Is it the real?!?

[JEStanek]

Mandograss (and others), please remember that this forum is a nurturing environment and that trolling for its own sake tells us as much about you as it adds to the subject being discussed. Ask yourself, what do comments like that serve? I would suggest you review the first of our Guidelines, once again.

Jamie

[Elliot Luber]

+1 I for one completely understand his reluctance to post a picture of this treasure. If I had $225,000.00 laying around the house I don't think I would broadcast it to the world. I am satisfied that Cliff indeed had at least one if not two Loars and it has been fun reading about a great builder who I unfortunately never had a chance to meet.

All my best to the family and a big thanks for all that shared their stories of Cliff. His spirit will live on through his creations and a little mystery is always a good thing. My guess is one day we will see his Loar(s) pop up on one of the sites for sale and then we will know for sure. I am satisfied until that time.

The silence is both deafening and telling. He was left a real legacy... and a few nice mandolins too!

[Nelson Peddycoart]

Blindboy,

Even if you have a real (or two real) Loars in your possession, it sounds to me like the most prized possession is the friendship and memory of Mr. Sargent. He sounds like the kinda fella I'd like to sit down and spend a little time talking with.

Nelson

[craigw]

Just to set the record straight, I located the ctscan images of Cliff's Loar and lo and behold, there is evidence that it possessed a Virzi. It's been a few years since I looked at them and I just didn't remember it having the Virzi.

[mandolirius]

+1 I for one completely understand his reluctance to post a picture of this treasure. If I had $225,000.00 laying around the house I don't think I would broadcast it to the world.

I don't understand. He has already "broadcast to the world" (although that seems a bit overblown) that he has the mandolin. What difference is a picture going to make, assuming it's not going to be accompanied by his name and address. This just seems like groundless paranoia.

It also makes me wonder about the nature of forums like this. I don't think it should be a matter of coming here to get what you want, with minimal input, and not really participate. The OP would surely have known that many forum users would be very interested in this and refusing to post a picture or participate in the discussion strikes me as rather selfish.

[mandolirius]

Mandograss (and others), please remember that this forum is a nurturing environment and that trolling for its own sake tells us as much about you as it adds to the subject being discussed. Ask yourself, what do comments like that serve? I would suggest you review the first of our Guidelines, once again.

Jamie

His joke was about a certain attention-seeking poster and, as such, was fair comment, imo.

[blindboy]

I don't understand. He has already "broadcast to the world" (although that seems a bit overblown) that he has the mandolin. What difference is a picture going to make, assuming it's not going to be accompanied by his name and address. This just seems like groundless paranoia.

It also makes me wonder about the nature of forums like this. I don't think it should be a matter of coming here to get what you want, with minimal input, and not really participate. The OP would surely have known that many forum users would be very interested in this and refusing to post a picture or participate in the discussion strikes me as rather selfish.

Holy Cow! I never would have thought an innocent/friendly post on this site would cause such a ruckus. I simply posted to get general feedback, even looking to keep names out of it. I then figured maybe if I offered up a name, maybe those that knew Cliff and had seen, held and played his mandolins would chime in. To be completely honest when I saw some reaction wasn't what I really wanted, nor intended I decided to graciously bow out. I never intended to be 'selfish' or anything along those lines, I simply decided to seek advice through other means and considered the thought that Cliff may not have liked it either. I love this site, the mandolin and bluegrass(and of course the people, which started with Cliff).

Apologies and thanks to all that offered up friendly and sound advice.

[George R. Lane]

Blindboy,
I understand and agree with you.
Sometimes folks here get a little riled up at the mention of a Loar.
Best of luck to you.

[barney 59]

It's simple, we are selfish! We want the eye candy! WE WANT THE EYE CANDY! Aw ..... come on, give us the eye candy!

[mandolirius]

Holy Cow! I never would have thought an innocent/friendly post on this site would cause such a ruckus. I simply posted to get general feedback, even looking to keep names out of it. I then figured maybe if I offered up a name, maybe those that knew Cliff and had seen, held and played his mandolins would chime in. To be completely honest when I saw some reaction wasn't what I really wanted, nor intended I decided to graciously bow out. I never intended to be 'selfish' or anything along those lines, I simply decided to seek advice through other means and considered the thought that Cliff may not have liked it either. I love this site, the mandolin and bluegrass(and of course the people, which started with Cliff).

Apologies and thanks to all that offered up friendly and sound advice.

I understand a bit better after this post. I'm really not sure where this thread went off the rails for you or what you expected might happen on an open public forum but I appreciate you weren't trying to be selfish, just jumped in and found the water not to you're liking. I certainly meant no insult to you personally but was commenting on forums and their usage, in a general way.

