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Thread: Price Haggling??

  1. #1
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    Default Price Haggling??

    I have a question for the other builders out there. Do you have folks wanting to haggle over the price of one of your new mandolins? Is it normal for people to question what you charge, and then start throwing out "well, I can get a <insert name here> for a lot less than what you're asking for yours".
    Just curious.

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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    For my benchmade violins, nobody has done that. Would be a curious thing to experience.
    Stephen Perry

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    Registered User sunburst's Avatar
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Quote Originally Posted by Kent Barnes View Post
    Is it normal for people to question what you charge, and then start throwing out "well, I can get a <insert name here> for a lot less than what you're asking for yours".
    Just curious.
    Seems to be pretty normal for people to do that. It can be even worst in retail, where stores are "competing" with online sales.

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    Registered User Timbofood's Avatar
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Seems a bit ballsy to me, when you go to a "custom" build, I would think the price will be negotiated with respect to what specifics the customer desires and the skill of the luthier and the time for the build. Me response,would be something along the lines of, " If "_________" can build what you ask for your price, go see him, I have the right to make a profit here too."
    Some people just want to feel like they got one over on a builder/company/ store, etc. They have to play "Let's make a deal!" I have never liked that game playing.
    Timothy F. Lewis
    "If brains was lard, that boy couldn't grease a very big skillet" J.D. Clampett

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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    This one wasn't a 'custom build' - more of a 'spec mandolin', and I didn't think my price was "super expensive" (as the prospective buyer stated). I thought I was pretty much in line (and mostly cheaper, given that I'm not a household name) than most of the other custom/handmade builders I've seen.
    I was just curious, as I haven't had any experience with this either. Personally, if I was buying some handmade product, I would do my research and know what I wanted to spend, and then go looking for items in my price range. Also, I would think the maker had a pretty good idea of what is was worth, and what folks would be willing to pay for said item. Otherwise, I don't think they'd be in business for very long.

  10. #6

    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    I believe this is normal, but that doesn't mean you should participate in the process!

    Some people just want to feel like they got one over on a builder/company/ store, etc. They have to play "Let's make a deal!" I have never liked that game playing.
    I fully agree here! Everyone likes to feel like they received a good deal (and there is nothing wrong with that). Some push this way too far. With few exceptions, the customers that push for the lowest prices are also the customers that require the most work after the sale and are more likely to be unhappy with the instrument or find problems with it. "Something is not right with this mandolin, it won't stay in tune." "I lowered the action down where I like it and the mandolin is buzzing. My last mandolin played fine at 1/64th!"

    You may well be dealing with this customer for decades after the sale. Price accordingly and if you are going to give discounts, do if for those that will not require abnormal amounts of customer service.
    Robert Fear
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    "Education is when you read the fine print; experience is what you get when you don't.
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  12. #7
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    I used to spend time with an old fellow who sold aged and hard to find auto parts and related stuff. He ended all negotiations the same way by simply saying "It's a fair price-" with no particular inflection. Quick and to the point.
    Jim

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    Registered User jim simpson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    I would't expect haggling with a maker who has set prices for models, features ,etc. It seems expected for the used market. I have been amused at some of the (outragious) offers on things I've had listed.
    Old Hometown, Cabin Fever String Band

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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    speaking s a hobbyist in buying and selling, and not a builder, people haggle a lot more now than they used to. I think they watch those "American pickers" and "Canadian pickers" tv shows. the best advice here was from folk musician.com. people who haggle also want throw ins, come back for ever with complaints and will lecture you on things they obviously know nothing about. I had a guy say a guitar I was selling was bellying and that that was causing the intonation to go flat. he was quite long winded and descriptive that when the bridge comes closer to the nut that was causing the intonation to go flat. he was way off, there was no flattening but it's the exact opposite. shorten the vibrating string length and the note sharpens. I tried to explain it a couple of times and realized he didn't understand. (and thought he had found a flaw to drive the price down--and this was on a vintage era lowden guitar) I got him out the door as fast as I could--wasting time.(the guy who actually bought the guitar came over, we went to a guitar tech he knew who checked it out, a ok on all issues, and made a cash offer and counted off the money).

