Snark tuner

[ionzi-removed]

Has anyone got any experience of the snark all instrument tuner? Thanks
I had qwiktune and found it didn't work very well...

[Johnny60]

Hi Ionzi, there's a sizeable thread on snark tuners further down the page, which might be of interest. I've been using a Snark on guitar and Mando for around 2 years with no issues. Hope this helps,

John

[Tobin]

Snarks are pretty popular, and for good reason. They work well, no muss, no fuss, and they don't cost much. I have several of them (SN-8 model) and think they're the best bang for the buck out there. They're accurate enough to get you on pitch, but of course you'll still have to dial in your double-courses by ear to get them perfect. They're easy to read and the batteries last a long time if you only turn them on when you're actually tuning up.

That said, they are kind of fragile if you're not careful with them. My wife broke the little plastic collar that holds the neck piece to the clip. So you have to be careful about twisting and bending the display, or cramming it in a case.

[Drew Egerton]

I've been using one for about two years and love it. If it acts weird in a group setting, make sure you have VIB picked instead of MIC. Also double checked that it is still on 440 once in a while as I have accidentally bumped it off before.


My only problem with mine is this: I recently had the little rubber cover come off of one side of the clamp. Not a problem the first time as I just slipped it back on....the next time however I noticed it was gone and nowhere to be found. I've been playing in a few different places to no telling where it might be now.

I am thinking if I can find another suitable common household material I could just glue it there but not sure what to use.
Has anybody had this issue?

[allenhopkins]

1. The rubber pad on the "upper" side of the clamp has a tendency to wander. Not a bad idea to pull it off yourself and put a drop or two of Duco cement on the clamp, put the pad back on. I've done this on a couple of my Snarks (I have four or five scattered among my instruments).

2. The ball joint on which the "head" swivels is also not super-sturdy, though I have only had one actually break. I then glued the joint into a fixed position, with the aforementioned Duco cement.

3. Snarks supposedly have a two-minute "dead man" switch that turns them off if they don't "hear" any vibrations for two minutes. Maybe so; but if you inadvertently leave the selector switch on "MIC" they'll hear ambient noise and not shut down, and bye-bye battery. Same if you leave your tuner clamped to your instrument while playing. You can use a lot of batteries that way.

4. Overall, my favorite tuner. Kinda hard to read the display in bright light, and it's very "angle sensitive," if you know what I mean; you can only read it when looking straight at it -- if it's tipped to one side or another it's unreadable. But I see Snarks all over now among the musicians with whom I play. The "MIC" feature makes it usable for instruments like Autoharp, which don't have headstocks on which to clamp regular tuners.

[JeffD]

I love them. I have the black snark and I use it all the time.

[Bill Baldridge]

I have lots of tuners and the Snark works about as well as any of them.

[Ron McMillan]

I had one. The spring on the clip is w-a-y too fierce, so if there is ANY softness at all on the headstock finish it will find it and mark it, badly. The coating on mine (a red one) degenerated, became soft and mushy - and spread red dye on any finger that ever touched it. It is also oversized and seriously ugly. Never again.

I have three Planet Waves Micros. Tiny, unobtrusive, easy to read, good on batteries - and no heavy spring to inflict damage on the headstock.

[zedmando]

4. Overall, my favorite tuner. Kinda hard to read the display in bright light, and it's very "angle sensitive," if you know what I mean; you can only read it when looking straight at it -- if it's tipped to one side or another it's unreadable.

Really?
I find it easy to read from different angles.
Much easier to read than any other clip on tuner I've seen or tried--some that cost 3 or 4 times as much.

[John Flynn]

I have TAS (Tuner Acquisition Syndrome), so I have at least one of just about every tuner out there. I have three red Snarks. Overall, I like them. I like that they are easy to read. The pads do tend to come off, so the glue idea is a good one. Snark has great customer service, BTW. I lost a pad and they sent me some new ones immediately, no charge. I don't like that they are "clunky." They don't lay flat, so they take up more room in a pocket or case compartment. My favorite tuner for performance is the Intelli 500.

[Jeff Mando]

I've got a Snark, works great, but I don't like clamping anything to my peghead and leaving it there. So, I clamp it, tune, then put it in the case, and play. For me two issues: First, they look ugly. When did we decide we wanted to clamp something onto a beautiful peghead that a luthier designed for our viewing pleasure? Like the Kyser capo craze of a few years ago--everybody had one clampled to their guitar peghead, even if they didn't perform a song requiring a capo! Just leaving it there! How about sticking it in your back jeans pocket? That's what I do. I put my slide in my front jeans pocket. Kyser experienced one of the greatest free advertising campaigns ever created--as seen on stage and television......and friends, it looks ugly on there! Secondly, there is a over-obsession (if that is a diagnosis?) with being in tune. Sure, tune up before you start, then play. No need to retune or touch-up between each song. If your instrument is any good it will stay in tune for an hour....without retuning. If it needs touched-up, use your ear--it couldn't have drifted that far in only a few minutes....could it have? And thirdly, did Bill Monroe, Earl Scruggs, or Jimmy Martin need a cheap plastic thing hanging from their pegheads? Just looks bad. Do you also want to hang scarves or feathers from you peghead?

I know I'm weird and in a minority on this. Some people put big chrome rims on a Cadillac, after Cadillac spent millions engineering the rims that come with your vehicle. Doesn't sound like a good idea to me. Of course, I also think middle-aged guys wearing shorts look weird, especially on stage. My friend recently invited me to see his "blues band" perform--it was outdoors and three of the five guys were wearing shorts????? They looked like three year olds up there. The goal is to look cool! I told him to take the whole band downtown and buy some blues brothers suits, hats, and sunglasses--and I would send him a bill for being a fashion consultant....

I could go on...the cell phone thing....who, besides the president and maybe a doctor on call, needs to be able to be contacted 24 hours a day? I put the thing in a drawer, when I get home, so I can't hear it and be bothered. If it's a hobby thing, I get it, something to do, your own personal travel video game......

What was so bad about 1957? Just sayin....

[allenhopkins]

...When did we decide we wanted to clamp something onto a beautiful peghead that a luthier designed for our viewing pleasure?...Secondly, there is a over-obsession (if that is a diagnosis?) with being in tune. Sure, tune up before you start, then play. No need to retune or touch-up between each song. If your instrument is any good it will stay in tune for an hour....without retuning...And thirdly, did Bill Monroe, Earl Scruggs, or Jimmy Martin need a cheap plastic thing hanging from their pegheads?...What was so bad about 1957?...

Well, in 1957 there were no tuners as we know them; Conn had a Strobo-Tuner that was the size of a toaster oven and considerably more expensive, so toting one to a gig was pretty much out of the question. People made do with pitch-pipes and tuning forks. One of my early-'60's memories is watching Mike Seeger tuning his Autoharp with a series of harmonicas -- recognizing that the harmonicas were tempered-tuned, so that an "A" on one might be slightly different from an "A" on another, since each was set up to sound "correct" in a diatonic scale based on a different key.

Electronic tuners were a welcome answer to some of these problems. I remember Robin Williams (of Robin & Linda) telling me, "The electronic tuner saved our marriage," cutting down on the arguments over who was in tune and who wasn't.

There are now tiny weenie tuners that one can attach to the headstock, and not have them noticeable from six feet away. I bought a couple of these to improve the "look" of my instruments, but having a tuner readily accessible for "touch-up" tuning mid-performance seems to me to override esthetic considerations. Plus, some of us retune guitars or banjos mid-performance, and while I consider my ear pretty reliable, it's nice to have a standard-pitch authority to confirm what the ear tells me.

And as for what Monroe, Scruggs or Martin did or didn't do -- I see quite a few recognized professional acoustic musicians with tuners clamped to their headstocks, and for those who "plug in," who knows which ones have "stomp box" tuners somewhere in the signal chain? Plus the acoustic-electric guitars with tuners built right into the instrument. I'd guess that after umpteen years of playing, many of the "greats" could tune their instruments to pitch without needing any external reference; "perfect pitch" can be learned, and putting a mandolin into GDAE for 50 years, you get pretty familiar with what that sounds like.

It's sort of like the debate about capos; some see them as a crutch, others as an optional tool. I'd be pretty lost without an electronic tuner now, though I still keep a couple tuning forks in my gig bag, just in case (or "in bag," as it were).

[jaycat]

I know I'm weird and in a minority on this.

Me too. Count me in.

[Tobin]

I've got a Snark, works great, but I don't like clamping anything to my peghead and leaving it there. So, I clamp it, tune, then put it in the case, and play. For me two issues: First, they look ugly.

Me too. I only put it on to tune up, then put it away (but within reach if I need it). I strongly dislike having a tuner clamped to my instrument, even if it were small and virtually unnoticeable from a distance.

Secondly, there is a over-obsession (if that is a diagnosis?) with being in tune. Sure, tune up before you start, then play. No need to retune or touch-up between each song. If your instrument is any good it will stay in tune for an hour....without retuning. If it needs touched-up, use your ear--it couldn't have drifted that far in only a few minutes....could it have?

I'm gonna have to disagree with you here. A few weeks ago I played at a jam that was in an open-air environment in the afternoon/evening, from about 5:30 until about 10:00. It was hot and sunny outside when we started, and I tuned up. We were under a roof, in the shade. As evening came on, the sun got lower and was shining at an angle under the roof line right onto my mandolin, which made it go significantly flat. Then, as evening turned to dusk, the sun went away and the temperature fell, causing even more tuning issues.

It's a myth that high-quality mandolins stay in tune better than cheap ones (or I should say they go out of tune for different reasons than cheap ones). Because they are built lighter/thinner and closer to the edge of structural safety (for volume and tone purposes), they are more reactive to temperature and humidity changes. Mine even changes after the first 15 minutes as it warms up to my body and hands. I usually have to twiddle with the A strings, as they seem to be the most hysterical of the courses for going out of tune. It will generally settle down for hours of playing if the environment is stable. But when there are big temperature/humidity changes over the course of a session, it does require readjustment. Not tuning back up is rude to everyone else. When my tuning has changed so much that it's going to take a total redo on all 8 strings, I'll grab my tuner and step outside or away from the group to get my instrument back where it belongs, rather than continue to play out of tune or waste their time trying to get it all back by ear with no overall reference tone. It's just the polite thing to do.

[DWM]

To the OP - go with the new SN-8 Snark model. It uses vibration only, no mic. It's more accurate and sensitive that the previous models. Tune, turn it off and take it off. You can clip it to your front pocket edge so it's out of the way but accessible.

[Drew Egerton]

I'd just like to report some high praise to Snark and their customer service as a follow up to my first post here.
Also, THANKS to John above. After reading his post I decided what the heck I will send them an email about my lost rubber cap.
I offered to pay given I ordered from Amazon over 2 years ago.

25 minutes later I had an email back saying that they would send one free of charge.
In return, I hope someone here decides to try one out knowing they have good customer service!

[Ron McMillan]

I'd just like to report some high praise to Snark and their customer service as a follow up to my first post here.
Also, THANKS to John above. After reading his post I decided what the heck I will send them an email about my lost rubber cap.
I offered to pay given I ordered from Amazon over 2 years ago.

25 minutes later I had an email back saying that they would send one free of charge.
In return, I hope someone here decides to try one out knowing they have good customer service!

To be fair to the nice people at Snark, when I discussed my faulty tuner a while back, I was quickly contacted by a representative who promised to send me a new one, despite the fact that I live in Thailand. Sadly it never arrived, but I prefer to think that might be the fault of the postal service out here.

rm

[journeybear]

I don't like clamping anything to my peghead and leaving it there.

