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Thread: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie recs?

  1. #1

    Default Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie recs?

    Hi Everyone,

    I recently picked up a Mandolin; I have no musical background or knowledge but I saw a mandolin somewhere and got it in my head to learn how to play it.

    I picked up a cheap Mandolin from my local music store (a Denver A style) and found that the bridge wasn't attached properly (it was sitting on a piece of foam, I suppose to prevent scratching during shipping).

    I removed the foam and while trying to set the bridge I snapped some of the strings that shipped with the mandolin, so I picked up some Ernie Ball Earthwood 80/20 Light strings (9-34, by the way, one of the strings is marked as 0.022w, what does the "w" mean? wound? aren't all base strings wound?) which were luckily some of the last strings my local store had in stock.

    Anyways, I was able to set the bridge so that all the strings (GDAE) were intonating properly at the 12th fret, though the bridge looks a tad slanted. Only the G string(s) buzz when I pick really hard, other than that it sounds great and hold tune great, for a cheap little mandolin!

    So I have a few questions; I hope you'll indulge me:

    1) The A and E strings (E mainly though) are really loud and "pingy". I've seen this referred to as "bright" and I can definitely hear it when I listen to mandolin videos on YouTube, but I find the sound really gets to me after a while, is there a way I can make the A and E strings less shrill? Would thicker strings, like say 10/14 or 11/15 remove some of the shrill-ness or high pitched-ness of those strings? They'd still be tuned to A and E but would they be in a lower octave because of thickness of the strings? I don't plan on playing Bluegrass or Folk style music, I don't intend to gig with my mandolin, nor do I care about the loudness, if anything i'd prefer it to be less loud just to prevent the ire of my neighbours.

    2) I've checked out Mandolessons.com and a few other online tutorial sites, but are there books that are recommended for newbies like me with no musical background at all? I'd like to be able to learn rudimental music notation so I can read music, but I don't want to get bogged down by it. I bought the mandolin because I liked the size and thought it would be neat to play. I'll also eventually want to learn guitar and figured that the Mandolin would be a great place to start and then transfer my skills to the guitar, eventually.

    Thanks, and Happy New Year!

  2. #2
    Registered User Louise NM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    I'll give an answer to you question about books. The website for Mel Bay has enough mandolin books to keep you entertained and learning for the next decade or so. One of my favorites is Marilynn Mair's The Complete Mandolinist, although if bluegrass is your main interest it might not be the best choice. Browse through and see what looks interesting. This book is another good one for a beginner—tunes in all kinds of styles.

  3. #3
    Orrig Onion HonketyHank's Avatar
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    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    Those Ernie Ball strings are very light, even for being labelled as "Light". Most would call them extra light. A lot of folks use D'Addario Mediums (EJ74) as a good all around inexpensive set of strings. The E string on that set is .011". D'Addario's Light set has 0.010" E string. My recommendation: Try a heavier set, but don't rush -- the light gauge of the Ernie Ball strings will be easier to fret while you are developing calluses. I have used those strings before, but only on an old bowlback mandolin with light construction. Modern mandolins are designed with heavier strings in mind. I don't know if heavier strings will help you in your particular problem but they might.

    Juststrings.com or stringsandbeyond.com are good sources for strings at a reasonable price if you don't have much selection locally.

    I may be the only person here who hasn't used Mandolins for Dummies by Don Julin. It gets very high marks from those who have used it.
    New to mando? Click this link -->Newbies to join us at the Newbies Social Group.

    Just send an email to rob.meldrum@gmail.com with "mandolin setup" in the subject line and he will email you a copy of his ebook for free (free to all mandolincafe members).

    My website and blog: honketyhank.com

  4. #4
    Registered User BoxCarJoe's Avatar
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    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    The right pick (for you) will tame a harsh E string.

    May I suggest ProPlec? They are reasonably priced and give a warm tone.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    Thicker and more rounded picks help tame highs. Some experimenting may be in order.
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  6. #6
    My Florida is scooped pheffernan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    In order of least invasive first:

    1) Technique — if you position your pick to attack at an angle, instead of straight through the strings, you will generally pull a richer tone. The same for picking closer to the fretboard than the bridge.

    2) Strings — As Hank said, your Ernie Ball set is more suited to a bowlback than an A-style. The D’Addario EJ74 is a standard medium set, and there are darker options beyond it.

    3) Pick — Like Joe and pops suggested, thicker and more rounded picks, such as the ProPlec, darken tone, and you can find darker shapes and materials.

