Workshop feeback

[mbruno]

Hey all

Question for the group. I've been hosting workshops for a bit now and usually have no issues finding topics to pull from. The hardest part usually is figuring out the best way to communicate the information to a diverse group of players that most likely are at different stages of playing.

I'm interested to hear from folks that have attended live workshops specifically. Generally speaking:

+ What are things you hate about live workshops? Do you think there's a way to eliminate those things?
+ What are things you love about live workshops?
+ What makes a good workshop in your opinion?
+ For those workshops that have lesson materials, did you find them useful?
+ Did any workshops have "follow up" sessions (online materials etc)? If so, did you use those materials?

Looking forward to hearing your feedback

[Mandobart]

John Reischman hands down does the best mandolin workshops I've ever attended. I've been to 3 of his, one was 4 hours long.

Since you're now in the PNW where John frequently tours, plays and leads workshops, you need to check him out.

[Mando Esq]

I’ve only been to one weekend of music workshops, but I definitely came away with some distinct impressions on all of these topics:

+ What are things you hate about live workshops? Do you think there's a way to eliminate those things?

The primary limiter on any workshop is time. Rambling and disorganized presentations, or ones where there are more stories than playing, waste lots of that time. Live workshops are expensive, so wasting time is wasting students money. It is VERY easy to tell apart the instructors who have a lesson plan and the ones who are winging-it. It’s never good when the teacher gets to the end of the session and realizes they only have a few minutes left to teach half of what they were supposed to cover because they’ve been telling war stories the whole time.

The way to eliminate that is to have a lesson plan and stick to it so that students don’t miss out on half of what they have signed up to (and paid to) learn.

+ What are things you love about live workshops?

The focus, feedback, and motivation that comes from playing live music in a group setting. Many (if not most) students likely only play alone at home. Learning in a live class means that there are no phones to distract, and there is an incredibly encouraging and motivating feeling of everyone becoming better together.

+ What makes a good workshop in your opinion?

A clear plan, achievable goals, and walking out of the class being a better player than you were when you walked in.

+ For those workshops that have lesson materials, did you find them useful?

Yes, especially when the materials are presented as concise “reference sheets” that I can keep around my practice area.

+ Did any workshops have "follow up" sessions (online materials etc)? If so, did you use those materials?

That didn’t apply to my particular class situation. But, knowing me, I would have made more use of in-hand materials than online materials given the convenience of already having them around.

[tiltman]

Love - an instructor that is prepared and wants to convey useful information. Handouts can be helpful.

Hate - question time from the audience (what pick do you use?, what strings do you use?, what hair products do you use?). groan. time wasted.

Kirk

[musicofanatic]

Love - an instructor that is prepared and wants to convey useful information. Handouts can be helpful.

Hate - question time from the audience (what pick do you use?, what strings do you use?, what hair products do you use?). groan. time wasted.

Kirk

I'm with ya

[Joe Bartl]

Thanks, mbruno, for asking. This response may be a little long, but having attended both great and nightmare workshops in the past (and paying $$$ regardless of the quality), I think your questions should be of import to anyone who stands before a group in an instructive capacity.

What are things you hate about live workshops? Do you think there's a way to eliminate those things?
* Instructors who do not know how to address the needs of attendees with varying levels of experience, e.g., assuming everyone in the session has a 1001 chords committed to muscle memory, or has years of experience playing swing rhythms, or knows the entire contents of the Nakano Library. This issue might be addressed by specifying pre-requisite knowledge before the workshop — and anything not falling into that “pre-requisite” being covered carefully in the session or in the handouts.
* Instructors who promise the world but only deliver a cup of tea … because that’s all they have time for.
* Attendees who assume their individual needs should always take precedence over the collective proceedings, for example, stopping the workshop in order to take a phone video or snapshot of the instructor’s fingers… ; or, for example., challenging the instructor’s sense of courtesy by taking up lots time with a personal issue; or, for example, spending half the workshop with questions about related technology with which the workshop is not directly concerned. These issues might be controlled by pushing all but quick/direct questions into an “after session” slot … call it a “Post workshop Q&A review” … and by honestly making time for this review.
* Attendees who noodle and chat while the session is ongoing.

What are things you love about live workshops?
* I enjoy the sheer presence of an authoritative voice.
* I enjoy the immediacy of the instruction.
* I enjoy instructors who have a limited agenda and meet it.
* I enjoy the give and take with the attendees and the variety of issues that a diverse group presents to the instructor.
* I enjoy relevant additions to the matter of the workshop by attendees.
* I most like when I find that a problem I thought specific to me is shared by others and that we are attending to it as a group.

What makes a good workshop in your opinion?
* A knowledgable instructor who knows how to instruct with efficiency and clarity.
* I want to leave a workshop with useful and doable steps to move my playing up a notch — these need not be game changers … progress is always incremental.
* I want to leave a workshop having respect and admiration, perhaps, for my fellow attendees … and a sense of shared accomplishment.
* A good workshop will have a productive mix of lecture and hands-on experience for the attendees.
* Through lecture, interaction with the attendees, useful handouts, I am left with confidence in the instructor’s knowledge and his sincerity in trying to share that with us lesser mortals.

