Schertler dyn-m and amp question

[morganpiper]

I am using a schertler and plugging straight into our P.A. I think I'd like to own my own amp. I'm in a country band with drums, electric and acoustic guitars and electric bass. The guys say they have a hard time hearing me ( sometimes, that might be best ). I would like to have my own amp so I'd have a bit more control. I am not using a preamp as of now. I'm playing a Rigel A natural, no pickup installed. What's a good amp to consider, thinking something off of Craigslist that won't get me in trouble with the little lady, under $500.00, hopefully less. Like to have a few suggestions to hunt for. I'm in Austin, Texas, and there is quite a lot of used stuff around. Cheers!

[almeriastrings]

I'd suggest a Fishman Loudbox. Good mic channel (which is what you'd use with the DYN - treat it like a dynamic mic, not a pickup), and you also have a balanced line out which you can run to the PA.

[morganpiper]

Is that a Fishman pro, or mini?

[almeriastrings]

The two current models (excluding the rather huge 'Performer') are the Mini and the Artist.

Both would do what you want - though it depends on just how much volume you are really looking for on stage. My own view on that topic is that the Mini should be adequate (it can get surprisingly loud with excellent clarity and audibility), but if you are running at very high stage levels, the Artist has even more 'under the hood' in reserve and also has extra channel capability. Certainly with mandolin, the difference between the driver units in the two models is not really significant. If you get a 'Mini' off the floor and angled right (stand/chair) they are capable of quite impressive audibility. Suggest checking them out in person. They are both very solid, nice amps, are reasonably priced and widely available. There are other options, but most are considerably more expensive.

PS: For example, the SA-220 which is truly superb (I have two of them), but you are looking at a lot more bulk and a lot more $$$$.... for sheer 'carrying power' (dispersion), however - these remain very, very hard to beat.

[morganpiper]

I will definitely check them out. I thank you for taking the time to respond, and always like a great reason to go to the music shops!

[dhbailey]

I just bought a Roland BA330 amp, which arrived yesterday. It's a 35-watt amp which from my preliminary tests puts out an awful lot of sound, and has line outs which can be run through the band's PA. It has two channels which have XLR and phone jack inputs as well as a sensitivity switch to select either mic or instrument level input. It also has two more stereo channels so that either stereo sources can be input OR two different instruments into each of channels 3 and 4, for a total of up to 6 inputs. If two instruments are input into one of these channels there is only a single channel volume control for each channel so their various levels in the mix would need to be controlled at the instrument.

This also runs on batteries (8 AA, can be alkaline or rechargeable) and reviews claim that up to 8 hours can be had using batteries -- I can't substantiate this because I haven't tested it on batteries yet.

I bought it so that my violinist wife and I can have a portable, powerful, good-sounding amp to use for playing violin/guitar or violin/mandolin gigs.

It costs $599 at Sweetwater, it has 4 6.5" speakers and 2 2" tweeters (2 6.5" speakers and 1 2" tweeter for each side, left and right) the fidelity of this amp is wonderful, according to my early tests. My mandolin (Epiphone ME50E with pickup built into the pick-guard) sounded exactly the same through the speaker as it does without amplification (louder through the amp, though).

It weighs 30 pounds so it's easy to transport, it has a speaker-stand mount in the bottom (takes 1.5" diameter pole - OnStage stands have a reversible pole which has one end that fits perfectly) and it also has a little kick-stand which angles the amp upward when it's on the floor so it can serve as a personal monitor to feed into the band or the house PA.

I'm excited to use this out on a gig soon, but for now it'll serve as the single amp in my teaching studio, replacing a venerable Fender Vibro-Champ amp.

[mandotim1955]

Another endorsement for the Fishman loudbox range. I have the Artist model, and it's a great amp for the money. There are amps that are marginally better, such as AER or Schertler, but they are a lot more money. If you were going for that price range, I'd be looking at the Fishman Soloamp as Almeriastrings suggested. Great bit of kit, much underrated.

[mandroid]

I own a Roland AC-60 and can use the 2 Schertler's in either channel..

output plug for the XLR, Occasionally, just has to be adapted to 1/4" .

If needed, I have an impedance matching transformer
(switched, In or bypass, to just reassign the terminal connection)

you can use any Guitar amp with the Impedance match. ,
a friend plays Flute, into a SM57 mic , then into a Fender Guitar amp.