    4) Mandolin — At some point, you might find the limitations of “a cheap Mandolin from [your] local music store” and that your ears gravitate toward a darker tone which might involve a change in soundhole (oval), brand (Silverangel), or even instrument (mandola).
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  7. #7

    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    Dawg-gone best pick out there imho . . . your A & E will love them. A little pricey at $18 for a dozen - but worth it


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  8. #8
    Worlds ok-ist mando playr Zach Wilson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    I had a similar issue with my the Loar LM170 when I first received it. The set up was fine as far as intonation, string height, level frets, no string buzz. The only issue was those scratchy and shrill A and E strings. I found that GHS A270s (they are a lot like Daddario EJ74) and a Dawg or Golden Gate pick helped. But what helped most was lubricating the nut slots with graphite. Not sure why though. Maybe it stabilized the thinner strings in their slots better.

  9. #9
    Confused... or?
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    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    My first stringed instrument, a "budget" Kay guitar in 1963 (Thanks, Santa!), had "pingy" unwound strings. Came to learn that's mostly due to 1) budget, and 2) unwound. That's life ...

    Yes, a thicker, rounded pick will help a lot. I second the ProPlec suggestion (I like large rounded-triangles). Personally, I find the Dawg picks to be too rounded & too dull, but that should be your call. Without getting into exotica (say $15 up to, what, maybe $100 for the material that shall not be named) there are a variety of heavier-than-Fender picks that are cheap enough to experiment with. But many won't show up in your everyday music store, whether mega- or mom & pop.

    Two other anti-ping ingredients are time & experience. Subtle variations in pick angle & touch do vary the tone - a good thing. Plus, the strings will tone down some in a week or two; sooner if you play all day!
    - Ed

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  10. #10

    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    Being a new instrument with the foam under the bridge, Iwoudl suspect that it needs to be fit to the top.

    Take it in for a set up if you are not handy with that.

  11. #11

    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    The shrillness of mine was tamed by replacing the bone - nut and saddle - with ebony. The ebony saddle definitely moved the sound in the direction I wanted to go. The ebony nut clinched the deal.

  12. #12
    Registered User John Flynn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    Agree with all that has been said. I would try heavier strings. I would go with Phosphor Bronze or Stainless Steel instead of 80/20. And a rounder pick and steeper pick angle will help. But mostly, just go light on the A and E, especially playing chords. I had an instructor tell me this once. The A and E just need a lighter touch on most mandolins.

  13. #13

    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    EDIT: Oops! I just noticed that Pheffernan already mentioned hand position. (I was reading too fast and didn't see it at first.)

    ------------
    My earlier post:

    All good advice above. But picking hand location hasn't been mentioned yet.

    If you pick too near the bridge, the sound will be more harsh and plinky.

    Whereas if you position your picking hand slightly further up towards the neck, the sound will be a little bit nicer and more mellow.

    You might already be playing slightly further away from the bridge, but if not, it's worth a try. While that won't magically transform a normal instrument into a bazillion-dollar instrument, it can improve the tone just enough to make the instrument more enjoyable to play.

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  15. #14
    The Amateur Mandolinist Mark Gunter's Avatar
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    Default Re: Making the A and E strings less "pingy" and general newbie re

    Quote Originally Posted by pheffernan View Post
    In order of least invasive first:

    1) Technique — if you position your pick to attack at an angle, instead of straight through the strings, you will generally pull a richer tone. The same for picking closer to the fretboard than the bridge.

    2) Strings — As Hank said, your Ernie Ball set is more suited to a bowlback than an A-style. The D’Addario EJ74 is a standard medium set, and there are darker options beyond it.

    3) Pick — Like Joe and pops suggested, thicker and more rounded picks, such as the ProPlec, darken tone, and you can find darker shapes and materials.

    4) Mandolin — At some point, you might find the limitations of “a cheap Mandolin from [your] local music store” and that your ears gravitate toward a darker tone which might involve a change in soundhole (oval), brand (Silverangel), or even instrument (mandola).
    ^ This is it ... and I would add, 5) Your ear.

    The mandolin being by nature a pretty high pitched instrument, it took some time for my ear to get used to it after a lifetime of guitar playing. I loved the cool sounds and tonalities especially on old time fiddle tunes, but the shrill highs took some time to assimilate. Once your ear settles down and tunes in to the instrument, and you develop some technique, you'll need to find something nicer than the lowest common denominator in the instrument itself.
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