Bald Cypress: Anyone Make a Top With It?

[Emmett Marshall]

This question is really just a "curious" thing for me, but I'm wondering if this wood would make a good top? I know it's soft and light, but I never hear of anyone using it and I'm just wondering what the reason(s) might be?

[Hendrik Ahrend]

Some really fine baroque harpsichords (and copies thereof) are completely made of Cypress (or just the sounding board or just the back and sides). Hence, at least Cypress seems to work as a tone wood. Unfortunately, I don't know about Bald Cypress. I'm afraid it's different.

[Jim Adwell]

Yes, this nylon string octave mandolin:



The whole thing is bald cypress, except the fingerboard, bridge, and tailpiece, which are cherry, and the amboyna trim stuff. Bald cypress is not very stiff, and although it works nicely with nylon strings, I think you'd sacrifice volume for enough stiffness to support eight steel strings.

[Jim Adwell]

duplicate post

[Emmett Marshall]

Yes, this nylon string octave mandolin:



The whole thing is bald cypress, except the fingerboard, bridge, and tailpiece, which are cherry, and the amboyna trim stuff. Bald cypress is not very stiff, and although it works nicely with nylon strings, I think you'd sacrifice volume for enough stiffness to support eight steel strings.

Yep that's cypress alrighty. Where did you come across that? Gosh, I'd love to hear it. What you're saying makes sense to me.

[Jim Adwell]

Bald cypress is fairly common construction lumber in the South. I found the board the octave mando is made from at a lumber yard where I buy hardwoods and thought it might be interesting to experiment with.

Here's a sound clip, wherein I play badly:

https://soundcloud.com/user438431190...ave-mandolin-1

[Emmett Marshall]

Bald cypress is fairly common construction lumber in the South. I found the board the octave mando is made from at a lumber yard where I buy hardwoods and thought it might be interesting to experiment with.

Here's a sound clip, wherein I play badly:

https://soundcloud.com/user438431190...ave-mandolin-1

Wow Jim, that mando has a, really and truly, beautiful tone. I don't guess it's for sale huh? As for you playing "badly," I must say, 'no way'! You played that piece really nice. It's a great sounding octave mandolin. I'm curious now as to what you used for a finish on that cypress?

Back, in the day, you could find me wading through the swamps of Louisiana collecting cypress "knees" and dead fall. I used to make lamp stands from the knees and coffee tables and clocks from the cypress as well.

[Clinton Johnson]

Here's a sound clip, wherein I play badly:

https://soundcloud.com/user438431190...ave-mandolin-

Badly? Well it certainly sounded good to me!

[Bill Snyder]

So Jim why would anyone name that tune "Really Badly"?

[Clinton Johnson]

Wow Jim, that mando has a, really and truly, beautiful tone. I don't guess it's for sale huh? As for you playing "badly," I must say, 'no way'! You played that piece really nice. It's a great sounding octave mandolin. I'm curious now as to what you used for a finish on that cypress?

Back, in the day, you could find me wading through the swamps of Louisiana collecting cypress "knees" and dead fall. I used to make lamp stands from the knees and coffee tables and clocks from the cypress as well.

Emmet, back in the day I too have wrestled a cypress log out of Bundicks lake in La with my Dad because he just had to have it to build a chair out of it(back in our trapping days). I've also built a rustic table out of cypress which sets in my parents cabin in AR. I always thought that cypress couldn't be used for mando tops but now I see it can.

[Bill Snyder]

Cypress is the tonewood of choice for many luthiers that build flamenco guitars.
HERE is a previous thread on cypress from 2004.
The thread points out that the common tonewood cypress is not bald cypress, but Bruce (Spruce) mentions fiddle makers in LA using what is undoubtedly unusually dense bald cypress.

[Jim Adwell]

Wow Jim, that mando has a, really and truly, beautiful tone. I don't guess it's for sale huh? As for you playing "badly," I must say, 'no way'! You played that piece really nice. It's a great sounding octave mandolin. I'm curious now as to what you used for a finish on that cypress?

Back, in the day, you could find me wading through the swamps of Louisiana collecting cypress "knees" and dead fall. I used to make lamp stands from the knees and coffee tables and clocks from the cypress as well.

It's finished with shellac, but not French polished. The finish actually is rather bad; I didn't make much of an attempt to make it look good. If you saw it close up, you'd agree with me about that, I think.

As far as the tone, that's the nylon strings, I think; they sound better (to me, anyway) than steel strings, and they are more forgiving on my old fingers. I also made a nylon string mandolinetto tuned CGDA, and I'm working on a matching GDAE mandolinetto right now. These are spruce over local Florida-grown sweetgum, with cherry fingerboards and tailpieces, and black and white ebony pickguards.



And the same music, attempted on the mandola:

https://soundcloud.com/user438431190/nylon-mandola-1

[Emmett Marshall]

Hey Clinton! I know that place. It's a 30 minute drive from where I used to live - "Cotile Lake". We pronounced it "Bundee Lake". I could recount many tales of adventure in the area of that lake! Your mention of it brings back many memories.

