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Thread: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

  1. #1
    Registered User Nick Gellie's Avatar
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    Default Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    I just received yesterday a used Eastman 404 Bk mandolin from Germany yesterday.

    Here it is as shown in the pictures

    Front:

    Click image for larger version. 

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    The mandolin was pretty much in near new condition when I got it.

    After careful inspection I first adjusted the truss rod and made the neck straight. The neck was straight through to the sound hole pretty much. A very very slight hump of 0.5 mm or so. Nothing to worry about.

    The bridge was leaning slightly towards the neck from the adjusting pins upwards. So i replaced the bridge with a standard Stewmac bridge whose curvature at the base was pretty close to the transverse curvature of the top. I prepared the bridge feet so that they matched the curvature of the top.

    I then replaced the strings with EJ74s. It had Thomastic strings on it - maybe a German preference. I just prefer the look and sound of the EJ74s to the Thomastic strings.

    I then cut new slots in the bridge saddle which turned out to be slightly narrower than when the old saddle. I also cut the slots so that the strings of each course were closer together. I will take a picture and add it to the review later. I prefer it when the courses are closer together. It is easier to play that way. I noticed that my MD505 was cut the same way as the factory bridge. I will adjust that later too to match the MD404.

    I then strung it up and played it. Wow it sounded like a traditional Gibson A when I compared it to Maria Fibish's mandolin and to other Gibson A mandolin videos I found on youtube. Here is one for instance:



    It sounds almost identical to Maria Fibish's mandolin here:



    Fire away with questions. I will post a sound clip later when I find time to do it.
    Last edited by Nick Gellie; Feb-03-2021 at 8:57am.
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  3. #2

    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    What a beauty Nick! It certainly looks mint in your pictures. Play it in good health :-)

  4. #3
    Likes quaint instruments poul hansen's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Hello Nick, very interesting. I'm looking for a Gibson A Snakehead or a substitute with a similar sound. Do you have the possibility to compare the two?

    Looking forward to a sound demo. Please include some slow chords and slow scales up the strings and some sustain checks, especially on the higher frets on the E-strings, which on some mandolins are almost mute.

    I'm in the EU as well, so I'm interested in knowing which site you found it on? Or any good site for mandolins in the EU.
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  6. #4
    Registered User Nick Gellie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Roy View Post
    What a beauty Nick! It certainly looks mint in your pictures. Play it in good health :-)
    It is pretty mint Rob. it does have some fine player scratches on the top imperceptible from afar.

    I am posting this review because I think the Eastman404Bk is a gem given what I paid for it and given how it sounds and plays. It sounds like an old Gibson A yet has the modern playability and looks aren't too bad. If they put a slightly flashier rosette on it, it would look even better. The other factor is with the small 12" radiused frets it plays as clean as whistle just how Maria Fibish plays it on her mandolin.

    I will certainly play it in good health. It has already been to a Gypsy Jazz practice mandolin session and it acquitted itself before I made changes to the bridge. It sounds louder and more clear now than it did before possibly because of the new strings and the new bridge and set-up.

    The only slight flaw in it is the thickness of the soundboard varies along the fingerboard although it is an even gradient. It is unusual. It does not bother me because the rest of the mandolin has a pretty much a perfect nitro finish. I love the look of the mahogany on the back. It does give a more mellow sound and perhaps not as loud as maple. I am not fussed about this because it will be played in a band context with microphones.

    I would also add that I downsized with Irish bouzoukis as well to a PT-305 Carvalho which I bought late last year. I bought that for Euro 400 including shipping and a good case. This was a bit more at Euro500. It was built two years ago. I also think that it is pretty faithful in sound and tone to the videos I heard on Youtube before I bought. I made an extensive comparison with a MD504. The MD404 won out in the evaluation context. My judgement was correct for a change. I have invested a lot of time evaluating both the MD505 and the MD404 before I bought them. Maybe I am getting better at picking mandolins than I was before.


    I have had some very nice Mike Black mandolins and MT-Os. I just like the narrower width nut on the MD404 and the way it sounds - nice sweet clear tone which is very suited to Celtic, Blues, and Jazz mandolin. I don't have much invested because I am living in Europe in the moment. I am planning to build an old Gibson A-2, perhaps even an A2z. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the more expensive mandolins. I have learnt to live with less and enjoying these cheaper mandolins because they are nearly at the same quality as their more expensive cousins.

