Gibson A-50 Neck Replacement

[SmileyChris]

My musical partner has a much-loved Gibson A-50 with f-holes, no visable serial number, and only a guess that it was made in the early-1950's. It's been out of commission for a few years now due to neck problems, but he's recently taken it to a very reputable luthier. It's been repaired a few times before and quickly had difficulties again due to a poor connection at the dovetail joint. We've just found from the reputable luthier that one of the previous luthiers cut the dovetail joint off the neck, cut through the truss rod, and simply reglued the neck to the fingerboard (no wonder the last repair lasted only a few days or weeks!)
Our recent luthier is actually more of a guitar person and the certified Martin tech in our area. He says that while he would attempt to make a neck for this mandolin, the Gibson dovetail joint includes a concave angle (excuse me if I don't get this terminology exactly right) that he's not entirely comfortable cutting. My musical partner is very attached to his old mandolin and doesn't want to accept a substitute. So... I'm looking for options here and will number my questions below.
I've found a dealer in necks, but they only sell A-5 necks and I've been told an A-5 neck will not fit an A-50. (Question 1) Will an A-5 neck fit an A-50?
(Question 2) If so, are there concerns that I should be aware of in buying a new neck with a pre-cut dovetail?
(Question 3) If an A-5 neck will not fit an A-50, are any of you aware of a place where a person could purchase a replacement neck for an A-50? I've been told that Gibson may be out of our price range and has been known to ask for about as much as you could purchase a new A model for.
(Question 4) If I can't purchase a new replacement and am forced to look for a vintage replacement, will any other vintage necks (A-50, A-40, A-00, etc...) fit this model?

My buddy and I will appreciate any advice you can offer us. Best wishes,

Chris

[fishtownmike]

I would suggest maybe contacting Gibson repair department. You can contact them through their site. they may be able to save this or replace the neck entirely. ..Mike
http://www.gibson.com/en-us/Lifestyl...ndRestoration/

[Michael Lewis]

It is probably possible to reattach the dovetail or make a new one to attach to the neck. This way the original neck is retained. This would be a somewhat smaller job than making a new neck.

Where are you located? Maybe we can recommend someone close by.

[mandroid]

Since truss rod , you say was cut, the fingerboard will have to come off, anyhow, so once that is off, rebuilding another dovetail combination, in neck and body, will be a clearer job , to see what has to be done..

Recalling we had a discussion on the Cherry cores on teens pre truss rod mandolin's necks a while ago , routing out a channel for another core of cherrywood for the dovetail replacement, would have historic precedence, at least.

[SmileyChris]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts, Fishtown Mike, Michael, and Mandroid,

Fishtown Mike, I may be forced to go to Gibson, but I'm concerned that that would be my most expensive alternative. It could be my best, but like getting a car worked on at the dealer, I've heard rumors that Gibson could be out of our price range.

Michael, we're in East Tennessee and I would appreciate hearing of someone else near me that might be able to do this without having to replace the neck. I do trust our luthier who has a great local and national reputation for guitars, but who mentioned himself that "mandolin guys" might have the specialized equipment necessary to cut the required dovetail joint. I have not yet seen the mandolin with the neck off, but I believe the combination of traditional dovetail and concave angles is what is making him nervous.

Mandroid, I'm not so sure we're looking to establish historic precedent here. Am I understanding you correctly to be saying that there's not a lot of wood to attach a new dovetail to once you account for the truss rod channel?

I appreciate all of you for responding and am looking forward to hearing more thoughts on this. I am still curious regarding some of my other questions from my original post that I'll include again below in this reply. Thanks again!

(Question 1) Will an A-5 neck fit an A-50?
(Question 2) If so, are there concerns that I should be aware of in buying a new neck with a pre-cut dovetail?
(Question 3) If an A-5 neck will not fit an A-50, are any of you aware of a place where a person could purchase a replacement neck for an A-50? I've been told that Gibson may be out of our price range and has been known to ask for about as much as you could purchase a new A model for.
(Question 4) If I can't purchase a new replacement and am forced to look for a vintage replacement, will any other vintage necks (A-50, A-40, A-00, etc...) fit this model?

[Gail Hester]

(Question 1) Will an A-5 neck fit an A-50?

No, they are different designs. Specifically, notice where the neck joins the body on the two models pictured.

(Question 2) If so, are there concerns that I should be aware of in buying a new neck with a pre-cut dovetail?

Yes, they all have to be fit, even if you were to find a reproduction A50 neck.

(Question 3) If an A-5 neck will not fit an A-50, are any of you aware of a place where a person could purchase a replacement neck for an A-50? I've been told that Gibson may be out of our price range and has been known to ask for about as much as you could purchase a new A model for.

I am not aware of any source for a pre-built A50 neck. Building a new neck is not a big deal however it is a lot of work with finishing and all. You may want to contact Big Joe's Guitar Works. They would do a great job. As far as it being economically feasible, that's a different matter as the repair will have a significant cost. Good A50s seem to be going in the $1200-$1500 range so your friend will be repairing the mandolin for the love of the instrument. The most cost effective repair would be to add wood and re-cut and fit the dovetail as others have said (this would be my first choice for the repair).


(Question 4) If I can't purchase a new replacement and am forced to look for a vintage replacement, will any other vintage necks (A-50, A-40, A-00, etc...) fit this model?

I would not think any neck but an A50 would fit. You may want to place a wanted add for a parted out A50 neck, who knows there may be one out there that will make the repair relatively easy (still a lot of work).

Good luck, I hope you are able to get the mandolin playable again.

[Big Joe]

The current neck may be repairable. If the original neck can be saved that is usually preferable. Without actually seeing it we cannot determine what exactly needs to be done. A neck can be built for it as well if that is needed. Building a neck and installing it is not the cheapest job on the planet, but certainly can be done. Whatever needs doing we can certainly do it and I am certain for a lot less money than the factory. They can do the job as well. However, they do not have necks and would have to build one from scratch just like the rest of us. In any case, your mandolin can be fixed. How much money and time can only be determined by physically seeing the instrument and goind over it carefully. Happy to help if we can.

[mandroid]

I was thinking to get a solid dovetail a joint between a lever , the neck , and the rest of the instrument , it needs a strong foundation.
a single piece of wood provided that, but that the dovetail, was flush cut off, as you say,
to make a good joint the more glue surface the merrier.

earlier someone showed that before truss rods were used there was a core of a hardwood , in the center of the nice looking Mahogany on the outside .

I have a 1921 A, it's been fine and straight , still is . no truss rod.

Proposed, a long tongue of a hardwood dovetail support structure, extending back into the neck for the glue joint surface and resisting the force of string pull. once the dovetail join to the body is made sound.

then after that join is solid the truss rod into it's channel can be replaced.

or at least that was my thoughts , it was late, so my linguistic clarity may have been reduced
from it's usual college dropout base level.

likely this is no clearer?


[lots of unseen gesturing and arm waving]

[j. condino]

Chris:

If you're in East Tennesee, I'm just up the hill in Asheville. Feel free to bring it by the shop and we can put it up on the operating table where you'll be able to see in detail all of the options folk are talking about here under the large maginifying lenses and with all the micrometers and calipers out. You'll also be able see a number of neck / body joint builds in process. I have pretty fond memories of an old A50 that I played when I was first getting started.

j.
www.condino.com

[Paul Hostetter]

Go see James.