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Thread: Best use of bulk time?

  1. #1
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    Default Best use of bulk time?

    I started playing mandolin a little over a month ago, and I am pretty excited about where I am at. Hoping to keep the train moving...

    I recently posted how I need to take a step back, and “re-learn” because I didn’t discipline myself in down up picking. So, I basically relearned all of my tunes, by slowing way down, and focusing on down up picking. My current tune list is:

    Wildwood Flower, Cripple Creek, Galopede, Golden Slippers, Red Haired Boy, Cherokee Shuffle, Liberty, and Whiskey Before Breakfast.

    I have all of these nailed, using down up picking, with the metronome at 100, most with the metronome at 120.

    DISCLAIMER- these are my metronome setting that sound right. If I play along with Bert Casey and the Mandolin Primer, he notes the metronome setting at half of these, 50 bpm and 60 bpm. Just being totally honest with anybody, everybody, and especially myself.

    Over the next few nights, I am going to have bulk amount of time available with just me and the mandolin. We are talking 5-6 hours each night. So, I want to make the best use of this time. What do you think I should do?

    Work on speed of these tunes?
    Learn some more?

    I have Mike Marshall’s Mandolin Fundamentals for all players DVD, work with that?

    Work hard on learning standard notation?

    My ultimate goal: just play beautifully. Not going out to jams, gigs, just want to bring out the beauty in the mandolin, for my own enjoyment at home. My daughters are learning some instruments, I enjoy picking with them a little. I envision getting into Celtic, Irish, and Classical, just haven’t even dipped my toe in those waters yet.

  2. #2
    The Amateur Mandolinist Mark Gunter's Avatar
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    That Mike Marshall set is a great one, IMO. I've often thought that it should be included with new mandolin purchases for any beginning player! That's how well-rounded it is IMO. Since Mike goes through fundamentals on picking exercises, melody playing and harmony playing, and references a bit of music theory behind the concepts, I'd think there may be some things in there that can inspire you to learn more through your own research and practice. So it might be good to spend some of your time working through things in there by diving deeply into sections that appeal to you and that you think you need.

    Then, from your above comments, I think you might benefit from continuing to play tunes you know and love but take the time to slow down, speed up, isolate any problem areas then work on technique and aim for getting the most beautiful tone possible, and for getting it right every time. That's a really tall order.

    And finally, of course, learn some new tunes or songs. Any genre that appeals to you. Learn by ear or from sheet music. Could be something you hear on the radio or music stream that appeals to you, or from wherever, just tunes that appeal to you whether you think you could play it or not, try to learn it by ear or using using sheet music. It's great exercise and you'll find some keepers - then you're back to playing them as tunes you know while working on your technique, memory and tone.

    These are just some thoughts, nobody can really say what you should do with your practice time unless they can hear you and know your strengths and weakness. If you've only been playing a month, then expect some setbacks from time to time. Take time to enjoy the journey and the progress, don't let yourself be discouraged by setbacks, and be easy on yourself. No one plays like a pro without years of practice, experience, setbacks and fun along the way.
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Thank you Mark, for taking the time to offer a well thought response. Appreciate it. I knew it would be difficult, like you said, nobody truly knows what I need.
    I just don’t want to miss out on this opportunity of time. Usually work 6 nights a week, but we happen to have the next 3 nights off (MLK)

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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Medley12 View Post
    I started playing mandolin a little over a month ago, and I am pretty excited about where I am at. Hoping to keep the train moving...

    I recently posted how I need to take a step back, and “re-learn” because I didn’t discipline myself in down up picking. So, I basically relearned all of my tunes, by slowing way down, and focusing on down up picking. My current tune list is:

    Wildwood Flower, Cripple Creek, Galopede, Golden Slippers, Red Haired Boy, Cherokee Shuffle, Liberty, and Whiskey Before Breakfast.

    I have all of these nailed, using down up picking, with the metronome at 100, most with the metronome at 120.

    DISCLAIMER- these are my metronome setting that sound right. If I play along with Bert Casey and the Mandolin Primer, he notes the metronome setting at half of these, 50 bpm and 60 bpm. Just being totally honest with anybody, everybody, and especially myself.

    Over the next few nights, I am going to have bulk amount of time available with just me and the mandolin. We are talking 5-6 hours each night. So, I want to make the best use of this time. What do you think I should do?

    Work on speed of these tunes?
    Learn some more?

    I have Mike Marshall’s Mandolin Fundamentals for all players DVD, work with that?

    Work hard on learning standard notation?

    My ultimate goal: just play beautifully. Not going out to jams, gigs, just want to bring out the beauty in the mandolin, for my own enjoyment at home. My daughters are learning some instruments, I enjoy picking with them a little. I envision getting into Celtic, Irish, and Classical, just haven’t even dipped my toe in those waters yet.
    A little more than a month ago ?? You are doing great and WAY ahead of me when I was at that stage !! Congratulations !