For those workshops that have lesson materials, did you find them useful?
* Lesson materials are useful only if the instructor actually goes into/through them, explains what use to make of them, demonstrates how an attendee may use the material later on.
* Lesson materials that are distributed and never addressed by the instructor are useless.
* In the past I have made good use of lesson materials. I have also puzzled over lesson materials to eventually discard it.
* Lesson materials must unambiguously address the stated purpose of the workshop.

Did any workshops have "follow up" sessions (online materials etc)? If so, did you use those materials?
* Yes, the ability to follow up with online materials is a good thing if those materials are suitable in the same ways mentioned above for lesson materials. In the past I have used and profited from online materials as follow up to workshops.

[Charlie Bernstein]

I've been to more creative writing workshops than music workshops. Any workshop forces people to work, and that's their strength.

The biggest pitfall in writing workshops is people trying to shape your work to what they want it to do. An extreme example: At a songwriting session I went to, I had a song sung from the point of view of a worker at a Lawrence, Massachusetts, textile mill. The only feedback I got an earful about how lucky immigrants were to find work there.

The guy wanted me to write his song. He didn't help me with mine. (I wanted performance advice, not a bogus history lecture.)

So for any type of creative workshop, I've found that there are two important questions to ask participants:

- What do you want help with?

- What are you trying to do?

I think those are good for any artform.

[mbruno]

Thanks all so much for the feedback. I've been going back and forth on a few workshop topics for the South State 48 and trying to find the topic that is both universal for the group and something that I can convey in an hour.

Original thoughts were to do "what to play when you don't know the song" and covering how to essentially fake it. A ripe topic for a bluegrass festival, but after prepping the topic, I don't know if it'll be good for a live session (might be a better virtual workshop honestly).

The other topics I've been thinking of are
+ How to practice - reviewing the basics of actual practice (not just playing in hopes you'll get better)
+ Double Stops - somewhat a repeat, but always a good topic
+ Picking hand practices / routines

I'm leaning towards the picking hand practices / routines as I feel that's a good one for all skill sets, pretty easy to cover most of the basics in an hour, and I have some of that written already (making my job easier haha).

I'll keep moving on it, but I really appreciate the feedback!

[NDO]

Picking hand practice sounds like a great topic but so does practicing vs. playing since I’ve just been learning so far by playing songs… although I’ve picked up some skills along the way by trying different/more difficult songs and different rhythms/picking patterns.

[Kenny]

Hey all

Question for the group. I've been hosting workshops for a bit now and usually have no issues finding topics to pull from. The hardest part usually is figuring out the best way to communicate the information to a diverse group of players that most likely are at different stages of playing.

I'm interested to hear from folks that have attended live workshops specifically. Generally speaking:

+ What are things you hate about live workshops? Do you think there's a way to eliminate those things?
+ What are things you love about live workshops?
+ What makes a good workshop in your opinion?
+ For those workshops that have lesson materials, did you find them useful?
+ Did any workshops have "follow up" sessions (online materials etc)? If so, did you use those materials?

Looking forward to hearing your feedback

+ What are things you hate about live workshops? Do you think there's a way to eliminate those things?
Attendees who ask inane questions (picks, strings, chord fingerings, finishes) or drone on with lo-o-ong statements that contribute nothing to the purpose of attending a workshop. Eliminate? No. Reduce? Yes. When the presenter has a clear topic and agenda and sticks to it (e.g. “Let’s pick that up afterward.” or “That’s pretty far off topic. Let’s stay the course.”) The presenter must be in charge and know how to handle diversions.
+ What are things you love about live workshops?
Seeing and hearing nuance in the demonstrations. Those are indiscernible online and enlightening in person. Plus, relevant anecdotes.
+ What makes a good workshop in your opinion?
As I mentioned above, a presenter who has a clear topic and agenda and sticks to it, who works at a level that most of us can keep up with. e.g. I don’t care if you can pick Chris Thiele’s repertoire note for note at his tempo. Demonstrating skills far beyond ours is rarely helpful. If I want to see that I’ll buy concert tickets instead of attending workshops. I’m at a workshop to learn and you’re here to help me learn.
+ For those workshops that have lesson materials, did you find them useful?
Yes. Even though I play a lot by ear, I find that documented etudes and examples often help. I go back to earlier lessons occasionally even after I’ve absorbed their substance.
+ Did any workshops have "follow up" sessions (online materials etc)? If so, did you use those materials?
I haven’t encountered those yet, but I’m still new to mandolin.

[Ranald]

A great sin of teachers is non-stop talking. There's no harm in pauses. If you demonstrate something, learners will want to try it out for a bit. After the host asks participants for questions, count to 30 seconds while waiting for a reply. Participants may be shy, hesitant, or need to think before articulating their questions. I'd recommend stopping the workshop fifteen minutes early, then giving the learners a short, anonymous questionnaire (not as they're leaving -- you'll never see most of the questionnaires again). Ask for instance: What did you want from this workshop? What did you get from this workshop? What would you have liked more of? less of? What was the best part of the workshop? What was the worst? -- questions like that. You'll learn how the participants react to your teaching. Don't be surprised to find huge contradictions in attitudes. I used this practice in university teaching and found it enlightening. Are you filling the sometimes conflicting needs of visual, oral, and tactile learners? Most of us are good at teaching people who learn like ourselves, but many learn differently.I'm writing this both as a sometime teacher and a person who's attended many workshops.
Good luck.