I own an internal installed C-Dyn, too, it has a TRS jack-strap button..

Output level is sufficient to go in an instrument or Microphone, pre-amp channel.



Roland also offers many back panel connections , I use 1 as a EFX loop,
1 out, 2, r/l back in, with a Y'ha AG stomp that has some extra gain.
& interesting effects , too.

and you can add another Basic Power amp to drive even larger speakers If You Wish.

[Mark Seale]

The Loudbox is a good amp for what you're describing. Not to be lost in the discussion is that it gives you a DI out to the board which gives you quite a bit more flexibility over the sound/signal you're sending. If finances allow, I'd go for the Artist so you have a bit more flexibility.

[morganpiper]

Thanks all for the info! Now I at least know where to start!

[morganpiper]

Oh, I have a couple of electric items (mandobird, and a tele) can they be used with an 'acoustic' amp? Or will it do damage to the amp?

[almeriastrings]

No. It will not do damage. Plug them into the 'passive' input. It will sound different than through a standard electric amp, however - mainly due to the different speaker configuration (LF + HF driver, rather like a hi-fi vs single full range speaker).

[Nevin]

If you have a decent amp for the electrics you could try the Schertler pre-amp and one of your existing amps. You may have to mess with the eq. I play my upright with a Schertler pickup and pre-amp into a bass guitar amp. I get a very nice sound without jsut a bit of tweeking.

[mandroid]

Or , any Microphone Preamp, since that is what it is, a contact microphone.

[Barry Canada]

What type of microphone preamp is recommended and useful for a schertler, Dpa 4099 and/or an audio technica 35 or 350?
I am looking for something universal! Thanks!

[mandroid]

Thought you had an AC 33 Roland amp the Mic channel should work fine .

I just plug into the AC 60 I have had for years. you need phantom power for the

condenser elements?

most dual channel Sing and play an instrument amps should suffice.

[almeriastrings]

The Schertler DYN will be 100% fine into any standard mic input. Think of it as an SM57....

The AT Pro 35/350 require a mic input with +18-52V phantom power available. If you have an amp that does not offer this, you can just run them through a separate phantom power supply box first.

[Barry Canada]

Thanks for the responses.
The main needpd is for the phantom power. Is there much if a difference between phantom power supply boxes?
Also does placement of a pre amp between the schertler and amp input provide anything useful for sound adjustment? Or is this just redundant?

[almeriastrings]

It is worth avoiding the very cheap phantom boxes. They come with cheap sockets, too. A source of potential future failures. Also, generally speaking, one that uses a power supply is likely to provide a more stable voltage than one using a single battery, though this can vary with circuit design. There are a few that use multiple batteries and those have an advantage: more stable, longer lasting power + freedom from potential ground loops.

A very good (but rather expensive) battery model is the Whirlwind. I have also used the ART Phantom modules at various times and found them to be good solid performers and very good value.

For a module than runs from its own PSU (which might be OK if you are using it next to an amp) the new Radial looks good.

If you have a good amp, I can't really see any advantage in an extra preamp at all. In fact, it could degrade your sound as you will already have a good impedance match and any extra hardware adds its own noise/distortion, however slight...

[mandroid]

Maybe tone shaping + a trifle of gain , in a EFX loop .. from one of these?
http://www.musiciansfriend.com/ampli...and-graphic-eq

no personal use, but other players, guitarists, around here, run their signal thru them..

YMMV.

[Barry Canada]

Mandroid and Almeriastrings,
I do have the AC33 but I find the equalization is very limited as it was probably designed for guitar frequencies and adjustments. Lovely amp! I have a trace Elliot which has a broader spectrum of equalization control. Is there a microphone designed DI that could work similar to the Baggs PADI, but for microphone application that will accept the XLR jacks from my microphones and schertler pickup? Thanks once again!

[almeriastrings]

I would suggest an A&H Zed 10 (FX version if you want the extra effects options):

You get:

4 X high quality mic preamps with +48v
Very nice EQ (certainly enough for your purposes)
2 super high impedance inputs if you wish to use other transducers, piezos, for example

You could feed this into the AC33 AUX input.

It is actually better than most standalone acoustic preamps, and is far more versatile. By the time you have added up the cost of phantom power, external EQ's, etc., you could have one of these and be set for a long time. The FX version is enough to serve as the main desk for a duo or small outfit... just add powered speakers.

These are a seriously good buy if you only need a few inputs. They sound great.