Disappointed in the Loar Mandolins

[Life Is Good]

Personally I think it is the lack of tone bars. I would not buy a mandolin without tone bars or transverse bracing.

[Elliot Luber]

A new mandolin just shouldn't be cracking.

[Mandolin Mick]

Bobbyburns-

I read your posts and then looked to see where you're from

In this neck of the woods you would be hard pressed to find a mandolin that's worth more than $200 in stores.

I've never bought a mandolin that I've played first. If I did, I'd have to take my vacation for it. The Classifieds here are a wonderful place to find quality instruments.

You apologized, and also acknowledged that not everybody lives in an area where you can check out a lot of mandolins before you buy one. I just wanted to confirm that.

[tburcham]

Dave,

I'm sorry you've had a bad experience with your The Loar mandolin. My experience was quite the opposite, as mine performed flawlessly and was as stable in various temperature regimes as any of my American made instruments. I've also had a KM-1000 and they are great mandolins as well.

The good news on this thread is that your dealer made your situation "right".

[Jim MacDaniel]

Ok guys, I apologized for that comment right up front, then I told of my experience with this company. I really have seen several instances where someone was selling the seconds off as first quality instruments...

It would have been better form to simply delete the comment before saving your post, and just sticking with your experience with the company. Leaving the offending comment in your post, and then apologizing immediately reeks of insincerity, since it seems you were more concerned with making a point about on-line retailers than not offending the OP.

[clarksavage]

I had a similar experience with my first purchase-by-internet Eastman about two years back. I got a higher end Eastman from a noted dealer in Tenneessee and the fretboard had a "hump" near the body to the top side, it caused some buzzing and dulling of the strings as played. My dealer believed it was shipping related and I ate the shipping. I really couldn't play that thing and have not been well disposed to the brand since, it was an obvious problem that I would rather have had QC people find and fix before I paid shipping.

Over time, I do engage my intellect to tell me that really, one bad one in a bunch (that I am lucky enough to pull out of the had) says nothing about the whole brand. But, I do have a visceral response when I see the name "Eastman" .... I must be Pavlov's mandolin player!

Clark

[Paul Hostetter]

Clark, I recall you had a heckuva go-round with that Martin dreadnought a few years ago. And it was not made in China!

I'm trying to fathom the humidity adjustments an instrument would have to endure in Indiana in the summer. Too much heat, perhaps? This is not like shipping in the dead of winter.

I contacted my online dealer and explained the problem to him and I was told I was the second one with a 700 model this month that has developed a top crack in the SAME place. I was told this month alone, he has had 2 700s and 1 300 develop top cracks.

Where were these instruments between the time they left California and the time at least one of them arrived in Indiana? New Mexico? The Atacama Desert? I'd be looking real hard at the dealer, not the brand. As already suggested by Burns, I'd also be looking into whether these were seconds from the get-go.

[Mandoist]

@Mandoist, Don't be like that And especially don't knock em' till you played em'.

dkinyon31 Agree with you Timleo about the comment by Mandoist. Some of us can only afford the less expensive mandolins!

FWIW...
Timleo: I love playing and investigating all new lines of instruments when they come on the scene (and sometimes before they are on the market). I have played many of the faux Loars. I personally think they make better guitars. But none of these 'Loar' imports "sing out" to me. Companies like this one can thank their lucky corporate stars that people have different tastes and varied tone producers in their respective ears.

2) dkinyon31: Nothing wrong with "less expensive" -- but these days I don't believe anyone has to settle for less in order to own a quality instrument they can afford.

[devilsbox]

Ouch!

[AKmusic]

I am very pleased with my LM-700. No problems. No regrets. I don'at think I could have bought a better mandolin for the money.

I had a KM-1000, but not long. I'm not saying that it was a perfect example of all KM-1000's, but this LM-700VS is the better of the 2 that I've owned.

[dkinyon31]

AKmusic, I am happy you have had a positive experience with your 700 Loar. Members of my family have had the same positive experiences with Kentuckys. I had no problems with my Kentucky 505. The Loars are beautiful instruments and sound great, I agree.
Dave

[Rodney Riley]

I bought a new Martin DM guitar in 2003 from the Guitar Center. Top started splitting on it within 2 months. Took it to a Martin certified tech who glued it and set the action for me. Split has not moved since. It's wood, too many variables with it. Probably some of the top builders have had this happen. As for three with the same dealer. All three made from wood from the same defective tree? Stranger things have happened.

