feature in the catalogues- I estimate it is from the 1920s- a Regal made item which one might describe as "mutton dressed as lamb".

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## KanMando

A friend of mine here in Kansas City bought this photo from a vendor at the city market.  The caption appears to be Scandinavian or German.

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brunello97

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## NickR

Whoever wrote that needed to be told to write more clearly! As it is Kansas, I'm going to suggest it is German. If it was Minnesota I would say Swedish! I did once learn German and a bit of Swedish but with that scrawl, it is hard to tell!

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## Jim Garber

> A friend of mine here in Kansas City bought this photo from a vendor at the city market.  The caption appears to be Scandinavian or German.


It is Swedish and a quote from Psalms 150:6 — "Let everything that has breath praise the Lord."

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brunello97

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## ollaimh

> I just came across this Harwood Bandurria right before this thread started. Rather unusual... tho the mandolin craze in the late 19th century was ironically started by bandurria players, there were v ery few manufacturers of bandurrias in the US. I have seen one made by (or for) Lyon & Healy and now this Harwood. Vega stated on their labels that they made bandurrias but I have never seen one and some folks have surmised that they called their 10 string mandolin/mandolas bandurrias.
> 
> The bridge on that one is a little odd and is not original. Usually these bandurrias have a glued-on bridge (sim to a guitar) combo with the strings going thru top a tailpiece. You can see the outline of the original bridge on the top.


now that's really cool. i doubt i'd play it but that's a rare collectors item

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## Jim Garber

> now that's really cool. i doubt i'd play it but that's a rare collectors item


I have a recent one that I have been meaning to string as an octave 12-string guitar. You just reminded me that I had one. Thanks!

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## KanMando

I took a screen shot of this group from a YouTube video.  I don't have any information about them.

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brunello97

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## brunello97

> I took a screen shot of this group from a YouTube video.  I don't have any information about them.


Thanks! Muy coolioso.  Any information on the YouTube video itself?  What context was this image shown in?

Mick

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## Jim Garber

This *Harwood Lyre instrument* just showed up in the classifieds as sold by Bernunzio.

Here's *the page* on Bernunzio's site. A converted 12 string mandolin.




> Harwood was a brand name used by J.W. Jenkins Company, a Kansas City, MO musical instrument dealer and wholesaler. They introduced the Harwood brand in 1885, although they did not manufacture these instruments, and were likely made by Hayes in NY. We have seem a small number of Hardwood instruments, but never one like this; a converted 12 string mandolin-lyre into six string guitar. The unusually shaped body features two hollow horns on a mandolin sized body with 11" lower bout; back and sides are mahogany and the top is spruce; fully bound and trimmed with several spots of replaced binding and gap fill; original 12 string bridge, and later moveable rosewood bridge. The mahogany neck has a 19.5" scale length, and was originally setup as a 12 string mandolin; rosewood fingerboard with newer frets; Harwood plaque present at lower edge of fingerboard; instrument plays well as it underwent a neck reset at some point (shim under fingerboard, and notable repairs on side block exterior); gold plated plate tuners, and Hardwood stamps present on back of peghead.

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brunello97

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## brunello97

> This *Harwood Lyre instrument* just showed up in the classifieds as sold by Bernunzio.
> 
> Here's *the page* on Bernunzio's site. A converted 12 string mandolin.


Thanks, Jim.  One of these turned up back on post #260 with the attached Jenkins catalog page.
Fortunately, the one you've posted shows enough clear differences to keep the Harwood "No Two Alike" streak intact.

Mick

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## brunello97

For a moment, I thought we had finally broken the Harwood "no two alike" string with this one the ebay.

Turns out this is the same mandolin discussed on post #196 in this thread and originally shared on this thread some years back.

Appears to be in good, if somewhat worn condition and now offered with a nice hardshell case.

Mick

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## btrott

This image in post#290 I think is the Mystic Mandolin Club, Creston IA, 1896. I have some late 19th mandolin sheet music with this ensemble on the cover page. You can ee this image and several others from music I have in my collection in an earlier thread.

