OM's and Mandolas

[Eddie Sheehy]

Just a few thoughts on the use of these instruments lately (past 30 years)...
The Irish Bouzouki revolutionised modern trad in the early 70's. Planxty roared onto the Irish scene and uileann pipes became commonplace in trendy sessions. The Bouzouki was used for trad tune backing by exponents like Donal Lunney - with some melodic counterpoint thrown in. Johnny Moynihan used it to fill pauses in his singing with melodic riffs and harmonies. Andy Irvine did the same but since he also liked to play the dance tunes at speed sought a shorter scale instrument but not as high pitched as a mandolin... He settled on a Waldzither - 19"scale, tuned FCCGGDDAA - sometimes restrung without the single F - and either capo'd or retuned to suit his vocal characteristics.
Meanwhile, across the pond, the Irish zouk had caught on but players like Tim O'Brien had sought a shorter scale more vocal-friendly variation - the Octave Mandolin - Tim has a superb Giacomel OM. But to play the jigs and reels at dance tempo the OM scale of between 20" and 22" is a bit of a stretch, so the Mandola/Waldzither still held sway in ITM. On the BG side, and probably influenced by Tim O'Brien, Sarah Jarosz and Sharon Gilchrist got into short scale OM's to back their vocals and the guitar-bodied OM caught on. More and more luthiers started producing longer-scaled Mandolas - at 17" and 18" scale lengths. These gave an even more manageable scale-length for the ITM dance tunes - Andy was capoing his Waldzither to reduce the stretches - and depending on their vocal key preferences these instruments were tuned - or capo'd - anywhere from GGDDAAEE (OM tuning) to CCGGDDAA (standard Mandola) to DDAAEEBB (Baritone Mandola or standard mandola capo'd 2).
16" Scale Mandolas don't seem as popular in BG or ITM, being seen more in Classical ensembles, but they are in evidence on a variety of performer's recordings. Marla Fibish is often seen switching between her Teens Gibson mandolin and her Gibson H1 Mandola (16" scale length)...

These are just my observations, I'm sure there's a whole lot more going on than I'm aware of.

[Eddie Sheehy]

I currently have a GOM carved top f-holes 24" scale that I use like an Irish Bouzouki - GGDDAADD tuning (currently experimenting with Daddario Chrome Flatwound strings), and a teardrop O hole flat top OM 22" scale tuned GGDDAAEE. Each has it's own unique voice and the flat-top is better suited to ITM, but they are pretty much interchangeable.
I have tried an 18 1/2" scale Mandola that I thought would work as a GGDDAAEE short-scale OM, but didn't like the sound and strung it with mandolin strings and tuned it CCGGDDAA (even tempted to push it to Baritone DDAAEEBB).
I have 2 17" scale mandolas - carved tops, one Oval hole and one F hole and both sound really cool with flatwound strings and regular CCGGDDAA tuning. I had droppped the F-hole mandola to GGDDAAEE using J76 strings and was quite pleased with the sound - a short-short-scale OM in effect.
For Classical I use a DGM3 16" scale with flatwounds (TI 164) - CCGGDDAA.
My favorite instrument is a Dave Griffin Baritone Resonator Mandola with a 18" Scale length. I have regular J74's on it and tuned it DDAAEEBB. I'm tempted to try FW74's on it.

[ptritz]

Interesting observations, Eddie. Like you, I also years ago settled on the DAEB tuning as a good solution for melody playing in ITM. For me, in order to comfortably play the melody at speed I think it's not so much the scale that's critical; rather, it's not having to reach way up there to the seventh fret for that high B that one uses all the time in ITM. Nick Apollonio built a DAEB mandola for me a couple years ago with a 19.25 inch scale, and I love it for melody. I've also used DAEB on the 17 fret tenor banjo for years, and as I recall the scale on the banjo is about 20.5 inches. Compared to GDAE, the trade off with DAEB is that you lose some opportunities for drones on the G string, and there are also a few tunes that you have to change a bit because they go down to notes on that missing G string. But overall I think it's a good solution. And I'm too old to change now anyway.

Pete

[Colin Lindsay]

I played guitar for many years, messed about on others - autoharp, bouzouki both bowl back and flatback, and mandolin, but always returned to the guitar for the type of chords and melody fingering I preferred. I only recently - since 2010 - started to seriously get to grips with other instruments; in fact I had sold everything else back in the mid to late 80s to clear unwanted clutter.
I was a huge fan of Andy Irvine having supported him on stage but was able to play most of Andy’s songs on guitar however this wasn’t the image I wanted - just another bl**dy guitarist…
I therefore cheated with guitar tuning on other instruments but found that four string instruments lacked the fifth string I loved to ‘bass’ on - so for a while I had a ten string cittern tuned EBGDA, then found that a Waldzither did almost the same but an octave higher. Big fingers don’t suit a mandolin so I use an octave mandola or bouzouki capo’d to the fifth fret for fast tune playing, but also use these for Andy’s slower songs. I’m not keen on this frantic strumming many bouzouki players like to confuse with accompaniment, I’d much rather explore the melodic counterparts that mandolas etc can add to a good tune. At present my Sobell octave mandola is tuned GDAE, as are my bouzoukis, but a recently purchased Waldzither is ADDGGBBEE and makes some interesting chord accompaniments to songs. I’ve been thwarted in my attempt to have a cittern specially made to take guitar tuning - the luthier has gone bust and run off with my deposit - but it’s still a project in the making. I also have a lute-guitar which sounds… interesting, but looks… different? It’s just experimentation, but it’s fun.

[tmsweeney]

I was playing some very simple tunes, Cukoo's nest, Staten Island, Black Berry Blossom with a guitar player the other night, he's pretty good but not very familiar with fiddle tunes. So I used the mandolin to teach the tunes to him and we played around with them for while with on and mando, and it was OK but nothin special, then I got the octave out and wow, then the music started to take on it's own character and form. I didn't know Octaves exisited until I started to look for mandocellos inspired by folks like Mike Marshall, Norman Blake and Peter Ostroushko, Joe Weed, who were the only people I was exposed to who were playing them in the late 80's and early 90's. Introductions to Donal Lunny , Andy Irvine, Manus Lunny, John Faulkner, Alec Finn, Gerald Trimble changed the game completely. I first converted and old damaged ovation guitar to octave, then got a Bardsong, and finally a Freshwater, and now a Weber. As a guitar player who felt there were just to many WG squared ( white guy with guitar) I was drawn to the mandolin's emphasis on melody and unique sound , especially with other stringed instruments. I soon found I was just another white guy with a mandolin at jams. While I still play mandolin, mandola and mandocello, my octave still gets the most attention.

[Nick Gellie]

What is a waldzither and where does it come from?

Thanks

[vernob]

A waldzither (tr:zither from the woods) is a five course variant on the cittern, guittar, cetole, and probably more names I don't know. As the name sounds, it's from northern Europe, probably Germany. The ones I've seen have nine strings. The bass course is a single string. The top four are double string.

[klaezimmer]

The waldzither is most notably associated with Germany. I have read that the Swiss have a similar instrument called a halszither. The waldzither is traditionally tuned C GG cc ee gg - a banjo tuning a fourth higher (aside from the fifth course on the waldzither being a bass string instead of a high drone as on a banjo). Outside of Germany, players frequently change the tuning to a mandola tuning (meaning CC GG DD AA) with the lowest string being a wild card tuned to suit the player or left off completely. Its scale of roughly 18.5 inches facilitates that tuning quite well.

Ron