Irish Traditional Tune Recordings to Learn by Ear From

[abuteague]

This is a call for help.

So I'm taking lessons and learning tunes by ear from recordings and it is going well, but I'd like some suggestions of some more tunes to learn. I don't just want a tune name however. I want a tune that was played on mandolin and recorded and made available so I can purchase it and learn it. The mandolin should be the lead instrument because I'm also learning ornamentation and technique. Also, they should be tunes I'll hear other people playing too. You know, traditional tunes instead of one of Celtic inspired tunes and not traditional tunes turned into Jazz. If you have a whole album to recommend, so much the better.

I'm not quite sure why this should be a challenge. I guess my search terms are just failing me this time.

[ptritz]

Mick Moloney's "Strings Attached" would be one good one to listen to. A lot of it is tenor banjo, but he has several tracks of mandolin. Marla Fibish's new recording (which I admittedly haven't actually heard yet) would be another. Roger Landes's "Dragon Reels" would also be a good source. Even though he's mostly playing cittern on it, much of the technique is similar.

[JeffD]

Hmmm. Hard to find I would imagine. Most every Irish tune I have learned from a recording was a fiddle. Kevin Burke, Johnny Cunningham, and Michael Coleman recordings probably acount for 60%, the rest being stuff I recorded at sessions and jams.

I am startled myself to realize that of all the Irish trad music I play and have played I don't think I have a single recording of mandolin.

[draino]

David Surrette's The Green Mandolin is a good album.

Check out Homespun Tapes 121 Irish tune book -- not mandolin, but pennywhistle. A nice entre into learning tunes by ear. And then there are also the Foinn Seisiun collections. Again, not mandolin, but available on iTunes, and a whole lotta tunes for a very little bit o' money.

[Paul Cowham]

Have you seen thefree resource of MP3's on the cafe:
http://www.mandolincafe.com/mp3/
the tunes on it are probably not that mainstream by and large but it has examples from albums by mandolinists which could be what you are after.

This thread lists the more common tunes so you could see if any of these are included on the albums sampled in teh Mp3 page.
http://www.mandolincafe.com/forum/sh...sh-Tune-Survey

I would also suggest not just limiting this to mandolin music as there is far more "celtic" music available not played by mandolins

good luck and enjoy it

[abuteague]

Thanks for the suggestions.

Fiddle is OK for the most part. Whistle and flute throw me. I just have a more difficult time finding those notes. I haven't tried listening to tenor banjo though. That would probably work just fine. I've ordered Marla's latest and it isn't in hand yet.

David Surrette's green mandolin has a couple tunes that the mandolin can be heard as clean and clear as a green field under a blue sky: http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/davidsurette2. I'll probably choose a couple tunes from his album. Thanks draino. This is useful.

In learning to learn by ear, choosing good tunes that are crisp can clean with recognizable key signatures and standard tunings and no capos really help.

Thanks.

[abuteague]

http://www.amazon.com/Strings-Attach.../dp/B000005CMB Mick Moloney also is a great suggestion. Thanks ptritz.

I'm self taught with 17 years of learning from books and standard notation. In learning to learn by ear, I'm trying to keep it focused, simple, and structured. Don't worry, I'll branch out gradually. I'm doing 5 months of lessons where I learn Irish tunes exclusively by ear. After that, I'll be on my own. I'll try to apply what I have learned to lots of other stuff. As soon as I have the learn-by-ear tool calibrated and ready for use, it will be employed whenever I want to learn a new tune regardless of genre.

[Jill McAuley]

Firstly I would echo the thoughts someone else has already shared on this thread re: don't limit yourself to listening to "mandolin" only recordings - the mandolin is quite new to traditional music so a) you're only going to find a handful of irish trad recordings featuring mandolin and b) in the time that I've been playing both tenor banjo and mandolin, one of the common mantras I've heard recited at workshops given by established, well respected trad players is to listen to as much trad played on other instruments as well, because that's where you'll really get ideas for phrasing and ornamentation. At a tenor banjo workshop given by Kieran Hanrahan a few years back he was suggesting we all listen to fiddlers and the pipes rather than just listening to a bunch of other tenor players. At a recent mandolin workshop given by Marla Fibish she suggested listening to flute players because what with the flute being a wind instrument and the player needing to take breathes at opportune times in a tune, which immediately colours how and where flautists place emphasis etc.