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## Rocky Dijohn

Jimi C


I think you have model 320. Here is the 1908 catalog description:

No. 320 Washington
Auditorium Size, Rich Dark Figured Mahogany, Highly Polished, Hardwood Neck Mahogany Finish, Selected White Spruce Front, Very Handsome Colored Wood Inlaid Strip in Back, Top, Edges and Sound Hole; Top, Bottom and Sound Hole Edges Bound with Celluloid; Ebony Bridge and Fingerboard; Large Pearl Position Dots; German Silver Frets; Strung with Wire Strings. Each $14.50

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## brunello97

It's been awhile, but, amazingly so, the Harwood "No Two Alike" streak continues with this one on the Ebay.


This has a nice engraved tuner plate cover, which apparently required to the serial number to be bumped up onto the headstock 'broken pediment'.  Very strange.

It's too bad that the neck has come out of alignment.  

Mick

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## brunello97

And yet another Harwood appears on the ebay.

This one with an all-mahogany ribbed bowl such was we were discussing earlier, which I think makes for a nice seamless look.  
The headstock lobes look rather clumsily executed.
The streak continues.

Mick

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## joliff@bellsouth.net

Hello brunello97, I am the gleeful winner of this mandolin.  It has the triangular trademark stamp inside on neck block. Five digit serial number on back of headstock above engraved tuner plate.  Am I safe in assuming this was manufactured in Jenkins' Kansas City factory?  Is it worthwhile to post pics of internal trademark stamp and serial number? Would that contribute to, or clutter up the Harwood information quest?

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## brunello97

Hi Joliff,

Congratulations on winning the Harwood at auction.

I think it would be great if you could post some more images of your instrument.
It would be a good contribution to this collection of material about Harwood instruments.

As you may have gleaned from the thread, I've yet to see two Harwood mandolins that were the same. 
So many variations and variables.
I'm not sure if I can be confident at all about which ones might have been made in KC or elsewhere.

As we have learned in the "Bowlbacks of Note" thread here, every scrap of information is useful and sometimes it might take a few years to 
really make a firm decision about something...only to have it change when new information arises.
But the MC is the best repository of such information contributed by folks like you!

We all look forward to seeing and hearing more about your Harwood mandolin.

Mick

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## harwood_kc

Hi all,

Last night I pulled my Harwood (Oct. 1886) mandolin out of the case and noticed broken strings. I removed the tailpiece cover and my heart sunk. 

The base plate (the part attached with three screws to the end) has two broken tabs where the strings hook. I was able to retrieve one tab, but cannot find the other. 

My question is: is it possible to fix the tailpiece base part that will allow continued use of the original parts?

I would guess this occurred due to some sort of fatigue and its age. Either way, I am hoping theres light at the end of the tunnel to bring this mandolin back to life. 

Examining the broken tabs, the base plate appears to be brass. If I seek a base plate that is period correct, it would not include the original stamped date. With the age of this mandolin (136 years old), would it be possible to repair the broken tabs? 

I am seeking insights or recommendations from this community. Hopefully this mandolin can make music once again. 

Thank you!

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## Denny Gies

I wonder if you can cut a small piece of brass that you can glue or screw into the wood.  I don't know how to draw one but.....______| then the hook on top of the vertical line.  Good luck..

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## NickR

You might cut new tabs where they are missing- they don't need to be very big- just long enough to hold the loop

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## Stereodawg

The Oct '86 is just the patent date stamped onto the tailpiece, so there would have been a lot of these around - it's possible you could run across a direct replacement.

I'm not recommending this (I jury rig my own stuff) but I'd just get a narrow strip of steel and crimp it with some pliers in a flat S configuration, loosen the right screw and slide one end up into the slot and hook the loop under the other end.

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## Richard500

The answer is yes, and there are several ways to do it, either yourself or with help. Since its covered, if it looks a little different, you might not mind.
If you live near a jeweler who does repairs….not all of them do, and ask for any brazed on pieces that a loop can hook over and take a 15 lb pull, he or she can gin up something. The plating on the brass is almost certainly nickel, and will be slightly damaged in a small area. You might get something that looks like a screw head.
Note that the mandolin may have been designed for lighter strings than you have now, and might be hurting in other places too.
A new base piece is possible, but your cover could be difficult to match, and many of us like to keep original hardware.