    the consistent thing with actual buyers, is they want to try the instrument, and play it and then make a serious offer, or decide against it. real buyers are quick to make up their minds. same with long distance. they ask questions, and want pictures, and make an offer or pass. they don't waste a lot of time.

    some people do this as a pass time and sure they will buy if they can get a quick profit, but not otherwise.

    when I have bought a new instrument direct from a maker I have usually played them, know the price range, and take about twenty minutes to play and then pay. instruments are not all the same even by the same maker, so you want to see if it's the one you had in your ear. I prefer the sound over the bling. I have passed on very ornate instruments for a plain jane by the same maker which really made my ear pop. the trick with that is there are a lot of people who don't actually have an ear. they can't work out riffs and melodies quicky by ear because they can't hear the details of music. they buy what their heros play, and want bling over sound, and price over beauty. Gibson guitar company made a career on that.

    I have never regretted paying asking price to a maker for an instrument I loved the sound of, and loved playing. and I have never had a maker that you treated well not help with set up and details later.

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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    And there's always the "I'm your best customer" gambit, usually followed by"What's your best price?" My answer was, depending on the situation, "A hundred dollars more than what it's marked." It's just frustrating when you deal with that kind of hoo ha all the time.
    I suppose one way around feeling like you're always getting beat up on price is mark them up an extra "X" number of dollars then let them play their game or, like those places always offering "WOW, 50%-70% OFF"!!!!! Mark it up to mark it down, shady as far as I am concerned. Or simply mark it fairly and not quibble.
    Pricing things is kind of an art, you have to really think about what your time and talent is worth, it's a difficult thing to learn. You have to weigh the learning part of your time too.
    Timothy F. Lewis
    "If brains was lard, that boy couldn't grease a very big skillet" J.D. Clampett

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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Give em an eighty year warranty and for every $100 dollars you knock off the price, knocks 35 years off the warranty.

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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Its like asking for the "Good Guy" discount.
    A talent for trivializin' the momentous and complicatin' the obvious.

    The entire staff
    funny....

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    Registered User Tom C's Avatar
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Haggling is fine if you are buying a used mandolin. Buying from a builder, you accept their pricing or move on. Just my opinion.

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  22. #14
    Adrian Minarovic
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    I experienced this once. Potential customer asked me how much my custom built mandolin costs. I told him basic price and he asked why that xy guy builds for much less than I do. The other guy is my friend, as we are the only two guys making archtop mandolins in this country, and we both know how we work and what we charge and never even thought about comparing our pricing. We often compared our mandolins and tested then all in good friendly atmosphere.
    I found the question silly and my immediate reply was "go ask HIM why he charges what he does... all I can say it that this is cost of my time spent doing best job I can." The customer never asked again, but few months later he ordered custom build for the price I quoted abnd still owns the mandolin, years later.
    Adrian

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  24. #15
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Haggling is fine if you are buying a used mandolin. Buying from a builder, you accept their pricing or move on. Just my opinion.
    I agree. If they can get what they want cheaper elsewhere, bye bye and good luck.
    Peter Coombe - mandolins, mandolas and guitars
    http://www.petercoombe.com

  25. #16
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    This stuff is probably common to any business. How this is dealt with, is the difference between a business that survives and thrives; and a business that starts up and dies within a few short years.
    I think pricing is important; but possibly respect is more the key. Personal, mutual, and shared.
    Bellowing hagglers lack respect.
    I you know your business, and can hang on until the rocket launches, you will have earned respect - but you might need to provide that for yourself in the early days. And the bellower has his hand in your pocket, and might have a sweet voice.

    I used to have a rule for my customers in the service business that I ran. The rule was a bit of a joke; but it turned out to be deadly serious, more than I ever expected. The rule: "My customers are required to be happy". My initial understanding of this was a light-hearted joke. My failure to enforce it cost me dearly; in more ways than I ever knew.

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  26. #17
    Registered User David Houchens's Avatar
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    If the customer is unhappy because I won't lose money so they can save money, that's them making themselves unhappy. I've dealt with a few and as said above, they're not gonna be completely satisfied even then.

