$750 Collings mandolin case at elderlys

[Jess L.]

... There is a fine line that must be walked between having enough protection and weight.

True. Mine were only slighter lighter (few ounces) than old factory-made plywood cases, probably too heavy by modern standards. I used normal curved shapes, so as to get that natural 'arch' strengthening effect. But yeah I know what you mean about some of the homemade cases, particularly when people use straight sections of wood they tend to use thicker wood to get the same amount of strength, overbuilt as you said.

[Bernie Daniel]

......3. The price is entirely reasonable. (In fact Collings may not be making a profit on them.) This is modeled after a 1930's Geib Redline case and it costs about the same if you update the dollars. A 1937 F-4 was $100 and the shaped Redline case was $16.50 (16.5% of the cost of the instrument.) Do the math: a $5,000 mandolin that had a case costing 16.5% would equal $825. By the way, the oblong case was $38, that would equal $1,900 at 16.5% of $5K. That's what it costs to make a quality case. Today's buyers demand low-cost cases and TLK complies by cutting corners and reducing quality. Then people complain about the poor quality of their $125 TLK case.

My thoughts. Yours may differ, and that's fine.

Steve
https://www.facebook.com/groups/vint...strumentcases/
http://www.stevekirtley.org/vintagecases.htm

I'm sure you know more about Collings and these cases than I do but I question whether any businessman builds a new factory to make something that will not turn a profit?

Also I read somewhere a couple of days ago that if you took a $20 bill back to 1920 it would be worth $250. So a $16.50 red-line case (1920) in today's economy should cost around $210 not $750?

[Perry]

As of last Thanksgiving, there were forms & prototypes for Dreadnaught cases, OM cases and F mandolins. It may be a while (perhaps a long one) until cases are available for all the guitar models & perhaps the A case. For those of that persuasion, a toneguard will not fit. My Ellis A fits snugly & perfectly in the F case.

Bernie, in approximate terms, a Collings mandolin includes a case, so the cost of the new case would be $850 less whatever the cost of the included case is ($250-$300?) less 10%.

Doc do you know if a slope shoulder short scale dread case (CJ35) is in the works?

[doc holiday]

Perry, I heard that the CJ & C10 cases were up next in line

[Austin Bob]

BTW, it looks like Collins is now shipping mandolins with the new cases.

http://massstreetmusic.com/collectio...s/collings-mf5

[Mandobar]

Ivan, don't assume that people are satisfied. We all settle, because there are just no good affordable alternatives. Are people happy with Home Depot? No, and as soon as alternatives arrived, their customers fled. if a company surfaces that can provide a quality replacement for their cases at a reasonable price the company would improve their product. Right now, they don't have to, so why spare the expense?

[Ron McMillan]

BTW, it looks like Collins is now shipping mandolins with the new cases.

http://massstreetmusic.com/collectio...s/collings-mf5

The zoom feature on the photo gallery really lets you see how beautifully crafted the case is, too.

[Jeff Mando]

The zoom feature on the photo gallery really lets you see how beautifully crafted the case is, too.

Agreed, it's a pretty case. I'm still struggling with the price point. I don't know if it is $500 prettier than a nice $250 case, at least to me. But, I haven't seen one in person, yet.

I went through this in the 70's being a photographer, so I understand the appeal of quality. The Leica stuff was 2-3X as much as the Nikon and Canon stuff, but the Leica just felt like jewelry in your hands during use and that sold me.

[Bernie Daniel]

Ivan, don't assume that people are satisfied. We all settle, because there are just no good affordable alternatives. Are people happy with Home Depot? No, and as soon as alternatives arrived, their customers fled. if a company surfaces that can provide a quality replacement for their cases at a reasonable price the company would improve their product. Right now, they don't have to, so why spare the expense?

The issue of what is a "quality" product and a "reasonable" price is subjective or at least a matter opinion. Is there really anything wrong with a TKL case? I must have had a couple dozen of them (counting mandolins and guitars) pass though my hands over the years and except of a few that had been abused all worked just fine as instrument holding cases.

That said I know some individuals might well want a fancier case and might consider spending over $700 on an ordinary albeit higher quality case (that seems like a contradiction - but I mean a "holding" case i.e., not a travel case). If that is what they want to do why not?

I paid over $500 to put my mandolin in a hardened Calton travel safe case -- that is less than 10% of the mandolin's value so it seems like a good deal. I would not pay $750 for a high quality standard holding case though -- but that is me.

P.S. I love Home Depot!

[houseworker]

Is there really anything wrong with a TKL case?

They don't get a lot of love in this thread. The whole thread's worth reading, but posts #58-61 really seem most pertinent to this discussion.

[Bernie Daniel]

They don't get a lot of love in this thread. The whole thread's worth reading, but posts #58-61 really seem most pertinent to this discussion.

Like the group of blind men touching the elephant in different places everyone describes his own experiences and people's experiences differ.