Here's a great link with a wealth of tunes for learning, played both at speed, and then slowed down:

Riley School of Irish Music

I learn tunes mainly by ear and sometimes via ABC's, but more and more I'm finding the ABC's I source to be inaccurate so I just bin them and go back to learning the tune by ear.

Cheers,
Jill

[draino]

As someone who also struggles w/ learning tunes by ear, I understand and applaud your efforts. I will say that as an entre into learning how to learn non-mando tunes by ear, the 121 Irish Tunes book by Homespun is really good (I know, I already said that):

(1) On the audio CDs, the song is introduced by both its title and its key -- that gives me a place to start from.

(2) What little accompaniment there is is really, really subtle, and also easily panned out (its in one channel only).

The tunes are played once at a fairly slow pace and once at a moderate pace with more ornamentation thrown in. So if you need something to bridge you across from learning mandolin tunes to learning from other instruments, I would really recomment it.

[abuteague]

Thanks everyone. I'll have to report back how my experiment goes.

[EdSherry]

I'd recommend Marla Fibish's two recordings, with Three Mile Stone and with Jimmy Crowley. Lovely Irish mando playing. (NFI.)

[Eddie Sheehy]

Check out Jill McAuley's Youtube channel...

[abuteague]

I have the Three Mile Stone CD and the new one with Jimmy Crowley called "the Morning Star" is on order. I second your enthusiasm for Marla's playing.



And Jill is an inspiration...
http://www.youtube.com/user/bikemutt?feature=mhum

[Jim MacDaniel]

I'd recommend Marla Fibish's two recordings, with Three Mile Stone and with Jimmy Crowley. Lovely Irish mando playing. (NFI.)

Here's also a taste of Marla's work with Three Mile Stone...



...and in a session:

[Jill McAuley]

Great clips Jim, thanks for posting those - I'm fairly sure I was at that Julie's performance in the first clip as well!

Cheers,
Jill

[Jim MacDaniel]

I really love that vid from Julie's -- and I enjoyed your YT channel linked in your sig as well.

Regarding the Marla session vid, I found a few others from the annual Lark in the Morning camps posted by the same guy, a couple others with Marla in 2006, and from other years without her as well. As evidenced by them, there appear to be some high quality sessions up there in Mendocino each year.

[CelticDude]

Simon Mayer's "New Celtic Mandolin" is a good CD, with some great arrangements. It even comes with a companion book, if "learning by ear" needs a little help...

[zookster]

I'll agree with the Marla Fibish recordings. Good listening. A lot of the Boys of the Lough albums have some fine mandolin work by Dave Richardson. Also check out Andy Irvine's mandolin work.

Mandolin still is an uncommon session instrument, probably more because of lack of volume than a lack of players.

Interesting comments about learning by ear, and being influenced by other instruments. I would not recommend listening exclusively to mandolin artists. You can develop a real appreciation for ornamentation by studying other instruments in Irish music. The great Michael Coleman, when asked about his influences growing up, didn't cite other fiddlers. He mentioned pipers and flute players, which are the dominant instruments in the Sligo/Roscommon area where he was from. While fiddle is certainly now the mainstay of the music, the influence of the pipes has shaded fiddle styles a great deal, and in turn the music. I also enjoy listening to, and playing with, concertina players, both the Anglo and English variety.

[rjb]

I would recommend Seamus Creagh's Tunes for Practice, http://www.tunesforpractice.com , the CD is specifically designed to learn tunes from, it has a good selection of tunes that are beautifully played.

Richard

[steve V. johnson]

Dagger Gordon has a nice instruction book out with audio on CD, all about mandolin, with notes on ornaments, and some concentration on the difference between the bare tunes and tunes as ornamented. Kevin MacLeod & Alec Finn have a record with a zillion different mandolin-family instruments on it called "Polbain To Oranmore." Tim O'Brien's instructional piece from HomeSpun Tapes is not particularly irish nor Celtic, but I learned a good deal from it.

