Band Practice

[Jaded]

I've been playing with a gospel bluegrass group for a few months now. We have made some good progress, but lately we're starting to feel like we aren't getting as much out of our group practices as we could be.

Any good tips for gettin the most out of group sessions?

[bdisp]

Like any successful meeting, have an agenda. a.) intro to xyz song. b.) harmony vocals on abc song. And so on. Make sure you accomplish something at each "meeting".

Then.......play the heck out of your instruments and have FUN............

[John Flynn]

It is really helpful to be able to give people recordings and sheet music ahead of time and set a ground rule that everyone is expected to show up 100% ready to play each tune.

[Christopher Howard-Williams]

Every band has its own dynamics and its own ways of working. Having four or five people who all want to take the same approach to practice is hard enough! Getting a song 80% right is easy - it's the last 20% that is difficult and that takes the real hard work. I guess that's what makes the difference between most of us and them

[mandocrucian]

Ah, the eternal debate over the pros/cons of the efficiency of dictatorship vs. the chaos of democracy!

My choice is a rotating benevolent dictatorship. If it your song, then you have the final say about the best way to perform/arrange it. When it's someone else's, they have the final say on how to screw it up as badly as possible.

NH
<span style='font-size:8pt;line-height:100%'>Some days you eat the band, some days the band eats you!</span>

[mmukav]

"but lately we're starting to feel like we aren't getting as much out of our group practices as we could be."

Jaded--can you be more specific about what you're not getting out of practice? Learning new tunes? Tightening up existing ones?

One thing I've found is that things are feeling stale, book a gig. Even an opening for another band, or a short show at a community center. Something to spur you on, it gives you a goal to work towards. It also gives the band a sense of urgency, forces you to get things done. It works for us.

[gnelson651]

I also play in a church band and get furstrated with the lack of organization within our group. I really like our music director but he has no sense of direction.

I agree that you must have an agenda and also a goal to reach. In otherwords, when will you be playing for the next service or church gathering and what song set list to you want to play?

In our group, we just practice some of the same standards or sometimes get new music to try out with no other reason then to play them. This is OK for awhile but gets boring fast. It ends up being a jam session. The question in my mind then is this a band or a jam session? This can make a difference in the sound of the band and its dynamics.

I believe that strong leadership with a sense of direction is important for a group such as a church band.

[Jaded]

I think the main thing is that we feel like we're not really addressing the things that need to be improved. Generally we play a song once or twice and then move on the next one whether that song needs more work or not.

I'm guessing a combination of cluelessness about what needs to be worked on and desire not to hurt anyone's feelings is the main source of the problem. I do like Mandocrucians idea.

[TonyP]

I agree with the "rotating benevolent dictatorship". Over the years I've usually been the one who had to travel for practice and I've noticed the "locals" are always the ones who just want to have fun. Now we've got a guy who has to come 3 times as far and finally there's someone more serious about making practice count than me! I'm also going to get copies of our whole repertoire so everybody has a chance to call a song or tune to practice. There's only one right now and I think he's got preferences about stuff to play because of things like he doesn't like the keys or doesn't remember the song, or plain just don't like it. If everybody has a list they can make the call so they can get the practice they need. Recordings of practice are very helpful for everybody too. Mini disc, cassette or like I'm working on, my laptop to record and make cd's on the spot.

[MDW]

Our band is relatively new - about 9 months playing together in the current configuration. All of us are new to being in a band. I'm the defacto leader of the group and do most of the organizing but everyone contributes to our song selection and arrangement decisions. We practice weekly. I usually send out an email early in the week with a list of the songs we're going to work on. Newer material hits the rotation more frequently until we feel like we have it down and each practice also includes includes a number of our older tunes. We usualy try to add something new on a regular basis to keep things fresh. The person bringing in a new song is expected to provide lyric sheets with chord changes and a CD with the song on it. As a performance approaches we narrow our focus to the material that we'll be performing but try to keep working on one or two tunes, usually instrumentals, that won't be in the performance. We incorporate the work on the harmony vocals into the practice of the songs as they come up. We record ourselves a lot, both in practice and in performance, and often listen to the playback from a mididisc recorder during the same practice period to get immediate feedback on what's working and what isn't. We keep the informal stuff for just before and just after practice where we just pick and sing stuff as it strikes us - but that is kept outside the 2 hours we set aside for formal practice.

