Highbrow Boil Them Cabbage Down

[HonketyHank]

Was listening to WKSU streaming online classical music station this morning a little after 8 (PDT) and low and behold, suddenly 'Boil Them Cabbage Down' was playing in the middle of a suite of tunes from a 17th century book called 'The English Dance Master'.

If you ever wondered how it would sound played on two lutes, you can probably find it in their archives. Not bad.

[Jess L.]

Couldn't find archives at WKSU website. But your post prompted me to finally get around to taking a look at some of the tunes in the 1651 John Playford book "English Dancing Master". I got about halfway through the list (downloaded midi versions of those tunes) and found one that might (maybe?) have been the tune you heard.

Even though the timing is different, I see/hear a similarity between "Boil Them Cabbage Down" and some notes in the second part of Playford's Half Hannikin (the first 10 or 12 notes after the first double bar), and from 0:12-0:23 in this lute video:


For comparison, although it's a different key but one can still see the shape of the melody, Boil Them Cabbage Down basic notes - melody starts on 3rd note of scale, goes to 4th, back to 3rd, 2nd, 3rd, etc., very similar to second part of "Half Hannikin".

Of course, it could be argued that such a simple progression of notes could be invented by anyone (in any culture/nation) and might not necessarily be traceable to any specific tune... who knows... however I wouldn't be surprised if there was a long-lost distant connection of some sort between those tunes.

Incidentally, thank you for your post, because it (a) provided me with enough curiosity to finally investigate Playford - been meaning to for, like, um since the 1970s or something, and (b) reminded me of BTCD as I hadn't thought of that tune in years.

Off topic:
While prowling through YouTube today to refresh my memory as to what Boil Them Cabbage Down sounded like, I found some interesting versions, for instance this 1978 John Hartford version. Back then, this version would have absolutely horrified me - in 1978 I'd have thought it was too 'modern' with the fancy fiddling and the drum-set, but now I actually like it:


And a 2010 French jazz-festival version by Mark O'Connor and Wynton Marsalis. Mark O'Connor was another fiddler I used to not appreciate, but either his playing has matured/improved or I just like alternative stuff now, or some of each. Anyway this is certainly a different take on an old tune:


Mike Seeger gourd banjo and vocal, at least this style is what I'm used to, I grew up listening to Mike Seeger stuff. Music starts about 2 minutes in:


1964 Andy Griffith TV show + Gilligan (Bob Denver), music by (I think?) The Dillards, I'm assuming this is lip-synced to some studio recording?

[DavidKOS]

Nice lute playing!

I wonder how many famous folk melodies are based in some way on earlier tunes? Probably a lot of them, I'd bet.

[JeffD]

I have always thought that the last movement of Mozart's 2nd Horn Concerto had too much in common with the old Irish fiddle tune Colerain to be a coincidence. Whether one was based on hearing the other, or whether both were based on some third as yet unidentified tune I don't know. I love them both, however, for the same reasons.

[UsuallyPickin]

OK here is one for any math Geeks reading this...... there are twelve tones in the western scale..... Let's not think about how many ?????? keys ....Lets just go with Major and Minor scales how many melodies can actually be played with that number of possibilities. And yes we all know that some melodies sound so much alike that the songs can't be played even remotely close to one another........ Hmmmm?