$199.00 solid F style mandolin

[dhergert]

My impression of the ABS nut is that it's harder than some bone that I've worked with. More brittle too. That's unscientific, yes, but the files just don't dig into it like some bone nuts I've worked.

And I'd agree with Verne about the bridge at least for the 4 MKLFSTBs that I've dealt with... Although I've heard from at least one person who did have a faulty (broken) bridge upon arrival. On mine, the bridges seems to be well made, with perhaps some rough edges that could be smoothed a bit but I've never bothered to do so. The most important point is to make sure it is seated properly.

I've fitted my MK with a CA armrest, ToneGard and a pickguard in an effort to protect vibrations. I'm also using DA EFT74 strings. I've been pretty happy with the results. Very hard to beat that $199 price tag.

My MK even had an influence on some work I decided to have done on my F-9. I like the wider frets.

[Br1ck]

I made an armrest from a piece of 1x2 mahogany I had laying around. Went to a violin shop and got some viola chin rest hardware. Net cost, $5.

I've gone back and forth with the CA bridge idea. Concluded a Tone Guard would be money better spent.

It's kind of funny that my SilverAngel came with a very nice strap far more suited to an F style, so my MK sports a $60 strap.

I like the results I got from a bone nut, but would not pay someone to make one. At this point I think I would be happy with anything I do to it, such is the attachment.

[Verne Andru]

I think it needs saying that this 'Festival' mandolin certainly lives up to its name.

All components on mine are pro-grade (far better than consumer-grade at the very least) and I would have no problem putting this through the rigors of a festival tour.

From what I see it's designed to be a working-musicians instrument and everything from the woods to the tuning machines, bridge, frets and even the tailpiece are made to go the distance. Even the matte finish should stand up much better to rough and tumble road use than the more expensive glossy versions.

Heck of a deal.

[pheffernan]

OTOH I can see a McClung armrest. That takes the arm off the top allowing for much better volume and projection plus I find an armrest more comfortable, but otherwise it's quite a fine instrument as is to me.

I've gone back and forth with the CA bridge idea. Concluded a Tone Guard would be money better spent.

The added value of an armrest or a ToneGard is that they are not forever married to just the one instrument.

[Br1ck]

The added value of an armrest or a ToneGard is that they are not forever married to just the one instrument.

Yes, but you want one for every instrument you own.

[dhergert]

That was true in my case. I tried to get used to playing without, but after a few weeks I knew pretty well I wanted an armrest, ToneGard and pickguard on my MK so it would feel as much as possible like my F-9.

Interestingly, now my F-9 also has wide frets and a more rounded neck profile like my MK.

[Jeff Mando]

Interestingly, now my F-9 also has wide frets and a more rounded neck profile like my MK.

Gibson would do well to take suggestions from Michael Kelly........

[pheffernan]

Yes, but you want one for every instrument you own.

Yes, but not for every instrument you sell.

[dhergert]

Gibson would do well to take suggestions from Michael Kelly........

I'm pretty sure we have a few new Gibson factory-original F-9 owners here who have wide frets and a radiused fingerboard. In other words, these things are available from the factory if ordered. The D profile neck may also be available to order.

I do agree with the sentiment though. I think a lot of lessons can be learned from the $199 MKs that have been purchased. And I think a few builders have taken notice (ie: KM-606).

[dhergert]

Interesting add in the Cafe' classifieds. Testing the water? Probably a very decent deal since it includes the Elderly setup, a hard case and some nice extras (NFI).

On a pragmatic note, I just got back from the Summergrass festival in Vista, California. Arrived after sunset on Wednesday evening, wanted to jam but didn't trust my footing in the camping area in the dark, so didn't want to get my F-9 out. Got out the MK and had a great time. Sounded great, played comfortably. It is serving its purpose.

[Br1ck]

I would not feel uncomfortable selling mine for that price, considering the extensive work done, and it's rather decent tone and playability when compared to the lower end of the Eastman and Kentucky line. Doubt I will because my recent campsite misfortune has reinforced the need for a beater.

[farmerjones]

Setting the market, eh? I can't seem to find a case (I want) for less than a hundo delivered.

Well, seeing how I've already given mine a floridectomy, and of course I'd sell it signed. . . . . .
If they want mine unsigned, it's going to cost an extra hundred.

On second thought, no. I'm not selling mine. I'm going to help create scarcity.

You're Welcome!