[Perry Babasin]

Expensive instruments develop cracks given the wrong climate and humidity situation. I have a Martin HD-28 (sounds fantastic BTW) built in '89. It developed a 7" crack in the middle of the top, I had it repaired and it still sounds fantastic and plays like butter...

Just a thought but I wonder if the lack of tone bars has anything to do with the increased risk of stress cracks. The 600 is close to being the same instrument with tone bars. That's the one I think I might buy as a back-up instrument.

[chris scott]

i think that the dealer was quick to accept the return off the mando is actually a positive review for the dealer and the Loar brand. I am sure that the loar maker will make good with the dealer just as your dealer did with you. so if it were me I would give them both a thumbs up. just my 2 cents, Chris.

[Mando Smash]

I ordered a Loar LM 600 from JDMC and when I opened it up I was completely disappointed. I sent it back immediately! The finish had a weird strip pealing on the front and the tuners where not quality.

[Clement Barrera-Ng]

The finish had a weird strip pealing on the front and the tuners where not quality.

Interesting... Here's what my 600 looks like on the front:



Is the one your received different from that?

I happen to be a fan of the Loar mandolins (inspite of the poor choice of brand name). I play my 400 every day and in a band, and I am still pleased and impressed by how much I get out of that little thing each time I play it, esp. considering how affordable this little bugger is. But I digress.

Without taking away from the OP and his experience with his 700, I just like to add a few obvious observations that I have:

• These are all mass produced instruments, so it is to be expected that once in a while defects do crop up
• If you receive an instrument that has some obvious problems out of the box, don't blame the manufacturer. Rather, ask yourself why your dealer would send you something that is clearly sub-par and take your money for it
• The original Loar mandolins are simply magical and can't be duplicated. There is a reason why they cost $100K+. To say that these new import Loars are poor copies of the real thing and therefore lacks any inherent value in and of itself, is probably comparing apples to oranges, to put it mildly
• These new Loar mandolins are not exactly staple at every music stores in cities and towns across the country, and I doubt very few people (aside from those lucky enough to live near Robert F's, Dennis' and Big Joe's stores) can actually play one before ordering. But as one poster already said before - we are thankful to all the dealers and TML for being readily available to remedy any issues whenever they pop up. That's what make buying online a far less risky proposition these days.

[Mando Smash]

Yea. I guess I just got a bad one. I ended up sticking with an Eastman 815V. Which I rarely let a day go by without playing it.

[AKmusic]

For the record - I bought a Collings D2H back in 2005. About 2 years later -the top developed a crack from behind the bridge to the tail block. Ugly mess. I sent it back to Collings, they repaired it (I paid for the repairs and shipping). Less than a year later, it cracked again - right beside the first one - again from the bridge to the tail block. I had it repaired by a local luthier this time. Humidity problems? Perhaps, but I have not had any cracks develope in any of my other instruments in the house (I do have a few). And after getting the Collings back after the first repair, you can bet I made sure the case was humidified. Now, I'm no longer "anal" about it. If it cracks again - I'll just live with the crack. Guitar sounds too good to even consider selling it because it has a crack. I'm not all tied up knots over the way it "looks".

You ought to see how many cracks are in my old KG-14 - both top and bottom. Bought it that way. But it has a home for life too - same reason.

Just saying - stuff happens. Even when it comes to instruments from quality builders. I don't think was is a design flaw (lack of bracing or tone bars, etc) or even a construction flaw (the way it was put together), as much as it was a plate that got used with that had inherent stresses that weren't recognized when it was selected. That doesn't say or even imply that all of them will have the same issues.

I'm sure sorry to hear about the bad news though. I do understand your disappointment. I'm going to temper my comments about the KM-1000 I sent back over issues for the same reason. Like I said before, I know that it wasn't an example of their best work. Some of the Kentucky have been very nice indeed. That's why I bought it first. I'm sorry it didn't work out. But I'm glad the Loar is working out (so far).

[Earlyman67]

this is the first time someone was unhappy with a loar mando that I have seen here. Seems to me a one off problem. Pretty sure Ford has a few problem cars now and then. Does that make them a bad car producing company? If the dealer sent a replacement, pretty sure this thread would have never been posted here and there would have been another happy Loar owner.

[Aisha]

In an ideal world never buy an instrument without trying it before, but in an ideal world everything would be available everywhere (nearby ).

I bought my Loar 700VS online and without trying it simply because where I live the only mandolins you find are basically the Italian type ones and if you're lucky you'll find two models of Chinese/Korean A and F styles cheap ones (which are here too expensive for what they are anyway). I'd have had to drive more than 6 hours to try a Loar (or as said above, take a vacation )...

