musings re. bass at jams, electricity, and carved vs. flat tops

[Mike Bunting]

This is one reason why I don't go to BG jams. Too many rules. I swear, it's worse than golf.

If it's a bluegrass jam, it's a bluegrass jam, who are you to tell the folks that like bluegrass that they should change their jam? I think you do the right thing by staying away. If I drag my mandolin off to other jams,I play by their rules and don't try to make them play what I want. When I INVITE people to a Sunday Bluegrass and Old-time jam at a local watering whole, people know what it is and are respectful enough to not try to make it something else.

[bayAreaDude]

I think electric bass can sound fine. I play it myself sometimes - it's loads of fun. Of course the player has to play appropriate to the style. It's also easy to transport even with an amp, which for BG need not be large. I myself would stay away from a jam that wouldn't welcome this if a bass fiddle isn't around.

[Steve Ostrander]

I think electric bass is fine, as long the volume is in control. Just keep those harmonicas, accordians, spoons and drums (or whatever they call those irish or hippie things) away.

So you're saying bagpipes are OK, 'cuz they're not on the list.

[bassthumper]

i'M seeing "double bass" being tossed around this thread quite a bit ... very few are ever heard or seen in bluegrass....3/4 is the standard....

[Jon Hall]

A more accurate "flat top versus archtop" comparison might be made with mandocellos since there a lot of flattops and arch tops out there.

[FLATROCK HILL]

I so prefer the dog-house, and am very grateful to the guy who comes every week to the jam, lugging it.

Right on!
One of my little 'Bluegrass' groups was blessed for years to have a guy there, week after week, year after year dragging his D.H. bass along. He wasn't fancy with it, just steady. He passed away recently. I miss him and I miss that bass.

The fellow who volunteered to fill in for him plays an electric fender-style. He does a great job too. On the rare occasions that no bass shows up, things do tend to fall apart rhythmically.

I'm still not ready to say that any bass is better than no bass though. As long as it sounds like...Thump Thump Thump Thump, I'm ok.
When someone shows up trying to make 'Heavy Traffic Ahead' sound like the intro to the Barney Miller Show...I'm out!

[multidon]

I would also like a technical answer to CeeCee's original question regarding arch top versus flat top.

I have never equated greater volume with arch tops. In fact the loudest mandolin I ever owned was my homemade Stew Mac Campfire, before it self destructed. That sucker was loud! Also a previously owned Mud Missouri flat top was very loud.

To me, arch tops have a different tone quality as well as a more percussive attack on each note, not more volume. Some flat top guitars are real cannons. A fine quality Martin guitar can be very loud. A fine quality carved top guitar isn't louder it's just different. I would describe the tone quality of a nicely made arch top guitar as " piano like".

Looking forward to hearing other viewpoints on this.

[OldSausage]

I'm pretty sure the theoretical answer is no. Carved tops are not amplifiers - at least, no more so than flat tops. They just change the characteristics of the sound produced.

[allenhopkins]

There aren't many carved-top acoustic bass guitars, with which to compare the "standard" flat-tops. The Chennell Arco is one, built like a "baby bass fiddle," but I've never heard one. KB Guitars (Ken Bebensee) made this one, looks like a "one-of" for a particular musician.

Overall, carved-top guitars have a sharper attack and less sustain than flat-tops, but you have to balance that with the fact that most carved-tops have f-holes, most flat-tops oval/round soundholes. And there are many, many other variables -- body size, composition, scale length, string gauges, ad infinitum.

Don't think that's a question easily answered. Main variable we've been discussing is body size, which is the obvious difference between bass fiddle and acoustic bass guitar. Scale length and string gauges are also quite different.

If someone has played or heard a carved-top acoustic bass guitar, hope he/she will jump in.

[outsidenote]

These guys seem to get by pretty well with the Ubass. Look at those smiles!

[allenhopkins]

Another option is the resonator bass guitar; Gold Tone makes a decent, affordable one, I guess.

Here's Jake Wildwood demo-ing it:

[bassthumper]

Taylor used to make an acoustic bass with a larger deeper body that pushed more air

[Phil Goodson]

I've got one of these Gold Tone Mbasses. Sounds close to upright and similar to Kala when amplified. Convenient!

Also have an upright, which I prefer. Can't beat the coolness of an upright. (But not convenient.)

[Bertram Henze]

Every now and then, people bring acoustic bass guitars to our Irish sessions. They are never audible, and everybody seems to be profoundly grateful, including the ones who bring the bass
The exception is one who brings an upright bass to a transatlantic session - he sometimes accompanies Irish tunes with it and it sounds good, but then he is someone who exactly knows what he is doing.

