"Space age flat pick" I-Tone

[Drew Egerton]

http://bluegrasstoday.com/space-age-...k-from-i-tone/

NFI or knowledge about these other than the article, I'm a BC user. The real question will be, can these demand the same kind of endless arguing that the BC has blessed us with?

[Br1ck]

May I be the first to say, with absolutely no knowledge of the product, that no pick is worth $35?

[DavidKOS]

May I be the first to say, with absolutely no knowledge of the product, that no pick is worth $35?

Tell that to all the Blue Chip users!

[sblock]

My oh my. That news release is truly incredible, in the original sense of the word! It even goes so far as to say (italics mine):

"Literally made from material used on the Space Shuttle, this new flat pick is literally something out of this world!"

That is literally an incorrect use of the word 'literally.' (Also, an overuse of the word.) As we all know, the Space Shuttle is made from many types of different materials, including steel alloys, aluminum alloys, multiple types of plastic, glass and ceramic, and so on. Most of these materials are thoroughly conventional, and not "out of this world." Their ad copy-writers need to appreciate the difference between 'figuratively' and 'literally.'

At .041" thickness (= 1.04 mm), the I-Tone pick would seem to be a bit on the thin side for many of us. The most popular BlueChip picks tend to be in the thickness range of .050" to .060" (= 1.3 mm to 1.5 mm), and the CT55 is .055" = 1.4 mm. This material would have to be awfully stiff to not over-flex at that thickness. But who can say, since we have no idea what the material is? Plus, it's only available as a teardrop shape, which is fairly popular for guitar players, but less so among mandolin players, who tend to prefer triangles or rounded triangles.

That said, I'd be very interested in hearing any reports from folks who have directly compared this pick to the BlueChip, which I now consider to be the gold standard -- figuratively speaking, that is!

[Jim Garber]

Interesting (I guess). Another mysterious material to make picks from. I wonder if it is this one:

Much of the shuttle was covered with LI-900 silica tiles, made from essentially very pure quartz sand. The insulation prevented heat transfer to the underlying orbiter aluminum skin and structure. These tiles were such poor heat conductors that one could hold one by the edges while it was still red hot.

I wonder what the advantage or differences are from BC picks:

It’s an absolutely great alternative to picks from manufacturers like Blue Chip. The only downside is that it is currently available in only one size and shape. As a teardrop guy who used to religiously use triangle shaped picks, I have to say it’s not my favorite design ever, although if they made a teardrop shape in it I’m sure I’d purchase several.

Hmmmm...

- - - Updated - - -

Tell that to all the Blue Chip users!

I think Br1ck is joking.

[keithb]

I ordered one - I'll post up some detailed pictures and a comparison with a BC when it arrives.

[sblock]

Jim,

About your speculation...

Most of the Space Shuttle heat tiles were made from an extremely lightweight and porous silica-based ceramic, which is filled with insulating pockets of air (or vacuum, in space). It has the consistency of a foam, only it's rather brittle. It would definitely not work as a pick material!

Other heat shields, on leading edges, were made from reinforced carbon-carbon, or RCC (this is what had become cracked and failed in the Columbia disaster). This material is jet black, and not the same color as the white I-Tone picks, so we can probably rule it out immediately.

Other heat insulation was provided using Nomex (found in oven gloves, fire-fighter suits, etc.), but this is a fibrous, heat-resistant plastic woven into a material, and not suitable for a pick.

I don't think the I-Tone is made from any of these things.

You could make a pick from ceramic, of course -- but not in the form used in the heat tile. Ceramics tend to be rather brittle, though. That said, I have seen some thick picks made from glass, or from glassy materials like agate. But these are always quite thick, because they cannot flex, and simply crack under strain when made thinner. To most of us, an ideal pick has just a bit of give to it.

Special "space-age" plastics, like certain formulations (and there are many, depending on cross-links and polymer lengths!) of polyimide and polyetherimide, seem to have made the best picks, so far. These materials have high melting points, are extremely wear-resistant, and yet retain flexibility. BlueChip and PrimeTone and ProPlec picks are all made from these types of plastics. The formulation of polyimide used in the BlueChip (Meldin, from Saint-Gobin) is very costly to buy, by the way, if you were tempted to make some of your own. I looked into this once, and decided I could better spend my money buying the chip from Matt Goins at BlueChip!

[Mandoplumb]

I need me one of them there picks that don't get hot sos I could stop burning my fingers on them fast songs.

[Willie Poole]

The Prime Tone picks are made from pretty much the same material as the Blue chip and they cost about 1/10th of the price and I do not see where any pic can sound any better than the P T`s that I am using,, No I have never owned a B. C. but I did try one once that a young lady had and I didn`t see anything so great about them but we all look for something different in sound...I am sure the hype will warrant many of us to try one of these new pics..

Willie

[sblock]

The Prime Tone picks are made from pretty much the same material as the Blue chip and they cost about 1/10th of the price and I do not see where any pic can sound any better than the P T`s that I am using,, No I have never owned a B. C. but I did try one once that a young lady had and I didn`t see anything so great about them but we all look for something different in sound...I am sure the hype will warrant many of us to try one of these new pics..