[Frankdolin]

One modification I did and haven't seen here is remove the tail piece and bend it so the strings come through the center of the tail going to the bridge with out touching top or bottom. I attach the strings to the very bottom of those posts, don't trust them, and they have a nice clear shot to the bridge with out buzzing or getting out right bent into position the way it was originally.Unrelated, my bridge is also now completely down on itself with no adjustment left, poor mans' solid bridge, and it sound great!

[Verne Andru]

I believe part of the design of the tailpiece requires the strings rest against the top as they exit to reduce sympathetic vibrations. It's actually a very smart part of the design IMHO. By changing the angle of the strings so they come straight out you may be creating problems where they they didn't originally occur as it defeats a design feature.

[Frankdolin]

I understand your point Verne. But to me it makes no sense to have string pressure pulling up as well as back on the tailpiece from where the strings attach. So I'll stay with my set-up.

[Verne Andru]

But to me it makes no sense to have string pressure pulling up as well as back on the tailpiece from where the strings attach.

That tailpiece is designed [from what I see and summize] to provide a clean string break-angle at the tailpiece exit point similar to the clean break-angles you get at the bridge and peghead. This helps ensure there are as few possible points where the strings are inadvertently vibrating against things they shouldn't and the tensions, string lengths, etc. remain stable.

I have no doubt the way you've modified your tailpiece will work as well/bad as any of the other tailpieces out there, just seems a pity to defeat what I consider one of cleverer design aspects of the piece.

Whoever designed that tailpiece put a great deal of time into thinking through the issues and deserves a gold star in my books.

[dhergert]

This is the newer generation MK tailpiece, the previous version was the light stamped sheet metal tailpiece similar to the traditional Gibson tailpiece...

There are a lot of good points about this newer version. Personally I like the heavier weight, the very secure mount with the integral end-pin and the fact that this tailpiece can use either loop-end or ball-end strings.

The designed break-angle is similar to a lot of longer banjo tailpieces which focus tension downward on the instrument's bridge and through the bridge to the sound board (the head, on a banjo), potentially producing quicker response and typically bassier lows. Of course even in the banjo world tailpiece weight is an ongoing discussion; some people also believe that the lighter tailpieces allow better resonance. I've got excellent sounding instruments with both light and heavy tailpiece approaches and because there are so many other setup variables involved I honestly can't say that the tailpiece is the only thing that makes a difference.

One thing I'm not too pleased with in the newer MK tailpiece is the way the unwound loop-end strings tend to have their loop windings slip and even come loose due to the thinness and slickness of the posts that the string loops go around. I've seen this consistently with two different brands of strings and as such have devised ways to wind the strings around other strings' posts in order to keep the windings from coming loose. This does work, but it's messy and extra work especially if other strings ever need to be replaced. To be fair, it would be nice if the loop windings were made by the string manufacturers to not slip but it would probably require soldering which may not be price effective... Unfortunately this slippage is so consistent that I've come to expect it now. I've even had to hand re-tie strings a few times.

Like with banjos, I'm sure that mandolin tailpiece designs and weight variations do impact tone, but how much, and sympathizing with what other setup variables, are all details that are very much up for debate.

[Verne Andru]

One thing I'm not too pleased with in the newer MK tailpiece is the way the unwound loop-end strings tend to have their loop windings slip and even come loose due to the thinness and slickness of the posts that the string loops go around. I've seen this consistently with two different brands of strings and as such have devised ways to wind the strings around other strings' posts in order to keep the windings from coming loose.

I'm at a loss as to how the tailpiece can be responsible for poorly wound strings coming unwound. Theories?

A little dab of solder on the windings holds everything tight. Some roadies do this to every string every time they change strings, which is usually before every show. This speaks to the issue that strings unwinding is a common enough a problem on a range of instruments/bridges that mitigating the issue is common practice among the professional crowd.

IMHO it's the strings, not the tailpiece.

[dhergert]

I'm not unsympathetic to that point... Note, quoting myself:
<< To be fair, it would be nice if the loop windings were made by the string manufacturers to not slip but it would probably require soldering which may not be price effective... >>

That said, I've used ball-end strings on this tailpiece, settling them over the existing string posts, and they do not slip off of the ball ends at all. So there is something about the width of the existing string posts, and possibly also something about the straight line of the string, and maybe even about the plating that might make them more slippery.

I do agree about soldering the strings... But, this doesn't happen with the old traditional stamped Gibson style tailpieces if the strings are positioned properly. That extra bend creates enough friction that the loop windings don't slip.

