Post a picture of your lyon&healy mando

[JEStanek]

Sorry, I've been away from the thread for a bit. I'm working with Brian Dean (www.bfolk.com) out of Montreal for this.

Here are my answers. The face plate of the style A is a weak design element aesthetically to me. It's a big blank slate (or rubber pad as the case may be). I don't see pearl inlay working in there given the fiddle head scroll. A channeled out or slotted headstock like on a Calace / Pandini may work better. It's something Brian Dean and I are exploring. I really appreciate the comments on restringing issues/challenges on that (thanks Mark). This is all still very much at the idea stage and Brian hasn't sketched it out yet. The mando isn't due until late March April 08 (sooner than I think).

An alternative, for those familiar with Brian's work, is some relief style carving in the face plate of a standard tuning machine headstock. I really like the rosettes Brian has carved (like on lutes) in lieu of the finger rest. I'm thinking something more geometric than figurative would look cool (imagine some of the old church screens or rose window geometry with triquetas) and could be referenced in the faceplate of the headstock.

I'm not shooting for a full on L&H Style A copy but, a Style A inspired instrument that Brian and I can play with design elements and shoot for a real elegant beauty (and for me it's hard to do too much with the asymmetrical Style A as it's almost perfect). I want minimal or no plastic (binding or tuner buttons), probably only pearl position dots on the board and side, and hopefully some kind of more eco-friendlier finish. I want a very organic feel to the instrument. And the back and sides are going to be walnut for a warmer tone.

I set a budget and we may have to sacrifice this or that to meet it. We'll see what the economy holds. I'm looking forward to sketches and then getting really serious about bringing it all together. But, this is an exciting build process and this thread is like a reference library for me.

Jamie

[chinatogalway]

here a lovely L and H
http://www.chinatogalway.com/TOYS%20....lin.htm

[Jim Garber]

here a lovely L and H
http://www.chinatogalway.com/TOYS%20....lin.htm

Kieron:
So, it looks like you also have one of the earlier, long-scale models. I think part of the tone comes from the longer scale. I didn't know that they wider necks. Mine measures 30mm (1 3/16"). And your tailpiece cover is very unusual. Do you have closeups of it?

[Jim Garber]

Jamie:
I believe you are referring to Pandini/Embergher style headstock. I can't recall seeing many Calace's with slotted headstocks.

Here is Doug Woodley's take on the L&H. He dispensed with the scroll altogether. This is Marilynn Mair's. I have not played hers but if it is like the one Woodley (the black F2) I did play, it is exquisite.

Whoops... left off the image the first time:


Aside from the rubber stuff, I like the elegance of the scroll headstock. I think the main difficulty is making one that work with modern tuners. The tuners are like no others I have seen and must have been made especially for (or by) L&H.

In any case, I am sure that Brian and yourself will come up with a nice, aesthetically pleasing solution. I ma looking fwd to seeing it.

[jnikora]

I bought this a couple years ago from a woman in Ohio. Her alcoholic stepfather had it for years but never played it - just took it out of the case every few months or so when he was good and liquored up and bragged about how beautiful it is. At least, he could still see and didn't damage it. The action was awful when I got it, like so many I have played - especially the short scale asymmetrical A's. I sent it to Pete Langdell for a neck reset. He made me promise that I would disclose that the work had been done if I ever sold it. It's pretty hard to tell that any work was done except that it plays very well.

I'll put up a bunch of pics...

Jim

[jnikora]

Probably should have sent the front first...

[jnikora]

That is a Hamilton stand - not a fifth string tuner! Here's a closeup of the sound hole.

[jnikora]

Just a couple more - Thanks, Scott for the bandwidth and thanks for having this thread.

[jnikora]

Pete's handiwork...

[jnikora]

Fantastic tailpiece

[Chris Baird]

Jim, that is quite the beauty, here is an addition.

[jnikora]

Chris,

That is a beauty - this is why so many of us feel it is the most beautiful aesthetic design of the period.