[f5loar]

At least let us drool over a full back shot if it's real or not! We already know you can post a photo. If you go back to the first post of asking is it real or not, we felt you wanted an honest answer. We in turn said no problem but you at least need to post a few photos to get an answer to your question. After 60 posts your answer has not been gotten from us. If you turned to outside sources for authentication that's great but why leave us hanging in the sidelines here? It's no secret now that Cliff had at least one Loar and likely 2 Loars. I personally only knew of his Feb. 18, 1924 F5 Loar.

[woodwizard]

[Ivan Kelsall]

However good the intentions & advice of the 'experts' on here,you still need to get he instrument verified as a Loar or not,if for nothing else,your own information & realisation of the instrument's value for insurance etc. No amount of educated 'guessing' is going to get it done,even by the experts,
Best wishes - Ivan

[P.D. Kirby]

I don't understand. He has already "broadcast to the world" (although that seems a bit overblown) that he has the mandolin. What difference is a picture going to make, assuming it's not going to be accompanied by his name and address. This just seems like groundless paranoia.

Groundless Paranoia? I think not, anyone who thinks that they are hiding behind the perceived anonymity of the web should do a little research. Even the lesser gifted hackers can back trace anything you put on the web right to your front door. There are many software packages commercially available to do just that. The more sophisticated hackers do this all the time, just remember there is no anonymity on the web. Just read the newspaper about how the FBI, CIA, and NSA track posts right back to the street, house and very computer that posted it and for what it's worth the really good hackers don't work for the government. A $225,000.00 payday can attract all kinds of attention and more often than not, the kind you don't want.
Just Sayin

[Rick Cadger]

Did some posts get deleted from this thread?

[MikeEdgerton]

Groundless Paranoia? I think not, anyone who thinks that they are hiding behind the perceived anonymity of the web should do a little research. Even the lesser gifted hackers can back trace anything you put on the web right to your front door.....

I've been in the industry a long time, take my word for it, hackers would rather steal your money via the web than travel to your house and steal anything. It's a better return with less risk.

[f5loar]

I don't see any missing or removed posts. All numbers accounted for.

[allenhopkins]

Did some posts get deleted from this thread?

Yeah, a "slam" was posted and then removed; you can still read it in quotes, if you want to, and Jamie's admonishment as well. Nothin' to see here, folks, keep movin'...

[Jeff Budz]

IMO the "Slam" was funny...

[barney 59]

Groundless Paranoia? I think not, anyone who thinks that they are hiding behind the perceived anonymity of the web should do a little research. Even the lesser gifted hackers can back trace anything you put on the web right to your front door. There are many software packages commercially available to do just that. The more sophisticated hackers do this all the time, just remember there is no anonymity on the web. Just read the newspaper about how the FBI, CIA, and NSA track posts right back to the street, house and very computer that posted it and for what it's worth the really good hackers don't work for the government. A $225,000.00 payday can attract all kinds of attention and more often than not, the kind you don't want.
Just Sayin

But the damage is already done. He's announced to the world that he has it (if he has) and everything that someone would need to hack into his identity is already in place or at least wouldn't be more in place from his posting a photo. I have to question whether or not it is in his possession at all. Maybe he wants it to be but hasn't worked out the details as yet. He was pretty good at posting pictures of other stuff but not the Loar. Was there ever a serial # offered?

[bernabe]

Wow. Ya dont read stuff like this here everyday. Or anywhere.

[pjlama]

Please stop...

[f5loar]

I now recall that Cliff's Feb. 18, 1924 Loar with Virzi was purchased at Gryphon Music in 1987. This same Loar was sold in 2007 for about $170,000. I'm not aware of any other Loars that Cliff owned included the supposedly 1922 F5. I think that is a date misprint in the article posted here and they meant to say it was a 1924. Although I only meet Cliff very briefly once in my lifetime he may have had a closet full of original Loars. He only showed me one and this is the one that was sold in 2007. It seems the OP does not want us drooling over photos of Cliff's fake Loars as those photos have been removed. I do have photos of Cliff's '24 Loar but since the cafe changed the way photos are posted I've not been able to post any more photos.

[barney 59]

This is all fascinating! I wonder if the widow Cliff or whoever is next in line knows that there are possible genuine Loars mixed in with a pile of reproductions?

[MikeEdgerton]

This is all fascinating! I wonder if the widow Cliff or whoever is next in line knows that there are possible genuine Loars mixed in with a pile of reproductions?

I'm going to hazard a guess that at least two of them do, yes.