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Thread: repairing mandolin

  1. #1

    Default repairing mandolin

    I have a mandolin, not sure who made it as it has a Gibson inlay and a Gibson 1925 fern label but it is neither.

    The neck has seperated from the block and I have had a luthier repair it once but it only held for about six months. When I say seperated I mean you could probably put a thick pick between the heel and body.

    What I am wanting to do is try to repair it myself as it is just going to be a wall hanger if not.

    First question- should I remove the back first and try to see what the heck is going on?

    As I say it is probably going to be a wallhanger anyway but would like to experiment with it a little.

  2. #2
    Café habitué Paul Hostetter's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Don't try this at home - find a better luthier.

    There should be a tab of the back that connects to the heel of the neck to keep the whole neck in place.



    Getting all the appropriate gluing surfaces clean and well-mated and then glued and clamped correctly isn't easy to do.
    .
    ph

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  3. #3

    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    The tab or button of the heel on this mandolin is connected to the heel itself not the mandolin back. I am not sure if this is from the last luthier repair or made that way. I guess you were just being funny but I doubt the heel button holds the neck in place.

    If anyone has any advice I would appreciate it. I am thinking I am going to need to replace or repair the block and neck joint and am looking for the best way to get in there.

    If I had the money for a luthier I would probably just blow it on groceries for the kids right now so please don't suggest taking it to a luthier.

    If I take it apart and cant get it back together it will make just as nice a wall hanger as it is now.

  4. #4
    Café habitué Paul Hostetter's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    I wasn't being funny. If it's a Gibson Fern or a clone of one, it would have the heel arrangement I showed, with the tab ("button") of the back lapping over and anchoring the neck. If yours is different, the path to setting things right is more complicated.

    One of my standards in repairing or offering advice is "Do no harm." I see you on the verge of compounding the harm already done. If it's now a wallhanger and you're on the way to retaining it in that condition after you experiment with it, maybe you should just leave it in its current wallhanger status until you're a little more flush and can get the thing fixed properly.
    .
    ph

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    Paul Hostetter, luthier
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  5. #5
    Registered User Lefty Luthier's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    If you are bound and determined to attempt a fix, why not just drive a screw in through the heel on a 45 degree angle. It will never be pretty but it would keep the neck attached to the head block. On the wild assumption that the neck is straight with the tailpiece, the instrument would play, otherwise hang it on the wall.

  6. #6

    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    I was watching the video made by the late John Sullivan where his first attempt at lutherie was taking apart a busted mandolin and figuring out how it was built. I guess he didn't get the advice I got.

    I have had this mandolin broken for twenty years and it is not worth the lutherie bill to fix it. This I know, so rather than trying to repair it myself however futile that may seem I think I will try, as I was inspired by Mr. Sullivan. Thanks anyway for the suggestions.

    I will bother you no longer.

  7. #7
    Registered User Bill Snyder's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Do a search on Frank Ford's site (www.frets.com) for neck reset.
    Bill Snyder

  8. #8
    Phylum Octochordata Mike Bromley's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by TEE View Post
    it as it has a Gibson inlay and a Gibson 1925 fern label but it is neither.
    Before you run away, I'd be interested to see what a Non-1925-Gibson-Fern actually LOOKS like!
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    Registered User Rob Grant's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Mike wrote:
    "Before you run away, I'd be interested to see what a Non-1925-Gibson-Fern actually LOOKS like!"
    ....................
    Me too! How about a photo of the heel button? The way it broke sounds more like one of those inexpensive Korean dowelled neck mandolins. If it is dowelled then Lefty's idea of a big wood screw is not too far off the mark!<g>
    Rob Grant
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  10. #10

    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by Rob Grant View Post
    Mike wrote:
    "Before you run away, I'd be interested to see what a Non-1925-Gibson-Fern actually LOOKS like!"
    ....................
    Me too! How about a photo of the heel button? The way it broke sounds more like one of those inexpensive Korean dowelled neck mandolins. If it is dowelled then Lefty's idea of a big wood screw is not too far off the mark!<g>
    Rob Grant-Since you can tell from several thousand miles away that it is a Korean made instrument with a dowel rod maybe you can tell Mike B what it looks like. I am glad you two seemed to be amused. I am not a luthier, that I freely admit, but I am not a jerk either, and right now I think I prefer the latter.