Here is the last one for now. The case is in great shape, too. A little wear on the logo where the strings rubbed it and a replacement leather handle - otherwise hard to tell from new.

Jim

[Chris Baird]

....

[Bill Halsey]

Jim, Chris -- spectacular instruments, thanks! S/Ns? Can you describe the guard plate attachment? Also, Jim, I notice that the center lamination in the neck is thinner than others I've seen...can you tell if it's the same "vulcanized fibre" material as in other L&H necks?

[jnikora]

Bill,

The serial is 1318 - the laminate in the neck appears to be the same vulcanized rubber that is used on the headstock overlay and the pick guard. The pick guard appears to be held on by one screw - a long small headed screw that goes through the edge of the guard all the way into the fingerboard. You can see it here in the picture. There must be other locater pins to stabilize it. Fascinating - I thought Lynn Dudenbostel had invented the system to float the guard over the top. There is absolutely nothing touching the top or rim of the mandolin!

[twaaang]

Am I seeing compensated bridges on some of the above? My Style B (SN around #670, I don't have it right here) has a straight one, and the intonation is just fine. -- Paul

[Django Fret]

Sorry for the picture quality compared to the rest in this thread. Here is an A and a C that I owned a couple of years ago. It does show the difference in the scale length and their relative sizes.

I still have the A, and it is serial number 794 and does not have the double stamped pickguard with the patent dates. It looks like this one was made after they used those guards up, but before they went to the asymmetrical style. It also has the pull out piece in the lower bout that I heard was designed to fit into a vest pocket for easier playing while standing.

[Jim Garber]

Am I seeing compensated bridges on some of the above? My Style B (SN around #670, I don't have it right here) has a straight one, and the intonation is just fine.

I would think that all of these would have compensated bridges. This is a Washburn labelled A 2199 (not mine).

[brunello97]

Fabulous pictures! Thanks to each of you for posting them. Jamie, FWIW, I'm growing to like the 'quiet' design of the unadorned headstock face. It is true, though that the longer scale models are more elegant with such an elaborated headstock. I like the 'Marilyn Mair' model but do think the wings on the headstock are a bit hefty. The more clipped version on Django's C model are more to my liking.

Jim, do you know what the differences are between the models marketed as L+H and those as Washburn?

Mick

[Jim Garber]

Jim, do you know what the differences are between the models marketed as L+H and those as Washburn?

The specs page I posted was from a 1924-5 catalog. At that point they were labelled Washburn. I think it was only in the last few years that they had the Washburn label. In the 1920 catalog they were called "Lyon & healy Own Make" so somewhere in between those years they transitioned.

[jnikora]

Gads! What great shots! Jim - that Washburn is PRISTINE. I noticed that a lot of the Washburns do not have leg pegs. I also think they are later - dunno why they changed - I think it had something to do with their business - one of their middle names was Washburn. Maybe they "restructured" or maybe it was just a marketing ploy. Mine is a Washburn and not really a "Professional A" but a Washburn "Style 5382". I lusted after one for years and finally ended up with one.

Jim

[chinatogalway]

l and h

[chinatogalway]

l and h

[squirrelabama]

Interesting tail piece cover there Andy. Can we get a close up of that?

[Jim Garber]

Gads! What great shots! Jim - that Washburn is PRISTINE. I noticed that a lot of the Washburns do not have leg pegs. I also think they are later - dunno why they changed - I think it had something to do with their business - one of their middle names was Washburn. Maybe they "restructured" or maybe it was just a marketing ploy. Mine is a Washburn and not really a "Professional A" but a Washburn "Style 5382". I lusted after one for years and finally ended up with one.

Jim

George Washburn Lyon was one of the guys. They used Washburn for their upper line of bowlbacks. I am not sure why they switched other than the fact that Washburn was maybe more well-known -- some sort of marketing ploy. Oddly enough these wonderful instruments were made (like the Loars) at the tail end of the mandolin boom. Strange, right?