    I never had a black top mandolin before. I have to say it has grown on me.
    Last edited by Nick Gellie; Feb-03-2021 at 9:36am.
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    Registered User Nick Gellie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Quote Originally Posted by poul hansen View Post
    Hello Nick, very interesting. I'm looking for a Gibson A Snakehead or a substitute with a similar sound. Do you have the possibility to compare the two?

    Looking forward to a sound demo. Please include some slow chords and slow scales up the strings and some sustain checks, especially on the higher frets on the E-strings, which on some mandolins are almost mute.

    I'm in the EU as well, so I'm interested in knowing which site you found it on? Or any good site for mandolins in the EU.
    Hi Poul,

    You can spend a lot of time looking for a good old Gibson A. I did have my eye on a MD404 Bk at TFOA in Holland. You can buy one there at a discounted price for 729E including shipping. They have a video of the one for sale there if you ask for it. I can also send it to you if you send me a PM with your email address. It sounds almost identical to mine. It sounds loud in the video. They may have upped the volume a bit. You will get the Gibson A sound with a factory warranty which is pretty good really. I would have bought it but I needed some fretting tools for my current and future mandolin production so it is there for the asking.

    All the best with your search and let me know what you got eventually.
    Nic Gellie

  9. #6
    Registered User Nick Gellie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    I said I would show a picture of the string slots on the new bridge. I have not radiused it. I will leave that for later. it is fine for now. I will bring the E course in a little bit to match the spacing of the rest of the string courses.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Registered User Nick Gellie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Here are some pictures of the headstock and tuners back and front. The tuners work fine better than the Collings MT anyway.

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    The neck profile is a cross between a U and a V - a sort of a C which it isn't. I have no problem with the 1 3/32" nut. Eastman cut the neck slots well. I have found I need a narrower nut as I get older. it makes the block chords easier although don't expect this oval mandolin to give you woofy chop chord tones.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I like the mahogany back and neck. I sort of prefer this look after seeing so much maple. It reminds me of the look of Irish bouzoukis and mandolas which often use mahogany type woods.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    And here it is with its stablemate and cousin the MD505. Both nice looking instruments. They both have their place in my household stable.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Next will be the sound clip this evening after I have had a bit of a rest. Thanks for your interest.
    Nic Gellie

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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    The MD404 has skinny frets. I used to prefer wider frets. The height is pretty much the same on both narrow and medium mandolin frets in most mandolin fretwire. the MD 505 has slightly wider frets. I have found playing 12" radiused small fretwire on the MD404 is pretty smooth experience. So there ain't much difference playing either mandolin. I thought there would be and yet I have not found a significant difference.
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    I bit the bullet and took the old frets off and sanded the slight hump at the 12th fret join. I am now installing Stewmac 147 fretwire. I should be finished at the weekend.

    The fret in the picture shows a sample fret at the 12th fret.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    I will show pictures when I am finished.
    Nic Gellie

  17. #11

    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Very nice. How much skill does it take to change the frets? Is it easy with the right tools?

  18. #12
    Registered User Nick Gellie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Quote Originally Posted by tooday View Post
    Very nice. How much skill does it take to change the frets? Is it easy with the right tools?
    Well yes and no. I have had to work really hard getting consistent. Each fret has to be considered a work of precision.

    I have the Stewmac fretwork book which has some handy hints on how to remove frets cleanly and how to a partial versus a full refret. Yes I have all the tools recommended for the job.

    I like to do minimal fret dressing if I can help it. I want the frets to be perfectly installed with little work afterwards. That is what I am aiming for anyway.
    Nic Gellie

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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Why did they make coloured top mandolins - was it originally a way to use wood that sounded great but didn't look quite so good (like the stories about plain colour LesPauls being cleaned off to find a stripey top with a filled resin pocket in it underneath), or just a matter of matching up the look of a band, or what? It's interesting that only the top is black (or gold, or white), not the whole mandolin. That's fairly unusual among musical instruments.

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    Registered User Nick Gellie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Yes it is - you know blacktop instruments are sought after in some circles. Anyway it mimics the Gibson A model colour.

    Here it is with new frets on.

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    Registered User Nick Gellie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Well I have completed the minor overhaul of the fingerboard. All went well with new frets installed. They look really nice on there. I also polished up the top with some polish and a microfibre cloth. I highly recommend a clean microfibre cloth.

    It is really nice to play, has a great sound almost as good as a Mike Black mandolin that I had.