Willie

Actually, no, sorry -- that's not quite right. BlueChips made from a type of polyimide, PrimeTones are from a type of polyetherimide. Those words may sound similar, but the plastic materials are really quite different, both chemically and physically. Polyetherimides are widely available and quite inexpensive to buy. But in contrast, most polyimides (like Vespel and Meldin. Kapton is also a polyimide) are comparatively rare and VERY expensive to buy -- up to thousands of dollars for a sheet the size of a typical manila envelope! And that mostly accounts for why you can buy a Primetone pick for about 7 times less than a BlueChip pick.

Many formulations of Meldin plastics also contain some graphite in them, and they have the property of being self-lubricating when they come into contact with something like metal. A BlueChip pick slips off the string more readily than a Primetone pick, and this is not simply because the BC pick is more highly polished: it's because the sliding friction is instrinsically lower!

Don't get me wrong: Primetones are great picks. But those of you who think they are "just about the same as BlueChips" are either missing something important or insensitive the very real differences, which are certainly there. But pick choice is a very personal thing, so what one person likes best may not be the same as for the next person. And in my own opinion, the BlueChip pick sounds better than the Primetone on my mandolin. But YMMV.

[foldedpath]

The Prime Tone picks are made from pretty much the same material as the Blue chip

It's not the same material, as far as I know. I believe the BC material was identified a while back as "Meldin" and it's expensive to buy:

http://www.professionalplastics.com/MELDIN7001

The other difference is that BC's are machined from this flat sheet material, and from the looks of the Primetone picks, those are a molded polycarbonate (to get the indent and extruded logos and bumps). Someone correct me if I'm wrong about that.

Neither material is objectively better than the other; it's all down to individual preference in tone and feel. Personally, I like the smooth "self lubricated" feel of BC picks, but I can certainly respect anyone else's choice of a different pick. I think it's great that we all obsess over this stuff, because it's no different than fiddle players talking endlessly about their bows. We just get to spend a LOT less money trying alternatives!

I think I'll pass on this new Space Age pick though. Excessive hype is never a good sign.

Edit: Ninja'd by sblock.

[DavidKOS]

At .041" thickness (= 1.04 mm), the I-Tone pick would seem to be a bit on the thin side for many of us. The most popular BlueChip picks tend to be in the thickness range of .050" to .060" (= 1.3 mm to 1.5 mm), and the CT55 is .055" = 1.4 mm. This material would have to be awfully stiff to not over-flex at that thickness. But who can say, since we have no idea what the material is? Plus, it's only available as a teardrop shape, which is fairly popular for guitar players, but less so among mandolin players, who tend to prefer triangles or rounded triangles.

Actually I'd like a thinner pick with the needed stiffness, and I prefer pointed teardrops to triangles or ANYTHING round, but I am not playing archtop Gibson-design mandolins.

The stiffness is the real issue - not so much thickness. One of the things I like about the original TS picks that now are not legally available, is how stiff they are at a 1mm or so thickness. So any material like Ultem that comes close to that stiffness/thickness is OK by me. Celluloid, nylon, etc., are usually too flexible at the same thickness.

- - - Updated - - -

Excessive hype is never a good sign.

Especially with musical instrument accessories. There's a long history of highly hyped gimmicks that didn't stand the test of time.

[Tom C]

The Prime Tone picks are made from pretty much the same material as the Blue chip and they cost about 1/10th of the price and I do not see where any pic can sound any better than the P T`s that I am using,, No I have never owned a B. C. but I did try one once that a young lady had and I didn`t see anything so great about them but we all look for something different in sound...I am sure the hype will warrant many of us to try one of these new pics..

Willie

where do you see 1/10 the price? They are also $35 each just as BC
- I just ordered one. I need to know

[sblock]

Tom -- you seem to have misread. He meant that Primetone picks are 1/10th the price of BlueChip picks, not that I-Tones are!

[Tom C]

ahhhh

[Jim Garber]

My oh my. That news release is truly incredible, in the original sense of the word! It even goes so far as to say (italics mine):

"Literally made from material used on the Space Shuttle, this new flat pick is literally something out of this world!"

That is literally an incorrect use of the word 'literally.' (Also, an overuse of the word.)

That word makes me cringe, too.

[Br1ck]

Interesting (I guess). Another mysterious material to make picks from. I wonder if it is this one:


I wonder what the advantage or differences are from BC picks:


Hmmmm...

- - - Updated - - -



I think Br1ck is joking.

Br1ck is indeed joking.

[Atlanta Mando Mike]

Sblock, great informative posts!!!

[LadysSolo]

I will wait for the review, as I am currently happy with Blue Chip.

[pops1]

I have a 35 BC, about 1mm and it doesn't flex, same for the Wegen at 1mm. I like the glide of the BC, but the tone of the Wegen. I think if they would make one thinner it would sound better on my mandolin. I started with a BC 60, then 50, then 40 now 35, each time it sounded better and not so dull. If you have a bright sounding G string the heavier picks would be great, but with some depth to the G they lack clarity for me. Sure like the glide tho.

