Tuning a mandolin like a mandola CGDA

[Ondine's Daughter]

Hi,
I want to get a modern mandolin with a Truss Rod in the neck so it can handle the tension of being tuned like a mandola or CGDA. I play the viola and tried to learn to play a 17" mandola but the stretch is too long for my small hands...I have tendon issues.

Has anyone out there tried that yet, and if so what were the results? I know the sound will be compromised but that's O.K. with me.

I can hear the viola/mandola jokes through the ethers already :-)

Bring it on!

[Tobin]

"Tuning bar in the neck"? What is that?

You can just capo a mandolin at the 5th fret to achieve CGDA tuning, although it will be an octave higher than a mandola.

[Ondine's Daughter]

Of course, I hadn't thought of that but it does limit one a bit. Thanks for that thought.

[pheffernan]

Have you considered a mandola with a shorter scale length? Mid-Missouri mandolas, for instance, are only 15.5 inches: http://mnmfrederick.com/used-guitars/img_3322/.

[Mark Wilson]

"Tuning bar in the neck"? What is that?

I'm guessing truss rod. You know. Next to the swirly ear

[Mark Wilson]

This was the last post I recall about tuning a mandolin to CGDA
mandolin to mandola

[Tom Coletti]

I'm guessing truss rod. You know. Next to the swirly ear

The expensive swirly ear at the ebony scaffold end of the fingerdance region or the fragile swirly ear by the eight twisty note changers?

--Tom

[Ondine's Daughter]

Sorry guys...I stand corrected.

[Mark Wilson]

The fragile one. I'm starting a list of Mandolin Cafe aka's. Twisty note changers will be on it.

[Mark Wilson]

Sorry guys...I stand corrected.

NP. I'd rather play viola but the sound I make drawing a bow is at it's best awful.

[Gravensteinrhonda]

Aaron Weinstein, the jazz violinist and mandolinist, posted to the Cafe a cool chord melody tune played on a mandolin tuned like a mandola very recently. I wondered how he set it up. Maybe you could contact him. You could alternatively try doing it with nylon strings on a uke.

[ricomando]

you can do it but the string will be fairly dull sounding

[Ondine's Daughter]

That's perfect as my playing is rather dull sounding :-)

[mrmando]

What's the scale length on your viola?

[bratsche]

I second the suggestion to get a shorter scale length mandola like a Mid Missouri - Big Muddy. (I have one of each, and they are both good instruments made my Mike Dulak.) Tuning down a mandolin to CGDA, whether you use mandolin or mandola strings, will just be too floppy for good sound or even good intonation, I'm afraid. It took me a while to be able to get around fluently on a 17" mandola, so I played the shorter scale for a while, and now, a decade later, I actually prefer playing the 17" scale (because it gives better tone on the C strings). It was an arduous journey to get there, but it was worth it. I wouldn't waste time using a mandolin as a mandola. Go for a real one!

bratsche

[Ondine's Daughter]

My viola is 14" - it was my teacher's suggestion to alter a mandolin. He's Italian and is classically trained.

[Tom Wright]

As pointed out above, Aaron Weinstein sounds great on a normal mandolin converted to viola/mandola CGDA. A fine old pro named Johnny Gimble was famous for that setup. 5- and 10-string mandolins are usually mandolin-scale. Mine are either 14" or 14.25". You don't need to tune higher, just shift them over and add a C pair of .047 or larger gauge.

The C works fine, and of course the other three are normal for a mandolin. The real issue is that the compensated bridge (stair-step zigzag pattern) will be wrong for that setup. You would replace the bridge with a mandola style for best results. Your nut would want the slots widened, and you would not have the full sound from the C that the small body can give for a G. Still, a viola is pretty weak on the bottom, too, and it has its value. I really like having the C, as a viola refugee.

[Pasha Alden]

Agreed with some posts here. A mandola with shorter scales will do.

[Petrus]

You tune GDAE down a fifth to CGDA, so the tension should be less, not greater. I have an old S.S. Stewart bowl back mandolin which can't handle the tension of normal gauge strings, and I didn't have any extra light gauge handy, so I strung it with normal mandolin strings but down to CGDA. It's a little loose but not that much and gives a dark, bassy tone with easy vibrato.

[Grommet]

Do check out both pf Aaron Weinstein's recent chord melody posts in the Cafe' Forum's Jazz section. He is playing a mandolin tuned down to CGDA and using only 4 single strings. Sounds very nice and he also reviews Don Stirenberg's recommended string choices for this set-up.

Scott

[ajh]

I changed all of my mandolin instruments to this tuning about a year ago. Slightly different scales on all, but usually just wind up putting regular D'ad Mandola sets on then futzing around with slightly heavier C strings if needed for balance. The main pain is that you do need a new saddle (or bridge) for correct compensation. Also need to reslot your nut (and you may need a new nut if the C's get too close to the edge). Is a great tuning if you are not into bluegrass band situations.

Tony

[s11141827]

You could use 2 sets of D'addario Prelude Short Scale Viola Strings as Flatwound Strings (replace the original tailpiece w/ an Allen Terminator Tailpiece). Johnny Gimble was known for Tuning his Mandolin like a Mandola.

[Mandoplumb]

I would try going down instead of up. Haven’t researched it but if the G, D, and A was moved
down one and a heavier string used as a forth for C. Would seem to me if C string was right , pull on neck would be similar even less

[s11141827]

There are Short Scale Violas which have the same size as Violins but are voiced in such a way to handle those low notes, what if they made short scale Mandolas?

[s11141827]

Do check out both pf Aaron Weinstein's recent chord melody posts in the Cafe' Forum's Jazz section. He is playing a mandolin tuned down to CGDA and using only 4 single strings. Sounds very nice and he also reviews Don Stirenberg's recommended string choices for this set-up.

Scott

Sometimes he uses 4 Pairs of strings depending on the Mandolin he has. Thomastik Alto Mandola Strings (Model 164) could allow you to convert your Mandolin into a Short Scale Mandola, they have a lower tension because they're designed like Violin Strings.