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Thread: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

  1. #1
    NY Naturalist BradKlein's Avatar
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    Default Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    Here's a nice one in the classified from Gryphon.

    I have a similar Style C, and this two point B looks like it's two-point, brother. Personally, I find the Gibson scale (which this has) much more satisfying to play in these L&H mandolins than the shorter violin scale.

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    No financial interest, and I haven't played this example. As for price, every L&H I've played has compared favorably to Gibson's top of the line teens A-4 models. In fit, finish, and tone. (different than Gibson teen A models.)

    And the 'long scale' examples seem to be scarcer than the short...
    Last edited by BradKlein; Aug-29-2022 at 8:28am.
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    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    Quote Originally Posted by BradKlein View Post
    Here's a nice one in the classified from Gryphon.

    I have a similar Style C, and this two point B looks like it's two-point, brother. Personally, I find the Gibson scale (which this has) much more satisfying to play in these L&H mandolins than the shorter violin scale.

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	temp.jpg 
Views:	122 
Size:	51.4 KB 
ID:	202958

    No financial interest, and I haven't played this example. As for price, every L&H I've played has compared favorably to Gibson's top of the line teens A-4 models. In fit, finish, and tone. (different than Gibson teen A models.)

    And the 'long scale' examples seem to be scarcer than the short...
    The long scale was made earlier. I have a long scale pro A and there were some problems with the necks on them. Not so much with the B's or C's. It was just that the A's had the scroll headstock routed out for the inset tuners which gave them a weak point in the neck to headstock area. I suppose the ones that survived might have only had lighter strings added. Mine was broken when I bought it for relatively (!) cheap and it sounded great while was playable but I already put lots of luthier dollars into it. Still, I would love to get it working again but I think it may need a whole new replacement neck. Oh well...

    In the meantime I have my later short-scale Washburn pro A and that one is in fine playable shape and is one of my main classical mandolins.
    Jim

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  3. #3
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    Default Re: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    The one at Gryphon is a very early one indeed-- note the serial number 67.
    These early ones had necks that were somewhat similar to Gibsons from the same period, perhaps a bit fuller in profile than later L & H's.
    Shortly after this one was made, they went to a slightly slimmer neck profile, with more of a "half broomstick" heel shape.

    I've played about a dozen B's, and the only one that was not a good strong instrument was one that had been poorly cared for. Carved L & H's were very consistent in tone and projection.

    I owned a long scale style B for 10 years. It was the most microphone friendly mandolin I ever owned.
    I'll bet a dollar that this is a good instrument.
    Last edited by rcc56; Aug-29-2022 at 6:22pm.

  4. #4
    Registered User Louise NM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    They have it listed as circa 1919, but with the low serial number I'd think it would have to be 1917.

  5. #5
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    Default Re: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    I do have a reference in a rather haphazardly done old book on Washburn that indicates that the carved mandolins were introduced in a 1917 catalog. With a serial number of 67, 1917 is a good guess.

    Or Frank Ford and Richard Johnston may have some information that we don't.
    If it's any help to anyone, I have a reference to a style C, #420, with an envelope addressed from a distributor to a music store in Ohio, postmarked September 6, 1922.

    I don't know of many catalogs for L & H and Washburn that we can pin down to an exact year. And L & H history after the late 1920's is a riddle with few concrete answers-- the short lived J.R. Stewart factory, the sale of the Washburn name to Tonk Brothers, manufacturing by Regal, etc. We're not even sure exactly when Washburn production stopped.

    If something wasn't made by Martin, or Gibson during the times they used a letter in a factory order number to designate the year, we cant really be certain about the exact year of any old instrument.

    Our number lists for just about anyone else are just estimates, based on catalogs, a few old sales receipts, and a lot of extrapolation. For L & H, Vega, S.S. Stewart, and many others, most of the dates we give are approximations +/- a year or two.

  6. #6
    NY Naturalist BradKlein's Avatar
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    Default Re: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    As for the date of manufacture, My model C is number 113, and it wasn't purchased until 1919 (most probably). Y'all have reminded me, with your thoughtful comments, of this thread. (a favorite of mine over the years here at the Cafe)

    My instrument can be safely dated to a 1919 purchase date, thanks to the tailpiece cover engraving, but of course it could have been manufactured before. Still... a decent data point.

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    Registered User Louise NM's Avatar
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    Default Re: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    I have a Style B with a serial number in the 200s. It has the "patent applied for" on both the tailpiece and pick guard. I'm guessing it's from 1918. Mine also has the ivory/ivoroid plate on the heel like this one. Although L&H's serial numbers leave much to be desired, I don't think they ever started over.

  8. #8
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    Quote Originally Posted by Louise NM View Post
    I have a Style B with a serial number in the 200s. It has the "patent applied for" on both the tailpiece and pick guard. I'm guessing it's from 1918. Mine also has the ivory/ivoroid plate on the heel like this one. Although L&H's serial numbers leave much to be desired, I don't think they ever started over.
    According to Hubert’s book (p. 148), the numbering for mandolins started over a few times, in 1907, then again in 1922, then again in 1935. Maybe they did it to drive us crazy.
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    Full Grown and Cussin' brunello97's Avatar
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    Default Re: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Garber View Post
    According to Hubert’s book (p. 148), the numbering for mandolins started over a few times, in 1907, then again in 1922, then again in 1935. Maybe they did it to drive us crazy.
    Or maybe they lost count?

    Do those dates correspond with changes of ownership or management? L+H was going through them changes in ‘20s.

    Mick
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  10. #10
    Mando-Accumulator Jim Garber's Avatar
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    Default Re: Lyon & Healy long scale Style B

    Quote Originally Posted by brunello97 View Post
    Or maybe they lost count?

    Do those dates correspond with changes of ownership or management? L+H was going through them changes in ‘20s.

    Mick
    Here is another clue, especially relevant to our thread here (from that same page in the Hubert book):

    Serial numbers for the Lyon & Healy/Washburn A-C styles between 1917 and the mid 1920s are in the 1-2,300s range. Research data from surviving instruments suggests that Styles A-C were each numbered separately prior to 1925 and that Style A mandocellos and mandolas were also numbered separately from the standard A Style mandolins.
    Jim

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