Ray Jackson -- Lindisfarne and Rod Stewart

I've enjoyed Bill Graham's article on Ray Jackson and his mandolin solo in Rod Stewart's Maggie May -- he's a player I have a lot of time for. I would, however, bridle a little bit at the sentiment that Ray Jackson is an obscure name, and bridle a lot at the sentiment that Lindisfarne were an obscure band in 1971. That may be true in the US, but in the UK, Lindisfarne were a very popular band in the early 1970s, and are still widely known to mainstream listeneners mostly through the association of their 1971 song "Fog On The Tyne" with the band's home city Newcastle-upon-Tyne.

Indeed, one could even argue that when he went into the studio in 1971 to record the Maggie May lick, Ray Jackson was a higher-profile musician than Rod Stewart himself -- Stewart had two previous solo albums, the first of which failed to chart and the second (Gasoline Alley) reached No. 62 in the UK charts, and one album with the Faces, peaking at No. 45. None of his solo or band singles had charted at all. By comparison, Lindisfarne's 1970 debut album "Nicely Out Of Tune" had reached No. 8, and Jackson was joint front man/lead singer of that band (along with Alan Hull).

It was Maggie May itself (and the album it came from) that made Rod Stewart an international superstar in 1971, but even then his fame didn't necessarily outshine Ray Jackson's during that year: Lindisfarne's second album "Fog On The Tyne", released a few months later, reached No. 1 in the charts, and they had two major hit singles in 71/72: "Meet Me On the Corner" (No. 5 in the UK singles charts) had lead vocals by Jackson and "Lady Eleanor" (No. 3) had a very tasty mandolin riff by him.

Both of those first two Lindisfarne albums are highly recommended for fans of good folk/rock, and Lady Eleanor in particular is a truly great song with a truly great mandolin part.

A few Lindisfarne/Ray Jackson links:

Lindisfarne Wikipedia page

Lady Eleanor on Youtube, recorded in 1978, lead vocals by Alan Hull with Jackson playing what looks like a Harmony Batwing mando.

Meet Me On The Corner on Youtube, recorded in 1971, with Jackson on lead vocals and harmonic (no mando).

Lady Eleanor, recorded in 2007 by The Gathering, with Jackson on both mando and lead vocals (still that Batwing -- he has now switched to an Ovation). Also note Jerry Donahue on lead guitar; one of my favourite musicians!

Martin

PS: That Columbus acoustic/electric mando mentioned in Bill's article as being the Maggie May mando can also be seen on Youtube here, on "Fog On The Tyne" recorded in 1971. However, it's being played by Simon Cowe rather than Ray Jackson -- Jackson just sings and plays harmonica.

I got their first three albums Nicely Out Of Tune, Fog On The Tyne and Dingly Dell by the original Lindisfarne lineup when they came out. Then the band split in three, with a revamped Lindisfarne (w/Jackson) and Jack The Lad, and Alan Hull going solo.

Jackson's playing was "right" for those Rod Stewart songs. Actually, I find that a lot of the stuff by the Brit players (Swarbrick, Martin Jenkins, Irvine, Woods, Knight etc.) really holds up musically far more than "look at me" mandoflash. Actually, it's one of the same reasons I ultimately prefer Albert Lee's mando playing on the Emmylou records over Ricky's.

BTW, Jenkins was a really excellent player. Get hld of one of those reissues with all two or three Dandoshaft allbums on one disc. 1st class (non-chop) accompaniments behind the vocals in addition to the lead work. (Anybody have the Hedgehog Pie album(s), his post Dandoshaft outfit?)

Niles H

Here is a neat interview of Ray

http://www.lindisfarne.de/interviews/ivrj0403.htm

An undertaker who undertakes to be your friend... classic Jackson.

I preferred Rod Stewart when he was with Jeff Beck. I still have the Truth vinyl album...

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Originally Posted by martinjonas

That may be true in the US, but in the UK, Lindisfarne were a very popular band in the early 1970s, and are still widely known to mainstream listeneners mostly through the association of their 1971 song "Fog On The Tyne" with the band's home city Newcastle-upon-Tyne.

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Let's just hope they've forgotten Gazza's version

At least we've still got the original!
"Presently we have a pint or two together, everybody do their thing" indeed!

Totally agreed that Lindisfarne was not an obscure band in those days. I was also surprised to read that line. Thanks for reminding folks of how successful they were back then. My one time jamming with Ray in a pub south of Reading with some of the bluegrass folks from that area, Richard Holland, Gary, et al.. was real fun.

