Old Ebenezer Scrooge - fingerings, 4th part

[almeriastrings]

Been picking this a lot recently, and started out with the 4th part being fingered with the 'standard' (?) 2-5-4-7-4-5 fretting on the 3rd string, but kind of by "accident" hit it a few times with the 7th fret 'A' changed to an open 'A' on the second string. That seemed to give it a bit more of a ring/drone type tone in there, which I liked quite a bit. I was wondering if there is a "definitive" way to play that phrase, or in other words, which one is "right" according to the original Monroe recording?

[Ivan Kelsall]

Hi Almeria - I heard OES for the first time earlier this year (or was it last year ?) courtesy of a fellow 'Cafe member & it knocked my socks off. I've worked most of it out from the recording,but re.definitive ways of playing 'any tune',i suppose it's 'which version' you prefer. One of my favourite Bill Monroe tunes is 'Southern Flavour',mainly because it's one of the easier ones to play,but the recorded version on the LP 'Master of Bluegrass' by Bill Monroe,isn't the same as the version he plays in the YouTube clip that i learned it from a few years back. So - do i go back & re-learn it ?. As 95 % of the tune is the same,i'll stick with what i've learned already.If you've come across a 'tone' that you like & that fits in & adds 'your own touch' to the tune without changing it,IMHO,go for it - i'd certainly like to hear it 'your way'.
One of my favourite tunes is Herschel Sizemore's tune 'Rebecca'. His 'original' recording of it on 'Bounce Away' isn't the same as his re-recording of it on 'Back In Business',which in turn, isn't the same as the TAB version in his tutor book - so which do i play ? - the one that i prefer,
Ivan

[almeriastrings]

Ivan,

I agree with all you say. Over time my various "accidental" (!) and deliberate variations tend to creep in anyway, which is just a part of making it your own, but.... I still like to know how the original were done! Curiosity, I suppose... also, always worth knowing how exactly Monroe/Scruggs/Blake/JD/Rice or whoever picked something as I think it gives you a bit of insight into their thinking - which is fascinating.

Southern Flavor changed quite a bit over years, that's for sure. Fortunately, there is quite a bit of decent video of him playing that one. For the others on 'Master of Bluegrass', very much less is out there.

Another really fun one to play is "Come Hither to Go Yonder". That is a wonderful tune that really uses those low strings.

[Fretbear]

Southern Flavor isn't on "Master of Bluegrass"..........

[Mandolin Mick]

I play Old Ebenezer Scrooge. In fact, I usually do it as a warm up to get the fingers going. I play this pretty much note-for-note and I do it with the 7th fret there. But, there's lots of open A's in OES!

[sgarrity]

I play open A's in the 4th part. I tried for years to train my pinky for that part but it just wouldn't cooperate. I also love playing this tune on the mandola in D. Great sound

[Ivan Kelsall]

Fretbear - You're probably correct, but as i received OES along with a few others over the I'net as MP3's under the banner of 'Master of Bluegrass',i thought it was on that recording - so which recording IS it on ? .Nevertheless,whichever recording it was on,it still isn't like the YouTube clip i mentioned.The tune on the LP begins with twin Fiddles & BM takes his usual solo,it's also much slower that the YT clip.
I like to learn tunes as close to the originals as possible,but sometimes learning a complex tune by ear makes it pretty difficult.I get as close as i can & then maybe when listening to the tune at some future time,i might pick up another 1% of the original & slot it in to what i already know.One of my personal favourite 'warm up' tunes is 'Eighth of February' by John Reischman.I can play it pretty accurately.I know it's not 100%,but i'm sure if i was playing it & JR walked into the room,he'd recognise it.In fact,i play it more accurately to his recording of it than he plays it in this clip - still,it's his tune so......................,
Ivan
http://youtu.be/yirqlDv8pf8

[almeriastrings]

'Southern Flavor' was on the 1988 MCA album of the same title. There is a fine live version recorded in Germany on the "Far Across the Blue Water" CD in the Bear Family boxed set.

