# General Mandolin Topics > Looking for Information About Mandolins >  Tell me about this banjo mandolin

## OzMando

This little banjo mando was lent to me by and elder gentleman at church.  He plays Bass and guitar but has had this mando since his mum passed it on to him.  He doesn't play (and I don't think he will watching him try to form guitar chords today, a bit sad really 'cause he loves bluegrass)  He knows nothing about it so I thought seeing as he's been kind enough to let me borrow it for a bit of fun that I'd try and find some information about it.  

So I'm interested in thoughts of maker, age, value etc.  
I don't expect anyone to know anything about the signatures on the head (is it called "head"  or "skin"?) but they do have a certain charm to them.
Enjoy!

 :Chicken:   :Mandosmiley:

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## allenhopkins

Guessing, mostly: from the construction and your location, I'd say English manufacture.  This immediately suggests Windsor, who made a ton of these, but the Windsors I've seen have had slotted headstocks, not solid like yours.  I tried some random Googling but didn't come up with one that looked like it.

You might try removing the resonator (does that metal fitting in the center of the back unscrew?) and see if there's any label inside it, or anything marked on the dowel stick.  The English banjo-mandolins I've seen generally had smaller heads (English terminology is "vellum"), like yours does; American instruments had larger bodies, closer to full-size banjos.

Many many of these built in the period 1890-1920, and lots of them are still around.  And a surprising number of them, and of banjo-ukuleles, have autographs on the head as well.  

Wish I could be of more help; I did look at a variety of banjos at the Pamela's Music website, where there's an "on-line museum" with dozens of English banjo pics.  You might spend a bit more time there than I did, and find a match.

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## OzMando

Thank you very much, I'll have a poke around and see what I can find.  And I'll check out that site too, very helpful thanks  :Smile:

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## mandroid

Came across this website from over there.. http://www.banjolin.co.uk/  about those,

maybe IT was sentenced to Transportation with its player.. so now it's there.

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## OzMando

Two things I don't understand from your post:
 "from over there.." 
and
"maybe IT was sentenced to Transportation with its player.. so now it's there."

sorry about that.

Also, I can't get the back off and cant see any sort of identifying mark.  And I haven't seen it anywhere on the net yet.  But that's ok.  Either I'll find it, someone will know, or I can at least tell him it's probably early 20thC English and possibly Windsor.  :Smile: 

Thanks for your interest guys.

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## epicentre

:Cool:   I had one of those, almost an identical twin, except:

Mine had a brass plate on the front of the headstock which said:
"Beare and Son
London England
&
Toronto Canada

It was not dated.

In order to get the back off, you have to take off the strings and loosen all those little nuts..........good luck.   I took mine apart and found.........nothing: :Frown: 

Quite British, and quite LOUD!  EH WOT!!

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## OzMando

Was the headstock the same shape ?

Thanks by the way  :Smile: 

And yes, very loud.

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## 8ch(pl)

If it is stamped British Made it will be a John Houghton and Sons.  They were probably the most prolific builder of these type of Mandolin Banjos.

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## allenhopkins

Well, here's a Houghton, and I'm not sure: different shaped headstock, six brackets instead of eight.  Could, of course, be a different model by the same manufacturer; other features are quite similar.

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## jeff mercer

Thats actually George Houghton & Sons, they usually have a gold G.H & S stamp on the headstock.

8, you were probably thinking of John Grey & Sons, another equally prolific UK banjo manufacturer ?

Funny thing is, here in Australia it's virtually impossible to walk into an antique store/junk shop and NOT find one of these  :Smile: !

The challenge is to find one with a straight neck, & even then the sound is kinda brash & penetrating..and,yes, LOUD !!

The one playable one I have (a G.H & S) is on permanent loan to a bluegrass mandolinist mate of mine. He likes to pull it out at jam sessions to torment the banjo player  :Laughing:

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## allenhopkins

Here's a John Grey; similar body, headstock's close but not exact...

Still sleuthing...

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## OzMando

But for the headstock and the tailpiece (I don't know how original it is) that could be it.  Same body design certainly and the neck looks to be about the same width, same inlays etc.  Thanks for all your help everyone.  :Smile:

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## thelawnranger

Ozmando, I have a very similar GH&S model 3000. In fact it looks identical in all respects apart from the gold embossing of the name on the headstock as discussed above. It has an 8 inch body. I have had it nearly 20 years and it played ok when last played. I wpould suggest yours is possibly made by the same manufacturer.

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## barney 59

Do those signatures mean anything in Australia? --Slim Dusky or members of Mucky Duck-- something like that?

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## jeff mercer

Barney,

Slim DUSKY ??

Mate, that is absolute sacriledge here in Australia. If you said that in a Queensland pub, you'd be out on your ear in 2 seconds flat !  :Frown: 

I played with Slim Dusty for 8 years until he sadly passed away in 2003, but he's basically still a household name in Oz.