I never looked into the Lindisfarne stuff. Now I'm curious to check it out. I'll have to see what's availiable.
On the unknown British mandolin players question, who plays the Mandolin part on the Stones tune "Factory Girl" on "Beggars Banquet"?
I'm w/ Claughaum on Stewart w/ Beck. I should still have "Truth" on vinyl also. I did see that band in Chicago many years back. I thought they were great (Beck,Stewart,Wood & the second drummer who in the words of "Rod The Mod" name slips my mind) I thought they were fun,& had a sense of humor. They didn't take themselves too seriously,like "We're heavy badd-### cats" ala Zepplin.
I did like parts of Rod's 1st LP, & "Gasoline Alley".
But this was all just a long time ago.

My favourite track from Rod's "Every Picture Tells a Story" is Tim Hardin's " Reason to Believe".

On the unknown British mandolin players question, who plays the Mandolin part on the Stones tune "Factory Girl" on "Beggars Banquet"?

I'm pretty sure it was Ry Cooder. Keith was sending a lot of time in Southern California back in those days.

You can find the Hedgehog Pie albums here:- http://time-has-told-me.blogspot.com...q=Hedgehog+Pie
Tosh

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Originally Posted by Eddie Sheehy

My favourite track from Rod's "Every Picture Tells a Story" is Tim Hardin's "Reason to Believe".

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Just wanted to mention that " Reason to Believe" was the A side of the single. Some DJ turned it over and played the B side, "Maggie May," and whammo - monster hit, the biggest ever featuring a mandolin. Thank you, kind stranger. :mandosmiley:

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Originally Posted by Dan Eaton

On the unknown British mandolin players question, who plays the Mandolin part on the Stones tune "Factory Girl" on "Beggars Banquet"?

I'm pretty sure it was Ry Cooder. Keith was sending a lot of time in Southern California back in those days.

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Yes, I would think so. Ry was hanging out with The Stones a lot at the time, and there was even some talk of him joining them. He also played mandolin on "Love In Vain," which I believe is the first time I heard mandolin on a rock record. He played slide on a few of their songs in that period, too.

Hold on a second! A quick peek at the wiki gives a credit to Dave Mason: mellotron (mandolin setting) on "Factory Girl." Huh! And the fiddle credit is for Ric Grech, bass player in Family and then, more famously, Blind Faith. So Ry gets to keep the credit I mentioned. And we all live and learn, a little. ;)

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Originally Posted by mandopops

. . . I should still have "Truth" on vinyl also. I did see that band in Chicago many years back. I thought they were great (Beck,Stewart,Wood & the second drummer who in the words of "Rod The Mod" name slips my mind) I thought they were fun,& had a sense of humor. They didn't take themselves too seriously,like "We're heavy badd-### cats" ala Zepplin.
I did like parts of Rod's 1st LP, & "Gasoline Alley".
But this was all just a long time ago.

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Me too, I saw The Jeff Beck Group as opening act for Big Brother and the Holding Company (w/Janis). Not a bad show for the first concert I ever attended.

I don't remember two drummers though. Was Mick Waller the drummer?

Agreed, Beck has never taken himself too seriously. Sometimes not seriously enough. Considering the enormity of his talent, he hasn't made that many good records . . . sigh . . .

Hmmm ... Any chance that was summer of 1969? I didn't go to Woodstock, but I did go to Newport Jazz Festival, a couple of weeks before, and they had opened up the roster to include rock bands. The Friday night show was spectacular - Blood Sweat and Tears, Ten Years After, Jeff Beck Group (Rod Stewart, Ron Wood on bass, and someone other than Mickey Waller :( on drums - my research indicates Tony Newman, unknown to me), Jethro Tull, and, best on this night, Rahsaan Roland Kirk, who blew rhe roof off the place - and it was outside! Led Zeppelin was on Sunday night. I'm not sure why I didn't go on Saturday - maybe because it was a 35 mile hitchhike each way - so I missed The Mothers Of Invention, Sly And The Family Stone, Miles Davis, and Stephane Grappelli. Oh well! Even so, that Friday night show was one of the best I've ever experienced.

Well, I guess it was October 20, 1968. Very pleasantly surprised to find this article on the venue and its history:

http://www.localkicks.com/local_styl...rs-rod-stewart

Ah, so ... I was assuming you were in Boston at the time, Now, yes, but then ... Very cool. Not sure where they came up with the image of the poster for an article bout how they can't find a poster. :confused:

Back around the same time there was a series of concerts at a place called Woolsey Hall on the Yale campus. This was a grand venue with an enormous pipe organ, hardwood floor stage, and ceiling with the images of all the nine Muses ensconced in full color. Very old school. The bands were members of the pantheon of rock - Hendrix, Cream, Janis Joplin, Moby Grape, Donovan, Steppenwolf, and other lesser-known but good acts like Terry Reid. I saw all pf those performers, (except Janis :( ), plus a few others that are slipping my mind, and even got to talk with Jimi briefly, as related here.

