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Thread: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

  1. #51
    Martin Stillion mrmando's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    If the dude really wants to sell this, he can make it a true auction: start it at a dollar and let the bidding determine its value. Or list it with a "best offer" option and see what happens.
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    If looking for a mandolin on ebay the first thing I would do is type "mandolin" in the search bar. I don't know if this "andolin" would show up....
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Paraphrasing the great Frank Zappa, Is that a real andolin or a Sear's andolin?
    There are two things to aim at in life: first, to get what you want; and, after that, to enjoy it. Only the wisest of mankind achieve the second. Logan Pearsall Smith, 1865 - 1946

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    Constantly In Search Of.. Michael Bridges's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by darrylicshon View Post
    If you do ask them about some of that nice old swamp wood, i bet we could make some nice mandos out of some, hey i started playing mando in Cincinnati
    Where did you finish?
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    Brentrup Evangelist Larry S Sherman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernie Daniel View Post
    I don't think that is a large group of mandolin pickers out there clamoring to have an axe with a squid on the head stock -- but I could be wrong.
    It's my favorite feature!

    Larry

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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Got to admit, I'm baffled that the seller would add more text to the ad but not correct the title. BTW, I remember when I started my internet participation and spellcheck informed me "noone" was not a word. I fought it for awhile but finally surrendered to convention and spelled it "no one." Seems sad, somehow ...

    Quote Originally Posted by darrylicshon View Post
    hey i started playing mando in Cincinnati
    Quote Originally Posted by Michael Bridges View Post
    Where did you finish?
    Reminds me of the old routine, which I find myself in every now and then:

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  8. #57
    Certified! Bernie Daniel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry S Sherman View Post
    It's my favorite feature!

    Larry
    OK so maybe you are an inveterate biologist? Or at least always wanted to be one but got hijacked by a mandolin?

    Warning OT: The one thing I most remember about the giant squid from my developmental anatomy course (circa 1962) is that the eye of the squid is largest in the animal kingdom (size of a dinner plate) and it is anatomically very similar to the mammalian eye and is often sighted as an example of convergent evolution -- that is starting from two different points and emerging at the same place.

    (P.S. not to offend --so if you are not a follower of Darwin that is just fine with me I am not taking a stand on evolution just communicating an interesting fact about squid eyes.)
    Last edited by Bernie Daniel; Jan-01-2015 at 10:55am.
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by rfloyd View Post
    If looking for a mandolin on ebay the first thing I would do is type "mandolin" in the search bar. I don't know if this "andolin" would show up....
    I did send the seller a note yesterday. I suggested more, better pics and also suggested that the "M" be added back to mandolin.

    And it looks like that part was well-received. It now says "Mandolin" again.

    But the reply was accompanied by a a lot of unfriendly push back as well -- including chiding me for not bidding even after changed it was changed back to mandolin! LOL!!!

    The seller apparently HAS followed the MC discussion and seems to feel that as a instrument seller he knows best -- in his view we are "tire kickers"! LOL

    Keep in mind that he has assured us that it sounds better than a Gibson.

    So let's get to bidding folks!!!
    Last edited by Bernie Daniel; Jan-01-2015 at 10:01am.
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  10. #59

    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernie Daniel View Post
    (P.S. not to offend --so if you are not a follower of Darwin that is just fine with me I am not taking a stand just communicating an interesting fact about squid eyes.)
    You added that little disclaimer in the nick of time Bernie. My blood was nearing the boiling point but thankfully it began to cool when I reached the end of your post.
    For a moment, I feared you might be going into your 'attack-mode' again.

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  12. #60
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by FLATROCK HILL View Post
    You added that little disclaimer in the nick of time Bernie. My blood was nearing the boiling point but thankfully it began to cool when I reached the end of your post.
    For a moment, I feared you might be going into your 'attack-mode' again.
    Thank goodness! I would not want anyone to overheat their radiator! And HNY!
    Bernie
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernie Daniel View Post
    Keep in mind that he has assured us that it sounds better than a Gibson.
    Oh, so now he knows something about mandolins? I've been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, out of a sense of charity, but if he's gonna get huffy with folks giving him a bit of good-natured ribbing, considering how it's well-deserved and he's earned it, and how much education he ought to have picked up through this process, all bets are off and he's on his own, AFAIC.

