Eastman MD-404BK Mandolin Frets

[colemole]

Hello all
I am a person new to the mandolin world. I am interested in the Eastman MD-404BK and curious about the fret size. Are they the smaller frets or more standard size. I need an instrument that is reasonably friendly to play as I start my mandolin journey. I have a Kentucky KM-250 but want to check out a oval mandolin versus the F holes. I have played ukuleles off and on for a number of years. I am not accomplished by any standard.
Your thoughts?

[rcc56]

According to their website, Eastman uses Jescar FW37053 wire in the MD-404.
This is a small fretwire, which has a crown that it is .053" wide by .037" high.

But according to The Mandolin Store's website, they list the wire on the 404 to be Dunlop #6310, which is .053" wide by .031" high.
I do not know which spec is more up to date.

I could not find any fret wire specs for your Kentucky mandolin on the Saga website. A couple of my students have Kentuckys, and one of them has small wire. I'm not sure about the other one.

Perhaps someone can provide measurements taken from a couple of recently built instruments. Since the crown height has a great effect on the playability of an instrument, some actual measurements would be quite useful.

By comparison, the larger wire that some builders are using now is approximately .080" wide x .040" high-- the exact numbers vary slightly depending on who they buy their wire from. Collings uses a wire in this range.

[maxr]

Colemole - dunno if this is any help, but my Eastman MD-305 has appreciably smaller fret wire than my Kentucky KM-250. Whether the 305 is the same as the 404, I don't know though. Max

[colemole]

So would this fret lend itself to realitvley easier fretting or better to find an instrument with larger frets?

[Steve 2E]

If it's set up well I think you'll be able to fret it quite easily. I had a 404 with thin frets that was very easy to play. I had a 505 with wider frets that was also quite easy to play. I wouldn't worry too much about the size of the fret wire.

[rcc56]

The height of the fret has more effect on playability than the width of the fret.
For mandolins, I prefer a finished crown height of no less than .035" after the frets are installed and profiled. .040" is better.

If Eastman is using the Jescar wire and not dressing it down too far, there is a better chance that the frets will play well. If they are using the Dunlop wire, which specs out at .031" before installation, it would fall below what I consider to be the minimum spec for good playability.

I haven't seen a recent Eastman in quite a long time; which is why I hope someone will take the time to take a measurement and post it. I did have an older one [2009] go through my hands a couple of years ago, and the frets on that one were good and high.

You could try to contact Eastman and ask them to confirm what fret wire they are currently using.

Different players have different needs. If at all possible, play a recent issue Eastman before you buy, and see whether it suits you.

[Bill Cameron]

I’m surprised to hear of any variation in Eastman fretwire in an6 of their stock mandolins. Seems to be the same thin Jescar throughout the lines every time I’ve looked (specs for all models are methodicall6 detailed at Eastman guitars.com) My gripe with Eastman fret wire is not playability/comfort which is excellent on my 505. It plays easier than my much pricier, recently set up, wider-fret Collings MTO. It has to do with wire durability. I had a very necessary refret done after nine years of playing, and the new frets (same jescar wire) were showing divots within a year! (Obviously, I’m an animal in my playing style). Most new players concerned about comfort are looking at neck width, which is a bit narrow on the Eastmans woth a 1 3/32” nut. Personally I think the axiom “try before you buy” is doubly true for oval-holes, imho there is a lot more variation in feel and comfort. But if you have to order without trying first, and neck width is a factor in your comfort, you might look for a wider neck than the stock Eastmans or Kentuckys provide. It’s a common ask so listings tend to mention a wider neck in their descriptions.

[Steve 2E]

I’m surprised to hear of any variation in Eastman fretwire in an6 of their stock mandolins. Seems to be the same thin Jescar throughout the lines every time I’ve looked (specs for all models are methodicall6 detailed at Eastman guitars.com)

Bill, I looked at the Eastman site and was surprised to see that all of their mandolins have the same spec for fretwire(23 Jescar FW37053). I did own a 2019 505CC that definitely had larger frets than the 404 I owned. I currently have a 304 that has smaller frets like the 404. I think I was under the assumption that they only used the smaller frets on oval hole models, but I guess I'm wrong. I did buy the 505 used, so maybe it was refretted. I dunno. Either way I found the playability of them all to be about the same.

[Steve 2E]

Perhaps someone can provide measurements taken from a couple of recently built instruments. Since the crown height has a great effect on the playability of an instrument, some actual measurements would be quite useful.

My 304 is dated as 9/24/21. Frets are a about a hair over .030. It plays and feels pretty good when I play it, but it's not my daily player. I would assume it has the 23 Jescar FW37053 fretwire.

[maxr]

I had a very necessary refret done after nine years of playing, and the new frets (same jescar wire) were showing divots within a year!

When I had my Eastman 305 in for a bridge fitting at less than a year old, the tech. advised me that there was more fret wear than you'd expect for that age. Part of that is probably due to my poor fretting as a beginner, but even then, it was unexpected.

[keith.rogers]

My '09 815v has small frets and there is very little left of them. They've been leveled at least twice (last time by me).

When I see a warm-enough stretch after the holidays to be able to spend time at the workbench in the garage, I'm going with Stew-Mac's "medium/highest" wire because that's what Northfield says they use on their mandolins and I really like the feel. (And, I'll probably run out of playing time before I get those leveled/dressed down to re-fret time...)

[Bill Cameron]

When I had my Eastman 305 in for a bridge fitting at less than a year old, the tech. advised me that there was more fret wear than you'd expect for that age. Part of that is probably due to my poor fretting as a beginner, but even then, it was unexpected.

Don’t blame yourself, it”s not a “beginner technique” issue. It’s an Eastman issue. Fret wear is a function of amount of playing time, string type and gauge, and amount of finger pressure exerted. Some popular styles require or prefer heavier strings and attack.

Refretting is kind of expensive so It’s disappointing to me that this is such an apparent widely-experienced problem. I am a big fan of Eastman mandos in general. If I were to do the refret again on my 505 I would have done a full refret instead of the first 12, because matching the unworn upper frets would not be an issue if you replace all frets with a thicker, harder wire. I’m not sure the extra expense would be financially worth it on a 305 though.

I really don’t have a problem with playing through some fret wear on a mando or guitar. After 9 years though the Eastman was so bad that the 2 e-strings literally would not play the same note at 5th and 7th frets.