I know I'm off on a tangent here, but my point is that there were some venues then that were pressed into service by concert promoters looking for good matches among the factors involved - size vs draw, acoustics, availability, etc - and thank goodness things worked out as much as they did. As time went on venues were reconditioned or even built to accommodate the burgeoning interest in rock shows, but at the moment things were sometimes a little off. I saw Jefferson Airplane at the U of New Haven gym (for goodness' sake!) a couple months after Woodstock, for $3. :disbelief: I saw Cream the next time they came through at The Arena, a boxing venue - where The Doors played when Jim Morrison got arrested.

At any rate, it doesn't matter where or when or how you get to see someone play, as long as you get to have the experience. In doing research over that Newport show over the years, I've found the program, the newspaper ad, a ticket stub, set lists, lineups, and even the availability of tapes. As much as I'm curious to hear what the shows sounded like, even on what were probably pretty low quality recordings, I'm hesitant to mess with my somewhat foggy memories. Was the music really all that great? It was to me, at the time. It really made an impact.

Very cool story about meeting Hendrix.

While we're woolgathering (and speaking of Terry Reid), and just to show how times have changed, I saw the Stones in 1969 at Baltimore Civic Center. First opening act was Terry Reid. Second opening act was B.B. King. Ticket price -- $7.50.

I had a friend who bought two tickets, certain he get a date to see The Rolling Stones. Well, he couldn't, and I bought his $7.50 ticket off him for $5.00.

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Originally Posted by journeybear

. . . As much as I'm curious to hear what the shows sounded like, even on what were probably pretty low quality recordings, I'm hesitant to mess with my somewhat foggy memories. Was the music really all that great? It was to me, at the time. It really made an impact.

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I agree, don't go there, just savor the memory. In the same way as you might not wanna look up your high school girlfriend on Facebook . . .

I was lucky enough to have managed to catch two of Lindisfarne’s Christmas concerts, one in Newcastle, one in Nottingham. In Nottingham, the management were doing their darndest to try to keep everyone seated but by the third song had to admit defeat and accept that this was a party and not just a concert. This should have been obvious to them if they had known the group and also that everyone was given a party hat on entry 🥳

As a newbie to the forum, could I ask if anyone has the tab for the mandolin piece on Lady Eleanor please, the search didn’t produce anything but did lead me here?

My first ever concert was headlined by Lindisfarne, with support from Genesis and Rab Noakes- it was 1972 and Lindisfarne were absolutely massive. After all, that year, Bob Johnston, no less, produced two albums for them. In 1971, I bought a compilation of their music from a classmate at school- there is a photo of Ray Jackson playing that Japanese electric mandolin of his in the book- a Kay knock off. He played it quite a bit at the concert I saw.

Back then we would try to get a concert in most weekends, if there wasn’t anything of interest in Middlesbrough, we would head up to Newcastle or the Coatham bowl in Redcar, we thought nothing of traveling to Leeds or Sheffield and all of this done in scrappy old motors that broke down more often than they drove.
Halcyon days...

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Originally Posted by Dan Eaton

On the unknown British mandolin players question, who plays the Mandolin part on the Stones tune "Factory Girl" on "Beggars Banquet"?

I'm pretty sure it was Ry Cooder. Keith was sending a lot of time in Southern California back in those days.

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Originally Posted by journeybear

Yes, I would think so. Ry was hanging out with The Stones a lot at the time, and there was even some talk of him joining them. He also played mandolin on "Love In Vain," which I believe is the first time I heard mandolin on a rock record. He played slide on a few of their songs in that period, too.

Hold on a second! A quick peek at the wiki gives a credit to Dave Mason: mellotron (mandolin setting) on "Factory Girl." Huh! And the fiddle credit is for Ric Grech, bass player in Family and then, more famously, Blind Faith. So Ry gets to keep the credit I mentioned. And we all live and learn, a little. ;)

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Since this thread got bumped, I took a spin through it, and something caught my eye. Followed the above link to the wiki, and found it's been updated to credit that mellotron (sans "mandolin setting") to Nicky Hopkins. Makes more sense. Just trying to keep the record straight. ;)

In answer to the burning question that led to this thread's Lazarus-like new life: sorry, no idea. But welcome to the Café! :mandosmiley: