Is there an open F tuning, and if not.. Can anyone create one?

[DirtyBirdy]

Ive been playing mandolin for about 5 months now. Year on guitar before that.. But i have to say i love the mandolin way more than my guitar, and i acutally know chords scales and all that in GDAE.. But i picked up a Johnson 100-MA the otherday for 30 bucks.. It holds tune, and ive been toying with GDGD and AEAE (Capo'd GDGD) And i have to say i really enjoy being a beginner again learning scales but this time armed with knowledge.

But really im also lazy... And my buddy has been killing me to learn a F chord.. And its so hard for me. Was hoping maybe an Open F would make it easier.. Then i could just figure out a G and D from that tuning.

Any help from anyone way more knowledgeable than me would be greatly appreciated :D


my main mandolin is a Savannah SA-100 if anyone is wondering. I want a solid body electric someday.. And maybe an octave.. But i like italian music (want a taterbug someday) , blues and been doing some bluegrass of course..

Love that Chop.

[JeffD]

I am not sure what you mean. In standard tuning I use the F chord on the left shown here.

http://www.mandolincafe.com/cgi-bin/.../ch.pl?chord=F

It is not a closed form chord, if that is what you mean.

I am not an orthodox chop chord player, so if I need to chop an F chord I will do an F double stop on the G and A string, a low A on the G string and an F on the A string, and not hit the other strings. It makes a woofish chop that is good enough for passing through an F chord. What is that 23XX.

[DirtyBirdy]

Oh i know how to do a F chord in standard tuning(It isnt easy for me yet) i was just playing with tunings on a spare mandolin, and i like Open G (GDGD) but i was wondering if there was a Open F



I have no intentions on like giving up on standard tuning and progressing on that... Id just like to have another tuning to play with, and if possible something that makes it easier for me to do something that is somewhat hard for me now. Cause i can do G C D A and E and few others i dont know the names of lol.

But yeah. Just was a thought really

[Tobin]

But really im also lazy... And my buddy has been killing me to learn a F chord.. And its so hard for me. Was hoping maybe an Open F would make it easier..

The usual F chords are 2301 (230X) or 5301 (530X). I prefer 5301 because it has a nice ringy 2nd inversion sound. If you're chopping, you can go up high, using the three-finger D chop shape, at 10-7-8-X.

None of these chord shapes are particularly difficult. What about the F chord is giving you trouble?

Anyway, to address your question, I would avoid going to a special tuning just for the sake of an easy F chord. That will introduce all kinds of other chording issues. But you might want to consider a mandola, or other tenor-tuned instrument in CGDA. The F chord there is very simple. It's played just like a C chord on a mandolin, 0230, 0233, 5230 or 523X.

[DirtyBirdy]

Yeah i had a mandola for a bit, but it wasnt really "happy" enough for me. (but it was also chinese ebay bought)

Im having trouble with any chords that require 3 fingers, im always muting something.. And my pinky is horribly dumb. I use 3 fingers typically in my playing so far.

[DirtyBirdy]

Im sure its something i will eventually overcome.. I mean for the longest time on guitar and mandolin i had trouble transitioning strings.. But i stuck with it.

I was just hoping there was a short cut i could use to appease my friend who wants to play Car Radio with me so bad on bar stage..

[JeffD]

Oh i know how to do a F chord in standard tuning(It isnt easy for me yet) i was just playing with tunings on a spare mandolin, and i like Open G (GDGD) but i was wondering if there was a Open F

Oh. I get you. I am really slow this morning. Note to self - Coffee before café, coffee before café.

I have gotten in the habit of calling GDGD cross G tuning, and AEAE cross A tuning. Maybe just a regional thing.

Nothing to stop you from going a whole step down from open G, which would be FCFC tuning. Then capo 2 when you want to be back in open G tuning.

I am reduced to double stops when I play in cross, because I haven't sorted how all the chord shapes are changed.

[JeffD]

Im having trouble with any chords that require 3 fingers, im always muting something.. And my pinky is horribly dumb. I use 3 fingers typically in my playing so far.

Three ideas for you, of things really helped me in this regard. One is to envision the pinky not as a fully independent finger, but as the companion of the ring finger. So I deploy the ring finger to just one fret below where I need the pinky, and then deploy the pinky. Like a pet on a short leash I send the ring finger somewhere close, but out of the way. (behind on the same string). And I apply full pressure with both the ring and the pinky. The pinky does better when it sees the ring near by doing the same thing.

Second idea is that once I had severe pain in my index finger and I thought I was going to lose its use eventually, so I started practicing everything without it, as if I had already lost it. (A real real heart breaking time let me tell everyone reading this.) Eventually the real problem was solved and the finger is 100% fine now, but I really benefited from the habit. The exercise woke up the other fingers. I still do exercises like this to keep the pinky awake.