For me the case is just something to put my mandolin in and as long as it protects the mandolin and isn't ugly or too heavy I don't pay any attention to it - I don't look at it at all usually.

So I would never pay $750 to get a higher quality case that does what a $250 case will do. But some people would because their mandolin experience extends to the case and it is wonderful that there is a case for them too.

I do spring for things like Waverly tuners, James tail pieces, Cumberland Acoustics bridges and fancy picks but in each case I think these to the job better than the less expensive counterpart.

[DataNick]

Well,

This thread is HOT, over Cases...I love this forum!

If opinions are still being received, here's my 2 cents:

1. They do look like very, very nice cases
2. Collings always does seem to just do things right, and in a most precise, professional manner
3. The price is probably a reasonable MRSP: remember $850 don't get you all that these days
4. I would rather have one of those new Collings cases than the Guardian case (like a TKL to me) that my F5L lives in

5. My personal direction when I get a new case though will most likely be a Calton. I've sampled a few up close and in personal and it's just the peace of mind factor from my perspective: especially after that mando in a Calton case was dropped out of the trunk of that rental car in Santa Monica, and survived the abuse of being on the street!

6. But CAS will beckon one of these days so.....

My best wishes for success to Mr. Collings; he's truly a one of a kind, innovative sort of guy!

[Nathan Kellstadt]

especially after that mando in a Calton case was dropped out of the trunk of that rental car in Santa Monica, and survived the abuse of being on the street!

I've never seen a better inadvertent advertisement for a product.

[foldedpath]

For me the case is just something to put my mandolin in and as long as it protects the mandolin and isn't ugly or too heavy I don't pay any attention to it - I don't look at it at all usually.

So I would never pay $750 to get a higher quality case that does what a $250 case will do. But some people would because their mandolin experience extends to the case and it is wonderful that there is a case for them too.

I wouldn't downplay the protection factor of the more expensive fiberglass cases, which costs just as much as this new Collings case.

One reason I bought my Pegasus is that it's perfect for loading in-between a bunch of other PA gear and other instrument cases in the back of my small SUV, when I go out on a gig. The slick surface means it packs easily, and the tough fiberglass shell means I don't worry about PA gear shifting against it during the drive to the gig.

So I can understand paying $750 for a case (which is roughly what the Pegasus cost me), but I do find it a little hard to relate to the idea of treating it like a precious object; like it's too pretty to scuff up, or put a sticker on. In that respect, a case is a case as far as I'm concerned. I do like the aesthetics of my Peg... that sweet curvy shape in fiberglass. But I'm not afraid to scuff it up in the line of duty on a gig or in a session, as long as it's keeping the mandolin safe.

[Loudloar]

I'm sure you know more about Collings and these cases than I do but I question whether any businessman builds a new factory to make something that will not turn a profit?

Also I read somewhere a couple of days ago that if you took a $20 bill back to 1920 it would be worth $250. So a $16.50 red-line case (1920) in today's economy should cost around $210 not $750?

I'm quite sure that Collings didn't build a new factory just to build cases. They probably have a few workbenches dedicated to this project. There is a video from a couple years ago with Bill Collings discussing his plans for this case project. He said building these cases was probably not a good financial decision but he was doing it because "it was the right thing to do." (Meaning he wanted to build some quality cases even if there were more profitable alternative projects available.)

I was not basing my price analysis on inflation but on the case price as a percentage of the instrument cost. Instrument prices have risen many times more than inflation.

Steve

[Ivan Kelsall]

From Data Nick -" ...especially after that mando in a Calton case was dropped out of the trunk of that rental car in Santa Monica, and survived the abuse of being on the street !". Then there was the one about the mandolin in it's 'Travelite' case falling off the back of a moving motor cycle & surviving intact,which was posted on the Cafe several months ago. We must remember that if we drop a mandolin in it's case,it hits the deck with the ''combined weight x velocity'' (momentum) of the mandolin + case. A heavier case = more momentum (force) & maybe a greater possibility of damage to the mandolin. So reducing weight whilst retaining strength is important. The limiting factor is usually the case materials we have at our disposal. Very light but very strong materials usually cost a lot of money,for example the Carbon / Kevlar construction of the ''Hoffee'' cases,for me,one of the most beautiful cases around right now. But even they come with their own limitations & most folk usually buy a cover for them to help prevent external damage. Given the wide range of materials around these days,it would be possible to design a high impact resistant case,which would also insulate the mandolin inside from the impact,but it would cost a lot of money. We'd also need to leave behind any internal 'padding' that's stuck to the rigid exterior. Design an exterior case that protects itself,& design the interior to protect the mandolin. Q) What protects ultra-high value antique 'ceramics' during transit - is it the wooden crate or the Polystyrene granules in which they're packed ?. A) Well,it's not the wooden crate. IMHO,to design a case to do exactly the same for a mandolin,we need to think along those (or similar) lines,
Ivan