[JeffD]

I'm pretty sure the theoretical answer is no.

[Jim]

Our weekly jam is sometimes attended by an electric bassist, She is always welcome. She knows her stuff and has played gigs with me in Rock, Blues, Folk and BG bands since the early 90s. My feeling is that at most jams it isn't so much the instrument (electric, acoustic, upright ect) but the way it's played. Play the song, fit in stylistically and dynamically and you will be welcomed by most.

Another option is the resonator bass guitar; Gold Tone makes a decent, affordable one, I guess.

That Reso Bass is way cool, I wonder if it's as loud as it seems in the video, My electric bass playing friend would love that for jams, especially if it came in a fretless version.

[jshane]

Hey CeeCee-

Seriously, give Pete Langdell a call. He lives in Jeffersonville Vermont. He's been building a pretty innovative answer to the portable bass issue. Pete is a really nice guy, and the couple times I have talked with him, we spent a LONG time discussing music, musical instruments, and luthier-answers to vexing problems (most of the conversation WAY beyond my understandings). Even if it doesn't pan out vis s vis the bass, I bet you have a great conversation.

[terzinator]

Another vote/recommendation for the Uke Bass. Our bass player uses one exclusively.

It's always welcome in a jam (or at least the participants are too polite to say otherwise).

[CeeCee_C]

The spousal unit's new Kala fretless U-Bass has just arrived. I bought it from a local dealer, so I feel good about supporting the local economy.

I did consider the other options presented above, but the deciding factors were that (1) the SU already plays the uke with a large group of fellow aficionados (who don't have anyone with a u-bass as of last week), (2) small and portable, (3) extremely affordable.

I'd like to adapt a case so that the SU can take both instruments both playing out and on our yearly nerd cruise (that's another story). The u-bass is ~24" long, ~3 deep and ~10" at its widest point.


Any suggestions? Ideally, I'd like to find a case that doesn't have to be gutted first.

And thanks for all the help.

[Ryk Loske]

Cee Cee,

I'd give Elderly a call. When i bought my Islander they knew just what case would fit it. AND ... it was inexpensive but still good enough.

Ryk

[ombudsman]

I thought all the U Basses came with a case. It's essentially a baritone uke body with different strings, tuners, and a pickup, so probably most baritone uke cases would work; due to the size of the tuners I would try before buying.

[multidon]

Guys, if I read CeeCee's post correctly, what she apparently wants is a double case to put the U Bass in along with something else. What the something else is isn't clear. A regular uke? I never heard of a double case for a baritone Uke and anything else. It would have to be custom make I think. If it were me, I would be tempted to go to a thrift store, find a small hardshell suitcase of appropriate dimensions, get some foam rubber and fabric, and go to town.

[CeeCee_C]

Guys, if I read CeeCee's post correctly, what she apparently wants is a double case to put the U Bass in along with something else. What the something else is isn't clear. A regular uke? I never heard of a double case for a baritone Uke and anything else. It would have to be custom make I think. If it were me, I would be tempted to go to a thrift store, find a small hardshell suitcase of appropriate dimensions, get some foam rubber and fabric, and go to town.

Don -

Exactly. U-Bass and soprano uke. However, I think any suitcase that would qualify as an airline carry on would be too short in length and too wide.

That's why an alto sax case seemed like it might work. It's about 25" interior length and the U-Bass is 24" end to end. I'm just being lazy and don't want to rip out the innards just to replace them.

Speaking of innards, does anyone know where I can get proper instrument lining material; the kind that doesn't discolor finishes?

[eadg145]

CeeCee, did you get an amp yet? Because if not, I highly recommend you forget about the Roland Microcube (which doesn't move enough air to get a good bass sound), and instead get a Pignose HOG 30. That amp is small, portable, runs on a battery (or AC), and sounds GREAT with my Ashbory bass for park casual jams.

And good on ya for getting the fretless version. I know there's a lot of love for the Kala UBasses, but I've found the setup/intonation to be sketchy on the various ones I've played.

Best of luck with the new rig! If S.O. is playing with other uke folks, he'll fit right in and they'll all be delighted.

[catmandu2]

I'd like to adapt a case so that the SU can take both instruments both playing out ...

Any suggestions? Ideally, I'd like to find a case that doesn't have to be gutted first.

Perhaps fashion something from a multi-racquet bag, and some closed-cell foam. Another possibility--visit a good drum store and look over their percussion bags...I have a Pro-tech bells bag that I use for mandola/fiddle or dola/charango, etc..