[Jess L.]

Several observations...

1. It *is* a regular triangle pick shape, *not* teardrop. At the manufacturer's website, the About page says:
   
   

   "The I-Tone Pick is currently made in an ultra-precision beveled triangle shape."

   Although, is it my imagination or does their picture show slightly less-rounded shoulders compared to, say, regular Fender guitar picks? That might bother me a little, as sometimes I like to turn the pick sideways and play with the rounded top shoulder instead of the more-pointy part.
   
   
2. Someone mentioned hype. Seems to me that it's mostly coming from the magazine writer, not the pick manufacturer. Not sure how it works with that bluegrass magazine, but I've seen instances of other magazines' articles (about people I know personally) where the person being written about didn't even get to read *any* of the early drafts of an article, let alone the final version. Sometimes it works out good, sometimes not so much if there are errors or if the writing style doesn't portray things in the right light.
   
   
3. Probably an aside, but for what it's worth, the co-inventor ain't no slouch on mandolin, check out his video, music starts at 0:59
   
   
   (or direct link)
   Wish he'd do some pick comparisons using other picks though, might help the undecided to make up their minds. The room sound seems a little harsh (from too many hard surfaces or something), not a studio recording I guess, but maybe that's good because it's more of a real-world situation? Anyway, I'm not qualified to comment on high-end picks, as I prefer 50-cent Fender mediums, but the only thing I noticed in this video is a few times someone's pick hit something -- I'm guessing it's the mandolin pick hitting the mandolin's fingerboard-extension-thingie (personally I'd get rid of that extension), most noticeable around 2:15-2:19, but heck for all I know it's an intentional rhythmic effect or something. Trivial detail though, doesn't detract from the music. I really like their playing.
   
   
4. If I wasn't such a cheapskate (and quasi-reformed packrat) I might be tempted to buy one of their picks just to check it out, make sure I'm not missing anything. Maybe someone needs to add one to the Traveling Pick Sampler?
   
   
5. Misc.: I don't see the phrase "space age" on the manufacturer's website, so may we assume the magazine writer chose that phrase? Huh. Didn't realize "space age" was considered a desirable thing anymore, thought that phrase went out after the 1960s (yes I'm showing my age) when people realized they weren't going to get a Jetsons flying car and have a robot maid and never have to exercise.

[Bertram Henze]

[Jim Garber]

1. Misc.: I don't see the phrase "space age" on the manufacturer's website, so may we assume the magazine writer chose that phrase? Huh. Didn't realize "space age" was considered a desirable thing anymore, thought that phrase went out after the 1960s (yes I'm showing my age) when people realized they weren't going to get a Jetsons flying car and have a robot maid and never have to exercise.

Shawn mentions NASA and the space shuttle in the video plus on the store page linked from the review:

Made from the same material as the Space Shuttle, the I-Tone Pick produces the clearest tone AND has the most wear-resistance and overall durability ever produced in a flat pick!

[Jess L.]

Shawn mentions NASA and the space shuttle...

Yes I know, but my point was that he didn't specifically use the phrase "space age", which has a somewhat different and more dated connotation:

"The Space Age began with the development of several technologies that culminated on October 4, 1957, with the launch of Sputnik 1 by the Soviet Union.... The launch of Sputnik 1 ushered a new era of political, scientific and technological achievements that became known as the Space Age.

"The Space Age was characterized by rapid development of new technology in a close race mostly between the US and the Soviet Union. Rapid advances were made in rocketry, materials science, computers and other areas. Much of the technology originally developed for space applications has been spun off and found other uses.

"The Space Age reached its peak with the Apollo program, that captured the imagination of much of the world's population. The landing of Apollo 11 was watched by over 500 million people around the world and is widely recognized as one of the defining moments of the 20th century. Since then, public attention has largely moved to other areas.[3]

"During the 1990s funding for space related programs fell sharply as the remaining structures of the Soviet Union disintegrated and NASA no longer had any direct competition."

-Wikipedia

However, despite the above quote's use of the past-tense "was", that page does display a definitely-non-1960s space shuttle picture prominently near the top of the page. One might conclude that the Space Age still exists as a technological era, in that we still send things to space.

But it certainly doesn't spark the imagination of the masses like it did in the 1960s. Maybe it's a regional thing, but around here the term "space age" is considered quaint & passé, nearly dead & gone as far as big high-profile space programs that capture public attention.

Maybe the phrase "space age" is finally making a retro comeback?

[MediumMando5722]

It's interesting they chose the same price point as BlueChip. It will be more interesting to see the big name players we see promoting these picks in the near future.

All that said, I love BC picks, and if they choose to make this one available in a 1.4 or 1.5mm thickness, I'd be curious to try one. Funny, I convinced myself the cost of a BC wasn't that great because I'd only have to buy one. Now I have two, and would like to try one of these.

Attention anyone who hasn't broken the $35 pick barrier: Do so at your own risk