Comparing 3 CBOMS of different scale lengths

[Tavy]

I'm not sure what this shows, but I thought it might be fun to compare these 3 very different CBOM's with very different scale lengths, but all playing the same tune in the same key.

We have:

1) 25-26.5" variable scale cittern (my build).
2) 20" scale vintage waldzither.
3) 15" scale mandola (with capo on 2, also my build).

See what you think:

[derbex]

interesting, from the video I think I like the Waldzither best if only because it was the loudest on the recording and a lot of character cam through, is that true in 'real life'? Sorely tempted. The guitar bodied cittern is just stunning to look at though, good tone too.

BTW how would you compare the Pluckthorn to a Bohm Waldzither?

[SGraham]

Tavy, Thanks for taking the time to record and post this. That was fun indeed to hear the differences in the scale lengths. I like the sound of all three instruments, but think I like the mandola the best. Thanks again.

[Bertram Henze]

I favor the cittern, and it's just what Hector the Hero needs.

[Tavy]

Well that's 3 different preferences Just goes to show how much personal preference comes into things...

interesting, from the video I think I like the Waldzither best if only because it was the loudest on the recording and a lot of character cam through, is that true in 'real life'? Sorely tempted. The guitar bodied cittern is just stunning to look at though, good tone too.

BTW how would you compare the Pluckthorn to a Bohm Waldzither?

Good questions, Boehm waldzithers are fancier looking, shorter (43cm scale), smaller bodied and more mandola than OM. Very nice sounding though. Pluckthum's are longer (50cm scale), much bigger bodied, deep body too, and that's reflected in the deeper sound. Both quality instruments, though the higher spec Boehm's with the Brazilian back and sides are well... higher spec.

Comparing the cittern and waldzither: the waldzither is warmer sounding in the mid range, can be muddy at times, rich and luxurious at others, all part of the same spectrum. The cittern has better clarity and note separation, but can be a bit nasal in the mids (I have some ideas about that should ever build another), but cuts through much better in a band situation. In fact in a band situation the waldzither is basically a dead loss for solos as they just get lost amongst the guitars, the cittern on the other hand is closer to an arch top guitar (think Dave Rawlings type sound) and has received lots of positive comments in that sort of situation. Though I confess I have one friend I back up country music for, and she doesn't like it - "it doesn't sound very mandolin" - and of course it's neither a mandolin, nor a "sound" typically associated with that genre. So horses for courses I guess...

With regard to volume, I agree the waldzither sounds louder up close when playing quietly, and yet the cittern can drown out almost anything when you dig into chords - what was that Mike Marshall quote on mandocello's, something like "2 note chords are big, three note chords are huge, and 4 note chords just want to take over the world", well believe me 5 note chords aim for interstellar domination

Perhaps as much for my own curiosity as anything, I should try those 2 with an "ambient" room mic, rather than close mic'ed where sound hole geometry and all sorts of other factors get in the way... always interesting to discover what the audience hears...

[Markkunkel]

John, thanks for that comparison. Gotta say that big ol' cittern is quite wonderful, and yes, Hector the Hero sounds splendid on it. The other two instruments are lovely as well. Very cool to hear them all side by side.

[gtani7]

I enjoyed that, a lot of info and beautiful instruments also. I was wondering, if you could try different picks to elicit different attacks and brightness, e.g. Blue chip, wegen and a very pointy one like a large ultex jazz 3.

Also, I think i have those same mikes, is that an at2020 and a condensor from the focusrite scarlett Studio? (Could also be at4040, a very good condensor for the money).

[Tavy]

I enjoyed that, a lot of info and beautiful instruments also. I was wondering, if you could try different picks to elicit different attacks and brightness, e.g. Blue chip, wegen and a very pointy one like a large ultex jazz 3.

Unfortunately my pick collection is rather lean - mostly variations on primetones and ultex. Could be time for UK travelling pick sampler?

Also, I think i have those same mikes, is that an at2020 and a condensor from the focusrite scarlett Studio? (Could also be at4040, a very good condensor for the money).

Yes the red one is from the scarlette studio, the other is an Octava 519 (interesting mostly because it seems to be a copy of a modded version of an earlier Octava mic.)

[vernob]

I'm impressed with the fan frets. Figuring out the angles as well as cutting the slots. Did you have access to CAD/CAM or something like it? Or did you cut by hand?

[Tavy]

I'm impressed with the fan frets. Figuring out the angles as well as cutting the slots. Did you have access to CAD/CAM or something like it? Or did you cut by hand?

By hand, I used fretfind2d to create the template. Seems to work OK Actually setup is much more difficult than sorting the fret slots - the strings in each pair are slightly different lengths and tensions and therefore intonate slightly differently - I have it mostly set up right, but it could use a little more work some time, one day when I have nothing to do!