    So let's get to bidding folks!!!
    I don't think so! Too rich for my blood. I'd rather get an A model Gibson for $1000 or less.

    Now, if another mandolin from this maker shows up with a whale or a marlin on the headstock, I might have to think about it ... as long as it doesn't come with clams built in!
    But that's just my opinion. I could be wrong. - Dennis Miller

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    Certified! Bernie Daniel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by journeybear View Post
    Oh, so now he knows something about mandolins? I've been willing to give him some benefit of the doubt, out of a sense of charity, but if he's gonna get huffy with folks giving him a bit of good-natured ribbing, considering how it's well-deserved and he's earned it, and how much education he ought to have picked up through this process, all bets are off and he's on his own, AFAIC.


    I don't think so! Too rich for my blood. I'd rather get an A model Gibson for $1000 or less.
    I think that the seller is very frustrated with all the comments and does not see them as "helpful".

    He'll just have to do it his way like Frank Sinatra and maybe someone like Larry who is attracted to squids on a mandolin will come along and just HAVE to have it!!
    Last edited by Bernie Daniel; Jan-01-2015 at 12:23pm.
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Well, it's true that we have been having some sport at his expense, but there has been a good amount of advice mixed in with that. People are funny critters, full of foibles, and if we can't laugh at ourselves, we are doomed. One of my pet peeves is the odd mixture of ignorance and arrogance some people display when confronted with an error they have made, however obvious it is or how deeply in denial they are. Think I'd better stop there, because I think the seller has been raked over the coals enough.
    But that's just my opinion. I could be wrong. - Dennis Miller

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  17. #64

    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrmando View Post
    If the dude really wants to sell this, he can make it a true auction: start it at a dollar and let the bidding determine its value. Or list it with a "best offer" option and see what happens.
    I agree in a perfect world, with millions of bidders, a dollar auction would seek its actual value. I think it would, still, if you had a mint condition vintage Martin or pre-CBS strat---let's say a $30,000 guitar, starting at a dollar will still bring close to that--if the demand is there and enough people are watching.

    I've seen eBay change over the years, I don't think it is the economy, seems more like apathy, to me. Nobody cares, anymore. When eBay first started it was like the Gold Rush of '49--a person could sell anything for almost any price. I can't tell ya how many vintage belt buckles, sunglasses, etc., I sold for $500 back then, and the buyers were happy to get them. I worked at a guitar store when eBay first started and guitars that had lingered for a year on the rack for $300, sold it a week on eBay for sometimes $450 or more! It was crazy, back then. Today, unfortunately, eBay is "old news" to a lot of people. A high starting bid is about the only way for a seller to protect themselves. I'm guessing if this mandolin started at a dollar it would peter out at $300-400, if that, based on the current climate. Same could be said of real estate. If houses were offered at absolute auction, in many areas, a $200,000 home would only bring $60,000 or so, to an investor, and most people are not willing to take such a loss or have more than that in the home. This is also happening with vintage car auctions--stuff that should be $125,000--goes for $60 or 70K. It is a buyers market, these days. And, as a buyer, my only motivation to spend money is if the price is right, because, like a lot of people, I don't need anything, instrument-wise.

    Just got back from visiting my Mother for the holidays. It is an 800 mile trip, I drive, taking two or three days, stopping at 30-40 music stores, pawn shops, flea markets along the way. Places I've been doing business with for years. I always see a bunch of nice stuff--if you want to pay retail--I don't because I don't need anything--but if something is a great deal, I'll peel open the ole wallet! No mandos this trip, but picked up four guitars--no museum pieces, but good deals are still out there if you apply yourself.

    So just saying, I see both sides of the high starting bid approach. Basically, the seller is saying they will take $1500 for it, or the first bidder wins it. I still do a fair amount of eBay, some items I will run for years until sold, using eBay's list until sold feature, which actually only costs you about 20 cents a month or $2.40 a year. You still have to pay a final value fee of approx 11 percent, when and if the item sells, but you can run it for years at $2.40 a year and get worldwide advertising. (and be subjected to worldwide ridicule on forums, such as MC, and many others, I might add---Ibanez, Electra, Univox, and Alembic all have forums whose members would make our friends here at MC seems quite mild-mannered and polite, by comparison!) LOL In the old days, a good item would sell in a week for my price. These days, sales are slow. Much more like a hobby, than an actual business.