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## brunello97

Harwood_kc....I notice this is your first posting here at the Mandolin Cafe.

Does this suggest your Harwood hasn't been included in this lengthy thread?


If that is true, would you mind posting some photos of it...and naturally the tailpiece cover if you still have it.

You do realize, that in the many many Harwood mandolins posted in this thread we have yet to come across two that are exactly alike.
Always some variation somewhere.

Maybe yours can help keep the "No Two Alike" streak alive.


Mick

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## Jim Garber

As noted, the tailpiece was patented in 1886 and the mandolin would be dated later probably somewhere +/- 1900. As Mick noted, post some clear photos of the whole mandolin. At the very least replace the tailpiece base with a functioning one and keep the old stamped one in the case for nostalgia purposes. Unless you have a jeweler friend it may be more expensive than it’s worth to repair the existing one. Also what strings are you using? They should be very light not standard mandolin strings.

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## harwood_kc

> The Oct '86 is just the patent date stamped onto the tailpiece, so there would have been a lot of these around - it's possible you could run across a direct replacement.
> 
> I'm not recommending this (I jury rig my own stuff) but I'd just get a narrow strip of steel and crimp it with some pliers in a flat S configuration, loosen the right screw and slide one end up into the slot and hook the loop under the other end.



Thank you to everyone who offered helpful advice.. Your suggestions align with my instinct to create a workaround fix. 

If I decided to find a replacement, What sites would you search? eBay would be a good start. Any other recommendations would be appreciated. 

With creating a workaround fix, I am concerned about damaging the integrity of an antique. However it would be nice to play it again.. This is a family heirloom. I will take photos to share, along with what history was passed along.

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## harwood_kc

This Harwood mandolin, circa 1900, has become a family heirloom. My great-great grandfather was the first owner, who was talented musically and played many instruments. When the mandolin was given to me, my father included a document with research he had found about this mandolin, as well as the family history. 

This Harwood mandolin came from the J.W. Jenkins Music Company of Kansas City. The Harwood triangle trademark is on the neck block. On the back of the headstock, it is stamped Harwood, New York. The serial number is 17002.

Reviewing an old catalog photo from this thread, I believe this is a model No. 46. 

I recently posted about my dilemma with a pair of broken tabs. This has been repaired! I cut out a piece of thin-gauge nickel and used JB weld to epoxy the piece in place, and now the mandolin sings again.

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## brunello97

Good news on your Harwood!

Quick question....what gauge strings are you using?   In your photo they look pretty hefty.


All the bowlback mandolin players here strongly recommend using extra light strings:  .09-.32 maximum on these old instruments.

You can get them from GHS strings.

Your next to last picture shows the string height to be extraordinarily high, which might suggest too much tension on the strings or a neck that has already moved out of position.

These weren't designed to handle the heavier strings used on carved top Gibson mandolins or other contemporary mandolins.

Be very careful with how you string up your family heirloom.  You can unintentionally cause real damage.


Mick

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## harwood_kc

That’s great feedback. I had decided the light duty strings were not as light duty as I had hoped. Oddly enough, the GHS strings you recommended were in the mail. I will restring it and know they will be the better choice. Have you seen any other mandolins in the style of mine? I’ve enjoyed learning about the fascinating Harwood history.

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## brunello97

With checking first, I would say "No, I haven't seen another Harwood that look _exactly_ like this."

So, congratulations, again.  You've kept the Butch Hancock-inspired Harwood "No Two Alike" streak going in fine style.

_The bookmatched and figured staves
_The very flat and curiously shaped 'cowl' at the neck / bowl joint.
_The small, Martin-esque volute at the neck / headstock joint.

Other familiar Harwood features are here but another unique mix of details and design.

Yeah...good move on the strings.

You've got to go as light as you can with these mandolins.

When you wear out the GHS strings and your loving your Harwood, spend a bit more and put on a set of Dogal Calace Dolce strings.   Lightweight, beautiful sound, great on the fingers, last forwever.

You'll really enjoy how the Harwood sounds with them.


Mick

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