Compulsive purchase- Flatiron 1N

[PCypert]

I'm not mad at the post or anything like that. Just hope we promote realistic pancake purchases here as well. I was just saying one could commission a new Sawchyn for the price these things are going for. At that point they kind of quit becomming the things we love them to be. Even at 500 (I'm glad you have one you love) I'm not seeing anymore mandolin than a MidMo and when you buy a used MidMo they'll fix it for free even if it wasn't your original purchase. I love the Flatty Pancake. I'm just for supporting realistic, down-to-earth, value reflective prices for them. Maybe the tread's scope of "pancake" should expand to meet the demands of the times . I would consider a 3 level pancake at 500 at the top of it's price point. I guess others disagree, but feel like they'd get a better mandolin from Sawchyn, others at that point.

Paul

[fatt-dad]

. . . . and then there's the mojo factor.

I'll offer yet another perspective: I wizz away a few hundred dollars a month on take out lunches, fake beer (quit drinking) and (formerly) cigars (just quit). Finding an instrument that may or may not be at the bottom price is not what I do. If I "overpay" by $50.00 or $100.00, I just don't care. Here's where the problem lies: If you don't know what you want or if your too timid to return an instrument during the 48 hour trial period. I just don't know whether I would like a MidMo "better" than my pancake, but I sure know that there are folks that do. Same's true for the other makers. Every once and awhile they post about them too!

f-d

[Eric F.]

I think the mojo factor is what is driving the auction prices. You see the pre-Gibson pancakes getting the most attention. The listings generally harp on how Flatiron was the company Gibson couldn't compete with, so it bought it, the implication being that it then ruined it. That begs the question of why archtop Flatirons are not going through the roof. I think the answer is that there is so much more competition above $1,000. You see probably four or five pancakes for every Mid-Mo on eBay, and I've never seen a Sawchyn or Davis or Arches flat top for auction.

Oh, and I agree with everybody.

Flatirons are nice, Mid-Mos are nice, Davises are nice, Sawchyns are probably nice, too. It's all good. Except fake beer. Yecch.

[PCypert]

Yeah,
There you have it folks. Advice from a guy who drinks fake beer .

I'll give you mojo. Just expect these to hit a ceiling and come back down. I know where one's sitting hidden on a shelf collecting dust for 350 bucks. First 50 paypal'd to me and I'll tell em where it is. I thought it was overpriced for the sound and looks, but looks like I was wrong. Tried to tell my wife I could resell it and she didn't buy. It's an old flatty from the Montana days. Blackface to boot.

Paul

[Nathan Sanders]

The Flatirons have the reputation, the history, the heritage, which today's flat tops are only beginning to build for themselves. For some it's fun to have a piece of history. Some would rather buy a new mandolin or are more concerned about price. Some are more willing to invest in a known quantity than take a risk with something which may not hold its value. Just some thoughts in the ongoing pancake conversation.

[Nathan Sanders]

Hey Paul, a flatty blacktop sounds like a Cadet model and $350.00 sounds like the price range some of the cadets have been getting lately. They are still great mandolins though. I know where a new Cadet model is for about $500.00. I guess it would be new old stock. The guy is a dealer and has had it a while.

[fatt-dad]

I thought it was overpriced for the sound and looks

Well if someone overstrung it with J-74s (i.e., doesn't have the currect string gauges on it), the sound/playability may not be all that impressive.

On a separate note: Old Milwalkee N.A. - all the flavor of Old Milwalkee without the alcohol!

fatt tough-crowd-shows-up-for-page-23 dad

[PCypert]

Yikes...if only they'd come out with a NA Steel Reserve!

Paul

Glad you're not drinking...not trying to poke too much fun...

[fatt-dad]

Glad you're not drinking...not trying to poke too much fun...

I'm WAY over that. It's giving up cigars and reckless mandolin buying that's working my nerves - ha.

fatt "mellow-man" dad

[Nathan Sanders]

Hello...my name is Nathan and I'm a Mandoholic.

[fatt-dad]

. . . back to the topic at hand. #I've never played any other "pancake", Army-Navy or flattop, other than my Alvarez Martin clone (separate animal) or my Kalamazoo (very similar - sort of). #The Kalamazoo was a spruce top mahogany mandolin. #The point of all this is that I have no idea whether the other mandolins (MidMO, Davis, etc.) are "better than my Flatiron". #For the two that I once had, I liked the playability of the Flatiron over the Kalamazoo, so I sold the Kalamazoo.

Is there, and has anybody here ever play a mahogany Flatiron?

f-d

[delsbrother]

You mean mahogany back/sides AND top? Or just b/s?

Speaking of cheap mahogany-ish pancakes.. Where do these things rate? Opry Mills import-quality? Better? Or worse?

