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Thread: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

  1. #1
    Registered User sgrexa's Avatar
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    Default Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    I have been selling on Ebay for almost 14 years and have over 450 positive feedback transactions. I sold a Schertler BASIK contact microphone and preamp the other week and the buyer claims the preamp was not included. This is very strange to me as I never even took it out of the case when I photographed for the auction. In short, I am sure it was included, but he claims otherwise. Even though I specified no returns, I told him I would refund his money if the unit was returned in the same condition, even if he just didn't like it. He has put in a claim with Ebay / Paypal and is returning the unit for a refund, presumably without the preamp. Maybe a less than honest UPS employee removed the preamp? I have no idea what happened, and basically just told the truth in my initial statement provided to Ebay arbitration. The buyer has around 105 positive feedbacks and I really do not have any reason to believe he is being dishonest. So here we have a case with two apparently honest sellers and a "he said / she said" situation. My gut feeling is that as Ebay offers a "100% money back guarantee" to all buyers regardless if the seller offers returns or not, that they will be less likely to rule in my favor. Does anyone have experience with a similar situation?

    Sean

    PS- I usually try to use the classified on this site first, but that does not always work out. This will likely be the last musical related item I sell on Ebay. I just read an article on a site called reverb.com that charges only 3.5% vs. Ebay's 10% and is dedicated to musical instruments only. It seems Ebay's monopoly on online auctions is starting to crumble ever so slowly. Has anyone used reverb.com with success?

  2. #2
    Registered User Vernon Hughes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Is the pre-amp pictured in the listing? If so,at least you have that to go on. Document every conversation through ebay,it helps.I've had a similar he said / she said instance after 15 years of selling on ebay and they just paid the buyer off and they kept the item. No consequences to either party.
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    Registered User sgrexa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Yes, the preamp is pictured. I really do not like the fact that Paypal takes that money right out of your bank account until the case is resolved. I have heard nightmares about this and had a few incidents myself, but these were luckily resolved "fairly" quickly.

    Sean

  5. #4
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    One thing to note is the weight of the package (listed on the receipt when you shipped it) and the weight of the package when returned to you. It may show that the package was heavier when you shipped it.

    Unfortunately, however, it may not help. All else being equal eBay usually sides with the buyer. A friend of mine sold some motorcycle parts once (granted this was a couple years ago) and the buyer filed a "Not as Described" claim through PayPal. They returned to him a box of miscellaneous hardware and gravel that weighed the same as the original package. PayPal pulled the money out of his account because the buyer had a return receipt showing that they shipped the package back. It was he said/she said and they sided with the buyer. I understand that they are somewhat less knee-jerk in this respect these days due to a rash of similar frauds, but in the end they believe the buyer over the seller when it is otherwise even.

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    Registered User sgrexa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Good thinking JLeather! Never underestimate the criminal mind! I suspect the preamp only weighed ~100g if that, but I will see if UPS has an exact weight recorded. Thank you!

    Sean

  8. #6

    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    I believe you have the option to report the buyer to ebay for "buyer abuse" in the event of fraud. Call in and ask to speak to someone who specializes in this sort of thing. If you can document such an issue they would probably find in your favor.

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    Registered User pfox14's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Every once in a while you will run into not so honest buyers. I got one negative feedback from a woman that hated a guitar I shipped her, even though I told her I would refund her money. She never sent it back. It is just par for the course with eBay sometimes.
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    sgrexa, Google "Ebay scams", there are people out there that will buy something, strip it out, or claim "doesn't match seller description" and then file claim, Ebay will side with the buyer most of the time. Also, there are bait/switch sellers who show pictures of another item, describe it slightly different than the picture, and send you a different item. It happened to me recently. Seller was hostile to me and called me a crook, when I asked him if he had the item in the three pictures that I thought I had purchased from him. Turns out, he used the picture TWICE, had sold that item 4 days earlier, but used the three pics again! Beware of scams!
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Wow - that bites. Not one of the common worries. I sold something (less $$) and the buyer claimed it never made it to his address. I had extras but he said he didn't want it - just a refund. I had sent it w/o tracking and ended up eating the loss. I've been careful about such things since, but never thought much about the need to proof what I put in the box. In the end it's all about whose story has the best details

  15. #10
    Registered User sgrexa's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Thank you all very much for the suggestions and help. This is one of the many reasons I love this forum. My question to Ebay would be, who do you value more, your sellers or buyers? I bet they have thought about that a lot and I think I know the answer but I doubt they would ever answer truthfully.

