Oval Hole Mandolin Kits

[Whittle]

Greetings!

I've played the mandolin for a little over a year now. I play on a Weber Gallatin F with natural stain and satin finish. I love it, but I think I'm ready to learn more about my instrument by learning about construction.

My woodworking skills are somewhat limited. I've sanded and stained furniture, and I'm comfortable using a chisel. I take things methodically and have an eye for detail. However, I've not had much experience cutting or carving.

For this reason I'm wanting to start with a kit first before trying a scratch build. I'd like an oval or round hole to contrast with the bright sound of my Gallatin. If it's an oval hole, I'd prefer an a-style.

I'd rather not do the campfire mandolin kit from stewmac due to me reading several threads about issues with the neck joint. I know whatever I make won't be of the same quality as my Gallatin, but I would like it to be playable.

One of the kits I'm interested in is the Mill Creek Mandolin kit by Don Kawalek. A flat top with a round hole would indeed be a departure from what I'm used to. I've found a lot of videos and sound samples of the octave from his kits, but I've yet to find a sample of the mandolin. Can any of you point me in the right direction? I've tried and failed several times searching the forum. For those that have built one of his mandolins; what do you think of it?

It looks like the only carved top kit mandolin with an (intended) oval hole I can find is the F4 kit by Roger Siminoff. All of the a-styles I've found appear to be A5s. Do any of you know of an oval hole, a-style kit I could look at? Do you think one of the more reputable kit builders (Arches, Siminoff, etc..) would be willing to build one custom?

Thank you for any assistance you can provide! Please be patient with my questions. I'm just starting to learn!

[Jim Garber]

I have heard very good things about Don Kawalek's kits and also his support in building them. I am working my way thru a StewMac Campfire kit now otherwise I think I would have gone thru that route. I did find a Campfire builder who figured out a way to avoid the neck joint problem with the Campfire. I posted a link to his blog and how he did it here.

However, it also says on the StewMac site that you can't order it anyway: "This item cannot be ordered at this time." I wonder if they are in the process of redesigning the kit.

If you want an A-model kit I would write to Roger Siminoff. He does put these kits together custom order so perhaps he can make one for you.

[belbein]

I built a Kawalek "Octave Mandolin," and it was a good experience. If it's representative of his other kits, it's pretty good quality wood, good hardware, very clear instructions, and Don is always available for questions. So I'd encourage you to look into it.

The other kits I've built have been Waldron instruments. Again, good quality wood, good hardware, very clear instructions, and Kevin and the guys are always available for questions.

Don't worry about the "never cut or carved." You don't really have to. If you're competent with a chisel, you've got enough woodworking skill to build one of these instruments. Not that chisels are all that necessary, but you already have the feel for wood that you need to start.

There are other kits, of course, by International Violin, Simonoff, Grizzly, and others. I can't comment on those because I haven't used them.

[Whittle]

Thanks for the information, Jim! I did notice that the campfires were unavailable at the moment, but I just figured they were making more stock. Seeing the 1+ month wait, I should have realized they might be doing a redesign.

I might get in touch with Roger to see if he's done oval kits in the past. Thanks!

Belbein, I'll have a look at the Waldron kits later today. Thank you!

[Iaen]

If you don't mind a round hole kit Musicmakers has one. Haven't built one myself but I have ordered other things from them and the quality was good. http://www.harpkit.com/mm5/merchant....Code=mandolins

[Bill Snyder]

You could get one of THESE from International Violin and cut an oval hole. They will not be like the oval hole A's of old from Gibson. They will end up being what is frequently call a hybrid. An oval hole mandolin with a longer neck (although the scale length is the same whether it is a short neck or long neck).

[Jim Garber]

I emailed StewMac to find out the status on the Campfire kits. I will post what and when I hear.

[Whittle]

Thanks Bill! That IV kit had crossed my mind. I was a bit leary of it since I ran across Avi Ziv's thread where his oval hole collapsed. Apparently the top is thinner than most oval holes since it was designed with f-holes in mind. However, macjansson looks like he's had a couple of successes with the MK7 kit using longer bracing. Perhaps it deserves another look.

What tools would you recommend for cutting an oval hole?

[Cary Fagan]

You just need a drill to get a starter hole and a coping saw or other fine saw to cut the hole (leaving a margin to then file and sandpaper. And a bit of patience. I did one on my flat top build.