[Emmett Marshall]

What a treat Jim. Thank you for sharing these photos and the sound clips. I honestly was expecting 20 people to reply to my question with 200 reasons why Bald Cypress would be a terrible choice. Instead I get blessed with seeing these possibilities. I thought my MAS was cured? In my ignorant, but commonsense mind, Shellac seems like a good choice for a finish on this type of wood also. I was thinking along the lines of just enough finish on the cypress to act as a good sealer while imparting a little more hardness to the surface.

[David Newton]

Emmett, I will be your outlier and steer you away from Bald Cypress for top wood, unless you can source some old and hard wood. What you can get at the yards is going to be soft and not very resonant. If you are looking for an unusual wood to build with, and can find some Longleaf Yellow Pine, I would recommend it highly.

[Emmett Marshall]

Hi David.....but..but...but.... did you listen to Jim's recording? I'm not building one. I was mainly curious and now I'm thinking about figuring some way to get Jim to part with his. I can see how using soft cypress would dampen things though. Long leaf yellow pine eh? I'm going to have to check that out also.

[Bill Snyder]

First mandolin I built has a yellow pine top. Eleven years old now and still going holding together.

[Jim Adwell]

More food for thought - I've made a tenor ukulele with a sugar pine top. It's got reasonably good volume, not huge, but acceptable. The tone is different than spruce or redwood or WRC or koa would be - it's not bad, IMO, just different. It's holding together under tension just fine, so far.



I really can't play ukulele, but here's some noodling:

https://soundcloud.com/user438431190/sugar-pine-ukulele

[Jim Adwell]

I was mainly curious and now I'm thinking about figuring some way to get Jim to part with his.

A few facts about the instrument: it's very light, it weighs 825 grams, according to my little Harbor Freight electronic scale, less than two pounds. It would benefit visually from a complete stripdown, resanding and refinishing. The strings are under fairly low tension; I'm calculating 96 lbs total for eight strings. The strings are a custom set I made from singles, which cost something like $15 a set of D'Addario Classic Nylon strings. Because of the lowish tension, playing requires a light touch, or you'll get buzzing on the bass strings. The tuners are cheap, from China, not very good (although they function okay at the moment) and of a non-standard post spacing, I'm measuring 25mm center to center. I've had a couple of buttons disintegrate on another set of the same make (there are decent economy tuners made in China, but these ain't them). I'm pretty sure it would fit in a standard banjo case.

If you were here in Florida, and you looked at it and played the thing in person and still wanted it, I would probably give it to you or sell it very cheap for the cost of the materials. I'm like that.

[choctaw61]

I have a good friend,all his people from south Louisiana.I mean pure Cajun.They all played music.They would come up to Winn Parish for the weekend.We'd cook(roast a pig) they'd play music.Anyway the old fiddle player(uncle Peewee),had a fiddle made outta cypress.He couldn't carry a tune in a bucket starting out the day.He'd cuss and rant at that old fiddle till bout 8-9 am.Then look out cuz they'd hand that old man a bottle of red eye and it was on. The redder his eyes got the sweeeeterr the music.He could fiddle with the best of fiddle players.That's probably the best fiddle I've ever heard.Man that thing could bark!U could hear that thing a country mile as the old folks say.I'd love to know who wound up with that old fiddle.

[Clinton Johnson]

Choctaw61 yall shoulda came on down to Rapides parish at Cotile lake and picked up ole Emmett then came on down to Beauregard parish where I was raised near Ouiska(whiskey) Chitto swamp and we woulda ate pig and picked with ya!

[choctaw61]

Lol,Hey Clinton I know we would have had a time for sure.I was thinking U fellows must have tough skin to wade around Cotile lake swamps.I use to Log that area a lot.That place full of Gators and those ol cotton lip rattle backs son!! Man U had to watch every step on the ground there.lol. I'm gna try to get up there to Mt.View around August.Daughter and Son in law just moved to Cabot.Mayb i can buy u a cup.of coffee and supper if I do.

[Emmett Marshall]

U fellows must have tough skin to wade around Cotile lake swamps.

It sure is a small world! Nah, I was just young, full of energy, and thought nothing could kill me. Not only that, but we're talkin' some tasty FOOD here brothers! I could go out at night and bring back a whole onion sack full of the biggest bullfrogs - frog legs nearly as big as chicken drum sticks. If we spent a weekend running yo-yo's and trot line at night, we'd come back with 40lbs of catfish fillet - easy. You're right about those snakes. While resting on a log because the frogs weren't croaking, I once had one wrap itself around my leg to keep from drifting in the current. Now don't even get me started on setting out crawfish traps....I'm already drooling!

Gosh fellas, It's been many years now since I had to leave Louisiana for work, but I can still remember: "Snake eyes are red. Gators are orange. Bullfrogs are yellow. Spiders are blue or green." - could be a good song in there? I could call it "Reflections"?

[Emmett Marshall]

It's holding together under tension just fine, so far.

You're having too much fun!

I really can't play ukulele,...

Okay. Somebody's gotta say it: Jim, you keep saying that you can't play well, but then you share these really nice sound clips making people want to hear more of you! You're messing with me man!