As folks have mentioned, in the Irish trad repertoire there aren't a whole lot of recordings with mandolin as the main melodic instrument. It seems to me that when folks learn from playing together in Irish sessions we learn to 'read' each other's instruments to some extent, and since the fiddle is a very, very predominant instrument, many of us get familiar with the
layout of GDAE, and with how ornaments are made there, in the process. And for ear training that's really practical in the
real world, prepare yourself to get used to getting tunes from fiddlers. Later on you will probably pick 'em up (along with
expressions, ornaments, accents) from pipers, box players, flutists... and so on.

Usually when folks search for one or another aspect of Irish, Scottish, Celitc, traditional musics, I think they find that the keywords change to players' names (or band names) that open doors to those aspects for which they're searching. And so folks have provided some good ones here: Simon Mayer, David Surette, Marla Fibish. Some other mandolin associations... Andy Irvine (who is very idiosyncratic, but tremendous to learn from), Dave Richardson with Boys of the Lough, the Fuchsia Band, Robin Bullock. Ged Foley, who's now known as a guitarist (see Patrick Street band) played mandolin with the Battlefield Band for a while...

The Three Mile Stone CD is one of the most wonderful records of Irish music made (IMO), and Marla's mandolin and mandola playing are stellar.

YouTube will be a great resource, as it is becoming for so many music teachers, in all sorts of music. Recently there was a video posted (here on the Cafe, I think, perhaps in this section) of Enda Scahill playing in a mandolin duet with ... ack ... [anomia] that luthier fellow from Dingle. It's a wonderful duet! Enda is best known as a tenor banjo player. That one should help.

You don't mention it, but in this music, playing with people is really essential to ear training, so I hope you have a few great sessions to attend, and perhaps join in, there in W. Mass. In the midwest we see quite a few mandolins in sessions, but they
aren't played all the time. Folks will start tunes with them, or accompany quiet tunes, slow reels/marches/jigs, songs, etc., with 'em, but it's true that they get put away when there are four fiddles and two or more boxes or pipers going.

I hope some of this ramble is useful... Enjoy,

stv

[Jim MacDaniel]

I would recommend Seamus Creagh's Tunes for Practice, http://www.tunesforpractice.com , the CD is specifically designed to learn tunes from, it has a good selection of tunes that are beautifully played.

Richard

Thanks for the link Richard; that's an interesting take on a repertoire-building CD:

"It is unique in that it is a purely auditory tutorial of a compilation of sets with introductions naming the tunes...This CD demonstrates that the oral tradition of passing on tunes is ongoing in Irish Traditional Music."

[abuteague]

Thanks everyone. This has been very interesting and useful for me.

Steve, I don't have a session to go to, but I do play Irish Traditional Music with others. We have harp, guitar, whistle, guitar, tenor banjo, guitar, harp, piano, cello, and mandolin. We sure could use a fiddler, but they seem to come and go. The leader doesn't have an ITM background, but there isn't a lack of music talent or intelligence. Sheet music is distributed and relied upon. When I'm handed sheet music, I struggle with it until I've heard the group play it a few times. So I heartily agree that playing with others develops your ear. There are a few sessions a couple hours away. I've not visited them yet. They seem to be VERY well attended. I might try it out in the next year or so. Saratoga NY at the Parting Glass might be one to go to.

So I've shared that I have difficulty mapping whistle notes to the mandolin fretboard and that fiddle is a bit easier, with mandolin being easier yet. I hear you that I should keep struggling with the whistle and add some pipes to the mix. Here is more... I seem to get most of the notes, but there are a few notes in every tune that I'm off by a third or fifth. When I learn the correct notes, it is a startling revelation. How could I have missed that? The culprits are usually on the e string. I wonder if this is unique to me or if others find the high notes slightly more difficult to interpret at speed.

[EdSherry]

There's also Dan Beimborn's lovely CDs, with lots of good up-front mando playing. I especially like his first CD "Shatter the Calm," and his second "Torch and Fire" is excellent too.

[Hessian]

I'm on the same mission as you and there are two online- sources I think are really helpfull: check youtube for "ptarmigan", he plays lovely tunes on a lovely Sobell- Mandolin. And then there is an irish- category on mel bays mandolin- session. It is really great for learning tunes by ear since one example is always played dead slow (but the reels are to much syncopated for my liking). Have fun!

[Jim MacDaniel]

BBC Radio 2's Virtual Session is another fun--and free--on-line resource. They have 20 sets of different types of tunes to play along with, and the dots are displayed on-screen if you need them for reference.