Satellite radio

[Jonathan Peck]

With bluegrass being broadcast nationally for the first time over the last few years, do you think that we will continue to see the commercialization of BG? How long before we start to see more BG bands with drums? Will new songs continue to move towards the country/pop formula? Will we start to see more singers that don't play an instrument?

[Ted Lehmann]

(1)Bluegrass has always wanted to sell (i.e. be commercial). Why else did Bill Monroe work so hard or guard his prerogatives on Grand Ol' Opry so jealosly. (2)You already hear them where they can't be seen, on records. How much could the percussive sounds needed in music and now provided in turn by the bass, mandolin, banjo, and sometimes the guitar be improved by the tasteful use of drums and still keep the sound true? (3)How long can bluegrass content continue to rely on a world of agrarian poverty and the depths of depression when almost none of the current performers ever experienced that life directly? (4)At present there are plenty of singers who either fake it on the instrument or who play at pretty rudimentary levels. While singing is crucial to bluegrass, lots of the best singers are only so-so pickers. And how many banjo players actually pick while they sing? Most, with a few exceptions (notably Eric Gibson)vamp while they're singing. Picking takes way too much concentration to combine with great singing. That's why most of the great vocalists are rhythm guitar players who play three chords and use a capo. - Ted

[Jonathan Peck]

(1)Bluegrass has always wanted to sell (i.e. be commercial).

I can't remember ever noticing a bluegrass section in any record store I was in (and now there aren't anymore record stores around here). I had also never heard any bluegrass on the radio. In fact, I had never even heard of bluegrass until I was in Virginia at a milestone birthday party. Heck, I didn't even know that the band was playing bluegrass, the only thing I noticed was that the members kept changing instruments and had great chops and musicianship on everyone they played.

I completely stumbled into it by accident. My fingerstyle blues guitar teacher had mentioned that he was doing a gig later that evening and asked me if I wanted to go. I wound up staying for the last act, the Steep Canyon Rangers, and then we all walked down the street to the Baggot and everyone joined in the jam. I was hooked, but completely by happenstance.

How exactly did BG do its selling?

[John Flynn]

How exactly did BG do its selling?

Bill Monroe took music that was essentially a folk art, "jazzed it up" (for lack of a better term!) and used it to carve a unique niche in the then-burgoening country music industry. So he took an amateur folk art and turned it into a commercial, performance art. He did it so well that it had a significant impact on all kinds of popular music. He "sold" his new music like any music gets sold, on the radio, through touring live performances and making records for sale. Bluegrass today retains much of its roots and is not as "commericalized" as some other genres, but it is still about performing, recording and getting airplay. IHMO, bluegrass has found and settled on a kind of happy mid-point between pure roots music and pop country music. I don't claim to be an expert on this, though. There are some experts here and there is a lot written on Bill Monroe that could illuminate this further. What I do think we will continue to see, though, is some artists who have Bluegrass backgrounds, like Ricky Skaggs, Marty Stuart and Allison Krauss, #following the money by moving in the country pop direction, while still keeping a BG flavor. But you will also continue have a lot of purists "keeping the faith," but never making it really big.

[Jonathan Peck]

But you will also continue have a lot of purists "keeping the faith," but never making it really big.

This is really where my original question started. I was in the supermarket last Saturday and they had bluegrass junction playing over the stores sound system. I pushed my cart around the store singing along to SOTOTW and noticed that everyone in the store was sort of tapping their feet and grooving along. When I got to the cashier, no-one seemed to know who put the station on, but it made me realize that BG is more accessible now with satellite radio.

It made me think of the blues resurgence back in the 70/80's when they started to dig up all the old blues pioneers to play the music the way it originated.

[Mike Snyder]

I's sad, I think, that the post-oh brother trend seemed to be "new-country" style music with some bluegrass instrumentation thrown onto the song intro that got pushed hard by the music biz. They have such a deep and wide resource to put some ad money and airplay behind. I'm always wondering why didn't Tim O become a superstar? or Riley Puckett, or Lauri Lewis, or__?

[Bernie Daniel]

Jonathan Peck: With bluegrass being broadcast nationally for the first time over the last few years, do you think that we will continue to see the commercialization of BG? How long before we start to see more BG bands with drums? Will new songs continue to move towards the country/pop formula? Will we start to see more singers that don't play an instrument?

Track 14 Bluegrass Junction has been on XM satellite radio for at least 10 years -- in summer of 2006 I was able to pick up the signal all across northern Canada through the Yukon Territory to Alaska. #I think BG is changing - but and I am certain that satellite radio (both XM and Sirius)are increasing exposure of the listening public to BG -- but I would guess that it would be hard quantify the relationship between that exposure and changes happening in BG though.

