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Thread: Bowlbacks of Note

  1. #7376
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Every Stathopoulo mandolin I have seen has had that scratchplate. What you can’t see is the multi-laminated neck that he used for many of his instruments. I am not home otherwise I would post some pics of those.
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    What you can’t see is the multi-laminated neck that he used for many of his instruments…..
    We can’t see the label or the back of the bowl from this single photo, either.

    It’s a single picture from an ad, Jim.

    I thought the scratch plate (however common for Stathopoulus, was ‘of note’ given the ongoing Ceccherini discussion elsewhere.

    I’m happy you are aware of this design feature.

    We’ve seen numerous early Epiphone bowls here and I have numerous examples in my files.

    Don’t interrupt your travels.

    Mick
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  3. #7378
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    I figured this is the best place to post this eBay Germany sale of a non-Luigi Embergher. https://www.ebay.com/itm/134609001249

    Interesting heart-shape in headstock though it looks slightly lopsided.

    In any case, other than the maker has or uses the same name not of too much interest especially in this condition.
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    Jim

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  5. #7379
    Full Grown and Cussin' brunello97's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Thanks, Jim.
    This one has been popping up on my eBay ‘saved search’ for months now.

    When you think of it, it’s remarkable how many mandolins weren’t made by Luigi Embergher.

    Mick
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  7. #7380

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Quote Originally Posted by brunello97 View Post
    When you think of it, it’s remarkable how many mandolins weren’t made by Luigi Embergher.
    Hmmm . . .

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  9. #7381
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Here's another one currently from the classifieds, a Calace Mandolyra, evidently priceless in all meaning of the term: https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/204681#204681

    I figure he says $3000 for the restoration alone plus additional setup so I imagine we are talking 5 figures here, at the least.

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    Jim

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  11. #7382
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    Here's another one currently from the classifieds, a Calace Mandolyra, evidently priceless in all meaning of the term: https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/204681#204681

    I figure he says $3000 for the restoration alone plus additional setup so I imagine we are talking 5 figures here, at the least.

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    Does this have the Sancho Panza bowl backside, Jim?

    The attenuated scratch plate and rhinestone cowboy lariat edge bling look pretty sweet.

    Saving my 5-figure $ for the electric car.

    Mick
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  12. #7383
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Sancho Panza backside? Want to explain?

    I think Fiat is making a retro EV with a bowlback.
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    Here's another one currently from the classifieds, a Calace Mandolyra, evidently priceless in all meaning of the term: https://www.mandolincafe.com/ads/204681#204681

    I figure he says $3000 for the restoration alone plus additional setup so I imagine we are talking 5 figures here, at the least.

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    The seller also posted it on Reverb where they list a price of $6500.

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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    Sancho Panza backside? Want to explain?

    I think Fiat is making a retro EV with a bowlback.
    If I recall from Cervantes, Sancho was a barber (along with being an erstwhile squire to the Don) and would use his hat to whip up the lather for a shave.

    Some of these mandolyras were provided with a truly bowl back as I now see this one does have.

    Were there some flatback versions, too? For the bearded players, I guess.

    Do you mean the Fiat Topolino, Jim?

    Doors apparently come as an option.

    I think you can charge it off your laptop.

    Ed Sullivan would approve.

    Mick
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  16. #7386
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    I don’t recall any flattop mandolyras, except for the one played by those fralini from San Franc Isco who chopped the Panza off.

    I love the bowlback Fiat.
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Quote Originally Posted by brunello97 View Post
    Does this have the Sancho Panza bowl backside, Jim?

    The attenuated scratch plate and rhinestone cowboy lariat edge bling look pretty sweet.

    Saving my 5-figure $ for the electric car.

    Mick
    Indeed, I think I'll pass on this too, interesting to actually see one of these up for sale, I don't recall seeing that before, so who knows what it's worth?

    BTW the one on reverb was posted two years ago and has apparently long since sold, is it the same one?

  18. #7388
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Quote Originally Posted by Tavy View Post
    Indeed, I think I'll pass on this too, interesting to actually see one of these up for sale, I don't recall seeing that before, so who knows what it's worth?

