Bowlbacks of Note

[brunello97]

Nice looking 1905 Fratelli Vinaccia on eBay. Lyre tailpiece. Looks in decent condition with some split in the bowl and piece broken off the end of the bridge.

Jim, what do you think about the 13-7/8" scale length the seller refers to? How common was this?

Mick

[Graham McDonald]

Jim, what do you think about the 13-7/8" scale length the seller refers to? How common was this?

Mick

I would suggest that it was so rare as to be almost unknown and the seller should perhaps measure from the nut to the 12th fret, which will almost certainly be 6.5" (or thereabouts). Mandolins had been around 13"/33cm since the middle of the 18th century (rarely shorter than 32cm) and this sound like an error on the seller's part unless the Vinaccias were experimenting with the new-fangled American ideas of Gibson. Do I remember back a year or so ago a short thread from someone in Switzerland who had inherited some instruments...

Hope yer all not too wet up there

graham

[Jim Garber]

I just asked him that same question, Graham before reading your post.

[Jim Garber]

Ian has another nice looking Ceccherini in need of some restoration on eBay right now.

[Jim Garber]

I heard from the seller and she (?) said: I measured from the nut to the 12th fret... its 6 1/2"

Standard length.

[Martucci]

Jim, what do you think about the 13-7/8" scale length the seller refers to? How common was this?

Mick

Don't know how common it is but my Martucci #2 (the maple bowl) which is just about complete is 13-7/8". The new fretboard matches the original and both are right on at that scale. When compared to Martcucci #1 (the butterfly) which has a scale length of 13-1/8" it is obvious that the top bend is closer to the tail even though the bowls are almost identical. Martucci #3 (the scalloped bowl which I recently purchased) is right in between at 13-1/2". I guess the location of the top bend and resulting bridge placement is a variable that works its self out when the top is matched to the bowl.

Fred

[brunello97]

Here is something one doesn't see often enough. Graupner and Meyer mandola scale bowlback

G+M Bowldola

which but for the top crack looks to be in quite good condition. The seller references its recent trip to Elderly but doesn't reference a repair to the crack. Not an entirely unreasonable price.

Mick

[Tavy]

Here is something one doesn't see often enough. Graupner and Meyer mandola scale bowlback

G+M Bowldola

which but for the top crack looks to be in quite good condition. The seller references its recent trip to Elderly but doesn't reference a repair to the crack. Not an entirely unreasonable price.

Mick

Always hard to tell from photos but the crack looks to be an old repair?

Also a 17.5" scale would have made this an octave mandolin back in the day I guess? You would probably get better sound from it strung as a 'dola though...

[Eugene]

Intriguing. The decor is more tasteful and more neatly executed than I generally expect of the era.

[dave17120]

Acquired from a woman who attended one of my Civil War concerts and was so moved by my rendition of Lorena that she wanted me to have her deceased husband's mandolin, which hasn't been played in the many years since he passed.

Eastern European am thinking, judging from the woman's accent, but I am not sure.

From the general style of the instrument, shape of sound hole, style of clasp, head shape, edging etc I'd say that was undoubdtedly German. If its still of any interest. Dave

[Schlegel]

Always hard to tell from photos but the crack looks to be an old repair?

Also a 17.5" scale would have made this an octave mandolin back in the day I guess? You would probably get better sound from it strung as a 'dola though...

I thought very hard about trying for this one- I had the same model once in mandolin size, and it was very nice sounding, comparable to Martin or Vega. Only sold it because the neck was just too narrow for me, so you can see why I found the mandola tempting.

[delsbrother]

Lookig at this Winder mandolin, I would say that its details are so close to standard Demeglios #that it was prob made by Demeglio under Winder's name. Even the stamp near the tensioner which I thought would say "sistema" mimics the Demeglio one.

Too bad the top is in bad shape -- that wicked warp -- tho I imagine that given the fanciness of this one, it may be worth the money it would cost to restore.

Jon or Martin... one of you should go for this one.
Jim

This ebay auction might be of interest to Winder Mandolin fans - some great pictures in this (very affordable) vintage article.

[brunello97]

Nice link! It looks like a very interesting article.

Unfortunately, the actually images from the earlier Winder conversation are lost along with their ebay ads. If Jim or Martin have copies of those, it would be great to see them here. I'll post the other pages from the Winder ad for posterity in case no one from the MC winds up with it.

Mick

[Jim Garber]

Your wish is my command, Sire...

[brunello97]

Thanks, Jim. That Winder doesn't look much like the examples shown in the article DelBro posted unless he was trying very hard to go DeMeglioid. But a very fancy DeM in any respect, if that. (This one has the same treble top-bubble as the one I recently have been working on.) That 'tortoise-shell' neck and headstock veneer is nice. Would like to find out more about JGW.

Mick

[Jim Garber]

Yes, alas, too many turtles gave their lives for that one.

[delsbrother]

I especially love the picture of the finishing table (next to the large window for daylight).

[brunello97]

Yes, alas, too many turtles gave their lives for that one.

Probably rustled up a lot of mock-turtle soup from that herd.

DelBro, I was enjoying that picture as well. Looks like Mr. Winder raided his wife's supply of perfume and lotions for that array of mixing bottles he has there...

Mick

[Graham McDonald]

I have it on my watch list and should be putting a bid in tomorrow before the deadline. Seems a bit silly for more than one of us to be bidding on it. I would be happy to scan and supply a pdf to anyone else interested if I win it.

cheers

g

Nice link! It looks like a very interesting article.

Unfortunately, the actually images from the earlier Winder conversation are lost along with their ebay ads. If Jim or Martin have copies of those, it would be great to see them here. I'll post the other pages from the Winder ad for posterity in case no one from the MC winds up with it.

Mick

[brunello97]

I have it on my watch list and should be putting a bid in tomorrow before the deadline. Seems a bit silly for more than one of us to be bidding on it....

cheers g

No bidding on my part, just posting as an FYI. Seems like it could be a helpful document for your research, Graham. Good like with the auction...

Mick

[Jim Garber]

Graham: I had it set to bid in my snipe program as of a few days ago. If you truly want to the original I can take my bid off. Otherwise I would gladly make a pdf of the whole thing as well for anyone who wants it.

[delsbrother]

No bids from me either. On things like these I tend to copy the ad photos and squint. Good luck on the bidding and I hope it stays "affordable".

[JeffD]

From the general style of the instrument, shape of sound hole, style of clasp, head shape, edging etc I'd say that was undoubdtedly German. If its still of any interest. Dave

Thanks. Yes if anyone could tell me more I am all ears. I have no intention of selling it, but I may fix it up and play it.

[trebleclef528]

I'm in Berlin at the moment and dont have access to my poicture gallery but
below is a link to a "Winder mandolin" that i recently sold on ebay (hope the link still works). Again you can see the "De Meglio influences".

I don't know too much about Winder except that he was one of only a handful of builders in England who made bowlbacks circa 1900 era, I've had a couple and the quality has always been very good

Winder

and yes it sold for a song at £69 (Ya win some... ya loose some )

[brunello97]

Ouch. That went for a relative pittance, even with the shipment to the US. Wish I had known... Nice looking hybrid design to my eye. DeMeglioidal + sound hole/scratchplate variations. Neck and all seemed in good, playable condition.

More Winder, please.

Mick