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Thread: New roman instruments

  1. #151
    Registered User Tavy's Avatar
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    Default Re: New roman instruments

    That's a work of art for sure - lovely!

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  3. #152
    Registered User Alex Timmerman's Avatar
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    Default Re: New roman instruments

    Hi all Embergher interested,

    (Not really a 'new' Roman instrument, but the reason why I post it here is that it could be the example to work from for luthiers who really like to come as close as possible to the Roman craftsmanship, sound and ideas of Luigi Embergher himself).

    Still excited about the sound and excellent playability I like to inform you about the following: recently the restoration of my 1905 Luigi Embergher concert mandola was finished by the Dutch Luthier/restorer Hendrik van den Broek who did a really excellent job.

    Once the mandola was back home and in my hands it turned out to be one of the most beautiful instruments that I know and play. An instrument with a very rich, sonore and warm sound. Ánd a sound also that - when required in the music - can be clear and penetrating so that it is heard! Simply fantastic!

    The interesting aspect of this mandola is that Luigi Embergher, working together at the time with Ginislao Paris (a mandolinist in St. Petersburough) placed a second soundboard designed by Mr. Paris inside the bowl. And of course it is difficult (it is just to early; I have to get used to it, to fully play and understand the instrument) to say whether this is a real improvement, but what I can say already that it is surely a wonderful instrument!

    The collaboration between Embergher and Paris was quite interesting and sofar we know that a Liuto cantabile, the mandola mentioned above, and two mandolins have survived. All instruments are of the highest models of the Mandolin family in the Luigi Embergher line.


    My best greetings,

    Alex.

    Click image for larger version. 

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    Last edited by Alex Timmerman; Dec-24-2016 at 5:27pm.

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  5. #153
    Registered User Martin Jonas's Avatar
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    Default Re: New roman instruments

    Very interesting, Alex! I haven't heard of Emberghers with a second soundboard before. How is it located in the bowl -- similar to what Umberto Ceccherini did a few years before (i.e. a second soundboard about a centimetre below the main board, extending the full width) or more like a Virzi, located towards the centre of the sound chamber?

    Martin

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  7. #154
    Registered User Alex Timmerman's Avatar
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    Default Re: New roman instruments

    Hi Martin,


    Indeed they are very rare. As mentioned, only a handful are known yet. All of them were made for the Russian pre-Revolution market.

    The second soundboard is very, very thin and has a sound hole that is located more or less straight under the place where the bridge on the top soundboard is placed.

    Unlike the Ceccherini the Luigi Embergher second sound board is situated much deeper inside the sound box and the soundhole in this second top is also placed at a different place.
    Also, there are differences in the design of the second soundboard between the Embergher/Paris mandolin- and the mandola design.
    In the mandola the soundhole is placed more towards the middle and much more visible than the sound hole inside the mandolin.

    If time permits I'll make a photo the coming week. A photo often explains it better than words.


    As for now; Merry Christmas to all,

    Best greetings, Alex.

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  9. #155
    Full Grown and Cussin' brunello97's Avatar
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    Default Re: New roman instruments

    Un regalo muy rico, for the Holiday, Alex. Gracias, amigo. I look forward to seeing (and hearing) more from this mandola.

    Feliz Navidad, my friend.

    Mick
    Ever tried, ever failed? No matter. Try again, fail again. Fail better.--Samuel Beckett
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  11. #156

    Default Re: New roman instruments

    Frank-Peter Dietrich and Markus Dietrich also build an Embergher style mandolin.
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    http://www.gitarre-laute.de/mandoline_19.html

  12. #157
    Registered User Alex Timmerman's Avatar
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    Default Re: New roman instruments

    Hello Martin, Mick and all,

    As promised: a photo of the Luigi Embergher Mandola with its double top.


    Best greetings,

    Alex.

    Click image for larger version. 

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  14. #158
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    Default Re: New roman instruments

    Good evening, Alex,

    Thank you for sharing this information with us and for the photo!
    Quite interesting to read that L. Embergher built intruments like those. 1905 is relatively early in his career, isn't it?
    Would you know the year of contruction of the other double-soundboard instruments?
    To your knowledge, did mr v.d.Broek find any sort of bracing on the inner board?





    p.s.
    Alex, would you have the time for me to ask your opinion on a few ideas on the roman features via email?
    In short, I was thinking about the motion of the fingers/palm while playing across the fretboard: mainly driven by my short fingers, I want to try fretting a board with some inclination to see if playability would benefit. I intend to try both 'positive' and 'negative' inclination and even though I reason that any benefit would come from E being lower than G (opposite to the pic), I not a professional player and listening to one would be most valuable -especially a person of your depth of knowledge, also being a teacher.


    p.s.2
    Here is my own first attemp on a roman mandolin, based on an old bowl with a badly split top; bracing pattern and construction etc from mr Lippi's schematics and other photos. Not true to a specific Embergher series though (plus, the scroll pick guard could be quite less wide..)

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    Last edited by Vangelis M.; Dec-29-2016 at 6:47pm.

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  16. #159
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    Default Re: New roman instruments

    Quote Originally Posted by Alex Timmerman View Post
    The interesting aspect of this mandola is that Luigi Embergher, working together at the time with Ginislao Paris (a mandolinist in St. Petersburough) placed a second soundboard designed by Mr. Paris inside the bowl. And of course it is difficult (it is just to early; I have to get used to it, to fully play and understand the instrument) to say whether this is a real improvement, but what I can say already that it is surely a wonderful instrument!

    The collaboration between Embergher and Paris was quite interesting and sofar we know that a Liuto cantabile, the mandola mentioned above, and two mandolins have survived. All instruments are of the highest models of the Mandolin family in the Luigi Embergher line.
    Ginislao Paris on wikipedia

    There seems to be a few pics of the n.8 mandolin on the website http://russian-embergher.com/, along with an interesting pdf on the liuto cantabile.

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    Last edited by Vangelis M.; Jan-07-2017 at 6:53pm.

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