[BigJoe]

The Opry Mills flat mandolins were not really designed for players. They were tourist items and many thought they should be professional quality instruments....for 200.00. They weren't, and we finally did away with them because they were not decent enough quality for me to be proud to let out our doors. I think having a good pancake mandolin is a good idea, but the Opry Mills mandolin was not. At least I'm honest .

[delsbrother]

Hi Joe, thanks - I think you've answered here about the OM products before. What I was actually asking about were those Ozark Army/Navy Specials (click on the link). They're about $200 too, but I thought Ozark was the same group making those Romanian Troubador mandos that some on this board also liked (for the price).

[pickinNgrinnin]

Check it out - Big Joe is following the Pancake thread. Maybe he is working behind the scenes to bring them back

[QUOTE]Hello...my name is Nathan and I'm a Mandoholic.

Make that, Hello...my name is Nathan and I'm a Pancakeoholic

[fatt-dad]

My name is fatt-dad and I forgot my other flat-top mandolin. I too have (I think) Romanian flat-top, "Montana" mandolin. I forget about it 'cause beach weather is come and gone for the year. When I'm on the beach it's my favorite mandolin - ha. My "Montana" has a solid wood top (four piece) and seems to be fairly well stable. Maybe the Ozark is a good "cheap" pancake - can we get an informed report?

I was wondering whether there is/was a spruce top, mahogany sides/back Flatiron and how it may sound compared to my earlier Kalamazoo. I guess I'll never figure this out via a message board posting, but that doesn't mean I don't wonder.

f-d

[Nathan Sanders]

[QUOTE= (pickinNgrinnin @ Oct. 05 2005, 21:51)]Check it out - Big Joe is following the Pancake thread. Maybe he is working behind the scenes to bring them back #

Hello...my name is Nathan and I'm a Mandoholic.

Make that, Hello...my name is Nathan and I'm a Pancakeoholic #

You may be right...I might be more of a pancakeoholic...oh well...it's a nice condition to have...

I sure would like to see the army-navy Flatiron back in the new line. Hey Big Joe, can a person still order a Gibson AN? I remember seeing one several years ago in a local shop. It was nice looking, sunburst I believe with a sound hole rosette and maybe some nice binding. Just wondering.

[kyblue]

Thank God someone just outbid me on that 1N on the auction site. I was starting to sweat.

I think I need a 12 step program. I guess one step should be a block on certain sites on my computer.

Please quit feeding the MAS...

[Eric F.]

Haw! I nearly bid on that myself, and another mando is the last thing I need. At $405, someone got a bargain by recent eBay standards.

[fatt-dad]

Thank God someone just outbid me on that 1N on the auction site.

Ah, but you would have gotten a good deal and we would have had new subject matter. I would think that a pre-Gibson 1N for under $500.00 (playable and not needing new frets) would be a good deal. Unfortunatly, that mandolin did not have the original case.

f-d

[delsbrother]

If we really wanted an answer to these questions, we could just e-mail Paula Jean at Sound to Earth. But it's more fun to speculate.

Well, I have emailed her about this thread (she'd always been helpful in my previous inquiries about both Flatiron and Weber).

She's:

a) Aware of this thread, and interested because it pertains to early Flatiron history.
b) Answered a few of my general pancake questions, and given me permission to post those replies here.
c) Offered to answer more, as long as we're patient (as she's very busy at the moment).

So I put it to you.. Do we really want to know more from the source? Or will that kill the thread?

Darrell

[pickinNgrinnin]

Here's a vote to hear what Paula Jean has to say about the Pancakes. She's been following this legendary thread?? That's great. She's the best in the business.

I'm sure there will still be plenty of room to speculate after Paula shares some info.

[Kilrush]

... those Ozark Army/Navy Specials ... I thought Ozark was the same group making those Romanian Troubador mandos that some on this board also liked (for the price).

Ozark is the brand name of a UK importer, their instruments come from various sources, both in Europe and the Orient.

They have sold the Romanian "Reghin" instruments (from the actual manufacturers of "Troubadour") for many years, the Army/Navy is a more recent offering and is made in Korea.

Personally I would be wary of that model, as I have seen several with cracks developing at the heel.

[Nathan Sanders]

Paula has always been helpful to me when I asked about Flatiron stuff. In fact I think I even put one of her replies somewhere in this thread about a tailpiece on one my pancakes. As long she is fine with posting her answers, I say post them. The more information the better. The thread will survive and continue to grow.

[RolandTumble]

To the best of my knowledge (and I'm not really an expert, just a long-time interested observer), there wasn't ever a production Flatiron pancake with mahogany b/s, though they all had mahogany necks. A possible exception is the Cadet/Scout instruments, as those were always opaque-finished because of their "lesser" woods.