Much to do about not very much though. I do like these newer MK tailpieces.

[Br1ck]

I've never had this problem with my MK. To me the tailpiece may well be the best thing about this instrument.

[Cornfield]

I have an opportunity to buy one of these. This will be my first mandolin. I've been playing tenor guitar and banjo in 5ths tuning lately and wonder about picking up the mando.
I've played ukulele and guitar for 10 years.
Is the mando mostly for playing in ensemble? I usually play and sing.
Two questions: is this a good first mandolin & is it good for solo playing?

[Hudmister]

Is the mando mostly for playing in ensemble? I usually play and sing.
Two questions: is this a good first mandolin & is it good for solo playing?

The mandolin is not mostly for playing in ensemble in my world, it makes a great solo instrument and many people specialize in that. The mandolin you are considering is an adequate first mandolin with a good set up and it is better than a lot of the mandolins people have started out on. Just save your money for the next one because as you get better you'll want more. As for playing and singing, the mandolin and you is all you need. It challenges you as a singer because you have to bring more to the song with your voice than singing with a guitar.

[Br1ck]

After a fret level and a setup, they are a servisable mandolin perfectly suited to a beginner on a budget. They are bright, and to temper this I've been using GHS silk and steel strings. Mine has gotten better over time but will never be mistaken for a small shop made mandolin.

I'd say mine easily compares to the lower end Eastman and Kentuckys I continue to try out in stores. The playability improved dramatically once the frets were leveled out, and the sound improved when the bridge fit was right. I'd pay 199 for one and sink another hundred into a good setup and feel I'd gotten a deal. Someone listed one recently that had been setup at $300 and that would work for me too.

So, yes, it would be fine.

[dhergert]

It's been about 3 1/2 years since this thread opened with a bang...

I pulled my MK out today, mostly just to look it over and make sure it's doing ok. It had been between 6 and 9 months since I had played it. My F-9 is my go-to instrument lately, especially as I'm learning to deal with some RA issues with my hands.

Since late September 2016 I've made a number of changes to my F-9, mostly inspired by my MK. I've had it professionally re-fretted (Gold Evo banjo-width frets) and I've had the neck re-profiled and speed-necked, and the nut replaced with a complete pro setup. Most recently I've replaced the tailpiece with a James tailpiece. It's a pretty nice instrument now and a big part of that is because my MK showed me what to expect...

Having been setup nearly exactly the same as my F-9, the MK showed me what my F-9 should feel like. It also showed me the kind of volume I should be getting out of my F-9. The F-9 still has a complex, dark tone with great clarity that the MK cannot emulate, but the MK was louder. The MK has been pretty respectable from the beginning like that, and really not just because of it's $200 price. The tone is bright and I'm guessing that by now it probably always will be, but the brightness is controllable based on touch. And the MK has tremendous sustain and bass response. Basically it's a very solid, loud, nice sounding instrument.

Today with both instruments out to compare, probably because my hands are so sensitive, my first comment to my wife as I played the MK was "it plays easier!". And it does. The MK has a wider neck and wider nut than my F-9, and it's just more comfortable to play. But the F-9 with the V-to-C re-profile, speed-neck and still-like-new fretwork is pretty comfortable now and it feels like a faster neck than the MK's. The F-9's neck will never be wider though, although I could probably put a nut with the strings spread more widely on it; an option I'll probably not worry about at least for now.

The MK had been louder than my F-9, until I put the James tailpiece on it. Today I observed this again, something about the James tailpiece design, material and/or geometry has improved volume a lot, this with the same strings and setup. With the same playing technique, the F-9 is a little louder and significantly clearer, so I'm very pleased with that.

As things sit, I expect to keep both instruments, lifers... The F-9 will probably always be the instrument I want to be playing, but the MK is a terrific backup for it, and if I close my eyes and work on touch a little, I can get it to sound close enough that I can enjoy it just about as much.

I'm still very appreciative for Mike for bringing this up!!! Thanks Mike!

[Br1ck]

I sure enjoyed mine while I had it, but can’t say I miss it. It started someone else on the path. But since I built my Arches kit, I’d rarely played it. My Arches is bright, but with way more tone, louder by a great deal, and my attachment is strong. When I upgrade, or sidegrade more likely, it will be to something between my Arches and my Silverangel’s voicing.

But set up, they are definitely in the Eastman/Kentucky ballpark. It is probably a crime most of them don’t get the considerable work they need.