Ted Lehman1)Bluegrass has always wanted to sell (i.e. be commercial)....2)You already hear them [changes other insturments] where they can't be seen, on records...(3)How long can bluegrass content continue to rely on a world of agrarian poverty and the depths of depression when almost none of the current performers ever experienced that life directly?....(4)At present there are plenty of singers who either fake it on the instrument or who play at pretty rudimentary levels. #

While singing is crucial to bluegrass, lots of the best singers are only so-so pickers. #And how many banjo players actually pick while they sing? Most, with a few exceptions (notably Eric Gibson)vamp while they're singing. #Picking takes way too much concentration to combine with great singing. #That's why most of the great vocalists are rhythm guitar players who play three chords and use a capo.

I agree with all of those points. #

All of these matters are opinions but I think many of the changes in bluegrass are not good ones. #"County" music went commercial and they make lots of money but do you bother to listen to it? #I don't.

The trends in performance are not what I want to see either. #I have always felt that a real bluegrass player even if a singer should also be a picker. #

Now many bands are Jane Doe and the Picking Guys. #I guess some like it. #In many of these bands the lead singer does not even bother to handle the rhythm guitar part but just stands at the mike. I think the songs of the band change to accommodate this format. Some people like it -- I don't.

On the other hand maybe it is inevitable. #Ted's third point is very critical only a tiny percentage of people in the USA live a rural life style of any kind -- say nothing of living in poverty. Most young preformers seem to be regular middle class urban folks. #I'm not saying this is bad just noting what is clearly true.

It figures that growing percentage of younger folks (including bluegrass performers and fans) do have a hard time relating to the older themes of country and bluegrass. #

The trains in my childhood really were steam powered, they stopped in small towns to pick up freight, passengers and mail, they really had hobo's and rr bums, and cabooses and open cattle cars too. #The fireman and the brakeman were real jobs. #You could put a penny on the track and no one cared. So I relate to songs about "riding the rail".

For now there are still many traditional bands so I can vote with my purchase of records and tickets - but I think it is changing. #That is why I really like Old Tyme and Celtic music too.

Please remit your two cents to my account.

[jefflester]

Track 14 Bluegrass Junction has been on XM satellite radio for at least 10 years ...

Well not quite that long. Wikipedia sez:

"2001 September 25: XM Satellite Radio service launches, first in San Diego and Dallas/Fort Worth, and spreads across the United States. The initial lineup includes 71 music channels and 29 other channels consisting of sports, talk, children's programming, entertainment and news."

[Bernie Daniel]

jefflester: Well not quite that long.

OK I stand corrected -- I have had a subscription since about June, 2002 and I thought had been around a for over year then already -- guess not.

[JeffD]

What I do think we will continue to see, though, is some artists who have Bluegrass backgrounds, like Ricky Skaggs, Marty Stuart and Allison Krauss, #following the money by moving in the country pop direction, while still keeping a BG flavor.

I thought that Ricky came back from country pop. The bands his company records are sure more BG than country.

Be nice if for every Allison Krauss that BG loses to country, there be a Rhonda Vincent who escapes back into BG.

[Ted Lehmann]

Jonathan - I've been thinking for the past hour or so about why you never heard bluegrass before. I checked your profile, which says you come from New York. Now if that means the City or nearby suburbs, the chances are you never would have heard it unless you listen to rather obscure FM radio stations like WFDU originating from Fairleigh-Dickinson University in New Jersey. Otherwise, bluegrass on the radio has been pretty much the province of rural AM radio since its inception. These days FM stations in the south carry several hours of bluegrass a week, but its often hidden in strange hours and you need to know where to look. The Internet has opened up a lot of opportunities to listen to bluegrass radio.

Early on, bluegrass was spread by bands traveling to small radio stations, playing live shows or making transcriptions for audiences throughout the south. Two major stations sponsored country music, which during the period of the 1920's and 1930's was indistinguishable from what later became bluegrass music. WLS radio in Chicago sponsored the National Barn Dance beginning in 1924 and later WSM in Nashville sponsored the Grand Ol' Opry. Meanwhile, Bill Monroe was out creating a fast paced, performance oriented music which came to be called bluegrass. For greater detail search the Internet some or, if you really want a more scholarly approach, read Neil V. Rosenberg's wonderful book "Bluegrass Music - A History."

The combination of radio, music publishing, and 78 rpm recordings spread the music around pretty well. In 1965 a promoter named Carleton Haney held the first bluegrass festival in Virginia. This conincided with the the explosion of folk music and the emergence of the counter culture, and a bluegrass hard core group developed. There's a thumbnail picture. Enjoy the music, luxuriate in its variety, become familiar with the arguments amongst those who love it. Have a good time. - Ted

[J.Albert]

Although not on "satellite radio" per se, there are several full-time streaming audio bluegrass channels on the net.

