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Thread: The search continues...

  1. #551
    Registered User sblock's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    With each new post to this trainwreck of a thread, I feel increasingly vindicated about all the helpful advice that was offered, but promptly ignored. And shame on those of you who told me to shut up and go away. You truly don't understand what the MC is about when attempt to silence opinions that happen diverge from your own.

    Here is a recap of some of the advice:

    1) Don't be compulsive and act in a rush when going about purchasing a truly high-end mandolin. Take the time to better educate your ears and hands first about the wide variety of sounds and playabilities that exist out there in this lofty price range. Travel to some places where you can gain more first-hand experience before shelling out $10,000-$20,000 -- or more. It's better to compare mandolins on an A/B basis when you can, rather than simply relying on your memory. The cost of a plane flight to Nashville is less than 10% of what you're thinking about spending, so consider that. Even if you come back with nothing, you will have learned a great deal.

    2) Don't buy a high-end instrument as your first and only mandolin. Get something decent, but perhaps not truly top-end, to tide you over as you search for the ultimate mandolin. Something in the $2,000-$4,000 range, like a Pava, Northfield, Collings, Weber, or the like would do very very nicely indeed. This should remove some of the edge, and your compulsion to buy. Or just get a 'beater,' in the $800-$1500 range. But have something to fall back on. Besides, you will need this mandolin whenever your high-end instrument goes in for repair, or whenever you go places where you can't risk taking along that expensive instrument. The purchase of a "lesser" mandolin only represents 10%-30% of what you'd spend on that top-end instrument, so it's a solid investment.

    3) Don't purchase and then return a high-end instrument for trivial reasons that are easily remedied by any competent luthier, like a bit of loose binding or some crazed finish or a minor issue with the bridge or setup. That betrays a real ignorance, and shows that you don't understand much about what you're doing. Buyer's remorse is less likely to occur when you are on top of your game.

    4) Don't whine!


    People love this thread because it illustrates a clear example the heartfelt passion that underlies MAS, which so many of us suffer from. We feel empathy, and we are experiencing vicariously with you. And that's all fine. But when your evident passion gives way to obsession followed by impulsive actions, it begins to lose sense. You really need to slow down a bit and catch your breath, I'd argue. Your wife now writes that you may have settled for that Wiens when you liked the Gilchrist better. And you appear to have panicked on the Gilchrist and sent it back due to some minor issues that really weren't about the sound. And now the dealer, who offered to fix the minor things (Gryphon), would rather not deal with you -- and small wonder! There surely must be a lot of buyer's remorse, now that the return period for the Wiens has lapsed, the Gilchrist is stuck in your mind, and you are out many thousands of dollars that you rushed into spending before doing all your homework. And that's not funny; it's tragic. These are all symptoms of a lack of confidence, or knowledge, or both, i.e., of not really knowing what you're truly doing. That's my opinion, anyway, and I'm sticking to it.

    There are some lessons to be learned from this thread for all of us on the MC. Lessons about passion versus obsession. Lessons about having a lot of disposable income to spend. Lessons about listening to our MC colleagues, and not rushing to silence them. Lessons about listening to mandolins, and not rushing to buy them.

    But what the hell, learn to love that Wiens -- enjoy it: I'm sure it's a terrific mandolin, regardless if it's not The One -- and move forward with your life, poorer but wiser.

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  3. #552
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Thank you Sblock

  4. #553
    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by sblock View Post
    But what the hell, learn to love that Wiens -- enjoy it: I'm sure it's a terrific mandolin, regardless if it's not The One -- and move forward with your life.
    It is OH MY GOD terrific. Money cannot buy happiness but it can buy you a world class mandolin to play until you find happiness.

    I would only add to sblocks comments:

    I have never made a decision where I wondered if the other choice might have been better. And that question, or twinge of regret lasts a while with me. I have learned to ignore it because, I now realize, I would have the same feelings if I chose the other option. There is no escaping some kind of questioning and regret. There is no decision that avoids it. None.

