Heartbroken!

[Wilbur Tabacsko]

Had an unfortunate accident yesterday. My latest work fell, hitting the concrete floor. Cracked the red cedar top from one end to the other. I am sick (an understatement). Looking for ideas to repair the top after I remove the back.

[Audio Artillery]

Bummer, that top looks beautiful. I like how varied the color and grain are. Looks like it split along a grain line, right? I guess that's possible w/ parallel bracing?

[Jim Ferguson]

So sorry to hear/see that Wilburlin..........no doubt extremely frustrating.......if there is any + from this it will be the experience you will gain from repairing that crack & it will make you that much more skilled at building & repairing mandos.......I wish you all the best.
Peace,

[JEStanek]

That is a big bummer. I'm sure one of the builders can offer clamping suggestions. It should be a salvageable fix but still a bummer.

Jamie

[Charles E.]

Here a link to a repair method we use on cello's mostly. It is very controllable. We use taller towers, similar to photo #5, and mini clamps, available from any hardware store.

http://www.hudelmayer.com/crack%20clamping.htm

Good luck.

[Jim Garber]

That is sad -- we always want things to be perfect. However, it was a two piece top and now it is a three-piece. That top would does look nice but with judicious repair it could be practically invisible from the top esp if you use a dark finish. Good luck. it looks like it will be a nice mandolin in any case.

[Rick Lindstrom]

What a wonderful repair method from the Hudelmayer site. If you're going to take the back off anyway, that looks like the way to go.

I didn't see it mentioned in a quick reading, but of course you remove the blocks after the crack is glued shut. I'd probably add several cross-grained cleats to reinforce the crack as well. Easy job if the back is off.

Actually, it occurs to me that if the top isn't finished yet, you could probably use the same method from the outside. Carefully remove the blocks, sand out the top, and you're good to go. Restain if you need to.

Good luck with the repair, and post some photos of the finished mando. Looks like it'll be a nice one.

Rick

[Rick Lindstrom]

Another thought-

Even if the top is finished, it might be less work to remove the top finish, glue the crack with the blocks outside, and then refinish the top once the repair is done.

Taking off a back and getting it back together properly is not a trivial task.

Rick

[Charles E.]

Rick, we use Tightbond to glue the towers, after they are cut down the glue washes right off. A lot of times we will clamp it up dry and just where we want it then glue in cleats across the joint. Then we thin the cleats to the point where they are flexable enough to open the crack and get some hot hide glue into it. Then we apply pressure to the clamps, insert the wedges, wash off the glue and set it aside.

[Wilbur Tabacsko]

Thanks for the replies, thanks for the link Charles, I am thinking about giving that method a try. I think Rick talked me into doing it from the outside. It only had a coat of sanding sealer on it. I need to call a friend who makes and repairs violins. Maybe he can help me. I had it strung up in the white and it had an unbelievable sound to it. (a keeper)

Wilbur

[Rob Grant]

Wilber,

FWIW: If the repair still stands out after you've closed and sealed the crack, consider a "black top." I recently did this with a spruce top that split from either end of one f hole. A nice looking black top finish wasn't that difficult to do and the instrument actually looks better then the natural top before the crack occurred.

[8ch(pl)]

Or Whiteface. it may be easier to get defects sanded out and hidden under a lighter finish. I would venture that White would be easier than Black.

[Jessbusenitz]

Can't help you on the fix part, but that's one sweet lookin' mando!

[Wilbur Tabacsko]

Called the violin maker tonight, he said to bring it up. He said he has done quite a few cracks, he he, and has everything I'll need.
Rob, my last one was a glossy black top. My first venture into a gloss finish. It turned out alright.
Here is a picture of the back, with a coat of sanding sealer on it. I really fell for this one. My best so far.

[billhay4]

I'd remove the top on this and replace it especially if this is going to a customer, but even if it isn't. Too major a crack for me. It will repair okay, but it would always worry me.
Bill

[bernabe]

If this is a new in-progress project, Id put another top on and move forward if it were me. Best of luck.

[Wilbur Tabacsko]

Yep, it is an in-progress project. My friend the violin maker insists that I take off the top to fix it. If I take off the top I'll definitely replace it with a new one. I have a piece of red cedar that Philstix sent me. It's been sitting on the shelf for quite a while, time to use it.

[Ivan Kelsall]

That's a dreadful thing to have happened to such a nice instrument. If you do take the top off & replace it with a new one,use the old one to try out the repair method that Charles E.outlined,simply to see if it works well enough to use the repaired top for another instrument - maybe a black top ?. It seems a shame to waste an opportunity to try such an excellent (IMHO), repair method,
Ivan

[Charles E.]

Wilbur, I think your best bet is to make a new top. It will take more time no doubt but that way it will be worry free.
If any one is interested in trying out the crack repair, you can get the special clamps from International Violin co.

http://www.internationalviolin.com/i...?ItemCode=T861

Wilbur, good luck and let us know how it works out.

[DerTiefster]

May not be the right place to put this question, but it's at least related: The top is a 2-piece top already glued down the centerline, a clean jointed surface with absolutely minimum surface area for gluing. The crack is (it would seem) an indication of the weakest portion of the wood, but it has now let go, is rough but matching on the two sides, and provides much more surface area for gluing than the centerline. Why, from a technical standpoint, is it not a stronger joint when re-made with appropriate glue than is the centerline joint? And if it is stronger than that centerline, why not use it? Possible answers include: 1) because it's damaged/repaired from at least an aesthetic view, 2) because the fact of the break means the wood isn't as strong as it looked like it was, 3) because the glue joint at the break -isn't- as strong as the centerline joint because the wood fibers were strained in an irrecoverable way when the crack occurred.

Thanks for any input here. The answers might possibly be of use to the O.P., too.

[Rick Lindstrom]

You're getting a lot of good advice here, and it's beginning to veer into conventional wisdom (replace the top).

If it were me, I'd try the Hudelmayer fix from the outside- it looks to be easy and won't take long to do. What have you got to lose? It might work spectacularly well, and given that it's a clean break that's never been glued (as a previous poster pointed out), the repair could be totally invisible and stronger than the surrounding wood. Plus the joint itself is as perfect as it could be.

Then, if it doesn't work or doesn't look right, you still have the option of a new top. Plus you will have gained experience in what looks to be a really cool repair technique.

Just sayin.....

Rick

[Wilbur Tabacsko]

I've been doing a lot of thinking after my last post. Why not do what Rick suggests, I've nothing to loose and a lot to gain.

DerTiefster...good points, my way of thinking.

All the replies are appreciated, thanks!



Wilbur

[Ken]

For whatever it's worth I had one of my mandolins crack the length of the body because of humidity issues (lack of humidity, my stupid, I had it at work and wasn't checking on it) anyhow I was able re-humidify it and glue up the crack and it's still holding up fine 12 years later. I refinished the mandolin at the same time and the glue joint is almost invisible, you have to know that it's there and really be looking for it to see it.
Ken

[Wilbur Tabacsko]

I got it glued. It's been really humid here lately and the humidity level dropped over the last few days. The top shrank a little bit and the crack went right back. I didn't do anything special. I managed to insert a couple of blades for my exacto knife into the crack, letting me get the glue (Titebond, I am not a master of hide glue yet) brushed into the crack. Removed the blades and used two of the long clamps that go across the top to hold it overnight. Sanded and restained, with a new coat of sanding sealer. I think I can live with this crack.

Thanks again for all the advice and info, what would I do without the Cafe!!

[Rick Lindstrom]

Great job Wilbur!

Be sure to post pictures when you have it finished and strung up. Looks like it'll be a striking instrument.

Rick