    Sean

  16. #11
    Registered User Petrus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    One thing I would suggest is that if you suspect a problem in the making, detach your bank acct information from eBay. They will want some sort of account sync, so put on a debit card or use an alternate account with only a nominal amount of money in it. Later you can return to your regular account. Actually, it might be a good idea if you do a lot of business with eBay to keep an alternative account on there all the time, not your regular account, and only keep a bare minimum of funds in there.

    The buyer/seller dichotomy on eBay can be problematic, it is true, but then OTOH remember that most of us are both buyers and sellers there at one point or another. I find myself buying as much as I do selling (if not more, unfortunately.) So it's a double edged sword.

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    Moderator MikeEdgerton's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    This is the reason I quit selling on eBay. I had a guy do the same thing to me with a PA. When I do sell anything and I mean anything using Paypal I immediately take the money of my Paypal account, again because they did the same thing to me. As for your question about who eBay values most, it's the buyers. Many years ago they took away the ability to leave negative feedback for a buyer. That took away any threat and feedback ransom became the norm.
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    I've had two such occurrences and ebay/paypal immediately sided with the buyer both times without requesting any kind of proof. The first one the guy claimed I sent him a pda with a scratched screen. Looking into some history I saw that he had done this same thing 3 or 4 times. The second was just the other day. I sold a woman a camera and she couldn't figure out how to close and lock the battery door--a simple two step process. No additional conversation just took the money out of my paypal account. Told her she had the refund but told her she should work on her stupidity. After several hundred positive transactions both buying and selling, I think I am finally done with ebay. They have just gotten too full of themselves.

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  22. #14

    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Quote Originally Posted by Petrus View Post
    The buyer/seller dichotomy on eBay can be problematic, it is true, but then OTOH remember that most of us are both buyers and sellers there at one point or another. I find myself buying as much as I do selling (if not more, unfortunately.) So it's a double edged sword.
    Very true, as long as the benefits as a seller outweigh the drawbacks. After all, eBay enables me to sell my stuff to buyers in Belgium and Japan, as well as other places. Paypal solved the money exchange issues, and of course they charge their percentage as well. Some of the members here might remember 25+ years ago, before eBay, of course. An average guy couldn't just sell to the Japanese. In fact, most vintage guitar stores couldn't sell to the Japanese, The reason was not only the paperwork involved, it was a trust issue that the Japanese had to know personally who they were dealing with. Once the guitar shows sprang up everywhere (again long before eBay) the Japanese could meet other sellers and make contacts for future sales. I mention the Japanese, as an example, before that time and for years they controlled the pricing and demand for vintage guitars, pushing the market, as such. I say this from experience, I worked for a vintage store during that time period and while we were open to the public, we basically had one customer--the Japanese. Of course, now a lot of that marketplace has changed.

    I should add that you're gonna have one customer in 500 who is a stinker...even if you do everything right. Hard to avoid. That is the cost of doing business. Have 'em return it, sell it to somebody nice. And as stated, eBay always sides with the buyer.

  23. #15

    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    So far, I am only an eBay buyer. And twice, the items I ordered did not arrive to my home as expected alhouth USPS tracking showed DLIVERED !!!. Then I complained to the seller sand they simply refunded me (items of less than 10$ each). To my surprise, the items arrived 6 months later. I tried to look up the sellers to pay them but they are no longer on eBay.
    Does this happen to anyone ?

  24. #16

    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    KKMM, I have had that happen once. But in that kind of situation, it's a USPS issue, not an eBay issue.