Me neither. The clip makes it easy-on, easy-off. That's the intent. But, you know, do as you see fit.

But I'll tell you something that just baffles me. Many times I've seen someone on a talk show appearance with a clip-on tuner on the headstock while performing. Really? Are they afraid they'll go out of tune during the one song they're going to do? And if so, what - are they going to stop and tune in the middle of it? I used to shake my head at the folks who would have a mike stand pick holder loaded up with picks during one of these appearances, as if they are really going to need all those spares to get through one song. The tuner thing is similar but worse.

[MysTiK PiKn]

I've got a Snark, works great, but I don't like clamping anything to my peghead and leaving it there. So, I clamp it, tune, then put it in the case, and play. For me two issues: First, they look ugly. When did we decide we wanted to clamp something onto a beautiful peghead that a luthier designed for our viewing pleasure? Like the Kyser capo craze of a few years ago--everybody had one clampled to their guitar peghead, even if they didn't perform a song requiring a capo! Just leaving it there! How about sticking it in your back jeans pocket? That's what I do. I put my slide in my front jeans pocket. Kyser experienced one of the greatest free advertising campaigns ever created--as seen on stage and television......and friends, it looks ugly on there! Secondly, there is a over-obsession (if that is a diagnosis?) with being in tune. Sure, tune up before you start, then play. No need to retune or touch-up between each song. If your instrument is any good it will stay in tune for an hour....without retuning. If it needs touched-up, use your ear--it couldn't have drifted that far in only a few minutes....could it have? And thirdly, did Bill Monroe, Earl Scruggs, or Jimmy Martin need a cheap plastic thing hanging from their pegheads? Just looks bad. Do you also want to hang scarves or feathers from you peghead?

I know I'm weird and in a minority on this. Some people put big chrome rims on a Cadillac, after Cadillac spent millions engineering the rims that come with your vehicle. Doesn't sound like a good idea to me. Of course, I also think middle-aged guys wearing shorts look weird, especially on stage. My friend recently invited me to see his "blues band" perform--it was outdoors and three of the five guys were wearing shorts????? They looked like three year olds up there. The goal is to look cool! I told him to take the whole band downtown and buy some blues brothers suits, hats, and sunglasses--and I would send him a bill for being a fashion consultant....

I could go on...the cell phone thing....who, besides the president and maybe a doctor on call, needs to be able to be contacted 24 hours a day? I put the thing in a drawer, when I get home, so I can't hear it and be bothered. If it's a hobby thing, I get it, something to do, your own personal travel video game......

What was so bad about 1957? Just sayin....

Thanks JM
You saved me a whole lot of typing.
People dumping money into this billion dollar biz don't know that a tuning fork or a pitchpipe - never run out of battery power - which supports another billion dollar biz - you lose, TWICE.
I've said it before - you tune with a tuna, and my ears will correct it. They are inherently always an approximation - as the needle moves, it's telling you it's still WRONG. o well.

In a jam, the tuna gets passed around - when the music starts I tune to EVERYBODY - they are all off tune. General average works even better than a tuna.

I heard of something new out there that uses a piezo electric in reverse to self power - dunno what it is yet. No more investments in battery LANDFILL.

1957? I know 67 was a fun time.

[catmandu2]

Mike Seeger tuning his Autoharp with a series of harmonicas -- recognizing that the harmonicas were tempered-tuned, so that an "A" on one might be slightly different from an "A" on another, since each was set up to sound "correct" in a diatonic scale based on a different key.

The reeds/pitches on "standard" harmonicas (and accordians) are well-standardized. Sure, they can get worn and slightly off, sometimes. But chances are that the reeds (of any given collection of quality standard free-reed instruments) are closer in unison than most given collections of string players. I use a pitch-pipe to tune my harps - when I need a reference pitch; I sometimes use harmonicas if I can't find my pipe, or use my pipe when I can't find my harmonicas.. My guess is that he used the different harmonicas (in different keys) for different pitches - which is the same thing I do. It's just expedience - If you're a harmonica player, then no need to carry a pitch pipe.