    The best thing, IMO, that you can do, is get on to playing the dern thing and enjoy the potatoes out of it, knowing you have an awesome mandolin in your hands that many, many of us can only experience vicariously through your joy.

    There are other mandolins, and differences that are more or less significant to your tastes, but there really are few if any mandolins better than what you have.

    Stop shopping and get on with the joy. You really don't have the wrong mandolin. None of your choices were the wrong mandolin.
    A talent for trivializin' the momentous and complicatin' the obvious.

    The entire staff
    funny....

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  6. #554
    Barn Cat Mandolins Bob Clark's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffD View Post
    Stop shopping and get on with the joy. You really don't have the wrong mandolin. None of your choices were the wrong mandolin.
    To that, I can only add:

    "If you can't be with the one you love, love the one you're with."
    Stephen Stills

    PS. Maybe not original to Stephen stills, but that's who most of us know it from.
    Purr more, hiss less. Barn Cat Mandolins Photo Album

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  8. #555
    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Yes. Even more so because the one he is with is an amazing one. The difference between the one he has and his other options is far far smaller than the difference between what he has and what most of us have.
    A talent for trivializin' the momentous and complicatin' the obvious.

    The entire staff
    funny....

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  10. #556
    Registered User UlsterMando's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by JeffD View Post
    It iThe best thing, IMO, that you can do, is get on to playing the dern thing and enjoy the potatoes out of it . . .
    Enjoy the potatoes out of it !
    JeffD you crack me up sir.

    Refrets, I've had a few . . .

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  12. #557

    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by sblock View Post
    .... and move forward with your life, poorer but wiser.
    Poorer? From what I gathered, he moved an instrument to free up funds for this purchase. Also, these instruments tend to hold their value pretty well, it's not like he flushed money down a toilet.

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  14. #558
    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    I just have a bit of experience that has driven home to me that most of us will lose our health before we lose our life, and I intend to get the maximum amount of playing into the time I have available.
    A talent for trivializin' the momentous and complicatin' the obvious.

    The entire staff
    funny....

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  16. #559
    Innocent Bystander JeffD's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    I will admit it is hard for me to think it, much less say it, without a crooked kind of smile and a raised eyebrow. Repeat after me:

    I have a Weins, my own, to have and to hold and to play for ever.

    But its not a Gilchrist.
    I see you smiling.
    A talent for trivializin' the momentous and complicatin' the obvious.

    The entire staff
    funny....

  17. #560

    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by Relio View Post
    Poorer? From what I gathered, he moved an instrument to free up funds for this purchase. Also, these instruments tend to hold their value pretty well, it's not like he flushed money down a toilet.
    Nothing right now is holding value. I've been buying and selling instruments for more than 20 years and have never seen the market like this.

    And it costs money to ship overnight, both ways, several times.
    "your posts ... very VERY opinionated ...basing your opinion/recommendations ... pot calling ...kettle... black...sarcasm...comment ...unwarranted...unnecessary...."

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  19. #561
    Registered User sblock's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    "Live! Life's a banquet, and most poor suckers are starving to death" Auntie Mame

    You have plenty to enjoy, and plenty of time to begin the real enjoyment.

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  21. #562

    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandobar View Post
    Nothing right now is holding value. I've been buying and selling instruments for more than 20 years and have never seen the market like this.

    And it costs money to ship overnight, both ways, several times.
    Nothing... Really? Ok... I made money on my last mando sale... I wonder what I'm doing wrong....

  22. #563
    Registered User Steve-o's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by Mandobar View Post
    Nothing right now is holding value. I've been buying and selling instruments for more than 20 years and have never seen the market like this.

    And it costs money to ship overnight, both ways, several times.
    All the more reason to keep the Wiens for a year or two. He presumably bought low, and with the right timing, may be able to sell high.