    BTW the one on reverb was posted two years ago and has apparently long since sold, is it the same one?
    You must be looking at the older listing when the current seller bought it. This is the current one: https://reverb.com/item/69163627-calace-mandolyra-1896-natural
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  19. #7389
    Pataphysician Joe Bartl's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Having just retrieved my own 1896 Calace from my luthier, who restored it to its former handsome and marvelously playable condition, it seems appropriate to use this forum to document it's existence:

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    And with one of David Brown's small pointy plectrums and new strings oft recommended by Jim Garber, a Calace Dolce set, it stands ready for the best version of "Torna a Surriento" that I can muster ... with a smile as wide at the wings on this instrument.

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  21. #7390
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Joe, maybe when you are ready you can post some audio clips. I can’t recall ever playing one of those but that are certainly a good conversation pieces. May I ask who did the restoration?
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  23. #7391
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    This 1941 Embergher 5bis just showed up on eBay. It seems more than a little suspect since the seller has a message that says if you are interested in buying don’t bid but inquire of the Buy It Now price, but he doesn’t use the standard BIN that eBay set up. https://www.ebay.com/itm/305174150130

    I just checked the seller’s about info and on the item post it says San Fernando, California but the about info says the UK and it says something about tattoo items. Also, the photos all have zardonino watermarks but that is not the seller’s name. Caveat emptor!

    I just submitted a fraud report for this item. BTW in the description the seller says BIN is $5059USD. As we all know, if it kids too good to be true it is probably too good to be true. This seems blatant.

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  25. #7392
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Jim, I can't offer a sound clip as I do not have the wherewithal to create one. This is a shame because the sound is certainly of a quality that lifts this above the level of a curiosity piece. I purchased the instrument from a large Vancouver collection earlier this year. My luthier here in Maryland for the last few years has been Marc Glickman who has done wonderful work with all the needy instruments I've put into his hands.

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  27. #7393
    Full Grown and Cussin' brunello97's Avatar
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Here's an otherwise attractive Puglisi bowlback with accompanying case.

    Cosmetically, it appears to be in pretty decent shape at 100+ years.

    But the lead photo in the Ebay ad is a very clear example of the kind of problem we see on so many of these old bowlbacks...where the rotational forces on the the neck / neck block transfer into the top above the soundhole causing some small amount of sinkage and thus for the neck to rotate up out of proper alignment yielding an unplayable instrument.

    The sinkage is quite visible from the particular angle of this photo.

    (Maybe not the best one to choose for your main sales image?)

    A lot contributed to the high attrition rate.

    Design flaws? Overtensioning strings? Creep over time? Improper care?

    All of the above, in my view, and probably other reasons as well (humidity, dryness.)

    But seeing an instrument that has obviously been kept in a case is disheartening.

    So many lovely mandolins are no longer playable without radical repair.

    And neck repair is particularly difficult on Italian bowlbacks with integrated neck / neck blocks.

    Maybe these weren't made to last cent'anni but the ones that have certainly make a person wish that more did.

    Mick
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  29. #7394
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Definitely needs some work! Shame as the inlay round the "skirt" is quite lovely, but yes, time has not served this one well. Interestingly I don't see bowl separation, or obvious really bad top distortion. Bridge is high though, but whether there still enough room for adjustment is a whole other issue...

  30. #7395

    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    This is a very ornate Rex Professional which I assume was made by Lyon & Healy circa 1910. Great inlays but we see the same bowl and neck on much less ornate examples which do not command high numbers.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/18623449990...emCondition=10

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  32. #7396
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Quote Originally Posted by NickR View Post
    This is a very ornate Rex Professional which I assume was made by Lyon & Healy circa 1910. Great inlays but we see the same bowl and neck on much less ornate examples which do not command high numbers.

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/18623449990...emCondition=10

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    Beautiful mandolin, Nick, with some very un-L+H details. (eg neck profile, headstock shape, tuners)

    What makes you think it comes from them?

    Of course...L+H would be a reasonable bet for just about any bowlback mandolin from the era.

    Here's an earlier discussion on Mandosaurus Rex...

    Mick
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  34. #7397
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    Default Re: Bowlbacks of Note

    Headstock similar to some unlabeled L&H, however there are some makers in New York area capable of work like that. Mannello and Ciani come to mind.
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