Deffinately have a plan on what you are going to play. Get a song list and work on a group. Dont overkill yourself. And if you having trouble on a song, Keep working on it! If you move on to something else when gig time comes your in for trouble.!

But most important Have Fun! Serve drinks and snacks to keep the energy going.

This stuff works in our group.

[mandowilli]

One someone is tunning everyone stops playing until that individual is done. Have a phrase that communicates this to everyone without ruffling any feathers. Always use the same phrase. In our group it is, "show some respect". You would not believe how much time this saves.

Don't try to teach a new tune to the entire group at once. Get together with one other member and learn it at least in its basic form before tackling as a group. This way, it is 2 showing 3, or 2 showing 4, as in my situation.

Learn to work on individual lines and passages of tunes as opposed to playing the entire song from the begining each time you want to correct or study an individual section. This is a very productive skill that will serve you greatly as a group. Don't kill yourself playing the tune from the begining every time you want to work on the bridge after the third verse!
Work on pieces of songs. The kickoff. An intro, an outro, turnaround, breakdown. Just the part you want to tighten up.

Work on a tune or a section once or twice and then move on. Write it down and do it one more time before the end of the session.

Last but not least, allow some time to chat and relax when it starts to happen. Being relaxed and friendly are the things that really enhance your performance and ultimately will be the bond that keeps it moving forward together as a unit.

willi
http://www.onestreetover.net/pages/1/index.htm

[dtb]

dang, you guys rock........all we do is drink beer, and play outa tune.

[Chip Booth]

Record record record. My band does regularly, everyone gets a CD, then we have a "post-mortem" afterwards. We use the recordings to figure out what works and what doesn't, and to keep a record of our unique arrangements. It's amazing what you can't hear when you are playing.

[Frankmc]

Practice on your own time--rehearse together. There is a difference.

[mandowilli]

Well, we do drink a bit of beer too...
But playing out of tune? Forget it!

willi

[dtb]

could be the beer.

you ever have those nights, where everything seems outa tune. sometimes it takes a while. I think all our ears are wore out from 30 years of picking together. It takes one little string, and next thing you know everyone is tweaking. I hate when that happens.

I like what one of you said about having a "code, signal" when someone needs to tune, so everyone "gives respect". We normally have to end up just yelling, "shut the **** up". lol

[straight-a]

We play through a song a few times to see if it "fits" the band. If it does, we go from there. We decide about kickoffs, breaks, how to stack the harmony, who backs up which verse and then we'll play it and take suggestions from the group about anything they heard or didn't hear and work it all out based upon the majority.

[Michael H Geimer]

Our song list has grown and grown and grown well beyond what we can cover in any one gig or practice. That's a good thing, but also a lot of material to keep in shape.

So, each song is on a list without about 5 or 6 others. There's the (A) list, the (B) list and so on. During the first part of practice we run through one of the lists. e.g. Tonight the (B) list is up, next week &copy;, etc. We'll run through it pretty much non-stop unless there is some particular trouble spot.

After we've covered that night's chore-list, we'll move on to new songs, or ideas that might require more dicussion and repetition.

One thing I really like about rotating list is that I know which songs are coming up each week, so I can use my personal time to iron out the details of my mandolin parts, knowing that the song will get played.

The guys had a good time trying to guess if there was hidden preferences of mine behind which songs went on which list. Ha! Nope. But, I will say that each list includes at least one song from each of our vocalists. Past that, it's just a list.

Similiarly, new material is on a separate list. As each new song reaches acceptable standards (our are quite low BTW), that song will get placed onto one of the global rotation lists, and presumably is also ready to get played out at gigs.

Agendas are a key factor to good progress! I'm glad I'm not the only one suggesting them. Also, assign homework due at the next practice ... within reason, or course.