Slims' wife Joy- one of the nicest people I've ever met in the music industry- wrote many of his best known songs, including "Lights on the Hill", which Del McCoury recorded a cover of.

Slim DUSKY ??.....tsk,tsk,tsk... :Smile:

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## OzMando

Slim Dusky indeed!  

Unfortunately I had to give this one back as I've now returned to Brissy.  But thanks all for your help.  I'll have to give the old bloke a call and let him know and see how he's doing.  

So cool how love of music and of an instrument can bring people together.

 :Grin:  :Coffee:

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## chafran

Yes I also have this banjo or is it a mandolin? not sure. I got this as an inheritance some years ago and decided to clean the attic and what pops up this music instrument in his case. Have a look at the photos and then please help. More info from internet on the John Grey badge says it is  "Post War" So how old is it.? Is it antique? What will be the cost for insurance or to cell.

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## 8ch(pl)

Please don't put it back in the Attic, that's the worst place to store anstringed instrument.  High summer temperatures, low winter ones.....bad for the instrument.

These don't have a lot of value, a couple of hundred dollars tops.  Yours is probably 1950s era, I think John Grey went out about '62 or so.

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## Pedrotheswift

> This little banjo mando was lent to me by and elder gentleman at church.  He plays Bass and guitar but has had this mando since his mum passed it on to him.  He doesn't play (and I don't think he will watching him try to form guitar chords today, a bit sad really 'cause he loves bluegrass)  He knows nothing about it so I thought seeing as he's been kind enough to let me borrow it for a bit of fun that I'd try and find some information about it.  
> 
> So I'm interested in thoughts of maker, age, value etc.  
> I don't expect anyone to know anything about the signatures on the head (is it called "head"  or "skin"?) but they do have a certain charm to them.
> Enjoy!


 I'm new here and no expert on banjos or mandolins but I do happen to have a banjo/mandolin which is identical to the one pictured. I believe it is  a George Haughton instrument manufactured in Birmingham England around 1920. Not a particularly valuable instrument. I had mine valued at between 80 to 100 pounds. Hope this info is of some use to you.

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## allenhopkins

> ...Hope this info is of some use to you.


May or may not be. since the last post on this thread was 4.5 years ago…

Nice to have Cafe´archives Google-accessible, but it creates a strange "time machine" quality sometimes.

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## journeybear

Well, since the door to this crypt creaked open just a bit, I'll put just my 2¢ in - not about these instruments' provenance or value as collectibles but their value as players.

I have one of these myself, or a similar one. I got it in a straight-up trade for my Vega Little Wonder. That was  a terrifyingly loud instrument, with a plastic head stretched over a full-size banjo frame. I was fond of saying it was utterly devoid of subtlety. It was useful for particular songs in my jug band's repertoire, and for most venues it was not necessary to mike it. But one day I saw this other one hanging on my luthier's wall, and with its smaller head made of real skin, it was quieter, warmer, and richly textured - at least more so than the Vega. It was a real joy to play, and at times I could get it to sound pretty pleasant. I hadn't thought this was possible with a banjolin.

Sadly, my joy was short-lived. After a couple of years the skin broke, and when I brought it into the shop, my luthier said it needed some work as well, and all told I was going to be set back upwards of $200. I left it with him and said I'd mull it over. That was probably more than twenty years ago, and I haven't seen it since.  I wasn't in the band any more and my motivation to put that kind of money into it was pretty low (I'd paid only $50 for the Vega to begin with.) I wouldn't mind having one in good working order, and if I did, it would be something like the ones pictured in this thread. They look like decent instruments, or could be if properly seen to. Don't let them suffer from neglect or fade away into apathy and oblivion.

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## allenhopkins

> Well, since the door to this crypt creaked open just a bit, I'll put just my 2¢ in - not about these instruments' provenance or value as collectibles but their value as players….I wouldn't mind having one in good working order, and if I did, it would be something like the ones pictured in this thread. They look like decent instruments, or could be if properly seen to. Don't let them suffer from neglect or fade away into apathy and oblivion.


And there are quite a few of them around, here and there, going for low prices.  If the mandolin-banjo doesn't say "Gibson," "Vega,"  "Paramount," "Bacon," or something similar, it's got low market potential.  And the small size of the "pot" means that there aren't pre-made heads to fit them, so heads need to be made from calfskin -- which used to be SOP, but is a less common procedure now.

I own a Vega Little Wonder, and also a "no-name" that was given to me, and which I enjoy because it's stamped with the name of a defunct Rochester music store.  I had a Renaissance brand head put on the "no-name," and it cut down the shrillness and made it sound more like animal skin -- more "plunky," less raucous.  If you find one of the small-head, often English/European make mandolin banjos, probably it won't cost more than the $200 you were quoted 20 years ago -- _not_ adjusted for inflation...

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journeybear

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