[darylcrisp]

From Data Nick -" ...especially after that mando in a Calton case was dropped out of the trunk of that rental car in Santa Monica, and survived the abuse of being on the street !". Then there was the one about the mandolin in it's 'Travelite' case falling off the back of a moving motor cycle & surviving intact,which was posted on the Cafe several months ago. We must remember that if we drop a mandolin in it's case,it hits the deck with the ''combined weight x velocity'' (momentum) of the mandolin + case. A heavier case = more momentum (force) & maybe a greater possibility of damage to the mandolin. So reducing weight whilst retaining strength is important. The limiting factor is usually the case materials we have at our disposal. Very light but very strong materials usually cost a lot of money,for example the Carbon / Kevlar construction of the ''Hoffee'' cases,for me,one of the most beautiful cases around right now. But even they come with their own limitations & most folk usually buy a cover for them to help prevent external damage. Given the wide range of materials around these days,it would be possible to design a high impact resistant case,which would also insulate the mandolin inside from the impact,but it would cost a lot of money. We'd also need to leave behind any internal 'padding' that's stuck to the rigid exterior. Design an exterior case that protects itself,& design the interior to protect the mandolin. Q) What protects ultra-high value antique 'ceramics' during transit - is it the wooden crate or the Polystyrene granules in which they're packed ?. A) Well,it's not the wooden crate. IMHO,to design a case to do exactly the same for a mandolin,we need to think along those (or similar) lines,
Ivan

you've just described a ReunionBlues Continental case

d

[fatt-dad]

all those pre-new-case Collings just took a hit in the secondary market.

f-d

[DougC]

I agree with Scott about Collings and design. Bill seems to know what to 'put in' and what to 'leave out'.
Personally I hate the latches on my TKL case and I hope they are not the ones on this new case.

[Mandobar]

The latches on the new Collings made cases are made at Collings. They are nothing like the TKL latches, which are more than likely bought by the tens of thousands by TKL from another manufacturer.

Once you see one of these cases in person, and touch it, you know why they cost what they do. The materials are just so much better than the TKL cases. The TKL cases are also showing signs of warping, which is why things don't line up. If they are actually made of plywood, the grade of plywood being used is not very good. I am also noticing that the tops on some of the cases don't fit the bottoms well at all. There is a tremendous opportunity for another manufacturer to come in and grab the market for instrument cases right now.

[Jeff Mando]

it's just the peace of mind factor from my perspective: especially after that mando in a Calton case was dropped out of the trunk of that rental car in Santa Monica, and survived the abuse of being on the street!

Granted, a great endorsement for a Calton, but as I see it the odds of that happening are probably equal to lightning striking your mandolin. However, from now on I will remember to make sure my trunk is latched!

I do remember interviewing more than one old musician and asking, "what happened to your old guitar you played on such and such.......?" More than once I was told that they backed over the guitar with their car and destroyed it. Seems impossible, but they told me that people always wanted to talk after a show and would walk them out to their car and they would set the guitar down by the trunk while talking, then get distracted, and forget to put the guitar in the trunk. Then back over it when leaving. Sounds like drinking may have been involved, but in any case, I always think of that when I'm putting my instruments in the trunk of my car.

[DataNick]

Granted, a great endorsement for a Calton, but as I see it the odds of that happening are probably equal to lightning striking your mandolin. However, from now on I will remember to make sure my trunk is latched! ...

My reasoning is that for me a case that has as many applications as possible makes the most sense. In view of that rental car episode in Santa Monica, if I ever am forced to check a mandolin while flying, I think that I might roll the dice if it was in a Calton...YMMV

[doc holiday]

News Flash! $750 = positively a steal. http://www.thestrad.com/ posts a violin case story. Not carbon fibre. Not a flight case. Sells for a record $17,220.

[doc holiday]

[QUOTE=Loudloar;1495430]I'm quite sure that Collings didn't build a new factory just to build cases. They probably have a few workbenches dedicated to this project."
Steve, Collings does an amazing amount with the relatively small shop space they have. The Waterloo & the case project (among other things) put them over the top. They had enough room to squeeze a place to build prototypes.
They did in fact build 2 new buildings. I saw them last Thanksgiving. The top floor of one building (thousands of square feet), is now occupied by the case production and the Waterloo guitars.

[Austin Bob]

Some on this thread see things differently than I do, with a valid point that at a $750 price point, a case needs to offer better protection.

I don't see this case as being offered to compete with Calton or Hoffee. They offer superior crush and perhaps even drop protection.

This case is more for those who simply want a very high quality case to store their mandolin in at home and to transport it around town to jams and gigs.

In a perfect world, I would have three cases for my F5:

• A Travelite for festivals or whenever I will have to carry it a long ways.
• My Hoffee with Thinsulate lining and an insulated cover for the ultimate in temperature and crush protection.
• The Collings, or perhaps a Gibson MM case for home and around town use.