"Uhhh Mike? See ... the things is ... the dog ate my harmony! "

- Benig

[GTison]

get a list
Play a song through. State that the Banjo is too loud on a certain passage. #play through again... Restate that the banjo is too loud on a certain passage. # (Others stare at the floor during this time)
Play a different tune note that the Banjo player is not singing the right harmony ( you call that harmony"). Guitar is puttin the run in the wrong place, and that the bass is dragging. Repeat song , Repeat complaints.
Next song.
exchange stern looks about which song to play, banjo player says we need to pick more and sing less. #Sigh. Stare at the floor.
everyone goes along as he fires into Pike Co. Breakdown. # after it's done he declairs how we gonna put that on the play list or he's gonna find somewhere else to pick. #(even though those little runs he does arn't clean at all. #No one dares to tell him it is not stage ready. #
the pair of brothers in the band start calling each other names and bring up old childhood fights while the others try to tune; one to himself the other to a tuner. #Different results occur. #Next song ... familiar results.
Practice continues happily along. #
You get the idea right? ... #... That's how we do it anyway . #hope that helps

[GTison]

get a list
Play a song through. State that the Banjo is too loud on a certain passage. #play through again... Restate that the banjo is too loud on a certain passage. # (Others stare at the floor during this time)
Play a different tune note that the Banjo player is not singing the right harmony ( you call that harmony"). Guitar is puttin the run in the wrong place, and that the bass is dragging. Repeat song , Repeat complaints.
Next song.
exchange stern looks about which song to play, banjo player says we need to pick more and sing less. #Sigh. Stare at the floor.
everyone goes along as he fires into Pike Co. Breakdown. # after it's done he declairs how we gonna put that on the play list or he's gonna find somewhere else to pick. #(even though those little runs he does arn't clean at all. #No one dares to tell him it is not stage ready. #
the pair of brothers in the band start calling each other names and bring up old childhood fights while the others try to tune; one to himself the other to a tuner. #Different results occur. #Next song ... familiar results.
Practice continues happily along. #
You get the idea right? ... #... That's how we do it anyway . #hope that helps

[Michael H Geimer]

Bowfinger,
You hit on that oh-so-vital aspect of practice time - the giving and taking of contructive criticism. Touchy stuff.

We recently said "Bye!" to our precussionist beacuse of his inability to discuss the songs. It came to a head one night when Dobro player Billy got up to start a song - one of his originals no less! He looked back at us and said, "Now let's make sure we get the tempo just right." and started chopping the 2's and 4's to set time.

Bongoboy snapped, "Don't you ever tell me what tempo to play a song!"

Ooops. Where'd that come from! So, make sure you're working with folks that can discuss the material without ego-barriers.

It helps to have a protocol in place for handling creative differences. I prefer a system where the suggestion that is brought up get tried. Period. No pre-emptive shooting down of someone's idea without trying it first.

Then, if you or I have a different take on the issue, we can try those ideas too. The 'owner' of the song (usually the singer or songwriter) makes the final decision.

Without prior agreement on conflict resolution, stalemates can pop up quick!

Jaded, you do realize that just by asking this question, you have stepped up as Band Leader? Be carefull what you wish for!

- Benig

[bsimmers]

I agree that practice is 'alone time.' And rehearsals are for arrangements. I like to pick, but I think 95% of bands spend too little time on vocal arrangements, too much time on instrumentals and breaks. Or maybe pickin' and singin' don't go hand in hand in bluegrass. If you're playing out, good vocals are it. To get the vocal arrangements, unless everyone understands harmony, taping practice is essential. I think Pete Wernick said in Frets Magazine years ago, 'If you have really good vocals, your picking doesn't have to be stellar, but the reverse is not true.'

"You always wanna do somethin' else just when I wanna do somethin' else." Ernest T. Bass

[Tom C]

It seems since I do not sing, I have no say. I just play.

[Michael H Geimer]

" It seems since I do not sing, I have no say. I just play. "
- Tom C

I can't really tell if you're being serious of midly sarcastic, but I think there is truth to what you say regardless. Of course, there are also fiddle tunes and other instrumentals that should allow non-singers to involve themselves.

I was a non-singing member of a band for many years - most of musical life in fact. Even though I was an active songwriter, and held many ideas about arrangements my expereice taught me that Vocals Trump All.

As a non-singer that was a bitter pill to swallow. But unless you're a bone-fide vocal coach, it's very difficult to tell someone how you think they should sing a song. It's just too personal, both physically and artistcally.

That doesn't mean opinions can't or shouldn't be expressed by non-singers, but I do think the vocalist needs to have the final word about what and how they sing. It's just practical.

Apologies if anyone thinks I'm getting too involved in this topic. I am certainly enjoying it!