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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Thank you Yankees1. I played banjo for quite some time. I feel very lucky in that I feel like I can pick up a tab really quickly.
    I don’t know how or why, I just do.
    I can nearly sight read with tab.

    Something else that I learned from Ross Nickerson was to memorize a tab as quickly as possible. So that’s what I do. I wanted to learn Whiskey Before Breakfast (one of the songs that really drew me towards mandolin) so I got the tab off of mandolessons, memorized it in parts pretty quickly, and then just played the fire out of it lol.

    But I really want to play the mandolin, not play tabs on a mandolin. I hope that makes sense.

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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Medley12 View Post
    Thank you Yankees1. I played banjo for quite some time. I feel very lucky in that I feel like I can pick up a tab really quickly.
    I don’t know how or why, I just do.
    I can nearly sight read with tab.

    Something else that I learned from Ross Nickerson was to memorize a tab as quickly as possible. So that’s what I do. I wanted to learn Whiskey Before Breakfast (one of the songs that really drew me towards mandolin) so I got the tab off of mandolessons, memorized it in parts pretty quickly, and then just played the fire out of it lol.

    But I really want to play the mandolin, not play tabs on a mandolin. I hope that makes sense.
    It took me years to get where you are at ! I didn't start until almost 64 however ! By the way I live about one hour North of Cardinal land !

  7. #7
    not a donut Kevin Winn's Avatar
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Make full use of the huge resources at MandoLessons.com (and donate!).

    Learn new tunes by watching the video breakdowns and learning them by ear, not just from tab.

    General rule of thumb is that it's more valuable to play shorter but more consistent (i.e., daily) practice sessions than longer sessions with several days in between.
    "Keep your hat on, we may end up miles from here..." - Kurt Vonnegut

  8. #8
    Worlds ok-ist mando playr Zach Wilson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Medley12 View Post
    But I really want to play the mandolin, not play tabs on a mandolin. I hope that makes sense.
    One thing I like to do when I have extra time is to take tunes I already know and learn them up the neck in the same octave (using different strings) or and octave higher. It helps to find "new" notes and chords (or double stops) without having to memorize a new tune and also helps me learn how to play by ear better.

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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    So, you are doing great.

    My personal experience is that bulk time is not the easiest thing to utilize well, especially early in your mandolin journey. For me, playing for a long time reaches the point of diminishing returns pretty quickly (maybe an hour and a half of playing, thought I could probably do that twice a day). If I was wanting to devote a bulk amount of time to mandolin, I would try to break it up into different sessions/skills throughout the day. So something like 30-45 minutes of skill drills, a little break, maybe reading on some theory, a little break, some time learning chords and working on rhythm, a little break, some time working on learning some melodies. Even that seems like a lot, so make sure if you see form breakdown and/or get tired or are just not enjoying it, it is OK to just call it a day or do something else until you really want to play.

    That could all just be me and my learning style. My advice is worth what you paid for it.

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    Registered User John Soper's Avatar
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    If you have "bulk" time, you should spend some of that time with purposeful listening to tunes that you want to learn. If you can sing it, you will eventually be able to play it. Don't over-play and get a repetitive use injury or tendinitis that could put you out of playing commission for weeks (don't ask how I know that this can happen).

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  13. #11
    Worlds ok-ist mando playr Zach Wilson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Man View Post
    So, you are doing great.

    My personal experience is that bulk time is not the easiest thing to utilize well, especially early in your mandolin journey. For me, playing for a long time reaches the point of diminishing returns pretty quickly (maybe an hour and a half of playing, thought I could probably do that twice a day). If I was wanting to devote a bulk amount of time to mandolin, I would try to break it up into different sessions/skills throughout the day. So something like 30-45 minutes of skill drills, a little break, maybe reading on some theory, a little break, some time learning chords and working on rhythm, a little break, some time working on learning some melodies. Even that seems like a lot, so make sure if you see form breakdown and/or get tired or are just not enjoying it, it is OK to just call it a day or do something else until you really want to play.

    That could all just be me and my learning style. My advice is worth what you paid for it.
    I'd like to add to use some of that time to listen to mandolin greats for inspiration (Dawg music is my go to) and do a string change

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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Thank you everybody. Got some good ideas...

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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Can anybody think of a tab that I might be able to easily attain, that would be a good intro into another genre? I pretty much just know fiddle tunes right now, but I’d love to explore.

    I look at lists of tabs, or table of contents in songbooks, and I never know any of the songs by name. So I don’t know where to start...

    Funny, I got the Hal Leonard Mandolin method book, and that was my introduction to several songs, and I love them. I listen to that cd often. I never heard Red Haired Boy, Midnight on the Water, Galopede, and these are new favs.

    I’m wondering what other favs are out there that I don’t even know about...