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  19. #65

    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernie Daniel View Post
    I did send the seller a note yesterday.

    But the reply was accompanied by a a lot of unfriendly push back as well -- including chiding me for not bidding even after changed it was changed back to mandolin! LOL!!!

    The seller apparently HAS followed the MC discussion and seems to feel that as a instrument seller he knows best -- in his view we are "tire kickers"! LOL

    I know where a lot of sellers are coming from. Many are retired folks who did the flea market thing and started doing eBay to supplement their income, but find it is too frustrating and requires too much attention to detail. (imagine putting them in charge of shipping your prized mandolin!) They are used to simply putting something on a flea market table and having someone hand them some money, usually after some haggling. They are interested in one thing, making money. They are not interested in your hobby or being a penpal. A lot of them seem gruff or blunt to this forum, because they do not speak the "language". We have also seen this type of seller in the MC Classifieds, from time to time.

  20. #66
    Martin Stillion mrmando's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Yes, eBay has a culture of its own, and so do mandolin players, and so does the Cafe, and this seller doesn't seem quite at home in any of them.
    I agree in a perfect world, with millions of bidders, a dollar auction would seek its actual value.
    I don't know about "actual value," but it would certainly find its current eBay market value. He's getting more eyeballs thanks to this thread than he would otherwise, but that might not translate into extra dollars if people get the impression that the seller is poorly informed or unreasonable. There's always the option of setting a reserve in an auction with a low starting bid.

    There's an F4 by Ithaca Strings in South Carolina, with a seller even more hapless than this one, that has been kicking around CraigsList for a while. It was on the Cafe for a bit and also on eBay:

    http://atlanta.craigslist.org/nat/msg/4826818063.html

    (Eric Aceto and Dan Hoffman made some well-regarded instruments when they were working together as Ithaca Strings, but they never quite achieved a national reputation for their guitars and mandolins—they were always better known for their electric violins. The partnership broke up a while ago; last I heard Dan was in Spain and Eric is still in Ithaca, and both are now doing more traditional violin work.)

    Anyhow, this seller wants $6K for this Ithaca F4 but doesn't have the first clue about how to get anyone to pay that much. She listed it in a no-reserve eBay auction, which I won for about $700, but of course she refused to send it to me for that amount. I think a seller who understood the market, and realized that Eric and Dan's mandolins, as good as they might be, are not in high demand, might be able to get $3–4K from the right buyer ... but that's never going to happen with the current seller.

    When you have something like the Whitaker Squidolin, by a builder with no reputation at all, you have to sell the mandolin based on its own merits, and this seller doesn't appear to understand how to do that.
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrmando View Post
    When you have something like the Whitaker Squidolin,
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    Professional Dreamer journeybear's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by mrmando View Post
    When you have something like the Whitaker Squidolin, by a builder with no reputation at all, you have to sell the mandolin based on its own merits, and this seller doesn't appear to understand how to do that.
    Nor interested in learning. Another approach would be to lower the opening bid but set a reserve price. At least if people start bidding, there can be a snowballing effect. But you have to get people started, somehow. A high opening bid on an odd duck instrument by an unknown builder isn't going to get it done.
    But that's just my opinion. I could be wrong. - Dennis Miller

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    Certified! Bernie Daniel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Mando View Post
    I agree in a perfect world, with millions of bidders, a dollar auction would seek its actual value...So just saying, I see both sides of the high starting bid approach.... I'm guessing if this mandolin started at a dollar it would peter out at $300-400, if that, based on the current climate.... and most people are not willing to take such a loss or have more than that in the home. Basically, the seller is saying they will take $1500 for it, or the first bidder wins it.
    But doesn't eBay still have the "Reserve" option? I'm sure it does because I still see "reserve not met" warning on some auctions. So he could offer it at starting bid $20, have a reserve of $1500, and offer BIN also -- then maybe he could move it. But no one but a totally uninformed buyer would plunk down $1500 for that item with no case. To his credit the seller accepts returns.