Myself, I've never owned an e-tuner in my life. I've used them once or twice, though - on stage, when I couldn't hear myself. But I may be an exception to the norm. Like Allen says - it probably solves a lot of problems for folks with tuning challenges.

[allenhopkins]

As someone who's played harmonica frequently for 40+ years, I have found that the "C" note on your "C" ten-hole diatonic harmonica may be slightly different from the "C" note on your "F" harmonica. They're tuned to be accurate for different individual scales, rather than "tempered" to accommodate a variety of keys. The difference may be minuscule, but actually, if you check with an electronic tuner, you'll sometimes find a few cents' difference.

Could also be due to wear, or, in some cases, the difference between a "blown" and a "drawn" note. And of course the situation is somewhat exacerbated when transferred to the Autoharp, which plays a series of chords that need to be tuned to sound correct. Sometimes one tweaks the Autoharp's tuning to compromise and get all 12 or 15 or 21 chords to sound acceptable.

In any case, I've found that a chromatic electronic tuner is mucho preferable, to using a series of reeds to which to tune the Autoharp. And the last time I was around Mike Seeger and his instrument, he was using one to tune his (diatonically tuned) Autoharp. If you don't need a tuner to stay in tune, I envy you, but I'd be lost without mine. I can do most touch-up tweaking by ear, but my Snark (or whatever tuner I'm using today) is a necessary accessory, IMHO.

[catmandu2]

As someone who's played harmonica frequently for 40+ years, I have found that the "C" note on your "C" ten-hole diatonic harmonica may be slightly different from the "C" note on your "F" harmonica. They're tuned to be accurate for different individual scales, rather than "tempered" to accommodate a variety of keys. The difference may be minuscule, but actually, if you check with an electronic tuner, you'll sometimes find a few cents' difference.

Could also be due to wear, or, in some cases, the difference between a "blown" and a "drawn" note. And of course the situation is somewhat exacerbated when transferred to the Autoharp, which plays a series of chords that need to be tuned to sound correct. Sometimes one tweaks the Autoharp's tuning to compromise and get all 12 or 15 or 21 chords to sound acceptable.

In any case, I've found that a chromatic electronic tuner is mucho preferable, to using a series of reeds to which to tune the Autoharp. And the last time I was around Mike Seeger and his instrument, he was using one to tune his (diatonically tuned) Autoharp. If you don't need a tuner to stay in tune, I envy you, but I'd be lost without mine. I can do most touch-up tweaking by ear, but my Snark (or whatever tuner I'm using today) is a necessary accessory, IMHO.

I don't disagree with anything there - drawing/blowing and embouchure on reeds certainly does produce noticeable variations. A pitch-pipe is preferable, but in a pinch a harmonica works.

But when folks say - touch-up/tweaking by ear, etc. - isn't pretty much all tuning just tweaking? What do you use the e-tuner for - to get in the ballpark or something ? Seems like getting in the ballpark is the fastest part of the process.. Even with all the hauling of large and temperamental gear I have - nothing is anything more than "tweaking" - unless you break a string or something.. Nothing is ever more than like 1 or 2 half-steps out, and if it was you just ratchet it back where it belongs (in the neighborhood).

I mean, I'm not advocating for - don't use tuners or anything - I certainly have no pony at the parade. But, just wondering...I have no idea.

Let me put it this way: using either pitch of two (or more) quality harmonicas (in good condition) will get you as reasonably close and "tweakable" as a tuner, wouldn't it? I mean, it would on my harps, anyway..

I don't want to sound *snarky* - in fact I've been contemplating and reading about them (Korg CA-1 or CA-40 - for harp) and wondering if it could help me. The harp is a beast.

