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Thread: Shop dust

  1. #26
    Registered User amowry's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shop dust

    I use that Mirka wherever I can-- on the top and back except for the scroll, and the headstock faces (only with the finer grits there to avoid rounding over the surfaces). I sand all my finishes by hand, though guitar builders typically use power sanders for most or all of that too. I also use a belt sander and oscillating spindle sander on the sides and edges of the headstock, until I get 220 and finer. In areas that I sand by hand, I like to alternate between sanding and scraping, as the latter is really effective at removing sanding scratches, particularly on end grain maple, and it's good at maintaining definition, like on the scroll.

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  3. #27
    Registered User sunburst's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shop dust

    I almost never use hand held power sanders.
    When I worked "at the factory" I seldom sanded by hand, except finishes, and even then I sanded first with an orbital sander. When I moved to my own shop and production was soooo much less, I found myself using power sanders less and less until I nearly never use one. Not sure why, perhaps the lack of noise, lack of vibration hurting my arthritic fingers, less airborne dust... not sure.
    I try to work as cleanly as possible leading up to sanding so that I don't have to sand excessively. In other words, clean cuts with sharp tools, scrapers and finally sandpaper.

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  5. #28

    Default Re: Shop dust

    For shaping plates before assembly, I use my Bosch ROS65VC (made in Switzerland), 2x+ the cost of most other ROS's, but the lack of vibration is astounding. For archtop instruments, I put a 1/2" soft foam interface pad on it, then Mirka Abranet discs. The sander is hooked up to an old Fein triggered vacuum that's amazingly still going strong. The soft foam pad follows the contours and knocks off high spots without putting flat areas in the plate. Abranet and Abrilon goes from as coarse to as fine as you like, amazing stuff.

    Since the thread is about dust, I have a confession to make. I am old and my knuckles/palms don't take well to pushing small planes through figured maple anymore. For the roughing out work, I've adapted to using a Kutzall spikey fine cut donut on an angle grinder. Talk about dust! Of course I do it all outside (the tough life of building in Florida) with a full respirator on. But in 10 minutes I accomplish what used to take hours with the fishtail gouge and fingerplanes. There's definitely a learned technique and art to it, but it's amazing how close I get to final countouring with the Kutzall. From the Kutzall donut, I'm able to go to 60 grit on the interface pad on the ROS, with some fine tuning of the recurve area using the Carruthers scraper (another great tool IMO).

    Of course, the system I adapted was to accommodate my worn out joints. Building only for myself, I knew I wasn't going to make enough instruments to justify a dupli-carver or CNC set up to handle the rough out work.

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  7. #29
    Registered User John Bertotti's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shop dust

    I remember several people over the years using angle grinders with various cutters to ruff out plates, and of course the safety plane crowd. I might try one someday but that will wait for a good drill press. Oddly I do not see anything safe about it. It is very interesting to see how others approach their end goals with regards to sanding and finishing.
    My avatar is of my OldWave Oval A

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  8. #30

    Default Re: Shop dust

    I don't find the spikey donut dangerous as long as you keep your wits about you. I learned to hold it with my elbows locked into my waist and swing arcs to get curve I wanted. I don't have any process pictures of mando backs but did snap one when I used it to do the belly cut on my last tele.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Now that safety planer gives me the heebee geebees. Even chucked up in a good drill press that thing scares me.

    Speaking of dust, in the old days of Gibson in Kalamazoo, the production way of producing curved surfaces was using a chair seat duplicarver to rough it out. Then to fair the curves a flexible rubber sanding disc backer was chucked up in a drill press and they'd bring the top/back up to it from beneath, using the flex in the disc to fair curves. Absolutely no way to control that dust, those poor guys.

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  10. #31
    Registered User John Bertotti's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shop dust

    I am very familiar with those types of cup rasps but the safety plane is anything but safe. I am amazed it is allowed on the market. But I am glad it is. Shop safety is each individual's responsibility not that of the powers to be. It does look like it does a good job. I expected there to be a lot more tear-out. Did you say you do top plates this way as well?
    My avatar is of my OldWave Oval A

    Creativity is just doing something wierd and finding out others like it.