  23. #564
    Registered User sblock's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by Relio View Post
    Poorer? From what I gathered, he moved an instrument to free up funds for this purchase. Also, these instruments tend to hold their value pretty well, it's not like he flushed money down a toilet.
    I believe that money invested in a great instrument is rarely money "flushed down the toilet." I never implied that, and I never would write that! I can't understand where you got that. But whenever we invest a lot of money, we are -- by definition -- poorer for having made the expense. Yes, we might be able to recoup the investment. We might even be able to make a profit, if the value of the instrument appreciates significantly. But except for a few collectors and dealers, most of us get mandolins for the pleasure of playing them, and don't really think of them as practical investments. And most of us "lose money," if you think about it that way. If it were just about the money, we'd probably be better off by keeping our money in the bank, or investing it in stocks, bonds, or real estate. But if we did that, we'd have no great mandolin to play!

    The best advice is still this, regardless of the path: Educate yourself. Buy whatever you can afford to buy, play it like there's no tomorrow, and enjoy it. And try not to look back.

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  25. #565
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Looks like an autumn sky...
    Click image for larger version. 

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  27. #566
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Demetrius,

    You bought a fine instrument. Enjoy playing it. But, keep in mind, you are not forced into a lifelong commitment. Learn what it does well. Determine what it does for you. Or, what it doesn't. I know from experience that if I don't absolutely love an instrument from the start, I never will.
    But that doesn't mean you can't still have a meaningful fling, even if it's a temporary thing.

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  29. #567
    Registered User UlsterMando's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by sblock View Post
    The best advice is still this, regardless of the path: Educate yourself. Buy whatever you can afford to buy, play it like there's no tomorrow, and enjoy it. And try not to look back.
    Nicely summed up.
    But don't just enjoy it. Enjoy the potatoes out of it.
    Refrets, I've had a few . . .

  30. #568
    Registered User red7flag's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Demetrius, Your journey stimulated my own. But, mine after three days of research and Cafe opinions, I was plain tired and ready to make a decision. You can find the thread in the CBOM section here: http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/sh...rester-Cittern I really enjoyed the experience, but was not willing to draw it out as I really desired resolution. I wish to thank you for your story, but glad I was able to cut mine short. Thanks for you example, even if I only partially followed it.
    Tony Huber
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    2011 Mowry GOM
    2013 Hester F4 #31
    2014 Ellis F5 #322
    2017 Nyberg Mandola #172

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  32. #569
    bon vivant jaycat's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    Quote Originally Posted by Demetrius View Post
    Looks like an autumn sky...
    Click image for larger version. 

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ID:	148777
    Oh, that thing one can admire for free?
    "The paths of experimentation twist and turn through mountains of miscalculations, and often lose themselves in error and darkness!"
    --Leslie Daniel, "The Brain That Wouldn't Die."

    Some tunes: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCa1...SV2qtug/videos

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  34. #570

    Default Re: The search continues...

    An interview with Dem about the Wiens...

    http://themusicianswife.weebly.com/h...rview-with-dem

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  36. #571

    Default Re: The search continues...

    Ok...it's time to replace the picture on top of your home page with the new Wiens.
    (Maybe that one never belonged to Demetrius.?. I see it has the dreaded flat fingeboard.)

  37. #572
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    I stand by my original opinion: If you can afford it, buy the Gil too and enjoy them both!

  38. #573
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    The Gil sold..... :~/

  39. #574
    Purveyor of Sunshine sgarrity's Avatar
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    Default Re: The search continues...

    It's a video and I get the shortcomings, but that thing sounds good. MUCH better than the Wiens I had for a short period of time.

  40. #575

    Default Re: The search continues...

    Note to self: If I'm ever in the market for a high-end mandolin, hopefully I can keep the process down to asking a few select technical questions -- nut width, radius, fret size, materials, year -- and then decide based on playing it and how it sounds to my ears. I don't think any of us would come out looking all that healthy after having laid bare the decision process and the personal emotions that get stirred up. I don't need an audience for that. Well, maybe just my dog...............

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