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Thread: Finger placement

  1. #1
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    Default Finger placement

    So now that I have a mandolin at last (my first fretted instrument in years) I've come against an annoyance. Either my fingers are too fat or I'm doing something wrong because whenever I try and play chords, the next highest string is always muted by my 3rd/4th finger and makes the frustrating "plonk" of a bum note. I've tried my fingers at all sorts of angles and rotations to the fretboard with no success, so help me please I'm begging!

    Also this is bound to be a beginner thing but it's taking me awhile to get used to pushing hard enough to fret a note, I'll attempt it once then have to play the note again after doubling the pressure from my fingertip. Though that could also be the rather high action which you can read about my adventures with in my previous post.

    Anyway, thank you for reading!
    Last edited by larten27; Jan-30-2022 at 5:51pm. Reason: Clarity

  2. #2

    Default Re: Finger placement

    Increasing pressure is usually not the solution to the problem. Increasing pressure and clamping tightly causes a host of other problems. Usually it is finger placement. It helps a lot to align the fingers along the length of the neck and using the pads of the fingers, as a violin player does, rather than arching over the top and using the ends as a guitar player does. Your fingers should be placed just behind the fret, not on top of it and not halfway in the middle. You should use no more pressure than it takes to make a tone. Any extra gives no benefits and lots of problems.

    Posture and using a strap are important. Small changes to the angle of the neck can make a big difference. Also rotation front to back can cause this. The fingerboard should be more or less vertical. A lot of people are trying to watch their fingers and have the mandolin rotated so they can see. That causes a lot of problems with both hands.

    Practice can help a lot also as tendons stretch increasing finger mobility. You may have to start with simpler two and three finger chord shapes till your fingers adjust.

    The set up is very important as you mention. Getting first fret string height down to an acceptable level, somewhere around 0.010 from the 0.018 or so you mentioned in your other post will make a massive difference in how the mandolin plays. That alone may solve a lot of your problem.

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  4. #3
    Registered User Randi Gormley's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finger placement

    Carl makes all the right points.

    Put your fingers on the instrument and move the bottom of the mandolin up to your chin as if it were a violin/fiddle. You see the angle your hands have moved to? that's a pretty good place to start for finger position. Most people, especially those who are looking at the fretboard to make sure their fingers are on the right strings, wildly underestimate the angle they need to place their hands/fingers at.

    I don't play chords very often and only know perhaps 3 of them. When I play chords, they are muddy, my fingers overlap and it hurts. I've been told this will disappear with practice. One estimate was that if I continue to play chords for two or three weeks, a lot of those problems will disappear. I can't say I've ever tried this -- my need for chords is pretty non-existent -- but that's what i've been told. You may just need to practice more chording, paying particular attention to your fingers, and then look away. don't look at your hands. just don't. You have to twist the mandolin too much and that makes chording even more awkward.

    If your fingers hurt too much, try lighter weight strings. It's not 'giving up' or 'taking the easy route' or any other of those things. You do what you need to do to make music. You can always put on heavier strings once you get fretting, chording or whatever under your belt. Truly, nobody has any idea what strings you have on your mandolin unless they ask you and you tell them.

    Obviously, one of the most important things is setup. But you know that.
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    Registered User lowtone2's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finger placement

    Yes, you should definitely play with the tips of your fingers with the finger arched over the fingerboard, similar to how a violinist stops the strings.

  6. #5
    Registered User urobouros's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finger placement

    Quote Originally Posted by lowtone2 View Post
    Yes, you should definitely play with the tips of your fingers with the finger arched over the fingerboard, similar to how a violinist stops the strings.
    Precisely! That makes a world of difference. And practice As others have said, your fingers will get more nimble as you play more. Before long you'll be working on adding some of that muting back in.
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    Default Re: Finger placement

    Thanks everyone! I do sometimes notice myself tilting the instrument to watch my left hand so I'll knock that habit early on, there will be more wrong notes as I fret or pick the wrong string but hey that's what practice is for. I notice a buzzing sometimes which I put down to bad fretting or pick angle (sure as shit ain't the action being too low).

    What I can say for sure is I need to always keep my nails chopped back if the aim is to play with the tips like a violin. I have horribly bendy joints so if I don't have the very tips on the strings the 1st knuckle bends pressing the pad of my finger right onto the next course of strings. Even just the 2-3mm of nail I have is enough to make that happen.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by larten27; Jan-31-2022 at 4:42pm. Reason: Missed information

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    Registered User mbruno's Avatar
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    Default Re: Finger placement

    I got big fingers too But trust me, it can be as much of a blessing as it can be a curse - bigger fingers make getting two notes with 1 finger easier which is great sometimes, but annoying other times.

    Aside from what's been said already couple of pointers:

    1. Anytime you have a problem, find the smallest thing that could be wrong and fix that first. What I mean is, if you are playing a G Chop chord (7 5 2 3 on the fretboard), and you notice that the A string is muted by your ring finger on the D string - start by just fretting the D and A strings and making sure you get a clear note on each string. Once you have clear notes on both strings, then add another finger (like the E string) and make sure you get clear notes on all three. Then add the last finger.

    2. Fret the string as lightly as possible to get a note. As stated above, clamping hard on the strings can create a ton of problems - both in your playing and in your hand. Typically, I find my newer students err towards too much pressure at first - which can mute strings etc. To avoid this, start by putting one finger on a string - just touching the string, not pressing it. Then, while picking that string, slowly add pressure to your finger. As soon as you get a clear note, stop. That's all the pressure you need. I'd start this practice with one string, but same logic applies to chords.

    3. Build your left hand muscles. The stronger your fingers are, the easier it is to make them do what you want - which can help you here. Playing scales in a variety of ways an really help this. So can learning chords in multiple positions as well as learning the melodies of songs etc. Mike Marshall's "finger busters" is a great tool for this side of things.

    A teacher / coach might be a good idea for you if nothing else, you'll get a few pointers
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    Registered User Tim C.'s Avatar
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    Default Re: Finger placement

    Tim Connell here, professional music educator chiming in - I recommend to my students to learn how to play one note at a time before worrying about trying to play 3 or 4 notes at a time. My advice: take some time to learn some melodies on the instrument. Once you slow down and really learn the proper technique, it will be easier to come back to this more advanced job you are attempting here.
    Tim Connell
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