And third, is chord shapes. If I have to deploy four finger chord I start with the pinky. The rest of my hand adjusts better and it seems to work.

Doesn't help with your open F issue, but it might help with the idiot pinky.

[DirtyBirdy]

No i fully understand im useless without caffine as well. And i think i will try the FDFD on the alt mando, but i have acutally heard of that exercise, stopping the use of the index to strengthen the rest is a great idea and i think imma imply it for some of the material i already know :D

Really appreciate the advice :D

and yeah i try to always start with the pinky in chord formations of 4 or 3, still! i think its just something to work through, will take your advice to heart though and i appreciate the help :D

[MandoJason]

I wouldn't personally do this, but an "Open F" tuning on the mando is actually really simple. Its going to create more trouble than its worth for you (unless you're playing something explicity modal, or celtic/drony where the chords can be static a little more). As I believe Jeff mentioned, there are easier ways to cross this by strengthening the pinky and also I'd add just become comfortable w/ closed position major scale (In F I'm reffering to D-string/1st finger start on frets 3(f) 5(g) 7(a) 8(Bb) -or- change strings here to the A-string/1st finger on 1(Bb) 3(C) 5(D) then change to E-string (Open) then 1(F)

F TUNING (to answer your initial question) Lower G string 1 step to F, Lower D string 1 step to C, keep A strings and keep E strings (You've spelled out an FMaj7 chord there- FACE)

Again, maybe this would be interesting for an experiment but I wouldn't recommend developing a mando style from this tuning for lack of comfort w/ the F chord.
I hope that helps.

[KEB]

There's an easier F chord to my mind that no one's mentioned-- I use it when I need to give a bit of a chop in a song in C in first position.

2-3-3-x is an easy way of doing it based on burns-style 3 finger chords.

[DirtyBirdy]

Thank you btw Mando Jason, yeah im not planning on giving up on the standard tuning, ive learned too much already to throw it away. But this was just a fun experiment with maybe the added bonus of being able to placate my friend lol

[sgarrity]

Use the 2-3-x-x F chord.

[DirtyBirdy]

Ooo i do not like F open haha

[Pete Martin]

Back to the question of F tuning. E up a 1/2 step to F. Open A. D down a step to C. G down 1 step to F.

FCAF

Let us know how you like it.

[DirtyBirdy]

Ooo i will ive tried FCAE and FCFC, didnt like it..

[DirtyBirdy]

Oh my goodness i love it. FCAF I'll post back on this thread with a soundcloud if i tinker into something im proud of..

Thanks Pete :D

[DirtyBirdy]

oh i see what u guys mean about scale and chords being messed up, im having serious trouble finding stuff without documentation.

[DirtyBirdy]

Single string, and the open chord itself sound good though lol

[Rodney Riley]

Eva Holbrook of SHEL played a song and said she was experimenting with an F tuning. Didn't get to talk to her long enuff to find out how she did it.

[JeffD]

Use the 2-3-x-x F chord.

Yea I think it works well enough in most cases.

I sometimes use a 4-5-x-x for a quick and dirty G chord if I am passing through quickly and happen to be in the neighborhood.

[Mandoplumb]

You said you played in E you do the same thing one fret higher you're in F. E doesn't have that many usable open strings that makes it that much harder to go up one fret IMHO

[Mike-D]

I tuned my citole to CFCF which is close to an F power chord. Easy to make a full F or C from this. This tuning is also easy for melodies.

[Tobin]

oh i see what u guys mean about scale and chords being messed up, im having serious trouble finding stuff without documentation.

This is the trouble with going to alternate tunings. To be quite blunt here, you have several easy ways of playing an F chord in standard tuning. Rather than screwing around with your tuning and introducing a whole bunch of other problems to confuse you, why not just learn to play your mandolin?

I sometimes use a 4-5-x-x for a quick and dirty G chord if I am passing through quickly and happen to be in the neighborhood.

I've been using that one a lot lately. I like it when playing in the key of D, because I hang out on a 7-4-0-X chord for D, then go to a 4-5-X-X for G, using my ring finger to hammer-on up to 7-5-X-X. It's a nice effect on the G, and then I slide up to 9-7-0-0 for the A. When resolving back to D, I go through an A7 using 9-5-0-0 to walk me back down to the 7-4-0-X.

The 4-5-X-X shape for G also has the benefit of making it easy to snap to and from a Bm shape, 4-4-5-7.

[Phil Goodson]

If you're just wanting to play in the key of F, why not just use 2 finger chords like:

530x for F, 301x for Bb, and 0230 for C, 200x for Dm if it should show up (I know there's no flat-3 there, but it works).

To play along with songs, how much easier could it be???