Can a UK buyer obtain a set of the satin gold waverlies?

[Lord of the Badgers]

Hiya
The tuners in my A5 are getting pretty troublesome (can't recall the make but it's one of the more obvious inexpensive makes), and in my F5 I've got a set of Waverlies.

Rather hard to ignore the difference in quality, but it's really frustrating, as due to the materials involved I guess; Stewmac can't ship me the satin gold set.

Are there any suppliers in the UK? ??
I looked at Jon Press' site (he lives near me) but he's only got guitar ones.

My A5's peghead needs the F style set - I don't mind them being satin finish, but they have to be gold to fit in with my tailpiece


Tailpiece for reference!

[houseworker]

Ask Jon Press if they can order them in for you.

[almeriastrings]

It's the real pearl knobs that are causing the problem. It is a bizarre situation, because this material is not restricted (in any way) by CITES or by the UK. You can order truck loads of the stuff direct from China and elsewhere with no paperwork at all...the difficulty is that the US requires complex (and costly) paperwork to be filed for each 'export'. This makes it uneconomical to deal with small shipments - it is down to US domestic legislation, in this case, the Lacey Act. As of December 2010, Stewmac ceased exporting anything at all with MOP or abalone parts... unfortunately, Stewmac are the only direct source of these tuners. The Waverley guitar tuners are not an issue because they have plated metal, ivoroid, and other non-shell buttons. Mandolin tuners - big problem.

You may have to try to find another brand that uses imitation pearl buttons and matches the spacing required. The Gotoh's are pretty good.

[Lord of the Badgers]

I actually want to retain the ebony buttons, the pearl buttons aren't important!! Should've said.

[Lord of the Badgers]

In my less interesting job, I work for a manufacturing company, so appreciate the tight controls in US customs. Something we have to constantly remind our Purchasing department about!

[houseworker]

Stewmac aren't helpful in terms of swapping out buttons to accommodate individual buyers (although it never hurts to ask), but they may be more willing to assist a trade customer.

Gotoh tuners (as recommended by almeriastrings) are excellent. and available in gold.

Your original tuners may not be working properly because of poor fitting rather than any inherent issue with the tuners themselves. Have you removed them from the mandolin to see how smooth they really are (or aren't)?

If you post a picture of the back of the headstock, we'll be able to see what you've got at present.

[Lord of the Badgers]

Hi
Hope this helps - the buttons were swapped out, so ignore them!

[Ivan Kelsall]

It might be worth asking Stew mac.to check the shafts on their Waverly tuners to make sure thay're the correct button fitting,& ask them to ship them less the MOP buttons.
Houseworker has it right - Gotoh tuners as per my Ellis "A" style are excellent & you can buy the gold plated ones - complete with black buttons, from Tonetech in Stockport :- http://www.tonetechluthiersupplies.c...mandolin+tuner ,
Ivan

[Ron McMillan]

I understand Waverleys are not only unavailable, but very expensive. Maybe you should ask Keith Robson in Sunderland what a new set of custom tuners would cost. I have a set on my A4 (see my avatar pic). They are gold, and extremely fine tuners that I have heard some people compare favourably to Waverleys.

[Lord of the Badgers]

looked back in my records - they are schallers

[Lord of the Badgers]

I understand Waverleys are not only unavailable, but very expensive. Maybe you should ask Keith Robson in Sunderland what a new set of custom tuners would cost. I have a set on my A4 (see my pic below my name). They are gold, and extremely fine tuners that I have heard some people compare favourably to Waverleys.

what sort of price Ron?

[almeriastrings]

You are looking at around £450 UK per set for Waverley's including import costs and tax...

They're good... but Gotoh's are good too. Very smooth and accurate at a fraction of the cost. I have a set of Schaller's with black knobs (nickle) on my Northfield, and they are also very good indeed, so it sounds to me like something is definitely wrong somewhere - they are considered a high quality tuner and should not normally give rise to problems. They are very "fussy" about installation, however, and if even a very slight amount "off" can object. I'd double check they are aligned absolutely correctly and especially, check the bushings.

[Ron McMillan]

what sort of price Ron?

I paid a lot less than the 450 pounds quoted by almeriastrings. Keith is a very nice guy and a pleasure to do business with. Check out the designs on his website and email him. Or contact him via his Facebook page.

[pops1]

I am with almeriastrings, check the bushings. If they are off any tuner will turn hard as the gear is pulled into the worm under tension. I have a very nice mandolin and had this problem and ended up shimming the nut side of the bushing to move it back slightly and it tunes much better and smoother. The Schaller's are a good tuner.

[Ray(T)]

My 2 penneth!

1) Keith Robson made me a set of tuners to replace the Stew Mac nasties on my Clark GBOM and I'm very happy with them. He did me a special deal at the time so it's no use telling you how much I paid but I'm sure his current price will be far less than Waverleys.

