pyramid flat wound strings

[Mike Thomas]

Anyone have any experience with Pyramid Gold Pure Nickel Flat Wound Mandolin strings? I'm currently using Thomastick starks, but I'm curious about these.

Thanks,
MikeT

[John McGann]

Haven't tried the mando strings, but the electric guitar strings are a total revelation-they sound nothing like the dull, rubbery US made flatwounds- they have a great character on attack, and actually sustain not unlike roundwounds, but have that smooth feel; they also last forever between string changes without going dead (and again, they don't start dead like most flats)- now I'm curious!

[Phil Goodson]

Okay. I just stimulated the dadburn economy!
Will report later.

[Barb Friedland]

I'm intrigued too. I'd love to hear a review that compares these against the JazzMando flat wounds.

[Rob Gerety]

A little off topic perhaps - but I am new to mando (old acoustic guitar player). What is the attraction of flat wound strings? I remember them from my teenage years and electric guitar. How to they sound on a mando compared to normal wound strings? Is there a particular style or genre that they are best for or are they seen as general purpose strings? Should I give them a try?

[onassis]

Rob, flatwounds are generally considered more of a "jazz" string than a "grass" string. They have less cutting power and high treble overtones (at least IMHO) than roundwounds, and also less percieved volume, which is one reason you won't find many dedicated 'grassers playing them. On the plus side, they have a beautiful, "round" tone that's great for solo and small group stuff, and they're MUCH easier on the fingers! Great smooth feel. Hope this helps!

[Perry]

Slightly off topic.....

FYI The Pyramid regular (non flatwound strings) for electric guitar are absolutely fantastic as well

http://www.pyramidstrings.com/st-guitar1.html

[Barb Friedland]

Rob,
What Mitch says about flatwounds is fundamentally true. That said, I love 'em. I play in a band that does a variety of music including Bluegrass. For a long while, I used Elixer mediums then experimented with lights. Then I decided to try JazzMando flatwounds. The tonal difference is a revelation. What they may lack in banjo spanking ability they make up for in spades in tonal finesse and playability. In addition, I find that I can play faster on flatwounds. My take is that picks and strings are a relatively low cost way to experiment and grow musically. String choice (picks too) is highly subjective stuff. Find out what's best for you.

[Rob Gerety]

I'll give them a try - I doubt I'll ever be a hard core BG guy. In fact, I suspect I will mostly be playing Celtic - and who knows, maybe even some blues/jazz stuff. Sounds like these might be nice for Celtic - except for the volume issue when playing unplugged.

Just took a look on line - $38 for a single set. Yikes. Have to wait for my tax refund. I pay that for 5 sets of regular PB wound Curt Mangans which are great strings. Three sets and I'd have spent enough to buy the new pick up I'm looking at. How long do these things last?

[onassis]

Wow. $38 a set is as much as Thomastiks, which I had supposed wre the top o' the heap. Guess I won't be trying these out anytime soon!:grin:

Rob- If you want to try some less expensive flatwounds, Jazzmando JM 11's are about $14.95 a set. They've lasted me 2+ mos of pretty heavy playing, and even then it was the A course dying. Ted has put an extra set of A's in the last two sets I've gotten, so all I did was change the A's. I think they're well worth trying.

[Rob Gerety]

That $38 figure is for a set of Pyramids. No way I'm dropping that kind of coin on strings. But yes, $15 I can do. I'll order a set today and try them out.

[Mike Thomas]

Thanks for helping Obama with the economy, Phil! If these are any louder than the Thomastiks, I'll be helping too.
Looking forward to hearing your report,
Mike T

[Carolie]

I just put a set of Jazzmando JM11s on my mandolin. The sound is so crisp and clean. Easier to play than D'Addario J74s too.

I figure if I'm putting down several hundred or thousand dollars for an instrument, what's $38 for a set of strings? My next string change will be the Thomasteks. I'll probably try every light gauge string on the market before I'm done.

Carolyn

[Amandalyn]

I like the Labella Flatwounds MF20 with the wound A string- same maker as the Jazzmando JM11 sets, just has the wound A which is nice, There were some initial problems when they first came out with breakage, but I think they worked out the kinks.