  17. #14
    Worlds ok-ist mando playr Zach Wilson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    https://www.amazon.com/Beatles-Mando...91347596&psc=1

    I like this for Beatles music. Here Comes the Sun, And I Love Her are fun ones.

  18. #15

    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Half is the difference between eighths and sixteenths. I was pretty amazed if you were playing four notes to a beat at 120 one year out of the gate.

    I can't do that and I've been doing it for 5+ years. Although I only have 1+ hour a day to practice as my aging hands won't take any more than that. I too have had the occasional week or two where I had to take it easy because I overplayed the week before.

    Playing eighths at 50-60 however that makes me feel much better, and that's pretty good progress too. :-)

    I remember when 60 bpm (16ths or 4 notes to a beat) was quite difficult for me and I was pretty happy to be able to do that after about a year. The years passed and then it was 72, 80 for a long time, and finally I could barely play one tune at 90 (which is the speed our jams go at around here). A few years later and sustained 90 bpm is still challenging for some songs, but I can play short licks considerably faster than that, so improvement is still coming. :-) Up the neck practice is slowing coming along too.

    The best up the neck lesson I ever had was from Banjo Ben Clark, it opened up the fretboard for me, and I can improv all over it now.

    Search for the Aonzo scales, that gets you started, but did not open up the neck for me, but prepared me nicely for what came later.

    The time to start classical is when you can control the tone coming out of the instrument, meaning you can control the volume of each note with finesse and care. It's about learning to play soft and loud and let the instrument sing for you. Very different than BG. I started to be able to do that about 2.5 yrs in, but I only had 1+ hour a day, not 4-5, with that amount of practice time it should come pretty fast.

    For classical I signed up with Caterina Lichtenberg over at artist works. She gives great stuff, but I had to search around for more repertoire as I ran out of stuff at my (eternally intermediate) level pretty fast. I am still playing student etudes at 60-80bpm that are marked 96, that's life at 1 hour a day I guess.

    The other styles I don't know much about but am thinking that celtic music is something I want to do at some point.

    Good luck and enjoy.
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    Registered User smokinop's Avatar
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Speaking of the Mike Marshall Mandolin Fundamentals, the two disk set download is currently on sale at Homespun.

    https://www.homespun.com/shop/produc...s-two-dvd-set/
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    This is the TableEdit library at Mandozine.com. It has thousands of tabs and can be searched by genre. You can use this Tefview file viewer (a free download) to view the Tabs.
    Mitch Russell

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  22. #18
    Registered User Jon Hall's Avatar
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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Several instructors have recommended that I video my playing. A lot can be learned from watching yourself. It’s easy to see if you’re relaxed while playing or if you’re tense. Tension is counterproductive to everything we try to achieve playing an instrument.

  23. #19

    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zach Wilson View Post
    https://www.amazon.com/Beatles-Mando...91347596&psc=1

    I like this for Beatles music. Here Comes the Sun, And I Love Her are fun ones.
    I have that book. In addition to Here Comes the Sun, the ones I play most are Eleanor Rigby, Lucy in the Sky With Diamonds, Eight Days a Week, and Here There and Everywhere. I've played all of them at one point or another, but those are the only ones I have played a lot. I guess Norwegian Wood, too, maybe, but its not that fun to play by yourself.

    Here Comes the Sun is great to work on because it has the somewhat technically tricky part (for a beginner). One I worked and figured out I could play that, it gave me some confidence that I could actually build some skills and sound pretty good.

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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Yes Jon, that is something I need to be working on indeed, tension.

    Trying to relax, and I added Bill Cheatum and Salt Creek to my list. They are not up to speed yet, of course, but I think I have the tabs down. Tonight, I am going to do one by ear, not sure which one yet.

    Also going to try to find something Celtic to try.

  25. #21

    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Quote Originally Posted by Medley12 View Post
    Yes Jon, that is something I need to be working on indeed, tension.

    Trying to relax, and I added Bill Cheatum and Salt Creek to my list. They are not up to speed yet, of course, but I think I have the tabs down. Tonight, I am going to do one by ear, not sure which one yet.

    Also going to try to find something Celtic to try.
    Bill Cheatum is a good one, especially the B part. Took me a bit to get it up to speed. I'd recommend Red Wing as well. Got a couple triplets in there, plus it's an easier one to improvise with, especially with just throwing in some double stops and chords. Plus it's one of those catchy tunes you'll find yourself humming all day.

    I'd also recommend Cooley's Reel for something a bit Celtic. May be more Irish rather than true Celtic, but it's definitely fun to play. It's got some good cross picking parts that really test your string/pick accuracy and timing once you start to build some speed on it.

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    Default Re: Best use of bulk time?

    Thank you for the recommendation, I was hoping to get one for something I have never heard of. I’m going to go look for it...

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