View Full Version : Rogue Dye...
bongomuffindan
Nov-11-2012, 5:30am
Hi there, I have just finished my first sunburst on my first scratch build and am delighted with the result. I have, however, make a rookie error.. I did use the balloon and cardboard trick to prevent dye going through the apertures, however, it failed miserably. I can live with this, as it is my number 1, but was just wondering if there was a way to sort this out or at least make it less obvious. I used Fiebings leather dye diluted in alcohol. I have attached some photos to show the result and the extent of my mess-up...
Thanks as ever,
Dan
940789407994080
Paul Busman
Nov-11-2012, 7:24am
Dye the whole interior?
Nice job so far!
lenf12
Nov-11-2012, 9:43am
How about a great big, tastefully artistic label with your name and the build date?
Len B.
Clearwater, FL
sunburst
Nov-11-2012, 10:09am
That dye probably soaked through the back rather than interring through the holes.
When the back wood is thin, as in the recurve area of the back, and especially when the thin back is curly maple, dyes can soak all the way through the wood, especially dyes like leather dyes where the color is intense and the solvent (alcohol) soaks into wood readily. Sometimes we just have to live with this sort of thing. It is difficult to prevent and does no harm, other than offending our sensibilities if we decide it doesn't look good in there.
Altar
Nov-11-2012, 10:28am
Out of curiosity, why did it fail? did the balloon pop while you were finishing? Honestly, it's probably one of those things that will bother you to no end, but no one else will notice.
Pete Jenner
Nov-11-2012, 11:13am
That spatter pattern reminds me of the day I got my brand new guitar. My then girlfriends brother (a great guitar player) played it for hours at the local bowling club not realising he had cut his finger carpet laying earlier in the day. By the time I noticed, blood was everywhere. I was a bit annoyed at the time because it wasn't a cheap guitar by any means. When I got home I tried everything to remove the spattered blood to no avail.
9 years later, the blood has become part of the character of the guitar and I wouldn't remove it now even if I could.
Marty Jacobson
Nov-11-2012, 2:16pm
As John says, the dye has definitely soaked through the back plate, it has nothing to do with masking or closing up the ff-holes. One way to prevent it would be to apply a very thin seal coat of shellac, say 1 or 1/2 lb cut, to the interior of the plates before joining. Then you would have to knock the gloss back with the final sanding, but the shellac should stay in the pores and keep it from being as obvious. Conventional wisdom is to not apply finish to the interior of the instrument, as it is not necessary and it just adds mass. I think it would be negligible in this application, though.
bongomuffindan
Nov-11-2012, 6:22pm
Thanks for the responses - its good to know my method for keeping the dye out wasn't the problem. I can live with the stains. I've never heard of this or seen this before though, is it a common problem when using alcohol soluble dyes?
Just purely out of interest - if you were building for a customer and the dye came through like this, what would you do? Or do you takes steps like Marty describes to prevent this just in case? A question simply out of interest...
Thanks again to all.
Dan
Marty Jacobson
Nov-11-2012, 6:40pm
...is it a common problem when using alcohol soluble dyes?
It is for me. I've only used this method a couple times, though. I generally tint the finish (shellac or lacquer) because it's a different look and I prefer it.
sunburst
Nov-11-2012, 6:59pm
...is it a common problem when using alcohol soluble dyes?
...if you were building for a customer and the dye came through like this, what would you do?
1. Yes.
2. Deliver the mandolin & collect the money! ;)
Altar
Nov-12-2012, 12:15am
Just purely out of interest - if you were building for a customer and the dye came through like this, what would you do? Or do you takes steps like Marty describes to prevent this just in case? A question simply out of interest...
Dan
It would depend on who you are and who the mandolin is for. If you were a nice old man making an A style for a teenager on a budget, don't sweat it. If you were Bill Collings, and you were making a beautiful mandolin for a distinguished player, you would burn the thing and start over.
Pete Jenner
Nov-12-2012, 4:52am
I'd burn Bill Collings and steal the mandolin - but that's just me.
Personally, I'd enslave him and have him make me stringed beauties all day long.
Marty Jacobson
Nov-12-2012, 6:50pm
Whoa.
It got weird, didn't it?
Altar
Nov-12-2012, 10:07pm
Nah, it just got normal.
By the way, BM, I love that mando. Pm me a general price point for one? If you would possibly want to start making them for others.
bongomuffindan
Nov-13-2012, 3:32am
Altar, you're too kind...
Altar
Nov-13-2012, 10:16am
Whoa.
It got weird, didn't it?
Kidding.