  11. #32
    Registered User urobouros's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shop dust

    I like to play with wood, mostly turning & carving, and use a 1000 cfm air cleaner along with a 1.5HP dust collector. If I'm turning or using a power carver, I also have a vented facemask. I use the King Arthur tools, both the carbide & chainsaw toothed discs, and they can get super smooth surfaces as long as you don't push hard. I found the guard got the way of my desired angles but two hands & plenty of caution has served me well. One moment of lax attention got me a hearty nick on my knuckle but, for a brief moment, I thought I took off the finger Nothing like a shorts-changing, come-to-Jesus moment to keep you focused!

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  13. #33

    Default Re: Shop dust

    Quote Originally Posted by John Bertotti View Post
    I am very familiar with those types of cup rasps but the safety plane is anything but safe. I am amazed it is allowed on the market. But I am glad it is. Shop safety is each individual's responsibility not that of the powers to be. It does look like it does a good job. I expected there to be a lot more tear-out. Did you say you do top plates this way as well?
    Nah, I could but carving spruce effortless and enjoyable. I really do detest flying sawdust.

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  15. #34
    Guitar & mandolin builder Tyko Runesson's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shop dust

    I stopped using sanding abrasives many years ago and that helps to get rid of all the fine dust that is the worst. Nowadays I just use scrapers and similar, or files. That gives much bigger dust particles that tend to not flying around that much in the air. In the cutting room I have a good wood working hoover (or what you call it) that I connect to the saw and drumsander. I also stopped using tropical woods many years ago and one of all benefits with that is the lack of the poison that is included in many of the tropical woods. Many builders I know have serious problem with the dust from such woods.

  16. #35
    Registered User John Bertotti's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shop dust

    I got the cyclone Friday. UPS just drops it on a porch and leaves, no doorbell nothing. I look outside and see the box fortunately no one comes out here so other than the wind blowing it away, and that has happened, it is safe outside. Now to get the filter. Wynn doesn't supply shipping info automatically. I emailed them and they said it would shop on the 5th. I assume they put the order into the production schedule as they get them. My only concern is the 1hp motor. Currently wired for 120V 9 amps but I can rewire and make it 240V 4.5amps. I doubt it will buy me any extra other than a stronger start-up and cooler operation. If these two items live up to their claims I won't have any dust in the shop.
    My avatar is of my OldWave Oval A

    Creativity is just doing something wierd and finding out others like it.

  17. #36
    Registered User John Bertotti's Avatar
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    Default Re: Shop dust

    Well cobbled together the cyclone on a metal 30-gallon trash can. Use 3/4" ply for a donut cyclone on one side with 1"x1" foam rubber insulation and the same foam on the bottom. Set it on the garbage can it conforms and when you switch the dust-collector on it sucks it down nice and tight. I don't think I even need clips on it. The wynn is on the little dust collector I put the foam on the metal ring folding it around and sat the donut on it then the Wynn filter and the removable lid. This one is on the receiving end of the cyclone so I used bungees in four spots to hold it together tightly. For a quick cobbled job, it works amazingly well. The jointer throws some chips out the top so it didn't get all of them and I can't help but wonder if a larger motor and impellor would help some but the little 9" impellor and 1hp motor did much better than I thought was possible. I would say for anyone looking for a unit just buy a larger unit to start with one from Oneida and use a Wynn filter. It is designed to be blown out. I think with proper maintenance it will outlive me. I am not a fan of the filters that have the paddle you turn around because any physical contact over time will wear out the filter in that spot. I grabbed the little Delta on a sale with rebate credits but in the long run it wasn't the best choice. I should have used them for something else and started with a better unti. FYI, we live and learn.
    My avatar is of my OldWave Oval A

    Creativity is just doing something wierd and finding out others like it.

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