I'm doing a saga kit now, which I think is the exact same as an IV kit (f hole). Given how inexpensive it is, I think it's impressive. You need work a little at getting the neck joint to fit and there may be imperfections (my back barely fit in the width but I managed) but you can learn a lot. I'm finishing it and will post pics when I'm done.

[David Houchens]

http://www.amazon.com/Deep-Cutting-D.../dp/B0017QH4EQ I use a deep one like this that lets me work full circle around the top when I cut the f holes. Don't have to change directions.

[Whittle]

Thanks Cary and David for the information. I was afraid I'd have to use a dremel, and I don't own a scroll saw. I think I'll have better control over a coping saw. That's a good idea to use a deep saw and just go all the way around. Is that the specific one you use, David?

[David Houchens]

No, thats not the exact one. I can't remember where I got mine. It was before lunch time yesterday, which seems to be the extent of my memory these days. Mines tubular, but looks to have the same depth of clearance. My hands are getting bad so I made a wooden plate that slides up and squeezes it together while I lock the blade. Then pull it off and the blade gets very tight. It was under $20 where ever I got it. Holding up fine.

[tablaninja]

I love my Kawalek mandolin kit! Here's my previous thread about it. I'm out of town for a few weeks but I can try to record some samples of it when I get home.

http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/sh...hlight=kawalek

[Whittle]

Thanks tablaninja! I would love to hear it. I've heard wonderful things about Don's kits. In your opinion, how does the sound differ from an archtop?

[spufman]

Another option and one I am anxiously awaiting, is to take the mandolin building course at the Whetstone School of Lutherie in Vermont. I'm signed up for the September class where over the course of six 8-hour days will turn a pile of nice wood into a nice looking and sounding oval A-like flat top. It will be great building alongside the instructor and should be an invaluable experience for future builds. Check 'em out.

[Jim Garber]

I emailed StewMac to find out the status on the Campfire kits. I will post what and when I hear.

Here's the answer I got. I guess they are not re-designing that kit.

Thank you for contacting us. The kit is currently out of stock, and we just have not yet received a confirmation yet from our supplier as to when the next shipment will arrive.

[Whittle]

Thanks for checking on that, Jim. I sent Roger Siminoff an email a few days ago at your suggestion. I'll post back whether or not they do custom oval kits.

[ShapeChangingIns]

You just need a drill to get a starter hole and a coping saw or other fine saw to cut the hole (leaving a margin to then file and sandpaper. And a bit of patience. I did one on my flat top build.

I'm doing a saga kit now, which I think is the exact same as an IV kit (f hole). Given how inexpensive it is, I think it's impressive. You need work a little at getting the neck joint to fit and there may be imperfections (my back barely fit in the width but I managed) but you can learn a lot. I'm finishing it and will post pics when I'm done.

Sorry to hijack the thread, but can you talk more about how you got the neck to fit?

I want a snug fit and have hand-sanded the crap out of it, but apparently, its been a bit too snug, and I've cracked the wood twice. I think I can glue and sand my cracks, but I'm definitely taking some time off before my next try.

[Bill Snyder]

If you are cracking something as you test fit it you are applying WAY too much pressure.

[Barry Wilson]

I will add another thumbs up for don kawalek's kits. he is willing to give advice over skype to help out and will do parts of the build for you if you don't have the tools (did my rosette for me). We chatted back and forth quite a bit before I got my kit and I built it with minimal tools...

[Whittle]

Thanks Barry. Do you happen to have a sound sample of your kit build?

[Cary Fagan]

Hey Shape,
I just took a bit of wood off at a time, with a chisel and then sandpaper, till it fit. I still had to be very careful to get the neck lined up properly (I put strings through two outer holes in the headstock and ran them down to the end of the mandolin to line it up). I was a bit uncertain about the neck angle. Siminoff's suggested bridge hight is notably lower than the height on my Passernig. I did something in between. Right now I'm doing set up and things aren't perfect so I've got some tweaking to do.

[thistle3585]

Call Steve Smith at Cumberland Acoustic. He was selling a "campfire" kit based on the Flatiron Army/Navy. I owned one for awhile and it was incredible. Unfortunately, it died at the hands of UPS.