  27. #18
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Do not stand for it. Stick to your price point and if the "buyer" wants to spend less on the other builder, let him.
    Charley

    A bunch of stuff with four strings

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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Agree with everything said except that buyers make up their minds and buy or reject quickly. If I am spending over a couple hundred dollars, I think about it for some time, not that I think it's not worth the asking price, that's easy "no thank you, not today". The hard question is do I want it enough to spend the money.I've lost out on things that I finally decided that I wanted because I waited too long.

  29. #20
    Registered User mee's Avatar
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    I have been on the other side when I did not buy because I couldn't afford it and was chewed out because they had "offered" a good price and I didn't buy. I never asked or expected a better price. I simply did not have the money they wanted.
    But back on the seller side, I think it is that way for most retailers that deal directly with customers. I know of many retailers that up their price so they can give a discount, it is so common practice that buyers now expect it from everyone.

  30. #21
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    I was a concrete contractor known for top quality stamped concrete work. I constantly got the question of why I was more expensive than company X, Y, and Z. When this one arrogant rich customer told me I was taking away his kids college money, I simply told him not to feel bad and that he was giving MY son a chance to go to college. He looked at me kind of quizzically, chuckled, and gave me the work anyway.
    Some folks will try to talk you down no matter how much money they have. You've just got to make them realize that you have a right to make a living too.
    It ain't gotta be perfect, as long as it's perfect enough!

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  32. #22
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    When I had Bernie Lehmann build my 10-string, we discussed body wood (curly koa), top wood (Adirondack), body shape (two-point), and then he quoted me a price. If I hadn't accepted it, which I did, I would have asked him if there were modifications he could make in the build, to make it less expensive. Wouldn't have expected to get the same specs for less money.

    Having said that, there probably are changes that can be made to reduce costs, with the understanding that -- while basic quality is maintained -- there may be lesser cosmetics, rosewood fingerboard instead of ebony, different tuning machines, etc.

    Any commercial firm building mandolins has a variety of models in different price ranges. Individual builders may not offer a range of styles -- though some do, see "F-model vs. A-model" -- but there well could be some room for negotiation.

    On the other hand, if a builder views "negotiation" as "haggling," an adversarial element has already appeared...
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    It's in the nature of some folks to want to get the rock bottom price for everything. If you offered them the things for free,they'd still want a discount. If any luthier's building for a living,then there should be a 'set price' for every style of mandolin he /she makes.After that,if a customer wants one at a lesser price,then the builder can make suggestions as to what he can do in order to reduce the cost,very much as Allen Hopkins advises. If that isn't acceptable,then the customer should be advised to 'go elsewhere' - very politely of course. It may very well happen,that having had a look around,the customer might decide to bite the bullet & return to his first choice,
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  35. #24
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Nobody makes an offer on an instrument that they DONT want to buy. Stay firm on the price, if they don't want it then let them go.

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  37. #25
    Registered User Petrus's Avatar
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    Default Re: Price Haggling??

    Seems to be a cultural and contextual issue. Usually if the seller is amenable to negotiation they'll indicate this in the advertisement or listing. Ebay has a "Make an Offer" button that I occasionally use within set parameters (usually 20% below the Buy It Now price.) People who haggle are not necessarily being malicious, they may just be so used to haggling in their experience that they automatically assume a seller has priced a haggling premium into the initial stated price!

    I've traveled to a lot of countries where haggling is actually expected. On many small items the initial stated price may be twice or three times what it is actually expected to sell for. If someone is offering something for 100 rupees I'll usually offer 30, let him come back with 70, then we may finally agree on 50.

    I agree that it's poor form to haggle on a commissioned work from a trusted luthier. Of course, if for some reason you think the person may be a haggler, you can always incorporate a haggling premium into your starting price so that they can still end up feeling like they got a deal.

    On eBay this is paralleled somewhat by having a very high "Buy It Now" price coupled with a low starting bid. I may offer a rare book with a Buy It Now of, say, $200, but a starting bid of $50. Often there is only one bid and the person wins it for $50 and feels like they got a screaming deal. In actuality I was happy to get the $50.

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