[allenhopkins]

Some good points. However, "getting in the ballpark" sorta depends on the size of your ballpark (Wrigley Field vs. the LA Colosseum). I use the tuner to set up my instruments at the beginning of a performance; make sure that all the strings appear to be standard-pitch-accurate. Not uncommonly, since I'm taking them around to gigs in various environments, an instrument will have gone sharp or flat in entirety, so that the strings are in decent relative pitch but not accurate as to absolute pitch.

Once I have the instruments tuned accurately, and I start playing, I can correct strings that slip out of pitch by ear, in most cases. That's what I meant by "tweaking." For example, putting a capo on a 12-string guitar above the second fret, nearly always implies that the heavier string of each course will sound sharp to the lighter string. I can correct that easily without resorting to an electronic tuner -- though it's nice to be able to check my adjustment against the tuner reading.

Then there's retuning, which is really common with the banjo. Again, I can handle this "by ear" most of the time, but again, an electronic reference point's useful. My main gigging banjo is a "Pete Seeger"-style long-neck, so I'm moving the capo around from open string to seventh fret frequently. As you're no doubt aware, changing the scale length that drastically from one song to another results in changes in intonation; the "12th fret fretted/harmonic" pitch check that works when the instruments uncapoed, will sound somewhat "out" when the new "octave" fret is the 15th or 19th fret.

Finally, working with a vibration-sensing electronic tuner is just simpler than using a blown note on harmonica or pitch-pipe; it's an easier mechanical action, rather than stopping, getting out the reference instrument, blowing into it, putting it down, tuning the string, checking it again. With an electronic device attached to the instrument, there's just a lot less fussing, which can be significant if you're in a performance situation.

IMHO every musician should be able to correct minor tuning problems "on the fly" without needing to resort to a reference, whether a blown reed or an electronic tuner.

Harps may a bit of a different deal. They don't get fretted, and it's the stretching action and manipulation on the fingerboard of a fretted instrument that often puts strings out of tune. Obviously, harps go out of tune, but perhaps there's less need for "tweaking" during performance? I'm not a harper, so just speculating.

[catmandu2]

Cool, yes, I can see - you could ensure that they're in the ballpark even while they're in their cases on the floor - just visually.

No, large harps - and especially wire) are the worst in this regard - require constant tweaking. I typically don't use any external reference thing - since I play solo, I can do this. But if I have so many strings out and I need to start somewhere, I typically use a reference note (pitch-pipe, harmonica) and then do the rest with that one note for comparsion.

I've been contemplating getting an e-tuner for a year or two now - something is really needed for (wire) harp - a notoriously difficult instrument. From what I've read, the massive resonance and overtones of wire harp (hammered dulcimer too) render the e-tuner somewhat ineffective - in that we have to always be tweaking anyway - even after applying an e-tuner. The clip-on wires are of course helpful here, yet the hassle of attaching/reattaching the lead for every string pin is an added burden.. But, it may largely be ineffective (for harp) anyway..

The last time I tried an e-tuner .. someone handed me one, and after I tuned (banjo) to it, it was so far off (just intonation and all that) I was pretty underwhelmed.

[catmandu2]

So I have a dilemma - ongoing for a couple of years. My small harps are easy (although still much more difficult than fretted strings) to tune, and maintain during performance - there are a number of factors why. Because of their relative ease in this regard, I can take several other instruments with me (and have time to use them).

But, my large harp is the instrument I want to play/perform with. It's a very difficult thing. Tuning is an aspect at which I've always excelled. Yet, this instrument poses a particular challenge. Have you noticed how long a harper must concentrate on tuning before performing? Even a hospice harper has to do this. I've just not found a viable solution to this yet - it could be that there is none. I may just have to resign myself to this - and deal with the awkwardness of needing to tune for lengthy periods at a venue.

I've so far solved this by using only small harps. But this is just a totally different instrument than a large harp. I guess this is where I have to commit to harping, if I'm going to play harp for folks.