For those to whom anecdotes are... well, anecdotes...
https://newt.phys.unsw.edu.au/jw/powerhousetwins.html
https://www.pnas.org/content/114/21/5395
For those to whom anecdotes are... well, anecdotes...
https://newt.phys.unsw.edu.au/jw/powerhousetwins.html
https://www.pnas.org/content/114/21/5395
John Hamlett
www.hamlettinstruments.com
Jim
My Stream on Soundcloud
19th Century Tunes
Playing lately:
1924 Gibson A4 - 2018 Campanella A-5 - 2007 Brentrup A4C - 1915 Frank Merwin Ashley violin - Huss & Dalton DS - 1923 Gibson A2 black snakehead - '83 Flatiron A5-2 - 1939 Gibson L-00 - 1936 Epiphone Deluxe - 1928 Gibson L-5 - ca. 1890s Fairbanks Senator Banjo - ca. 1923 Vega Style M tenor banjo - ca. 1920 Weymann Style 25 Mandolin-Banjo - National RM-1
All of my mandolins open up with new strings. When the old strings start to fall asleep, I change picks to a spare one of my 153 different picks. It’s just amazing.
And I’m sure my hearing improved during my many years of running power machinery too. Routing is the new meditation.
Not all the clams are at the beach
Arrow Manouche
Arrow Jazzbo
Arrow G
Clark 2 point
Gibson F5L
Gibson A-4
Ratliff CountryBoy A
Dunno, I have been working for a long time on being a curmudgeon. Mostly, I think it's just natural crankiness. At least so says my loving and long-suffering (because of me) spouse.
I fall into the "maybe instruments change subtly, but so does my memory of what they used to sound like" camp. Not to mention the effect of temperature, humidity, type and age of strings, action, room acoustics, and on and on. I do agree with Jim that buying an instrument in the hope that it will turn into one that I like is not in my makeup.
Now, excuse me, I need to practice yelling "You kids get off my lawn!"
Kit
Guitars, Mandos, Violins, Dulcimers, Cats
I did ask once here years ago if instruments 'close down'. And I was told they do. And I think it is possible that keeping instruments in cases and not playing them might 'stiffen' them, or at least compromise their resonance. So I guess, and I'm just guessing, that a well played instrument might 'loosen' through vibration. I also think you do get better, and get to know your instrument. However, I'm not going to doubt those who say that their instrument got better.
JBovier ELS; Epiphone MM-50 VN; Epiphone MM-40L; Gretsch New Yorker G9310; Washburn M1SDLB;
Fender Nashville Deluxe Telecaster; Squier Modified Vintage Cabronita Telecaster; Gretsch 5420T; Fender Tim Armstrong Hellcat: Washburn Banjo B9; Ibanez RB 5string; Ibanez RB 4 string bass
Pedalboard for ELS: Morley Cry baby Miniwah - Tuner - EHX Soul Food Overdrive - EHX Memory Toy analog Delay
Fender Blues Jr Tweed; Fender Greta;
If I luck out, I will reach the big eighty this fall and I have noticed in the last couple of years that my mandolins sound worse. Its an obvious case of breaking out or closing up after decades of thrashing.
-Newtonamic
Not all the clams are at the beach
Arrow Manouche
Arrow Jazzbo
Arrow G
Clark 2 point
Gibson F5L
Gibson A-4
Ratliff CountryBoy A
Jim
My Stream on Soundcloud
19th Century Tunes
Playing lately:
1924 Gibson A4 - 2018 Campanella A-5 - 2007 Brentrup A4C - 1915 Frank Merwin Ashley violin - Huss & Dalton DS - 1923 Gibson A2 black snakehead - '83 Flatiron A5-2 - 1939 Gibson L-00 - 1936 Epiphone Deluxe - 1928 Gibson L-5 - ca. 1890s Fairbanks Senator Banjo - ca. 1923 Vega Style M tenor banjo - ca. 1920 Weymann Style 25 Mandolin-Banjo - National RM-1
Kit
Guitars, Mandos, Violins, Dulcimers, Cats
I remember playing a Loar, that had been in a vault for a number of years. The maker who owned it proudly handed it to me to try. Here was the acme of mandolin making in my hands. Hit those strings and... dead. I mean the Loar sounded like a block of wood. Since this builder went to great effort to bring me this Loar, I tried a number of tunes and styles... dead. I handed it back to the builder and with no guile told him that I preferred his new instruments to the Loar.
Tony Huber
1930 Martin Style C #14783
2011 Mowry GOM
2013 Hester F4 #31
2014 Ellis F5 #322
2017 Nyberg Mandola #172
There is no way I would buy a musical instrument with high hopes that the sound will improve as time goes on.
2021 The Loar LM700 VS
PS -
From the cafe classifieds, following up on post #20, here's an example of a torrefied top: https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/152246#152246
I'll bet that's true. Something else: The sound of resonator mandos and guitars doesn't improve with age. They fail mechanically. So I've bought a couple of used reso guitars for low prices, just because, unless they're desirable for other reasons, they don't appreciate the way flattops and carved tops do.
If you look at the classifieds at www.resohangout.com, you'll see what I mean.
Over time, you will open up to your mandolin.
Or you might sell it.
Girouard Custom Studio A Oval
P.W. Crump OM-III
If torrefaction dehydrates wood and modifies instrument tone, wouldn't extended periods of storage in low humidity alter the sound? Once played a small 1850's Martin guitar that was astounding light weight and had an unexpected big voice.
Although it is only a relatively small subset of mandolins produced, an instrument with an oil-based varnish will take two or three years to “dry,” and the sound on a well-made mandolin will improve as the varnish dries.
Doug Brock
2018 Kimble 2 point (#259), Eastman MD315, Eastman MDA315, some guitars, banjos, and fiddles
Torrefication occurs prior to putting the instrument together, so the wood is theoretically ‘Drier” but more stable when assembled. Unless you’re Frank Wakefileld, storing your already assembled instrument in low humidity and/or higher heat is likely to result in top and possibly back cracks, failed, braces, joints, etc, as the wood contracts to different degrees from one another...
Frank got really lucky, IMO...
Chuck
Well... do forty year old D18 Martins sound like brand new D18's? What I am curious about is how good will a new Gilchrist or Nugget sound in ninety years. Yeah time and playing changes the tone of a wood instrument. So.... call it what you will. Yes technique makes the largest tonal impact. And then there is everything else that all adds up to make a difference. Soooo … Play on . R/
I love hanging out with mandolin nerds . . . . . Thanks peeps ...
I think Charlie's observations sum it up pretty well. Is the mando finished with nitrocellulose lacquer? If so, then the sound definitely will change over time. Nitro consolidates and gradually becomes one with the wood. On my new builds, the first three months see the most drastic change. At about three years things seem to plateau. I've also heard that red spruce needs a little more break in time, at least in flattop guitars.
I'm one of the ones who experienced a new mando "opening up" & wasn't going to post due the varied opinions & thinking did it really ? But after reading Rob Roy's post I'm chimming in. I had a custom mando built for me by well known builder a few years ago with a nitro finish on it. When I first got it sounded good but maybe slightly muted than after a few months it changed for the better and ended up sounding real good. When I first got it I was switching back and forth between my Weber & it than after a few months the Weber didn't get played for over a year. How ever I would never buy another mando without playing it first and would never expect or buy one thinking it will sound better when it" opens up".
Lou
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