[Mike Thomas]

that's right! When trying to stop string breakage, the first thing you need to do is get rid of the kinks!:)

Sorry, I couldn't resist,
MikeT

[mandroid]

Wound A may be OK if you get your volume from the pickup and amplification , if you are used to
laying into the strings with the picking force , they will break in a day or hour or 2.

Core wire is a tiny gage. wound A is for Pianissimo players.

[DerTiefster]

I'm a rank beginner, but on the strength of some things I've read about the Thomastik strings, I have ordered a set of the Mittels from a local guitar store. They're due in soon (they don't stock them, but I try to deal through local brick&mortar places where it's feasible to do so) and I'll get to hear the difference on my Breedlove KO mando. It's a recent purchase. Although the strings are looking a bit tarnished, the sound is still good, so I may keep the old strings another few weeks. But I'm looking forward enough to hearing the difference that I'll probably not try to squeeze the last bit of life out of the strings it came with. They're who knows how old, anyway.

To address one of the earlier questions about "why pick flatwounds?" I could mention my Dad's opinion of years ago that he didn't like the sound of fingers sliding across the round-wound strings. He used flatwound electric guitar strings on his Gibson archtop.

[Stephen Lind]

for me
different strings work differently on different instruments:grin:
i like Thomastik starks on my Shutt
and J74s on my Givens
Pyramid light roundwounds on my Jazzmaster and Thinline
Martin XP+ light on my Noble and my Sand
XP custom light on my Tippen
etc

i've got a set of the Thomastik mittles and the Pyramid gold middles for mandolin that i haven't tried yet
i'm thinking they might work on an old A

[Soupy1957]

What is the most common choice by players for the diameter of the G string?

I have found that there is quite a spread of choices of diameters available for that string and I'm not sure "why."

Please don't just say "personal preference" or "Genre".........I'm requesting specifics.

Thanks,

[dorenac]

Going back to the Pyramid flat wounds, I have two questions. Where can you buy them? And in a light gauge set, does anyone know what the string diameters are? I love Thomastiks on my Strad-o-lin but wouldn't mind a bit brighter sound with the smooth feel and without going back to phosphor and bronze. Also it might be interesting to try these on my Phoenix as well.

[Soupy1957]

http://www.pyramidstrings.com/st-guitar.html

[emitfo]

All of them or just Ray & Dave?:))

I could resist but chose not to!


that's right! When trying to stop string breakage, the first thing you need to do is get rid of the kinks!:)

Sorry, I couldn't resist,
MikeT

[Phil Goodson]

Okay guys. Reporting back.
Elderly got the Pyramid 532 strings to me within 48 hours of my ordering. Wow!
I got the "heavy" which is gauges: 11, 15, 22, 32. Link (http://elderly.com/accessories/items/P532.htm)

I put them on my Elliott which is light and plays much like a Phoenix (just for comparison).
At first, my D strings had a rattle on frets 1-5 which didn't make any sense. Even raising the bridge didn't help. Other strings were okay.
Being the patient person I am (not!), I hung up the mando for the night. This morning everything is perfect. Overnight miracle? Just new strings settling in, I suspect.

Anyway, the strings feel and play just like Thomastiks (which I had on this mando till 2 weeks ago when I wanted to try some EXPs).
The sound is definitely brighter to my ear than the TIs were at any time. It's not the very bright or metallic sound you hear with the usuals, J74s EXPs, etc. but brighter than TIs.
So right now, I like them a lot. We'll see how they wear. They will definitely need to sound good 3 months from now to justify the price. I'll try to remember to report back periodically.

[Phil Goodson]

Okay. 2 more days have passed. New report.
My D course of Pyramid heavies began rattling again.
Nothing I did helped, including putting paper under the string grooves in the nut, not raising the action at the bridge.

As an experiment to be sure the problem did not lie with my mandolin, I replaced the D course with some old TI's I had taken off and saved.
Rattle gone!!
It's interesting to compare adjacent strings: Pyramid G course and TI D course. The Pyramids feel much softer. Feels like lots less tension in the string and the string seems more flexible compared to the adjacent TI.

That might be the probem: the Pyramid D strings might have a wider vibratory range with a given energy input from the pick and therefore hit the frets easier.

Whatever. I'll play the Pyramid set with TI D course for a while, but I don't think I'll use Pyramids on THIS mandolin in the future.
Maybe I'll put the Pyramid D course on a different mando soon and see if the same problem occurs.

[Mike Thomas]

I don't think you mentioned it, but are you using the heavy guage Pyramid strings? Apparently they come in 3 flavors, like the Thomastiks. If you got the softer ones that could account for the buzz.

MikeT

[dorenac]

I believe the strings are the heavy seat, based on the gauges mentioned. I'd be curious to see what the tension rating is for the D's. TI mittels' D is 15.43lbs. It seems harder to find this information for the Pyramids, I guess due to their scarcity here in the USA. The metals used may be different, too, which might result in tension differences.

[Phil Goodson]

Okay. 2 more days have passed. New report.
My D course of Pyramid heavies began rattling again.
....

Pyramid heavies. I still think it's the extremely flexible nature of the strings. If the G strings aren't PERFECTLY tuned and great care taken, I get intonation problems 'cause I push down too hard when fretting and the soft strings bend out of tune easier.
I can push the Pyramid strings much closer to the wood of the fingerboard as compared to TIs.

[Mike Thomas]

I just sent a note to Pyramid regarding the string tensions. I'll forward any response.

[Phil Goodson]

The listing at Elderly lists the string tension at 7 kg (15.4 lbs).
The TI starks are 17.6 lbs.
So maybe 2.2 lbs makes that much difference, or maybe there really is a difference in the alloy or core that makes the stiffness different.

All I know is there's a difference in rattling of the D strings for me.

I think I'll have to remain a TI guy for expensive flatwounds. And JM11s for when I'm thrifty.

[Phil Goodson]

Just for reference:

[Phil Goodson]

Just a final follow up:

Today I found that the winding had worn through on one of the A strings.
Given the problems I've had with these Pyramids, I won't be buying any more.

[DerTiefster]

I don't think you mentioned it, but are you using the heavy guage Pyramid strings? Apparently they come in 3 flavors, like the Thomastiks. If you got the softer ones that could account for the buzz.

MikeTLike I mentioned above, I ordered flatwound Thomastik-Infeld Mittel strings. They're not Pyramid, the topic of the O.P., but I also got a treble string buzz. I traced it to a smaller diameter E string sitting lower in the nut and buzzing against the first fret. "Small difference," I may be hearing someone say, but when I raised the treble side of the bridge a bit, the buzz went away.

[mandobassman]

OK. I have been reading the comments about flatwound strings and I have to throw my 2 cents in. I have been using Thomastik heavy gauge for 15 years now, back when they were $18 a set (a bargain). Anyway, I play exclusively bluegrass and I disagree with the generalization that flatwounds are for Celtic or Jazz. While they are great for that I have known several players that use them for bluegrass. It all depends on your playing style, your mandolin and the volume of the other players in your band. I have a somewhat strong rhythm style, although my leads are not that forceful. I have a pretty loud mandolin (Breedlove Quartz OF), and play into a single condenser mike with the entire band. I have never had a problem being heard. Please don't tell newcomers that they are only for certain music styles and let people try them and make their own decisions. I have also tried the LaBella (from JazzMando) and did not like them as much as the Thomastik. Nowhere near as much volume and I had two strings break (I have never broken a Thomastik in 15 years). But once again, they may be fine for others. As far as the price is concerned, yes, Thomastiks are expensive, but I leave them on for nearly a year. $35 or so for a year is not too bad. Try that with roundwound strings. I love them and have found I hate the metallic brightness of bronze strings. I don't care how much they cost, I'll continue to use them.

PS...I haven't tried the Pyramid strings yet. I keep reading mixed reviews on them. Many people have not liked them but also some like them better than Thomastik. Since I love the Thomastiks and the cost is about the same, I see no need to switch.

[Brent Hutto]

I know this is an old thread but the chart giving tensions in the graphic, above, has an error. The D'Addario strings are based on a longer scale length than the others. The Pyramid tensions are calculated on 13" scale for some reason. The giveaway is that the plain steel 0.011" strings are lower tension in the Pyramid column than elsewhere.

[pickloser]

I put Pyramid Gold Heavies on my Phoenix right before Kaufman Kamp. I am loving these strings. Since Kamp, I've taken this mando to many jams, mostly bluegrass. I've gotten compliments on the mando's sound and looks. Except for those who tried it out, no one has noticed or commented about my using flatwounds.