Old Virzi and more found at Mandolin Brothers

[Timbofood]

Now that I am thinking about it, the "Virzi" was installed before the body was closed. So, what (or to what degree) did they impact Lloyd Loar's ear with regard to the musical style the F-5 was conceived to play? We have evidence of them being removed (for more contemporary/ "bluegrass" music) but, the "expected" impact for the original orchestral design of the F-5 asks a different question, doesn't it?
Rapid decay and volume are arguably one of the notable (sorry) qualities of the (BG) genre most often sought. "Hot and hard" over "Long and delicate" in broad terms.
Roger, any input?
Sorry, kind of a long winded rehash of Steve's post.
Apologies, it's been a weird day.
No mandolin music!

[Jim Garber]

Jim, any chance it was #75702? That mando was at Elderly's once, went to Retrofret and was eventually test-driven and compared to a non-Virzi (#75310) at Carter's: www.youtube.com/watch?v=0h_CdTa-2-U

Yup. I think that is the one. You can see the serial number on the RetroFret site on the pic of the label. Listing is here.

As Chris said, "This is as good as a Virzi Loar as I ever played."

[JEStanek]

Thanks for sharing these. That Mandolin Brother's shop must be like a treasure trove for interesting bits of mandolin ephemera.

I'm a fan of the different voice the Virzi gives.

Jamie

[Charles E.]

Here are two we have in the shop, a violin and a cello.........

[Charlieshafer]

Here are two we have in the shop, a violin and a cello.........

You're killing me! Throw one in a cello for me!

[Jeff Mando]

It was the "tone-gard" of its generation!

[Willie Poole]

If they cut down on the vibrations of the top of a mandolin then wouldn`t thicker (heavier) tone bars do much the same thing? I would bet that Loar installed them because violin makers had installed some in their instruments and we know that Loar liked to copy some things that were used in/on violins...I guess that is just speculations since no one has ever heard him state that...

Willie

[Hendrik Ahrend]

I enjoyed reading John Monteleone's approach:

Let it be known that I don't intend to step on anyone's toes, and I may have rattled someone elses cage or two, but I'm have great difficulty trying to recall anyone who ever said to me "gee, I wish I had that Virzi back in my mandolin". Nor have I ever been asked, thank God, to make one and put it in their mandolin.

It's not often that you will see folks come to the defense of Virzi either. Sure, I'll take you up on your offer. I'd like to see the video but I'll tell you right now that chances are that the microphones, recording, and related engineering might not reveal a fair judgement. However, I do have an open mind about these and other things. You can't be a luthier of good reputation and not comtemplate the good and the rediculous. Perhaps it was during one of these open minded sessions that Mr. Virzi had one too many thimbles of grappa.

Regarding the installment of a foreign object inside and under the bridge of [let us say] a Loar mandolin; you could hang a bees nest in there and still be able to appreciate its wonderful tone, if it's there to begin with. And I will speculate that the tone will sound sweeter, not to mention buzzier.

In fact, technically speaking, one could suspend a variety of objects in there of different material even, and because you are adding mass to the bridge area you stand a chance of increasing the sustain, one of the so-called advantages of the Virzi. But we gain questionable sustain at the more likely sacrifice of other more important tonal positives. Now, if the Virzi is so good why aren't they requested and built in as standard practice?

The argument for Virzis, if there are any, may remain to be a debatable issue for those few. The argument against them is more convincing. Ask anyone who has had them removed. This issue by the way is not a new one. It's been going on for some time, probably since they were first installed.

If I may quote myself from an earlier response to this question, "But I would have loved to have over heard the convincing sales pitch that Mr. Virzi sold to Mr. Loar", " I don't know what they were thinking." Well, perhaps it was also this very lunatic proposition that contributed to leading Lloyd away from Gibson in the first place. Who knows?


To found here:http://www.mandozine.com/media/CGOW/monteleone.html

[Jim Garber]

Well, perhaps it was also this very lunatic proposition that contributed to leading Lloyd away from Gibson in the first place. Who knows?

Yes! He designed the ViViTone guitars and mandolins, some of which has spruce backs among other novel features. "More grappa, please, Giuseppe!"

[brunello97]

Yes! He designed the ViViTone guitars and mandolins, some of which has spruce backs among other novel features. "More grappa, please, Giuseppe!"

Grappa? Did you say grappa? Come on, my boy.



Mick

[j. condino]

Here is a virzi stalactite in a 1924 Gibson harp guitar:

[goaty76]

Here is a virzi stalactite in a 1924 Gibson harp guitar:

Cool, never seen one in harp guitar before. It's a good day when you see/learn something new. Thanks.

Phil