'Old Ebenezer Scrooge' was the first track on the 'Master of Bluegrass' album from 1981. The entire album (+ a very nice full page repro of the cover) is found in the 'My Last Days on Earth" collection, also in the Bear Family boxed set. This is accompanied by a very nice hard cover book, too. I gradually acquired the entire series and there is a lifetime's worth of listening and learning in there!

[Mandolin Mick]

Ivan,

I'm trying to figure out from your 2 posts what your question is about Old Ebenezer Scrooge ... It's the first song on Master of Bluegrass, which is an album of all mandolin instrumentals. The first song on YouTube if you do a search on Old Ebenezer Scrooge Bill Monroe is the song from the album. All mandolin with the other instruments just providing backup. Very fast and one of Bill's best instrumentals!

[Mike Bunting]

'Southern Flavor' was on the 1988 MCA album of the same title. There is a fine live version recorded in Germany on the "Far Across the Blue Water" CD in the Bear Family boxed set.

'Old Ebenezer Scrooge' was the first track on the 'Master of Bluegrass' album from 1981. The entire album (+ a very nice full page repro of the cover) is found in the 'My Last Days on Earth" collection, also in the Bear Family boxed set. This is accompanied by a very nice hard cover book, too. I gradually acquired the entire series and there is a lifetime's worth of listening and learning in there!

You are absolutely correct! A body should have the entire Bear Family set of Monroe material, the notes are totally complete, who played what and when and details about what was going on in each decade. Finish it all off with the Columbia set of the original band from '45 to '49.
What I can't find is a recording of Land of Lincoln. I saved a Youtube of it but I'd really like a recording of Bill doing it.

[almeriastrings]

There is a live version by Bill and the boys recorded at Bean Blossom in 1969 (with Kenny on fiddle) on Youtube...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hILdQEJ65jU

That's the only version I know of, recorded.... could be other live tapes, out there of course.

[AlanN]

Lou Martin did a faithful transcription of OES in the defunct Acoustic Musician magazine. Those latter-day Monroe tunes have their own thing going on, very rhythmic and pahrful. Nobody picks OES or CHTGY, least around here. SF does get play, mostly due to me picking it

[Don Grieser]

IMHO the finger pattern on the last part of Scrooge is a big part of the Monroe style. You'll find similar finger patterns being used in other tunes. Well worth learning and practicing even if you have to go to something else to play it to speed. A real workout for the pinky and the whole left hand.

[almeriastrings]

A real workout for the pinky and the whole left hand.

I've noticed....

[Don Grieser]

It also teaches you to keep your fingers close to the fingerboard.

[Andy B]

Lou Martin's transcription uses the 7th fret of the D string for the A note in that lick at the end of part 3 and all through part 4. I suspect that was the way Bill played it.

[Jim Garber]

There is a live version by Bill and the boys recorded at Bean Blossom in 1969 (with Kenny on fiddle) on Youtube...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hILdQEJ65jU

That's the only version I know of, recorded.... could be other live tapes, out there of course.

That one seems to be Land of Lincoln.

Here are a couple of versions by Monroe disciples:

[sgarrity]

Here it in on the mandola in D. of course you can hear Compton do it much better on the mandola on "The Gathering" cd that was released last winter. Highly recommended!!

[Mike Bunting]

That one seems to be Land of Lincoln.

Yes it is, that is the tune that I had asked about in the previous post.

[Jim Garber]

Sorry, Mike... I missed your post. In any case I thought it was appropriate to post those videos.

[Dan Cole]

There is another great version of this tune available on iTunes. The Album is from Butch Robins - "Grounded-Centered-Focused". I'm not sure if its Monroe, or Compton playing it. The tune is actually called Old Ebenezer Dangerfield on the album. Well worth checking out.

[almeriastrings]

I believe it is Mike Compton on Butch's album on that particular track. Yes, well worth having. Some very interesting material on that one.

[Mike Bunting]

Sorry, Mike... I missed your post. In any case I thought it was appropriate to post those videos.

As far as I'm concerned, it's always appropriate to post MC videos and it doesn't hurt to see Shaun's face up there either.