  11. #11
    Registered User Rob Grant's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Tee,

    No joke or offense meant. I've seen and repaired a few instruments with the break you describe. Generally a good dovetail or even a pinned mortice doesn't crack across the button. With some of the early Asian "imported" mandolins the button was part of the neck heel and not the back. If you want advice on how to repair your mandolin it is necessary to know what sort of neck joint we're dealin' with. Hence the photo request.

    Here's the URL for for a recent repair I did on a dowel pinned neck. If your instrument has a more substantial, traditional method of attachment then this won't concern you...

    http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/sh...ht=Junk+repair
    Rob Grant
    FarOutNorthQueensland,Oz
    http://www.grantmandolins.com

  12. #12
    Registered User man dough nollij's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    TEE, what I see here is some world class luthiers honestly trying to help you out. I would also like to see pictures of the mandolin in question.

    I've seen some pictures of some really nice hand-made mandolins that were logoed (is that a word?) to look like a vintage Gibson. I really think the motives of the builders were not to produce fakes, rather copies. Didn't Randy Wood and R.L. Givens do that? No slouches, those two.

  13. #13
    Registered User Bill Snyder's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Tee,
    I have read several of the fine luthiers and repairmen here write about having to try and fix a previously "fixed" instrument that would have been much easier to repair if they had gotten it before it had been "fixed". I think that is why Paul gave his suggestion of waiting until you had the funds to have someone else repair it. I really do not think anyone is being a jerk.
    None of us have seen it and that is why caution in going forward has been suggested. You are really the only one that knows what you have. If the knowlege that it might not be repairable when you get done is ok with you then I understand your desire to fix it. If you can, post a few photos before you do anything.
    As for removing the back, that may be what you have to do, but without knowing just what kind of joint it has makes it impossible to say.
    Bill Snyder

  14. #14
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    No one can adequately tell you how to repair your mandolin if we don't see the problem. Depending upon the kind of neck joint it may be a simple fix that could be done by a non luthier. If it is not a simple fix it should be done by someone with the right experience to ensure it is functional and will hold. Putting a screw in the neck heel is likely the wrong way to fix it...even if it is a dowel joint. A dowel joint can be repaired, but it is a pain. In any case, good photos of the damage will be a real help to getting you the right information.
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    Joe Vest

  15. #15
    Registered User Lefty Luthier's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Speaking or repairing busted neck joints. This little fellow got sat on by a drunken guest. The neck dovetail cracked out on the side, broke off part of the binding and separated up to the fretboard. The customer just wanted it returned to playing condition. I used a 1-1/4 #6 wood screw through the broken binding near the heel joint to pull things back together and put a little binding patch on. Finish is not yet complete, the binding needs to be scraped clean and a patch of broken wood where the neck boundary meets the fretboard needs to be fixed. This will make it playable but obviously it will never be restored to like new without removing the binding and reworking the entire backboard finish.
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  16. #16

    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    I took the neck off today. The joint is a V type joint. The block is in good shape but the heel portion of the V is too small and will need to be reshaped.
    I plan on reshaping both sides and try to get a better fit.

    Sorry to be rude before but I really asked a question and was told that I did not have the ability to correct the problem and some commented that the mandolin was probably too cheap to fix. This without knowing me, my mandolin or my ability to comprehend instructions.

    I went to other sites and learned how to remove the neck. Not exactly brain surgery, but I was able to easily remove the neck and look at the joints and block.

    Sorry, I do not own a camera.

  17. #17
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Tee, glad you're on your way. No one that I read was out of line, but I can imagine your concern over the instrument. Hey, it's the internet, no one can see your face, or tell your voice inflection, and sometimes what we take as irritating are just said in good humor. And, as was mentioned, a serious, helpful, and thoughtful answer from one of these guys would have been greatly helped by a borrowed camera.

    But wtf, it's water under the bridge, good you're on your way!

  18. #18
    Registered User barry k's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Lefty, who built that mandolin where you showed the neck repair??

  19. #19
    iii mandolin Geoff B's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Hey TEE, I've learned a lot on this forum just from paying attention and appreciate that you posed your question here. How did you end up getting the neck off?

  20. #20
    Registered User Lefty Luthier's Avatar
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    Default Re: repairing mandolin

    Quote Originally Posted by barry k View Post
    Lefty, who built that mandolin where you showed the neck repair??
    One of my early ones (1988). It has a Russian Spruce soundboard and East Texas Black Walnut backboard cut from where a big limb came out of the trunk. Musically it is now fine but really needs some finish TLC to be restored to its' original beauty.

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