A quick check using the iTunes radio tuner reveals:
- Bluegrasscountry.org (well-known "radio-style" format with emcees
- Bluegrassradio.org (little less-known, but very good, no emcees, just streaming music at high bit rate, gospel on Sunday mornings)
- Gospel Grass - all gospel, all the time
- Radio-io Bluegrass - a new one to me (just tuned in for the first time right now, Ron Stewart's playing)
- Radio-io NEWgrass - as the name implies!

Remember, you don't need to be on a Mac to use iTunes - the Windows version should get all these, too.

I hook up a minidisc to the computer, record right off net radio, and take it along for music on the Harley.

Also, my local Comcast cable tv provider carries music channels as well. Channel "404" is the bluegrass channel. Info about the performers is usually displayed while the songs play. Actually, whoever is doing the programming seems to actually know something about the music!

There's plenty of other stations on iTunes, as well, all free of charge. Worth looking into if you haven't tried it already!

- John

[Brady Smith]

Don't forget the #1 ranked dj station on the internet....www.worldwidebluegrass.com

[luckylarue]

Don't forget "East Tennessee's Own", WDVX, streaming on the web. Probably one of the best radio stations on the planet, imo.

[DryBones]

I thought that Ricky came back from country pop. The bands his company records are sure more BG than country.

Be nice if for every Allison Krauss that BG loses to country, there be a Rhonda Vincent who escapes back into BG.

IMHO, Rhonda's latest CD definitely has a very country sound with a few BG songs mixed in. Could she be leaning back towards country? my 2 cents, YMMV

[J.Albert]

msnyder wrote:
<< I'm always wondering why didn't Tim O become a superstar? or Riley Puckett, or Lauri Lewis, or__ >>

I sense there has always been (well, since rock 'n' roll broke onto the scene in the early 1950's) a "bluegrass barrier", if you will - a line separating "commercially acceptable" (from the mass broadcasters' point of view) music from bluegrass/acoustic music.

Now and then, something breaks across the line (examples: c.1962, "The Ballad of Jed Clampett", 1967, "Foggy Mountain Breakdown"; 1972, "Dueling Banjos", and "Oh, Brother..."). Afterwards, bluegrass/acoustic enjoys wider recognition, at least for a short while. Then interest fades and things settle back down to "their own level".

As of late, we've been seeing something I'd call (for lack of a better term) "NashGrass". Quite often it involves a singer (usually female) who doesn't play, but uses acoustic instruments for backing, quite often with really good pickers who can kick up the dust. Alicia Nugent comes to mind as does Carrie Hassler. It's "close to bluegrass", but still, just a bit derivative.

Interesting coment about Laurie Lewis, you made....

Back around 1993, I was at the Winterhawk festival in which two female-led band were on the bill. One was Laurie's "Grant Street" and the other Allison Krauss & Union Station. Krauss was still "up and coming", but had yet to attain the fame or sales potential she has today. Of the two ladies, I found Laurie to be much more interesting, particulary in view of her own song contributions. To me, Laurie's music was far ahead in terms of "substance" (for lack of a better term).

I still feel that way 15 years later!

- John

[pocketbones]

I thought that Ricky came back from country pop. The bands his company records are sure more BG than country.

Be nice if for every Allison Krauss that BG loses to country, there be a Rhonda Vincent who escapes back into BG.

Alison Krauss, though she doesn't play straight-up Bill Monroe-style bluegrass, has probably done more for bluegrass in the last few years than anybody. #When you realize that she is Ken Irwin's cash cow (Rounder Records), generating money for the company, then you can realize what large amounts of bluegrass Rounder puts out to be enjoyed.

If it weren't for Alison Krauss' success, Rounder may not even be in business in today's music market.

Out recently (or coming soon) on Rounder:

Tony Rice compliation (august 2008)
Dan Tyminski-Wheels
Michael Cleveland-Leavin Town (July 29th 2008)
Daily & Vincent
Rhonda Vincent-many recent recordings
The Grascals-Keep on Walkin' (July 15th 2008)
The Steeldrivers-
Danny Paisley-The Room Over Mine (June 24, 2008)
Blue Highway-Through the Window of a Train
Sierra Hull-Secrets
Longview-several releases
James King-several releases
JD Crowe-several releases

Now, all of these folks have demonstrated their wares and earned the ability to be signed by Rounder due to their longstanding work ethic or maybe due to their brand new band and the music they play. #

But, I personally know that Alison has had a rather large hand in determining what and who Ken signs and then again the money she generates helps Ken to fund these projects.

She has complete artistic control of the music she records and has a good bit of input into how Ken should leave these artists alone, when they go into a recording studio.