Charlie Christian for the Non-Jazz-Mandolin Player

[crisscross]

Alas, such a book doesn't exist, but I think it would be a good idea. I'm not a big fan of jazz guitarists of the bebop or later eras, but I really like the short and sweet solos Charlie Christian played with Benny Goodman on such swing classics as "Rose Room", "Honeysuckle Rose", "I've found a new baby" or "The sheik of araby". That's why I bought a book with transcriptions of his guitar solos.
This afternoon, I started learning the solo to "Oh Lady be good", wich is in G-major, and I thought, that what he plays is not to far away from bluegrass lingo, so I might try it on the mandolin. It seemed to work
I still have to learn the whole solo and play a little more acurately, but I think I'll stick with the mando for this one.
So if any of the mandolin book authors happens to read this, think about publishing a book of Charlie Christian solos with mando tabs, a CD where a professional mandolin player plays half- and full-tempo versions and some nice pics.
I'd surely order it.

[GreenMTBoy]

Good Idea ,I would buy one in a heart beat !

[rubydubyr]

I like that, looking forward to the rest of it

[crisscross]

Another idea for the book: many of these tunes are in horn-player-friendly keys like A-flat-major or B-flat major. For the hardcore jazz mandolinist, this might be OK, but ordinary guys like me like to throw in an open string once in a while. So tunes in difficult keys could be transposed a half step up or down to a key, that allows open strings. I do that, when playing swing tunes like "Limehouse Blues", transpose it from Ab to G. Makes life much easier.

[Patrick Melly]

Our neighbor and Oingo Boingo guitarist, Stan Ayeroff, authored a study of Charlie Christian's guitar solos for Mel Bay... is that the book you're using?

http://www.melbay.com/Products/20196...christian.aspx

NFI

Patrick

[Pete Martin]

Here is Christians "Swing to Bop" solo. This arrangement is for 5 string mandolin (low C). Those with normal mandolins can transpose these notes up an octave.

[DavidKOS]

Great stuff! Any jazz string player should study Christian's guitar work.

[montana]

Try Airmail Special. Fun tune to play.

[DavidKOS]

Try Airmail Special. Fun tune to play.

Lovely fun tune - also "Flying Home", "7 come 11", and the version of Topsy called "Swing to Bop", as Pete pointed out, is outstanding:



http://www.jazzitalia.net/lezioni/pi...p#.VL05lWTF9pY

http://www.jazzitalia.net/lezioni/pi...p#.VL06VGTF9pY

http://www.jazzitalia.net/lezioni/pi...p#.VL06TWTF9pY

[crisscross]

Thanks for the hints and links. I saw the transcription of Christian's solo to "Swing to Bop" and appreciate it, but I think this is way beyound my ablilities. As I already mentioned, I'm no dyed-in-the-wool jazz musician. I had to plough my way through the first chorus of "Oh Lady be good" as through a classical piece ( and still cannot play it perfectly).
But I think Christian's solos to songs like "I found a new baby" or "Ida,Sweet as apple Cider" should appeal to people, whose idea of jazz is something like Grisman/Garcia's "Russian Lullaby".
There's even a version of Ida by Bill Haley. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOOL7PpL3fQ
Alas without a mando but with a clarinet.

And yes, I have the book by Stan Ayerhoff.

I think I'll play the second chorus on my Godin 5th ave, wich is badly unemployed during the last time, for the mandolin part I unearthed my Kentucky electric with the trebles cut off to do justice to Christian's electric Archtop sound.

[crisscross]

Well, after days of toil and sweat, I think I'll finally call it a day. Maybe a bass player friend of mine will add some walking bass, but my part is done.
I recorded the melody with my Irish tenor banjo.
The first chorus is played on my Lebeda F5. I toyed with the idea to use my 4-string electric, but it sounded too much like a tiny guitar, so I opted for an 8-string acoustic.
The second chorus is played on my Godin 5th ave, wich, true to the spirit of Charlie Christian has no cutaway.


Well thanks Charlie Christian and Stan Ayerhoff for giving a guy, who has absolutely no talent for improvisation, the possibillity to catch a glimpse of great swing playing.

[DavidKOS]

Nice work, keep it up!

[dwc]

I've been playing Seven Come Eleven. It lays out quite nicely on the mandolin in Bb.

[Pete Martin]

I've been playing Seven Come Eleven. It lays out quite nicely on the mandolin in Bb.

And in Ab, the standard key.

[dwc]

And in Ab, the standard key.

How would that (or would it) change the "B" section?

Right now I play the "A' section in Bb, basically the riff, twice, then the "B' section is 2 bars of A, 2 bars of D, 2 bars of G, a bar of C and a bar of F, then back into the "A' section, improvising over the whole form.

[DavidKOS]

How would that (or would it) change the "B" section?

Right now I play the "A' section in Bb, basically the riff, twice, then the "B' section is 2 bars of A, 2 bars of D, 2 bars of G, a bar of C and a bar of F, then back into the "A' section, improvising over the whole form.

It's just a whole step down.

The bridge becomes C7 F7 Bb7 Eb7.

The whole tune is a simplification of rhythm changes.

[Pete Martin]

Actually the bridge in Ab is

G7 C7 F7 Bb7 Eb7 not quite Rhythm Changes

The A part in the Christian Goodman version is just a long Ab chord.

[dwc]

Actually the bridge in Ab is

G7 C7 F7 Bb7 Eb7 not quite Rhythm Changes

The A part in the Christian Goodman version is just a long Ab chord.

This is what I thought, and why I thought Bb was an easier key. A,D,G,C, and F (or all 7ths versions) seem easier for string players. I mostly play with bluegrass musicians; they let me slip in one or two of my "jazzy songs" every now and then, but if I told them the chords were Ab, G7, C7, F7, Bb7 and Eb7 they would throw a capo at me, even though those really are not that much harder.

[crisscross]

but if I told them the chords were Ab, G7, C7, F7, Bb7 and Eb7 they would throw a capo at me, even though those really are not that much harder.

For chop chords Ab,Bb7 and Eb7 work as well as well as A,B and E7, but when soloing, it's nice to have the possibillity to play some open string licks.
Plus, you've got to think about those poor b***o players.

[DavidKOS]

Actually the bridge in Ab is

G7 C7 F7 Bb7 Eb7 not quite Rhythm Changes

The A part in the Christian Goodman version is just a long Ab chord.

I'm sorry I made an error and forgot the first G7 chord.....yes it really is "G7 C7 F7 Bb7 Eb7"


The Real book has the bridge as :

2 Measures G7, C7, F7, and 1 measure each of Bb7 and Eb7.

[DavidKOS]

For chop chords Ab,Bb7 and Eb7 work as well as well as A,B and E7, but when soloing, it's nice to have the possibillity to play some open string licks.
Plus, you've got to think about those poor b***o players.

The bass players have no issue with that key, Ab is easy enough in half and 1st position, and you get to use one open string!

You can use other open strings on the bridge chords.

[Pete Martin]

Open strings in keys like Ab are VERY useful. One example is the open D string is the b5 (#11). A line I play often in this key is (all notes on the D string) G F E D Eb and the C note on the G string. Very boppish sound.

The Open A string is the b9. The open E string the #5 for those augmented licks. And of course the open G string is the major 7. All these are very useful notes for Jazz lines.