  25. #17

    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Quote Originally Posted by Marty Jacobson View Post
    KKMM, I have had that happen once. But in that kind of situation, it's a USPS issue, not an eBay issue.
    Marty is right, not an eBay issue, but of course, the buyer's recourse is usually with the seller, not USPS. In my 30+ years of mail order (that's what it was called before eBay) I estimate I've sent over 7500 items, mostly instruments and music accessories. I will have to say USPS has an excellent track record--I've NEVER had an item get lost (knock on wood!) and I've only had about 3 items get damaged, but still delivered--in 30+ years! I'd say that's pretty good for a government run outfit! Of course, I triple check the address before I send it, overpack everything, basically, do all I can at my end for a "no issues" transaction. I hate to say it, but most delivery issues stem from the buyer giving me the wrong address, just moved, on vacation, etc. In those cases, the item is returned to the seller, even on international sales. I can't imagine ordering an expensive instrument and forgetting to update your eBay mailing address--but it happens? Seems a little unfair to the instrument, to be subjected to any extra travel and chance for damage, IMHO.

  26. #18

    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    in that kind of situation, it's a USPS issue, not an eBay issue
    I agreed to this as USPS said DELIVERED but only delivered the item(s) 4 to 6 months later !!!
    However, as a buyer, what would you do in this case ? Bring a complain to local USPS office ?

  27. #19

    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Expect to be treated scurrilously by the USPS... They don't honor claims - regardless of how much insurance you have and how fast you shipped with them... if it's broken when it gets there, tough. They'll be happy to tell you "it was clearly broken AFTER it was opened", yes they are all experts... and if you file an appeal expect it to be dismissed out of hand...

    The good thing about this is it forces you to get your own insurance, or to "take a chance" and save a few bucks on insurance, but there's no point in paying USPS extra for insurance just so's you can get sneered at... Just sayin'

  28. #20

    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Here's an interesting thing. I won an Ebay auction for a 12-string guitar - $332 plus $25.60 shipping. The Seller emailed me asking if I wanted insurance. I informed him of Ebay's rule - it is the responsibility of the Seller until delivered safely and he good do what he wanted. He emails back that "THERE IS A PROBLEM..." Shipping will cost $150 and insurance will cost $70 and he still has to get shipping material so he want another $300 since Ebay/Paypal won't let him at the funds I paid, which he wouldn't want to use anyway... but I can have a refund if I want... that was a no-brainer.

  29. #21
    Registered User Vernon Hughes's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    He could have used auctivas ship cover insurance if that might be the listing service he uses..It's very cheap and they pay shipping damage claims immediately no questions asked.It is the responsibility of the shipper/seller to insure the item gets to the buyer safely. Didn't used to be that way,insurance was a buyers option and the bill was footed by the buyer if they wanted it.
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  30. #22
    Registered User Petrus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Question for Seasoned Ebay sellers

    Quote Originally Posted by Eddie Sheehy View Post
    Here's an interesting thing. I won an Ebay auction for a 12-string guitar - $332 plus $25.60 shipping. The Seller emailed me asking if I wanted insurance. I informed him of Ebay's rule - it is the responsibility of the Seller until delivered safely and he good do what he wanted. He emails back that "THERE IS A PROBLEM..." Shipping will cost $150 and insurance will cost $70 and he still has to get shipping material so he want another $300 since Ebay/Paypal won't let him at the funds I paid, which he wouldn't want to use anyway... but I can have a refund if I want... that was a no-brainer.
    I don't like the sound of this transaction at all. Sorry to tell the guy, but it's his responsibility to hold up his end of the bargain. If he misjudged shipping costs, he's going to have to eat it, since you held up your end by paying him. On more than one occasion, as a seller, I've ended up losing money on a deal (not a lot, five or ten bucks) due to my own misjudgments. I can't blame that on the buyer or expect him to pony up. How hard is it to figure out how much shipping/insurance something is going to cost in advance, or to have your packing materials ready in advance?

    As a seller, I do occasionally purchase insurance from USPS for high-value items; it's not expensive and it relieves some anxiety.

    On a tangential note, Ebay seems to keep making changes to the detriment of sellers. Lately they've instituted a new form of seller rating. If you don't enter a tracking number when you ship something, for instance, it will eventually count against you. Also, getting a "neutral" is almost as bad as getting a negative rating. Working things out with the other party privately rather than opening up an official case with eBay will also count against you. And so forth.

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