Now, before ordering, I knew what I was looking for (a good quality/good price instrument, knowing it would not be the top of the tops and knowing I didn't need the top of the tops). First thing I did: a search on the Internet (which led me to among others this forum )), read many different opinions and reviews, checked The Loar site, well I took as much information as I could. Then I thought that The Loar 700 might make me happy. I also read carefully the general conditions of the online Music store I was planning to order from (a big European one), and then I took the risk of being disappointed and ordered. One thing I was not happy with was that the store refused to set it up for me before sending it, so it was like buying a non-food item at a supermarket. But ok, no matter the reason I could return it within 30 days should I not like it.

I didn't have to. When I received my mandolin I was very happy with how it looked and the way it sounded -this said I admit I had not much to compare with, only my first Korean "cheap" one. With only the factory settings there was a slight buzzing noise on 2 frets (G string only), which worried me at first, but (after good advice from Big Joe) I changed the strings and now, even if I'm sure it could sound even better (according to what I read here ), I really like it.

All this to say I think there's no good or bad way to buy an instrument, the most important is to know what to expect for what you pay and last but not least, where you buy.

[Eric Hanson]

NFI
Just for those who might be interested in a great shop in Southern IN.
In Nashville, IN there is a nice little shop not known by too many. It is called "The Weed Patch Music Company".
It has a number of really nice instruments made by local area Luthiers, and also a few imports.
I tried out three "The Loars" a couple of days ago. They had a LM-700, an LM-600, and if my memory serves me right, an LM-500.
Although the 700 had a higher price tag and nicer head-stock inlay, the LM-600 was louder and had more of the deep woody sound we hear so much of here on the Cafe. A real nice surprise. It was set up well and played easily. A man I know who "knows" mandolins said he even thought of purchasing the mandolin, just because it sounded so good. He didn't. But it was quite telling to me that he thought hard about it.
The staff is pretty knowledgeable and very helpful. I am sure they would provide shipping if asked and would work with you if contacted.
I have NFI in this. I would just hate to see a great little shop not get recognition, and maybe even some traffic from those of us who live in Indiana.

http://www.weedpatchmusiccompany.com/

[Ed Goist]

...snip...Now, I'm no longer "anal" about it. If it cracks again - I'll just live with the crack. Guitar sounds too good to even consider selling it because it has a crack. I'm not all tied up knots over the way it "looks"....snip...

Good philosophy! Seem to work pretty well for this guy, and for this guy as well.

[Dick Hutchings]

The first one I built has a crack from the bridge to tail piece on the bass side where I got the wood a little thin. It still sounds great and I keep playing it like it is until I finish the 2 I'm working on. Then I might fix the crack.

[Andy Fielding]

I researched over and over and finally decided on Jeff Cowherd's JBOVIER! I spoke to him and wrote emails back and forth, and finally decided on the Tradition Antique satin finish. To say I'm not dissapointed is an understatement. I love this thing. Everywhere I've played people comment on the ease of play, loudness and tone. I played it next to a $3000 Breedlove and there was not much difference at all or if any between it and my JBOVIER. Lucky??? I guess, but research helped too...

I just love the JBovier F5Z I bought from Rob here on the Cafe. You can hear him play it in this YouTube video, and I'll tell you, it sounds even better in person.

The only tricky thing is finding an excuse to show people the zebrawood back and sides, which are quite pretty (not to mention, distinctive!). It's obvious that this unusual wood Jeff used had a special influence on the sound, too.

[Adam Sweet]

I am very disappointed in the Loar Mandolins. (

Agreed. I've had nothing but bad experiences with them. I've had several come in as trade-ins through my little studio. I also see them regularly listed in my Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/mandoworks/, in fact there's one listed there now.

That said, they are similar to other mid-priced factory made acoustic instruments. I've visited the factory that makes Michael Kelly, Bean Blossom and Fender instruments and you know the workers that do the bulk of the handwork are not trained luthiers. They are not mandolin makers. They are average chinese workers that are showed how to do one or two things, then they do them over and over and over, hundreds of times a day. It's about muscle memory, not skill.

My main complaint about the instruments I've seen in China is for the most part they are made with poor quality materials: tonewood, fretwire, etc. The tonewood is usually of poor origin and kiln-dried (they put the billets in a garage with a furnace and close the doors for a couple of weeks to dry out the wood. That's the source of your cracking, OP.