    Personally I think $750 - 800 is right considering how essentially nothing is known about it, & the pics are pretty uninformative -- how many are out there looking for modern 3-point F-2's anyway?
    Bernie
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  24. #70

    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernie Daniel View Post
    But doesn't eBay still have the "Reserve" option? I'm sure it does because I still see "reserve not met" warning on some auctions. So he could offer it at starting bid $20, have a reserve of $1500, and offer BIN also -- then maybe he could move it. But no one but a totally uninformed buyer would plunk down $1500 for that item with no case. To his credit the seller accepts returns.

    Personally I think $750 - 800 is right considering how essentially nothing is known about it, & the pics are pretty uninformative -- how many are out there looking for modern 3-point F-2's anyway?
    Yes, eBay still offers a reserve option, but many bidders, including myself, don't like to feel they are bidding against somebody's reserve. They prefer to bid against another actual bidder who wants it. So, a lot of times I won't even bother bidding if the reserve is not already met--then it is fair game. If the seller ran a reserve auction and the reserve was not met, at least it would give them some indication of where the bidding would stop and therefore a selling price.

    I wanted to add that we should separate the mandolin's virtue from the seller. Unfortunately, you have to go through the seller if you wish to purchase it.

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    Certified! Bernie Daniel's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Jeff Mando View Post
    ....I wanted to add that we should separate the mandolin's virtue from the seller. Unfortunately, you have to go through the seller if you wish to purchase it.
    Yes this seller is his own worst enemy. The add is a bit of a mess -- starting with "5-point mandolin", and a "no name" builder listed in the title (for what reason?) and so forth and so on.............

    But then who knows? There might be someone out there secretly watching this auction and ready to bid $1500 in the last few seconds!! LOL!
    Bernie
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    Brentrup Evangelist Larry S Sherman's Avatar
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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bernie Daniel View Post
    ...maybe someone like Larry who is attracted to squids on a mandolin will come along and just HAVE to have it!!
    It seems like a perfect convergence of my interests in 3-point mandolins, giant squids, and gypsy jazz petite-bouche soundholes.

    Yes, I would buy it, but not at that price. I would certainly lose my shirt on any future resale, as the Django-Squid market is quite small.

    Larry

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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Well, the seller seems to have a good sense of humor-- "Andolin" only for women who do want the word "man" in it--or something like that--haha!

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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Quote Originally Posted by Larry S Sherman View Post
    It seems like a perfect convergence of my interests in 3-point mandolins, giant squids, and gypsy jazz petite-bouche soundholes.

    Yes, I would buy it, but not at that price. I would certainly lose my shirt on any future resale, as the Django-Squid market is quite small.
    Huh? What do you mean - resale? Sounds to me, given these factors, you are the perfect end consumer/lifetime owner for this unique artifact. Except for the price, I guess ...
    But that's just my opinion. I could be wrong. - Dennis Miller

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    Default Re: Ebay: Copy of a Lloyd Lane!

    Tell you what. This is one of the strangest episodes I've encountered on eBay. Not that I've been that active there, but still ...

    I don't understand why the seller doesn't just rewrite the description. Instead, he keeps adding to it, creating a running dialogue between himself and whomever may be keeping an eye on the developments. That doesn't matter a bit - all that matters is having a description that will make the instrument sound desirable. All this play-by-play blather is much more likely to send anyone curious running far and fast.

    Seriously - is this kind of yammering going to make anyone want anything to do with him or the item?

    ATTENTION.... ive been scolded about my listing heading saying ANDOLIN instead of MANDOLIN. in the heading they only allow so many letters,i used too many and it chopped off the M. but i didnt know until i was told,that noone would know what it was so i corrected for those who might mistake it as a different instrument called an ANDOLIN. AN ANDOLIN IS ONLY MADE FOR WOMEN WHO DONT WANT THE WORD MAN IN IT. AND IT WAS MADE BY A WOMEN ONLY FOR WOMEN. MADE BY ANN DOLIN. LOL I FIGURED ID EXPLAIN THIS AFTER BEING BEAT UP OVER IT.

    Please - just correct the copy. Trim it way down, keep it to the point, no caps, maybe you'll sell the blessed thing. It's a description, not a rant. And for goodness' sake, change it to "3-point," remove "Gibson," and find out how to spell the builder's name!
    But that's just my opinion. I could be wrong. - Dennis Miller

    Furthering Mandolin Consciousness

    Finders Keepers, my duo with the astoundingly talented and versatile Patti Rothberg. Our EP is finally done, and available! PM me, while they last!

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