    A few minor tweaks to be made to the setup and then a sound clip showing a few tunes in different rythmns and tempos.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Now that I have this as a template,. I am planning to build an A2 using the Siminoff and Condino plans.

    I have decided I really like oval holes. There is more roundness and sustain in an oval hole compared to an f hole. I also have an F4 in the works too. I built one before from a Siminoff kit. I really liked it.
    Nic Gellie

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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Here is a recording of the Eastman 404. Actually there are two there.

    http://Listen to Eastman 404 test - ...p.goo.gl/SC2Kg
    Nic Gellie

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    My Florida is scooped pheffernan's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Gellie View Post
    It is really nice to play, has a great sound almost as good as a Mike Black mandolin that I had.
    Which one?
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Gellie View Post
    Here is a recording of the Eastman 404. Actually there are two there.

    http://Listen to Eastman 404 test - ...p.goo.gl/SC2Kg
    I’m interested in hearing this Nic, but I can’t get it to play. It might be a fault with me and my device, but I don’t usually have any problems playing sound clips or videos. I’ll keep trying.

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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Try this one

    Listen to Eastman 404 test - Tripping up stairs and Southern Comfort by Nicholas Gellie on SoundCloud

    https://soundcloud.com/nicholas-gell...pboard&p=a&c=1
    Nic Gellie

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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Thanks, that worked.
    A nice review. It looks and sounds great. I look forward to seeing and hearing your A2 build.

    Are you going to scoop the extension over the 404’s sound hole?
    Last edited by Steve 2E; Feb-07-2021 at 8:03am. Reason: Had a question

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  32. #21

    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Since most old Gibson As vary in sound one from another, the Eastman MD-404 fits right in the family, kind of like a double first cousin. I've owned a MD-504, a MD-514, a Gibson A, an A-4, and Martin Style 20 oval hole. Biggest difference is in the aged woods of the vintage models.

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  34. #22
    Registered User Nick Gellie's Avatar
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Steve,

    I left off the last two frets and filled the slots with ebony dust and superglue. So in a way I have scooped the extension. I would do the same if I made an A2 mandolin like it. I am highly inclined to make two of them - one to keep and one to sell.

    As for comparison with Mike Black mandolins I had an A4 and an A2Z. I think the A2z was the best one I had and I should never sold it. I loved the look of it.

    If you want to compare the Eastman 404 and this is a SoundCloud clip I made sometime back of the Mike Black A4. You will find other sound clips of this and other instruments on there made back in 2014 or so.

    [URL=https://soundcloud.app.goo.gl/F6FvX]

    I made a mistake selling either of them. Well I have sort have recovered my losses having a great little instrument for about 1/4 of the price. And it is the sound I am looking for in an oval hole mandolin. The mahogany back and sides does it for me in terms of tone. The Eastman 404 has more of that Gibsonesque oval hole tone than the Black A4. My 12-year-old son even commented independently that the 404 is the best of my current mandolins. So it is not just me saying that.
    Last edited by Nick Gellie; Feb-07-2021 at 1:25pm.
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  36. #23
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Gellie View Post
    As for comparison with Mike Black mandolins I had an A4 and an A2Z. I think the A2z was the best one I had and I should never sold it. I loved the look of it.
    I thought the A2, Gary Wilson’s old #12, had a real richness and depth.
    1924 Gibson A Snakehead
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  37. #24
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Quote Originally Posted by pheffernan View Post
    I thought the A2, Gary Wilson’s old #12, had a real richness and depth.
    yes Pat I agree with you that A2Z was special. Basically, Gibson style oval holes work better with beech or mahogany backs. They both give a warmer tone with more echo.
    Nic Gellie

  38. #25
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    Default Re: Eastman 404Bk Mandolin review

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Gellie View Post
    yes Pat I agree with you that A2Z was special.
    I believe Gary's #12 was a plain A2, not to be confused with your former A2-z (#20) that I housesat for a while.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick Gellie View Post
    Basically, Gibson style oval holes work better with beech or mahogany backs. They both give a warmer tone with more echo.
    I'm guessing that my Gibson has a birch back, and I know that my Poe Scout flattop does, but I detect no loss of ring with the maple of my Black A2-z.
    1924 Gibson A Snakehead
    2005 National RM-1
    2007 Hester A5
    2009 Passernig A5
    2015 Black A2-z
    2010 Black GBOM
    2017 Poe Scout
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    2018 Vessel TM5
    2019 Hogan F5

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