2) Strangely, my Kimble A (2008) came with satin gold Waverleys but not pearl knobs. The buttons are not the removable ones so there may be some of these lying around somewhere.

3) My Kimble F (2008!) came with Alessi tuners so these may also be an option - if you can persuade Mr Alessi to answer an email and they're also likely to be cheaper than Waverleys as they're made in the EU (post June excepted!)

[Lord of the Badgers]

I am with almeriastrings, check the bushings. If they are off any tuner will turn hard as the gear is pulled into the worm under tension. I have a very nice mandolin and had this problem and ended up shimming the nut side of the bushing to move it back slightly and it tunes much better and smoother. The Schaller's are a good tuner.

Yes and no. Some are too easy, some (the 2nd G) are a nightmare to turn. Feel all over the place, whereas the Waverlies on the f5 are just spot on. Granted they've been used solidly for about 4 years before I got that mandolin. I'm not handy at all, so hoping that with a nudge i can get Phil to sort that out.

[pops1]

Take the tension off of the strings that are hard to turn, are they still hard to turn or are they easy now. If they are still hard to turn the problem is most likely with the tuners, if not I would have the bushings shimmed on those holes that are hard to turn.

[houseworker]

Yes and no. Some are too easy, some (the 2nd G) are a nightmare to turn. Feel all over the place, whereas the Waverlies on the f5 are just spot on. Granted they've been used solidly for about 4 years before I got that mandolin. I'm not handy at all, so hoping that with a nudge i can get Phil to sort that out.

May need no more than a tweak on the screws inside the cogs (which adjust the stiffness of the turn). Otherwise you're probably best getting a specialist luthier to take a look - is Tavy within easy reach?

Have a look here.

[Will Kimble]

Doesn't appear that Waverlys would be a straight swap due to the worm over/worm under relationship. Best to stay put in my opinion, what problems are you having with the tuners? Most tuning problems are caused by setup rather than the tuners themselves.

Will Kimble
www.kimblemandolins.com

[HoGo]

Doesn't appear that Waverlys would be a straight swap due to the worm over/worm under relationship. Best to stay put in my opinion, what problems are you having with the tuners? Most tuning problems are caused by setup rather than the tuners themselves.

Will Kimble
www.kimblemandolins.com

Agree, 9 out of ten problems with tuners are actually problems with their installation and not the tuners themselves. I've had one defective set of schallers though that had worms turned offcenter so half turn went smooth and the other was tight but some turning with grinding paste did help it.
Your tuners are worm over so you would have to do custom order from Stew-Mac as F style Waverlies are offeerd in worm under config.
If you really want to order new tuners go for Alessi. As good or better than Waverlies and will come cheaper buying from EU. I recall I paid something like 400 EUR for totally custom set with pearl buttons. There's no problem with customs and such within EU.

[Tavy]

Badger, I think this comes down to a "time or money" issue. If it's easier to just through money at the problem to make it go away (so you can get on with playing rather than maintenance) then any of the tuner options listed above would be good - to those I'd add Rubner about whom I've heard nothing but good.

On the other hand, if you can spare a little time.... de-string and remove the tuners from the instrument, are they still stiff? If not then it's a fitting issue, and you may have problems with whatever else you put in there, unless you use one of the cheaper options (Gotoh) that have a bit of slack in them, or else get the headstock hole-spacing fixed. If they're stiff off the instrument - and the only set of Schallers I've had were annoyingly so, then you may need to spend a few hours disassembling lubing, and tracking down the issue. You could also try loosening the screw holding them together - just a touch - you want it light finger tight - but not screwed down as hard as it will go or the tuners likely will be unturnable.

[mandroid]

All it takes is shipping them across the Pond from Stew Mac D.
Ebony buttons are an Option*, in the menu. as would be the worm over gear cut.

NB: Waverlys are even fussier about accurate peg head hole spacing being spot-on accurate.

* I had a regular A set with Ebony Buttons, made that way.

[Lord of the Badgers]

Hey all thanks for your help. I'll see Phil soon - he's doing some tweaks to my F5 at the moment, so I have to go back to see him.
We'll see what he thinks can be done.

thanks

[Phil Goodson]

All it takes is shipping them across the Pond from Stew Mac D.
Ebony buttons are an Option*, in the menu. as would be the worm over gear cut.
....

But apparently not in F style AND gold.

[Ivan Kelsall]

The tuners on my Weber & Lebeda (Schallers) worked fine,but i did apply Frank Ford's 'tune up your gears' wisdom to them & slackened off the screws holding the gear wheels,& then re-tightened them just 'finger tight'. They now work very smoothly indeed.
As FF says,if the screws are too tight,they get pinched between the screw & the back plate = stiff,
Ivan