Harmony Sovereign 1201T

[fox]

Mine was "sticker less" but does have a steel rod in the neck, the problem with the Harmony archtops is that the tops are made from either ply or solid birch, neither of which offer much sustain or tone.
They are playable but hardly comparable to a quarter sawn Spruce or Cedar top guitar.
I find that my archtop is ok if you sing or even for a bit or Irish melody, people love to see it in action but honestly it does not really satisfy my ears.
Having said that it is not for sale or likely to be until I die

[Verne Andru]

Mine was also "sticker-less" and I have no clue what's in the neck, but it is straight and that's all I care about.

These are solid birch, heat pressed into an archtop. I also have a Loar, which is a hand-carved, solid spruce archtop.

They sound different, but are definitely cut from the same cloth. I don't find much difference in sustain. Loar has a bit more volume, but that could also be attributed to extra strings and how they are tuned.

Archtops were designed for the pre-amplification big-band era and to be played really, really hard so they could be heard in an ensemble.

A common complaint about archtops of all types, has to do with volume and sustain, but I suggest that comes from comparing them to a flattop build, which is quite different. I've found lack of sustain has more to do with how well the bridge is fitted to the top, than the type of instrument they are.

Flattops can't take a very heavy picking/strumming hand before they start compressing. That's a by-product of how the strings move the sound-board.

Archtops, OTOH [including the Harmony's] are designed to take a tremendously heavy hand. Unlike flattops, the sound doesn't compress under pressure and they just keep getting louder, exactly as they should.

They aren't designed for subtle. You have to love them for what they are to get the most from them. I think many people expect them to be just like a flattop, and that's where the disappointment comes from IMHO.

[MikeEdgerton]

I would think you could check to see if a neck had a steel rod in it with a rare earth magnet. I may check that out at home.

[fox]

Hi Andru, I am sure that generally speaking you are right, I can only quote from my personal experience
I know it is probably not a very good comparison but my small body 20" scale hand made spruce top archtop tenor guitar, has more sustain & volume than my much larger harmony!

[RussianDragon]

Hi all. I am so grateful for the wealth of information on this forum and really glad to be a part of it. I recently got bitten by the tenor guitar bug and have found myself playing more than I ever have before whether it be ukulele or guitar.

There is a 1966 Harmony Sovereign 1201T for sale about an hour from me, in fine playing condition, with a firm price of $300. I am writing this to find out if anyone has any experience with these instruments and can tell me what they think.

It is fifty years old and solid wood, but I have enough instruments to know that sometimes instruments just play better than their heritage or genetic makeup would indicate. I have an all-plywood baritone uke that sings with the right strings. And sometimes the reverse is true.

I'll be able to take a look at the instrument but not play much, as it is currently tuned in fifths and I only play fourths. If I get it, it will be restrung Chicago or my current odd-ball super-sized uke tuning.

Thanks for impressions and suggestions.

Aaron

Anyone interested in buying a 1201T should check out this Regal on MusicGoRound:
http://www.musicgoround.com/p/414924...e-tenor-guitar
I forget the model number for the Regal but it is exactly the same as the 1201T, made in the same Chicago factory at the same time. This one is reasonably priced too!

[Verne Andru]

Hi Andru, I am sure that generally speaking you are right, I can only quote from my personal experience
I know it is probably not a very good comparison but my small body 20" scale hand made spruce top archtop tenor guitar, has more sustain & volume than my much larger harmony!

I'm not going to begin arguing Harmony's were anything other than mass produced instruments with a build style focused more on manufacturing costs and inefficiencies than sound and play-ability.

That said, from what I've read about the condition you received your Harmony in, and what you had to go through to get it playable, I would suggest yours was compromised from the start. I could be wrong, but I might suggest keeping an open mind about them until you've had a chance to play a few that are still in good, original shape.

[MikeEdgerton]

Vern is correct. Even when these were new they were hit and miss. In the early to mid-60's Harmony (and Kay) instruments were the bottom end of the instrument line. There were no imports yet to speak of. Within a decade that industry had totally changed and we had good and bad instruments being imported from the far east and Harmony and Kay both died. I'm still shocked at what some folks are willing to pay for these things.

[fox]

Hi Verne, one problem with internet forums revolves around the misinterpretation of peoples post!
To start with I did not mean to use your surname .. sorry about that & secondly I am just about the easiest going person around, I find it difficult to argue about anything
You may well be right about my own Harmony, it had loose braces & sunken f holes. I think it was stored in very dry environment.
I do play it but I have a very strong desire to fit a new spruce or Cedar top! I think it would sound a lot better but of course it would not have that beautiful looking flat sawn top it has now.
It is even in my profile picture ......

[MikeEdgerton]

Replacing arched tops with flat tops is not unheard of. There is an entire generation of Martin's out there that have been retro fitted.

[Verne Andru]

No worries, Fox. I've been around forums long enough to understand the dynamics.

I remember playing a number of Gibson F5s back in the day and most of them were quite horrible as well, so it's not just Harmony. I think it's safe to say it's much easier to make a descent sounding, mass-produced flattop, than it is to make a good sounding, hand-carved and tuned mass-produced archtop.

The Loar appears to have found a pretty good forumula for making great archtop guitars and it would be so cool if they would add archtop tenors to their line-up.

[RussianDragon]

By the way, there's tons of great information here and I am really grateful for all the feedback. Thanks to all.

Yet another 1201T has shown up on the 'Bay: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Harmony-H120...IAAOSwFqJWnV5G

The photos and description demonstrate many of the issues we've discussed here: high neck action and a bridge lifting up off the guitar's top, despite the two screws trying to hold it down!

[vic-victor]

I once had a Harmony Sovereign dread guitar, it was really good. Much better than an average Harmony stuff, it was their top of the line series and labelled "Poor man's Martin" by some.

So Sovereign series is a much higher class instruments, while an average Harmony is a cheapie.