fretboard length and size of frets

[Rick Back]

Like most new players, especially with small hands, I'm having some trouble reaching the G chop cord. I can reach on a 13 in. scale length but the low, old, narrow frets on my 1923 Martin seem to make it harder to get good tone than a 13 7/8 in. scale with larger frets because the small ones require more finger pressure. The action is actually lower on the Martin and both are strung with light gage strings.

Is this a common occurrence ? Would it be helpful to put larger frets on the smaller scale ?

Rick

[Dave Cohen]

Your 1923 Martin and a 13 7/8" scale mandolin with ff-holes are different types of mandolins, and that difference is responsible for most of the tonal differences between the two. The ff-hole type mandolin gives the characteristic percussive "chop chord" because the tonal characteristics of the chop chord are within its tonal capabilities, whereas they are not part of the tonal palette of most oval hole mandolins. I have heard a very few longer scale oval hole mandolins that would produce the characteristic chop chord, but most of them will not do so.

Having larger frets put on your 19223 Martin would make more difference in playing characteristics than in tonal ones. Whether or not you would like the difference is a matter of personal preference. If you have not already done so, consider playing a variety of mandolins with different size fretwire to ascertain whether or not you actually prefer the playing characteristics of the larger fretwire.

I built one ff-hole type mandolin with a short scale, ca 13 1/16". It is a very nice sounding box, currently residing in Atlanta, and is very capable of producing chop chords despite the shorter scale length. What gives it that capability is the ff-holes (well, sorta ff-holes). The fretwire on that mandolin is the smaller 0.053" width.

http://www.Cohenmando.com

[Rick Back]

Thanks, Dave. Perhaps I didn't elaborate very well.
When I said tone, I really meant that some of the courses are misfretted, giving a poor chord sound. The 13 7/8 scale is on an oval hole A. The frets on the Martin are the original square ones and are 0.038 in. wide. The larger frets are oval and are 0.077 in. wide. It seems that the narrow frets require more finger pressure, causing my fingers to slip, especially on the 4th course. I actually think the larger are easier and more comfortable. That being said, they are the original and so I have some reservation to mess with them.

Rick

[Dave Cohen]

At 0.038" width, you may be looking at bar frets, instead of modern fretwire with a bead above the fretboard and a tang with studs on it in the slot. The modern fretwire is made for slots about 0.023" in width, whereas the bar frets (if that is indeed what you have) is a constant 0.038" (or whatever) width, both above and below the slot. That means that in order to have the mandolin refretted with modern fretwire, you would have to have the fingerboard replaced as well. Another possibility, though, would be to have the bar frets dressed and re-crowned. That would leave the frets with rounded tops, and might improve intonation a bit. I refretted a Neapolitan with 0.040" width bar frets a year or so ago, and crowned the frets with a re-crowning file. That made them easier to slide over, less of an obstacle to the fingers. I don't recall that mandolin being difficult to fret of play in any way. I don't see how the narrower frets should need more pressure to fret. You may very well like the feel of wider frets better, though. But if the frets on your Martin are actually bar frets, refretting with wider frets would not be a trivial job.

http://www.Cohenmando.com

[Daniel Nestlerode]

If you're having trouble reaching the G chop (7532) then the likely culprits are technique and/or action rather than the frets themselves.

To find out if it's technique, have a look at this video. Between about 1:40 and 2:40, Mike Marshall demonstrates good left hand technique.

It seems counter-intuitive, but when you try it you know MM is right. Don't approach the mandolin with your left hand as though you were playing a small guitar. Keeping your fingers at an angle to the strings rather than perpendicular to the strings will give your pinky a little more strength to reach that 7th fret D note.



Daniel

[Rick Back]

Yes, they are bar frets and I hadn't thought about the difference in slot width. And I think you are right . I like the feel of the wider frets. Thanks for your help.

Rick

[Rick Back]

That video has already helped me improve the angle but MM is worth looking at for a good reminder. I agree that my technique could improve. Thanks Daniel.

Rick