Hi all, I'm new here! Been playing with my Mandolin for about three months, I'm almost through "Alfred's teach yourself the Mandolin" and I'm really trying to focus on technique now before I move on to anything else. I can't figure out how to get my right hand comfortable and consistent. I'm really worried about tension, so I hold it very loose, but then the pick seems to wander around with a mind of its own. Nonetheless I can usually hit notes pretty well, but it becomes a problem when I start trying to get into Tremolo. The string seems to become a barrier and block the pick from moving up and down nicely and producing a pleasant sound. When I try to be extra careful not to tense up (and I'm not trying to tremolo very fast) then instead just nothing happens. The music simply stops. It's so awful. On top of that, I can't figure out the proper posture for my right arm. I've watched many videos and I try to keep it relaxed and I lightly rest my wrist on the top of the bridge but I'm trying to transition into floating over the bridge, but when I do that my wrist begins to get tired and ache. I don't want to ruin my right hand or start ingraining bad habits, so I'm not quite sure what to do. I wish I could afford an instructor! Any ideas?
First of all, LL, welcome to Mandolin Cafe and to the Newbies group. Second of all, you mention videos, so I hope you have found Baron Collins-Hill, Mike Marshall, Brad Laird, Pete Martin, Banjo Ben, and many others who have either totally free lesson videos or at least free sample videos. There is some great stuff out there. My overall favorite is Baron C-H at http://www.mandolessons.com/lessons/all-lessons/ . I think I know the problem you are describing and it is something that I have worked to overcome, or at least make less troublesome. There seem to be three things that have helped me. One would be angle of the pick with relation to the strings as the stroke is made. If the pick is flat against the string (ie, parallel to the string), there is a tendency for it to get hung up. To me it feels like I am sort of tripping over the string instead of brushing through it. So there has to be a slight angle of the pick. You can angle the pick consciously but most folks get the angle by holding the mandolin so the neck is angled a bit up from the floor. That way when you pick down, you are actually going at an angle to the strings. You can over-do the angle thing though. Too much angle and you lose the 'attack' sound. You get a kind of brushy, swishy sound. But a little bit of angle lets you get the pick through the string with minimum resistance while still getting the plucking sound. Second, you want to use just the tiniest bit of the tip of the pick. Play around with seeing how close you can come to missing the string but still get a nice tone. I have gradually adjusted my grip on the pick to the point where only less than a quarter of an inch (4-5mm?) is exposed - that's plenty and it has the additional advantage helping prevent the pick from rotating in your fingers. Third, and maybe most important to me, and which I work hard on trying to do right, is do NOT 'pluck' the string. The act of 'plucking', to me anyway, involves a digging wrist twisty motion that gets the pick almost under string and then plucks out away from the body of the mandolin. I want to brush down through the strings on the beat and up through the strings on the off beat with the pick at exactly the same angle on both strokes. The loose grip I use will let the pick 'flop' slightly as I go through the string, but I really work hard at having that pick the same attack angle with both down and up strokes. That plucking motion basically insures that you will 'trip' on the strings and also will make it harder play faster. I am sure there are more tips, but these are three that come to mind based on my own weaknesses.
Welcome to the zoo, Lemonylobster. I will toss out a couple of thoughts and suggestions also, for you to consider. Be aware that we all have had similar difficulties in the beginning. 1. Generally speaking, mandolin picks are fussy and cantankerous to control. This is where all that beautiful sound begins. Try a heavier pick, say 1.0 or so. Think fender heavy. Some folks find picks with small holes drilled in them or serrated finish. I just use a razor knife and scratch a cross hatch pattern in the area where my fingers are holding the pick. This prevents the pick from moving around or leaving my grip completely. Many people experiment with different picks constantly. 2. Try to get a smooth down stroke followed by just as smooth up stroke on the strings. Practice this with a metronome both on open strings and while fretting notes. Play as slowly as need to, so you can see and hear when things get sideways. How slow? Perhaps 50 -60 bpm. The goal is a very smooth down up, down up with the pick gliding across the strings. Or as Henry said "brush" through the strings. Working on the techniques up to a speed of say 120 bpm or so will have you jumping to tremolo quickly. Also Henry mentioned the tip of the pick. We call that digging in when we end up with a quarter inch of pick below the strings. Bad form sir! 3. As for your right arm, I am going to admit that I lightly rest my hand, on the bridge. Depending on where I am striking the strings with my pick (sweet spot) the bridge is touching the fleshy part of the thumb down towards the wrist. I have the neck of the mandolin pointed out away from my body at about 45 degrees and also the neck is tilted up some. 4. After you have watched multiple videos and listened to plenty of advice, you will find a position to be comfortable while playing. After all, we have unique body shapes and sizes. If it causes undue pain, change the position.
2-cents worth of advice from a 2-cent mandolin player: First and foremost - relax. The 'problems' that you are encountering are the same problems that almost all of us have had to deal with as well . . . they are perfectly natural, and given a little more time, you will begin to see significant improvement. Choice of pick is a very personal matter. If possible, go to a music store, or talk to other players, and try out as many different styles and thicknesses as you can. Try small picks, large picks, picks with grips, picks with holes - anything and everything possible until you find one that you are comfortable with. In the meantime, there are a couple of little 'tricks' that you can do to help your grip, such as putting a small bit of some sticky substance on your thumb and index finger; glue a small piece of sandpaper to the pick; try putting deep scratches onto a pick for a better grip surface, etc. Use your imagination until you come up with a workable solution. Technique is also just as personal as pick selection. Just because some video instructor says to do this or that, does not mean that it is the only way to do it. Get as much advice as you can, try them all, and then push on with whatever works best for YOU. Think about it - some of the best and most respected players in the world, (on any instrument), achieved their fame and notoriety because they came up with styles and techniques that nobody had ever done before. If everybody strictly played according to video instructors, we would have a very monotonous selection of mandolin players to listen to. Start slow, be patient, listen, learn, experiment, and enjoy!
Thank you all for your sage wisdom, it is much appreciated! I feel better knowing this is all just a normal part of learning the instrument. I think I have been "digging in" just a bit too much without realizing it. I do have picks with holes in them but it doesn't seem to fix the roaming pick problem. I think I just need to find the right way to hold it to prevent it from moving yet still have a lot of flop. I've also tried a few different ones. Unfortunately the one I like best is also the one that roams the most! Hopefully my hand/arm will just catch up with the mind eventually and work how it should. I read this really interesting piece about mindfulness in practicing and accepting that while you may learn quickly on an intellectual level your fingers, wrists, arms et cetera simply take longer to get up to speed because they have to build muscle memory, and that inevitably takes time and cannot be rushed. http://www.singingwood.com/Frustration.html Thank you for the kind welcomes as well.
LemonyLobster: First of all, pat yourself on the back for taking up a new instrument. Learning a new instrument from scratch is like learning a new foreign language. It's tough stuff! I'm learning the mandolin too but I have 40 plus years of guitar playing to draw from. Let me add my two cents: 1. All of the above comments are excellent and worth trying. 2. Relax. You'll find find what works and what doesn't over time. Keep on playing and try different things. 3. Get out and play with other musicians!!! No one will ever get good playing by themselves alone in a room. This is the number one thing I tell young musicians. Besides, it's so much more fun playing with others anyway. You'll be amazed at how fast you can learn by hanging out with like-minded musicians. 4. Lastly, "feel" the song in your head and let the song's rhythm and tempo help guide your right hand motion. Technique will be mastered in time. Be patient and enjoy the learning process. Your success will come in many small steps. Have fun!
